WEBVTT 00:01:24.984 --> 00:01:26.352 THE SENATE COMMITTEE ON PRIVACY, 00:01:26.419 --> 00:01:27.353 DIGITAL TECHNOLOGIES AND 00:01:27.420 --> 00:01:28.855 CONSUMER PROTECTION. 00:01:28.922 --> 00:01:30.323 INFORMATIONAL HEARING ON THE 00:01:30.390 --> 00:01:31.324 UNDERSTANDING OF THE CONTOURS 00:01:31.391 --> 00:01:33.626 OF THE AI. THREATSCAPE IS 00:01:33.693 --> 00:01:35.328 CALLED TO ORDER. WE WILL BE 00:01:35.395 --> 00:01:37.096 JOINED SHORTLY BY OTHER MEMBERS 00:01:37.163 --> 00:01:38.965 OF THE COMMITTEE AS WELL, AND 00:01:39.032 --> 00:01:40.300 THE REMAINDER OF THE COMMITTEE 00:01:40.366 --> 00:01:41.501 MEMBERS I KNOW ARE MONITORING 00:01:41.568 --> 00:01:42.869 THIS HEARING FROM THEIR 00:01:42.936 --> 00:01:46.105 DISTRICTS AS WE ARE IN THE FALL 00:01:46.172 --> 00:01:47.574 IN THE SENATE'S FALL RECESS. 00:01:47.640 --> 00:01:50.109 BUT I WANT TO WELCOME IN 00:01:50.176 --> 00:01:51.177 ADVANCE OUR COLLEAGUES FOR 00:01:51.244 --> 00:01:53.746 JOINING US TODAY. THIS IS THIS 00:01:53.813 --> 00:01:56.216 IS A MONUMENTAL MOMENT FOR FOR 00:01:56.282 --> 00:01:58.751 CALIFORNIA. AND WE ARE HERE 00:01:58.818 --> 00:02:00.186 TODAY TO CONTINUE CALIFORNIA'S 00:02:00.253 --> 00:02:01.821 WORK IN THIS IN THIS SPACE. BUT 00:02:01.888 --> 00:02:03.456 REALLY, TO MEET THE MOMENT OF 00:02:03.523 --> 00:02:05.592 ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT 00:02:05.658 --> 00:02:06.359 TECHNOLOGICAL, ECONOMIC AND 00:02:06.426 --> 00:02:09.195 SOCIAL CHANGES THAT THAT HUMAN 00:02:09.262 --> 00:02:10.196 SOCIETY, CERTAINLY THE STATE OF 00:02:10.263 --> 00:02:12.398 CALIFORNIA HAS EVER FACED. 00:02:12.465 --> 00:02:14.934 CALIFORNIA IS DEFINED BY OUR 00:02:15.001 --> 00:02:18.171 OUR FOCUS, OUR BELIEF, OUR, OUR 00:02:18.238 --> 00:02:20.673 LOVE OF INNOVATION IN EVERY 00:02:20.740 --> 00:02:22.041 POSSIBLE WAY. CALIFORNIA HAS 00:02:22.108 --> 00:02:24.644 CHANGED ITSELF AND THE WORLD 00:02:24.711 --> 00:02:26.846 THROUGH ITS. OUR CONSTANT, 00:02:26.913 --> 00:02:29.315 CONSTANT ATTENTION TO THE 00:02:29.382 --> 00:02:29.949 POSSIBILITIES THAT ARE IN FRONT 00:02:30.016 --> 00:02:32.252 OF US AND THE RULES THAT ARE TO 00:02:32.318 --> 00:02:34.387 BE BROKEN, THE NEW THINGS THAT 00:02:34.454 --> 00:02:36.389 ARE TO BE, TO MAKE OR TO BE 00:02:36.456 --> 00:02:38.625 MADE, WHETHER IT'S IN THE WORLD 00:02:38.691 --> 00:02:40.460 OF ENTERTAINMENT OR AEROSPACE 00:02:40.527 --> 00:02:43.296 OR TECHNOLOGY OR FOOD AND 00:02:43.363 --> 00:02:45.231 AGRICULTURE. CALIFORNIA HAS LED 00:02:45.298 --> 00:02:47.667 THE WAY REPEATEDLY. CALIFORNIA 00:02:47.734 --> 00:02:49.135 HAS LED, WITH ITS WESTERN 00:02:49.202 --> 00:02:51.237 ORIENTATION, ITS COWBOY CULTURE. 00:02:51.304 --> 00:02:53.106 LET'S TRY, LET'S, LET'S TRY 00:02:53.172 --> 00:02:54.440 ANYTHING TO SEE IF WE CAN MAKE 00:02:54.507 --> 00:02:55.942 IT BETTER. CALIFORNIA, THOUGH, 00:02:56.009 --> 00:02:57.410 HAS ALSO, ALONG WITH OUR 00:02:57.477 --> 00:02:59.045 FRIENDS IN EUROPE AND ELSEWHERE, 00:02:59.112 --> 00:03:02.048 HAS ALSO LED THE WAY IN 00:03:02.115 --> 00:03:04.617 GOVERNMENTAL IN GOVERNANCE TO 00:03:04.684 --> 00:03:06.753 MATCH THAT INNOVATION AT EVERY 00:03:06.819 --> 00:03:09.656 SINGLE STEP. AND I EMPHASIZE 00:03:09.722 --> 00:03:11.424 THIS ONLY BECAUSE I KNOW IN THE 00:03:11.491 --> 00:03:12.859 REST OF THE COUNTRY THERE IS A 00:03:12.926 --> 00:03:14.294 CONSTANT DEBATE ABOUT WHETHER 00:03:14.360 --> 00:03:15.795 INNOVATION AND GOVERNANCE, 00:03:15.862 --> 00:03:17.530 INNOVATION AND REGULATION, 00:03:17.597 --> 00:03:19.332 INNOVATION AND CONTROL ARE 00:03:19.399 --> 00:03:21.200 MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE. AND 00:03:21.267 --> 00:03:23.670 CALIFORNIA IS IS THE TEXTBOOK 00:03:23.736 --> 00:03:25.104 EXAMPLE IN THE GLOBE OF HOW 00:03:25.171 --> 00:03:26.573 THAT ISN'T TRUE, AND IN FACT, 00:03:26.639 --> 00:03:28.708 HOW THE OPPOSITE IS THE CASE. 00:03:28.775 --> 00:03:31.578 THAT PREDICTABLE, MEANINGFUL 00:03:31.644 --> 00:03:33.746 TRUST, BUILDING GOVERNANCE AND 00:03:33.813 --> 00:03:35.281 REGULATIONS ARE ESSENTIAL. THEY 00:03:35.348 --> 00:03:37.717 ARE THE ESSENTIAL FOUNDATION TO 00:03:37.784 --> 00:03:39.118 INNOVATION, BOTH AT SAFETY, BUT 00:03:39.185 --> 00:03:41.321 ALSO ITS WIDESPREAD ADOPTION, 00:03:41.387 --> 00:03:43.456 USE AND EMBRACE BY THE PUBLIC, 00:03:43.523 --> 00:03:45.992 BY CONSUMERS AND BY OUR 00:03:46.059 --> 00:03:48.528 CITIZENS. TODAY, WE'RE HERE 00:03:48.595 --> 00:03:50.930 BECAUSE CALIFORNIA HAS LED THE 00:03:50.997 --> 00:03:52.832 WAY WITH RESPECT TO ARTIFICIAL 00:03:52.899 --> 00:03:54.601 INTELLIGENCE, REGULATION AND 00:03:54.667 --> 00:03:57.837 GOVERNANCE IN MANY, MANY WAYS, 00:03:57.904 --> 00:03:59.672 AND IT IS WHOLLY INSUFFICIENT 00:03:59.739 --> 00:04:01.441 TO MEET THE MOMENT THAT IS NOW 00:04:01.507 --> 00:04:03.977 BEFORE US. CALIFORNIA WAS THE 00:04:04.043 --> 00:04:06.846 FIRST IN THE COUNTRY TO ADOPT A 00:04:06.913 --> 00:04:10.817 SWEEPING STATUTE, SB 53, WITH 00:04:10.883 --> 00:04:13.353 RESPECT TO CATASTROPHIC RISK, 00:04:13.419 --> 00:04:14.787 TRANSPARENCY AND RESPONSE, 00:04:14.854 --> 00:04:16.322 BUILDING OFF AN EVEN MORE 00:04:16.389 --> 00:04:18.358 AMBITIOUS PROPOSAL AND SB 1047 00:04:18.424 --> 00:04:21.594 IN THE THE YEAR PRIOR. AND THAT 00:04:21.661 --> 00:04:25.198 LAW HAS BEEN COPIED AND EVOLVED 00:04:25.264 --> 00:04:27.367 AND ADAPTED BY OTHER STATES. 00:04:27.433 --> 00:04:29.535 AND IT IS REALLY, IN MANY WAYS, 00:04:29.602 --> 00:04:32.805 AND THIS IT HAS DEFINED THE THE 00:04:32.872 --> 00:04:34.273 TERMS BY WHICH MOST OF THE 00:04:34.340 --> 00:04:36.009 COUNTRY IS TALKING ABOUT THIS 00:04:36.075 --> 00:04:38.878 ISSUE. AND OUR CALIFORNIA'S 00:04:38.945 --> 00:04:41.447 WORK ON FRONTIER MODEL SAFETY, 00:04:41.514 --> 00:04:43.216 AND PARTICULARLY THE WORK OF 00:04:43.282 --> 00:04:44.317 SENATOR SCOTT WIENER, OUR 00:04:44.384 --> 00:04:46.552 COLLEAGUE WHO IS OCCUPIED AT 00:04:46.619 --> 00:04:48.254 THE MOMENT, UNABLE TO JOIN US 00:04:48.321 --> 00:04:50.423 AT THE HEARING TODAY. BUT HE IS 00:04:50.490 --> 00:04:53.292 VERY MUCH WITH US BECAUSE BOTH 00:04:53.359 --> 00:04:55.828 HIS PRESENCE. IT. IN THE 00:04:55.895 --> 00:04:58.698 INTRODUCTION OF SB 1047 AND HIS 00:04:58.765 --> 00:05:00.967 TIRELESS WORK WITH WITH WITH 00:05:01.034 --> 00:05:02.535 OTHER MEMBERS, BUT ALSO WITH 00:05:02.602 --> 00:05:05.872 OTHER COALITIONS TO TO WIN 00:05:05.938 --> 00:05:08.775 ENACTMENT OF. ULTIMATELY, SB 53 00:05:08.841 --> 00:05:12.745 HAS LED LED THE WORLD IN, IN, 00:05:12.812 --> 00:05:15.281 IN FOCUSING ON AND 00:05:15.348 --> 00:05:16.215 EXPERIMENTING WITH APPROACHES 00:05:16.282 --> 00:05:18.518 TO FRONTIER MODEL SAFETY. AND 00:05:18.584 --> 00:05:19.619 SO ALTHOUGH HE'S NOT WITH US 00:05:19.686 --> 00:05:21.287 TODAY, AS I SAY, HE IS VERY 00:05:21.354 --> 00:05:23.222 MUCH WITH US IN TERMS OF THE 00:05:23.289 --> 00:05:25.158 WORK THAT HE HAS SET IN MOTION, 00:05:25.224 --> 00:05:26.793 THE, THE, THE MODELS AND THE 00:05:26.859 --> 00:05:28.261 CONCEPTS, THE IDEAS, THE, THE 00:05:28.327 --> 00:05:29.729 BARS BY WHICH WE JUDGE 00:05:29.796 --> 00:05:31.130 OURSELVES AS WELL AS THE 00:05:31.197 --> 00:05:32.331 TECHNOLOGY. AND I WANT TO THANK 00:05:32.398 --> 00:05:35.034 HIM FOR THAT. CALIFORNIA'S ALSO 00:05:35.101 --> 00:05:36.903 LED THE COUNTRY IN LEGISLATING 00:05:36.969 --> 00:05:39.038 TO PROTECT CHILDREN FROM 00:05:39.105 --> 00:05:41.541 COMPANION AI CHAT BOTS. WE HAVE 00:05:41.607 --> 00:05:43.710 ENACTED LEGISLATION LAST YEAR 00:05:43.776 --> 00:05:46.279 ON WORKPLACE PRIVACY AND 00:05:46.345 --> 00:05:48.081 WORKPLACE PROTECTIONS FOR 00:05:48.147 --> 00:05:50.483 WORKERS AROUND AROUND JOB LOSS, 00:05:50.550 --> 00:05:52.685 AROUND THINGS LIKE DEEPFAKES 00:05:52.752 --> 00:05:54.887 AND INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY, 00:05:54.954 --> 00:05:56.656 AROUND HEALTH CARE AND AROUND 00:05:56.723 --> 00:05:58.891 BIAS, JUST TO NAME A FEW. SO 00:05:58.958 --> 00:06:00.259 CALIFORNIA, REALLY MORE THAN 00:06:00.326 --> 00:06:03.129 ANY OTHER STATE, HAS BEEN 00:06:03.196 --> 00:06:05.298 LEADING, LEADING IN TERMS OF 00:06:05.364 --> 00:06:06.766 ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE 00:06:06.833 --> 00:06:07.500 RESPONSE AND REGULATION. 00:06:07.567 --> 00:06:08.935 WELCOME TO OUR COLLEAGUE 00:06:09.001 --> 00:06:10.369 SENATOR BECKER, WHO ALSO HAS A 00:06:10.436 --> 00:06:11.471 DISTINGUISHED RECORD OF 00:06:11.537 --> 00:06:12.538 LEADERSHIP IN THIS AREA, AND 00:06:12.605 --> 00:06:14.340 I'M EXTREMELY GRATEFUL THAT 00:06:14.407 --> 00:06:16.843 HE'S WITH US TODAY. SO 00:06:16.909 --> 00:06:19.312 CALIFORNIA HAS HAS LED THE WAY. 00:06:19.378 --> 00:06:21.914 AND AT THE SAME MOMENT, WE ARE 00:06:21.981 --> 00:06:25.852 FACING A A MENU OF THREATS AND 00:06:25.918 --> 00:06:27.620 RISKS THAT ARE QUITE 00:06:27.687 --> 00:06:28.721 SUBSTANTIAL, BOTH IN THEIR 00:06:28.788 --> 00:06:29.856 INTENSITY AND THEIR POTENTIAL 00:06:29.922 --> 00:06:30.957 SEVERITY, BUT ALSO IN THEIR 00:06:31.023 --> 00:06:35.194 SCOPE. AND, AND SO WE WHAT 00:06:35.261 --> 00:06:36.262 REMAINS BEFORE US AND WHAT WILL 00:06:36.329 --> 00:06:37.897 BE A SIGNIFICANT FOCUS OF 00:06:37.964 --> 00:06:39.465 TODAY'S HEARING IS FRONTIER 00:06:39.532 --> 00:06:43.503 MODEL SAFETY AND THE RISKS THAT 00:06:43.569 --> 00:06:46.339 THAT HUMANS, THAT SOCIETY, THAT 00:06:46.405 --> 00:06:48.174 CONSUMERS, THAT THAT GOVERNMENT 00:06:48.241 --> 00:06:51.377 THAT ALL OF US FACE FROM FROM 00:06:51.444 --> 00:06:53.179 FRONTIER MODELS THAT WHOSE 00:06:53.246 --> 00:06:55.014 CAPABILITIES INCREASINGLY 00:06:55.081 --> 00:06:56.449 OUTSTRIP WHAT WE THOUGHT WAS 00:06:56.516 --> 00:06:57.917 POSSIBLE OR IMAGINABLE, EVEN, 00:06:57.984 --> 00:07:00.787 EVEN JUST A FEW YEARS AGO. AND 00:07:00.853 --> 00:07:02.421 SO THAT THAT WILL CONTINUE TO 00:07:02.488 --> 00:07:04.056 BE A MAJOR AREA OF FOCUS FOR US, 00:07:04.123 --> 00:07:06.159 AS IT HAS BECOME FOR THE ENTIRE 00:07:06.225 --> 00:07:08.294 COUNTRY AT THE SAME AT THE SAME 00:07:08.361 --> 00:07:11.597 TIME THERE. WE NOW HAVE NON 00:07:11.664 --> 00:07:15.134 FRONTIER MODELS AND AI SYSTEMS 00:07:15.201 --> 00:07:17.336 THAT HAVE CAPABILITIES THAT FAR 00:07:17.403 --> 00:07:19.505 EXCEED WHAT WE WERE REGULATING 00:07:19.572 --> 00:07:22.008 FRONTIER MODELS ABOUT IN SB 00:07:22.074 --> 00:07:23.476 1047, AND CERTAINLY SB 1053, 00:07:23.543 --> 00:07:25.011 BUT PARTICULARLY IN SB 1047 00:07:25.077 --> 00:07:27.046 JUST A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO. AND 00:07:27.113 --> 00:07:28.481 WHAT HAS BECOME CLEAR IS THAT 00:07:28.548 --> 00:07:31.384 IN ADDITION TO THE WHAT OUR AI 00:07:31.450 --> 00:07:32.819 FRIENDS MIGHT SAY ARE THE 00:07:32.885 --> 00:07:35.655 INTELLIGENCE GATED THREATS FROM, 00:07:35.721 --> 00:07:37.123 FROM FROM FRONTIER MODELS WHO 00:07:37.190 --> 00:07:39.659 ARE WHO WE WHO WE ARE 00:07:39.725 --> 00:07:41.060 INSUFFICIENTLY CAPABLE OF 00:07:41.127 --> 00:07:43.596 CONTROLLING THAT THERE ARE ALSO 00:07:43.663 --> 00:07:45.798 SUBSTANTIAL, LESS INTELLIGENCE 00:07:45.865 --> 00:07:47.600 GATED THREATS FROM, FROM 00:07:47.667 --> 00:07:50.136 AGENTIC SYSTEMS AND FROM OPEN 00:07:50.203 --> 00:07:51.904 SOURCE AND OPEN OPEN WEIGHT 00:07:51.971 --> 00:07:53.706 MODELS AND THEIR DEPLOYMENT 00:07:53.773 --> 00:07:55.107 BROADLY IN SOCIETY THAT DON'T 00:07:55.174 --> 00:07:56.576 DEPEND SOLELY ON THE 00:07:56.642 --> 00:07:58.010 INTELLIGENCE OF ARTIFICIAL 00:07:58.077 --> 00:07:59.378 INTELLIGENCE MODELS, BUT ALSO 00:07:59.445 --> 00:08:01.981 DEPEND ON ITS PERSISTENCE, ON 00:08:02.048 --> 00:08:03.816 ITS. WE WILL TALK ABOUT THIS 00:08:03.883 --> 00:08:05.184 DURING THE HEARING AS WELL, ITS 00:08:05.251 --> 00:08:07.086 PERSISTENCE IN MAKING SURE NO 00:08:07.153 --> 00:08:09.155 TASK, NO OBJECTIVE IS 00:08:09.222 --> 00:08:11.357 UNSATISFIED, ITS SHAMELESSNESS 00:08:11.424 --> 00:08:13.125 IN WHAT TACTICS IT MIGHT 00:08:13.192 --> 00:08:14.193 UNDERTAKE IN ORDER TO 00:08:14.260 --> 00:08:16.729 ACCOMPLISH THAT. AND WE ARE NOW, 00:08:16.796 --> 00:08:18.631 THANKS TO META AND META'S MUSE, 00:08:18.698 --> 00:08:19.599 WE HAVE MILLIONS OF 00:08:19.665 --> 00:08:21.033 CALIFORNIANS THAT ARE USING 00:08:21.100 --> 00:08:22.235 AGENTIC SYSTEMS, ABOUT WHICH 00:08:22.301 --> 00:08:23.936 THEY UNDERSTAND VERY LITTLE, 00:08:24.003 --> 00:08:26.038 AND ABOUT WHICH THE LEGAL, 00:08:26.105 --> 00:08:27.874 STATUTORY, REGULATORY AND 00:08:27.940 --> 00:08:30.443 LIABILITY PROTECTIONS ARE ARE 00:08:30.509 --> 00:08:32.612 RADICALLY MISUNDERSTOOD OR NOT 00:08:32.678 --> 00:08:34.480 UNDERSTOOD AT ALL. AND SO PART 00:08:34.547 --> 00:08:36.883 OF THIS, THE SECOND HALF OF OUR 00:08:36.949 --> 00:08:38.184 HEARING, OR THE SECOND PORTION 00:08:38.251 --> 00:08:39.352 OF OUR HEARING TODAY, IS REALLY 00:08:39.418 --> 00:08:41.554 FOCUSED ON ON THOSE THREATS 00:08:41.621 --> 00:08:43.656 THAT ARE NOT THAT ARE NOT ABOUT 00:08:43.723 --> 00:08:44.824 THE FRONTIER MODEL SPECIFICALLY, 00:08:44.891 --> 00:08:46.092 BUT ARE ABOUT THE REMAINDER OF 00:08:46.158 --> 00:08:48.361 THE AI ECOSYSTEM, OF WHICH 00:08:48.427 --> 00:08:49.528 FRONTIER MODELS ARE AN 00:08:49.595 --> 00:08:51.631 IMPORTANT BUT NOT THE ONLY PART. 00:08:51.697 --> 00:08:53.633 AND SO THAT WE WILL BE TAKING A 00:08:53.699 --> 00:08:56.669 LOOK AT THOSE ISSUES. WE REMAIN 00:08:56.736 --> 00:08:57.737 CALIFORNIANS REMAIN CONCERNED 00:08:57.803 --> 00:08:59.605 ABOUT THE IMPACTS OF THESE 00:08:59.672 --> 00:09:01.340 SYSTEMS ON JOBS AND THE NATURE 00:09:01.407 --> 00:09:03.476 OF WORK ITSELF, AS WELL AS 00:09:03.542 --> 00:09:06.412 INCOME AROUND THE IMPACTS ON 00:09:06.479 --> 00:09:07.513 INSTITUTIONS AND SYSTEMS. 00:09:07.580 --> 00:09:08.915 CALIFORNIA IS THE FIRST IN THE 00:09:08.981 --> 00:09:10.716 COUNTRY TO TO ENACT ANY 00:09:10.783 --> 00:09:12.151 LEGISLATION AT ALL ON THE ON 00:09:12.218 --> 00:09:15.154 THE CHALLENGES OF AGENTIC 00:09:15.221 --> 00:09:19.725 FLOODING, WHICH IS A. 00:09:19.792 --> 00:09:20.726 SEPARATELY DESCRIBED THIS AS 00:09:20.793 --> 00:09:21.827 SORT OF AS INFINITE KARENS, 00:09:21.894 --> 00:09:23.429 WHICH IS AN INAPPROPRIATE WAY 00:09:23.496 --> 00:09:25.831 TO DESCRIBE IT, BUT IT IS 00:09:25.898 --> 00:09:27.300 SIMPLY THE LEGISLATION THAT WAS 00:09:27.366 --> 00:09:28.034 INTRODUCED THAT WAS ENACTED BY 00:09:28.100 --> 00:09:29.435 THE LEGISLATURE AND GOVERNOR 00:09:29.502 --> 00:09:32.438 EARLIER THIS YEAR TO TO ADDRESS 00:09:32.505 --> 00:09:35.207 THE REAL CHALLENGE OF FOLKS, OF 00:09:35.274 --> 00:09:37.743 FOLKS, EITHER HUMANS OR AGENTS, 00:09:37.810 --> 00:09:39.545 ABUSING OUR CIVIC ENGAGEMENT 00:09:39.612 --> 00:09:41.347 PROCESSES BY FLOODING THE 00:09:41.414 --> 00:09:42.515 SYSTEMS TO THE TO THE POINT 00:09:42.581 --> 00:09:44.183 WHERE GOVERNMENT SHUT DOWN AND 00:09:44.250 --> 00:09:45.418 WHERE REAL PUBLIC INPUT CANNOT 00:09:45.484 --> 00:09:47.787 BE SEEN IN A IN A FLOOD OF 00:09:47.853 --> 00:09:49.588 SWARMING AGENTS. SAME THREATS 00:09:49.655 --> 00:09:50.656 TO OUR LEGAL SYSTEM, BUT 00:09:50.723 --> 00:09:52.124 CERTAINLY ALSO PRIVATE 00:09:52.191 --> 00:09:53.893 COMPANIES, NONPROFITS, LITTLE 00:09:53.960 --> 00:09:54.994 LEAGUES ARE GRAPPLING WITH 00:09:55.061 --> 00:09:56.796 EXACTLY THE SAME CHALLENGE OF 00:09:56.862 --> 00:09:57.563 AGENTIC FLOODING AT THE LOCAL 00:09:57.630 --> 00:09:58.664 LEVEL. CALIFORNIA WAS THE FIRST 00:09:58.731 --> 00:10:00.433 TO ADOPT LEGISLATION IN THIS 00:10:00.499 --> 00:10:02.568 SPACE, BUT IT REMAINS LARGELY 00:10:02.635 --> 00:10:05.805 AN UNPROTECTED AREA. ISSUES OF 00:10:05.871 --> 00:10:07.907 AGENTIC INEQUALITY, WHICH IS TO 00:10:07.974 --> 00:10:09.742 SAY, FOR EXAMPLE, IN THE 00:10:09.809 --> 00:10:11.277 CYBERSECURITY SPACE, AS SOME OF 00:10:11.344 --> 00:10:12.578 THE COMPANIES HAVE SUGGESTED, 00:10:12.645 --> 00:10:14.714 THAT WE SHOULDN'T BE THAT 00:10:14.780 --> 00:10:15.848 CONCERNED ABOUT CYBERSECURITY 00:10:15.915 --> 00:10:17.316 BECAUSE IF WE WOULD JUST IF WE 00:10:17.383 --> 00:10:18.851 WOULD JUST LICENSE THEIR MODELS 00:10:18.918 --> 00:10:20.553 TO PROTECT US AGAINST 00:10:20.619 --> 00:10:21.587 CYBERSECURITY THREATS, THEN WE 00:10:21.654 --> 00:10:23.823 WOULD BE FINE. OF COURSE, THE 00:10:23.889 --> 00:10:25.992 CHALLENGE HERE IS THAT THE THE 00:10:26.058 --> 00:10:28.461 MODELS ARE NOT ALL EQUIVALENT. 00:10:28.527 --> 00:10:31.697 AND SO WHATEVER CYBERSECURITY 00:10:31.764 --> 00:10:33.199 MODEL WE WERE TO USE HERE BASED 00:10:33.265 --> 00:10:35.334 ON AN AI CYBERSECURITY SYSTEM 00:10:35.401 --> 00:10:37.036 BASED ON AN AI MODEL THAT MIGHT 00:10:37.103 --> 00:10:38.571 PROTECT US HERE IN THE 00:10:38.637 --> 00:10:40.373 CALIFORNIA STATE SENATE AGAINST 00:10:40.439 --> 00:10:43.242 ATTACKS, IF THE ASSEMBLY 00:10:43.309 --> 00:10:45.378 LICENSES A MORE POWERFUL, MORE 00:10:45.444 --> 00:10:47.546 INTELLIGENT AI MODEL THAT IS 00:10:47.613 --> 00:10:51.150 CAPABLE OF DEFEATING OUR OUR 00:10:51.217 --> 00:10:53.719 OUR REGULAR PRICED AI MODEL, 00:10:53.786 --> 00:10:55.087 WE'RE WE'RE AT RISK. THE 00:10:55.154 --> 00:10:55.955 ASSEMBLY, I'M SURE, WOULD NOT 00:10:56.022 --> 00:10:57.857 DO SUCH A THING. BUT THE POINT 00:10:57.923 --> 00:10:59.759 IS, THE POINT IS, IS THAT THE 00:10:59.825 --> 00:11:00.526 RATCHETING, THE CONSTANT 00:11:00.593 --> 00:11:01.961 RATCHETING, THE INFINITE 00:11:02.028 --> 00:11:03.029 RATCHETING OF THE POWER OF 00:11:03.095 --> 00:11:04.797 THESE MODELS MEANS THAT THE 00:11:04.864 --> 00:11:06.298 MODELS THEMSELVES CAN CAN OFFER 00:11:06.365 --> 00:11:08.067 US ONLY LIMITED PROTECTION 00:11:08.134 --> 00:11:10.569 AGAINST AGAINST THEMSELVES, 00:11:10.636 --> 00:11:13.139 UNLESS WE ACCEPT MASSIVE 00:11:13.205 --> 00:11:14.240 INEQUALITY SO THAT ONLY FOLKS 00:11:14.306 --> 00:11:16.008 WITH UNLIMITED WEALTH HAVE THE 00:11:16.075 --> 00:11:17.343 ABILITY TO HAVE ACCESS TO THE 00:11:17.410 --> 00:11:18.911 MOST POWERFUL MODELS, WHILE THE 00:11:18.978 --> 00:11:20.679 REST OF US, THE LITTLE LEAGUE, 00:11:20.746 --> 00:11:23.182 THE SENATE, YOUR CORNER, YOUR 00:11:23.249 --> 00:11:25.017 CORNER SANDWICH SHOP HAVE 00:11:25.084 --> 00:11:27.453 ACCESS ONLY TO TO THE TO THE 00:11:27.520 --> 00:11:29.288 LEAST CAPABLE MODELS WHICH ARE 00:11:29.355 --> 00:11:31.157 INCAPABLE OF DEFENDING AGAINST 00:11:31.223 --> 00:11:32.558 EITHER GIGANTIC FLOODING, 00:11:32.625 --> 00:11:33.659 CYBERSECURITY THREATS, OR OTHER 00:11:33.726 --> 00:11:34.794 CHALLENGES THAT MAY COME FROM 00:11:34.860 --> 00:11:37.229 MORE POWERFUL AGENTS. SO A MORE 00:11:37.296 --> 00:11:39.365 POWERFUL MODEL. SO AGENTIC 00:11:39.432 --> 00:11:40.499 INEQUALITY IS A SIGNIFICANT 00:11:40.566 --> 00:11:43.369 ISSUE FOR US TO FACE OUR. I 00:11:43.436 --> 00:11:44.837 SERVE ALSO ON THE EDUCATION 00:11:44.904 --> 00:11:47.673 COMMITTEE AND THE CONCERNS 00:11:47.740 --> 00:11:49.475 ABOUT COGNITIVE AND CREATIVE 00:11:49.542 --> 00:11:51.410 SURRENDER. THAT IS THE EXTENT 00:11:51.477 --> 00:11:53.446 TO WHICH STUDENTS RIGHT NOW, 00:11:53.512 --> 00:11:55.381 BUT ALSO WORKERS AND HUMANS 00:11:55.448 --> 00:11:58.184 MORE GENERALLY OFFLOAD SO MUCH 00:11:58.250 --> 00:12:01.353 OF OUR COGNITIVE THINKING AND 00:12:01.420 --> 00:12:03.556 CREATIVITY ONTO MODELS THAT WE, 00:12:03.622 --> 00:12:05.658 WE OR OUR OR THE NEXT 00:12:05.724 --> 00:12:07.460 GENERATION FORGET OR NEVER 00:12:07.526 --> 00:12:09.261 DEVELOP THOSE CAPACITIES IN 00:12:09.328 --> 00:12:11.063 OURSELVES. AND SO THESE ARE 00:12:11.130 --> 00:12:12.398 THESE THIS IS AN IMPORTANT 00:12:12.465 --> 00:12:13.566 CHALLENGE FOR US TO FACE. AND 00:12:13.632 --> 00:12:16.936 THEN PRIVACY IS A IS A CENTRAL 00:12:17.002 --> 00:12:19.405 ISSUE. SENATOR BECKER, WITH HIS 00:12:19.472 --> 00:12:21.173 AUTHORSHIP AND AND CONSISTENT 00:12:21.240 --> 00:12:22.608 CHAMPIONING OF THE DELETE ACT, 00:12:22.675 --> 00:12:23.876 WHICH GIVES EVERY CALIFORNIAN 00:12:23.943 --> 00:12:26.912 THE ABILITY TO, TO, TO, TO 00:12:26.979 --> 00:12:28.380 REMOVE THEIR DATA FROM BEING 00:12:28.447 --> 00:12:30.149 HELD BY DATA BROKERS THAT THAT 00:12:30.216 --> 00:12:31.917 THEY DON'T WANT. HOW DOES SUCH 00:12:31.984 --> 00:12:35.254 SYSTEMS WORK IN AN ERA WHEN AN 00:12:35.321 --> 00:12:36.355 AGENT AND I'M NOT PICKING ON 00:12:36.422 --> 00:12:37.923 META, BUT BECAUSE MUSE IS THE 00:12:37.990 --> 00:12:39.859 MOST USED AGENT AT THE CONSUMER 00:12:39.925 --> 00:12:43.462 LEVEL IN, IN THE STATE, IF IF 00:12:43.529 --> 00:12:46.499 IF, IF MUSE IS, IS, HAS ACCESS 00:12:46.565 --> 00:12:48.501 TO ALL OF MY EMAILS, WHICH I'VE 00:12:48.567 --> 00:12:50.302 GIVEN IT, I HAVE NOT. BUT IF 00:12:50.369 --> 00:12:52.238 I'VE GIVEN IT ACCESS TO ALL OF 00:12:52.304 --> 00:12:53.472 MY EMAILS AND MY BANK ACCOUNTS 00:12:53.539 --> 00:12:54.673 AND EVERYTHING AND MY TEXT 00:12:54.740 --> 00:12:56.742 MESSAGES ON MY PHONE AND 00:12:56.809 --> 00:12:58.944 EVERYTHING ELSE, AND IT IS 00:12:59.011 --> 00:13:00.779 USING THEM AND NOT STORING THEM 00:13:00.846 --> 00:13:02.615 IN A, IN A SINGLE FILE IN THE 00:13:02.681 --> 00:13:04.283 WAY THAT WE MIGHT THINK OF 00:13:04.350 --> 00:13:05.384 UNDER THE DELETE ACT AS AN 00:13:05.451 --> 00:13:07.219 EXAMPLE THAT APPLIES TO DATA 00:13:07.286 --> 00:13:08.654 BROKERS. HOW ARE WE, HOW ARE WE 00:13:08.721 --> 00:13:14.326 TO TREAT PRIVACY ISSUES WHEN 00:13:14.393 --> 00:13:14.994 WE'RE NO LONGER TALKING ABOUT A 00:13:15.060 --> 00:13:15.628 SINGLE SET OF COOKIES OR OTHER 00:13:15.694 --> 00:13:16.228 FILES FROM THE FROM THE LAST 00:13:16.295 --> 00:13:17.329 FROM THE LAST DECADE OR TWO IN 00:13:17.396 --> 00:13:18.430 TERMS OF THAT PROTECTION? BUT 00:13:18.497 --> 00:13:19.832 MORE IMPORTANTLY, OR PERHAPS AT 00:13:19.899 --> 00:13:22.001 LEAST AS IMPORTANTLY, IS IF I 00:13:22.067 --> 00:13:24.904 HAVE DONE THAT AND I AM IN 00:13:24.970 --> 00:13:25.604 COMMUNICATION WITH SENATOR 00:13:25.671 --> 00:13:27.706 BECKER AND SENATOR BECKER, AND 00:13:27.773 --> 00:13:29.909 I PASS EMAILS BACK AND FORTH, 00:13:29.975 --> 00:13:32.478 TEXT MESSAGES BACK AND FORTH. I 00:13:32.545 --> 00:13:33.612 OFFERED TO PICK UP SENATOR 00:13:33.679 --> 00:13:34.780 BECKER AT THE AIRPORT ONE DAY, 00:13:34.847 --> 00:13:36.782 AND HE SENT. HE SENDS ME HIS 00:13:36.849 --> 00:13:38.851 SOUTHWEST ITINERARY AND I PULL 00:13:38.918 --> 00:13:40.019 OFF. AND THAT ITINERARY 00:13:40.085 --> 00:13:41.220 INCLUDES THE LAST FOUR DIGITS 00:13:41.287 --> 00:13:43.589 OF HIS CREDIT CARD NUMBER. 00:13:43.656 --> 00:13:44.723 PERHAPS IT'S A FOREIGN FLIGHT, 00:13:44.790 --> 00:13:46.492 AND I PICK UP HIS PASSPORT 00:13:46.559 --> 00:13:48.561 NUMBER. SENATOR BECKER HAS IN 00:13:48.627 --> 00:13:51.864 NO WAY AUTHORIZED MY MUSE, 00:13:51.931 --> 00:13:53.799 AGENT, OR MUSE, PERIOD OR META 00:13:53.866 --> 00:13:55.801 TO COLLECT THAT DATA, TO HOLD 00:13:55.868 --> 00:13:57.236 THAT DATA, OR TO BUILD A 00:13:57.303 --> 00:13:59.205 PROFILE ABOUT HIM. AND HE HAS 00:13:59.271 --> 00:14:00.839 NO WAY TO KNOW THAT SUCH A 00:14:00.906 --> 00:14:02.708 THING EXISTS, OR THAT I'VE 00:14:02.775 --> 00:14:04.310 AUTHORIZED MUSE TO DO THAT. AND 00:14:04.376 --> 00:14:06.212 HE HAS NO WAY TO EXERCISE HIS 00:14:06.278 --> 00:14:07.379 RIGHTS UNDER THE DELETE ACT OR 00:14:07.446 --> 00:14:08.614 THE CALIFORNIA CONSTITUTION TO 00:14:08.681 --> 00:14:10.149 TAKE CONTROL OF THAT DATA 00:14:10.216 --> 00:14:11.984 HIMSELF. AND SO THE, THE ISSUES 00:14:12.051 --> 00:14:13.118 THAT WE'RE THAT WE'RE FACING 00:14:13.185 --> 00:14:15.321 WITH RESPECT TO PRIVACY IN AR 00:14:15.387 --> 00:14:17.356 ARE SUBSTANTIAL. FORTUNATELY, 00:14:17.423 --> 00:14:19.291 THE CALIFORNIA KNOWS, YOU KNOW, 00:14:19.358 --> 00:14:20.492 KNOWS A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THIS 00:14:20.559 --> 00:14:22.294 ISSUE AS ONE OF THE LEADING 00:14:22.361 --> 00:14:23.429 STATES IN THE COUNTRY, BUT WE 00:14:23.495 --> 00:14:25.331 HAVE SIGNIFICANT WORK TO DO. SO 00:14:25.397 --> 00:14:28.234 I LIST ALL OF THESE ISSUES, NOT 00:14:28.300 --> 00:14:30.402 TO NOT TO SCARE US INTO, INTO, 00:14:30.469 --> 00:14:32.204 INTO, INTO, INTO, YOU KNOW, 00:14:32.271 --> 00:14:34.206 ABJECT FEAR ABOUT AI. I KNOW 00:14:34.273 --> 00:14:36.208 SOME FOLKS FEEL THAT AND THAT'S 00:14:36.275 --> 00:14:37.676 LEGITIMATE TOO, BUT SIMPLY TO, 00:14:37.743 --> 00:14:40.145 TO, TO NOTE THAT, NUMBER ONE, 00:14:40.212 --> 00:14:41.347 WE, THE, THE FRONTIER MODEL 00:14:41.413 --> 00:14:43.716 SAFETY ISSUE IS, IS, IS THE 00:14:43.782 --> 00:14:44.883 CENTRAL ONE. IT IS NOT THE ONLY 00:14:44.950 --> 00:14:47.653 ISSUE. AND NUMBER TWO, TO 00:14:47.720 --> 00:14:49.922 EMPHASIZE, FOR THOSE WHO ARE 00:14:49.989 --> 00:14:53.459 HOPING THAT THAT CONGRESS WILL 00:14:53.525 --> 00:14:55.361 COME BACK AND SOMEHOW MAKE THIS 00:14:55.427 --> 00:14:57.763 ALL GO AWAY WITH SOME SIMPLE 00:14:57.830 --> 00:15:02.368 ACT. THAT ONE CONGRESSIONAL ACT 00:15:02.434 --> 00:15:06.405 AWAY FROM FIXING AI IS, IS 00:15:06.472 --> 00:15:09.708 FOLLY. THERE'S THE CONGRESS IS 00:15:09.775 --> 00:15:11.343 IS APPROPRIATELY EXAMINING SOME 00:15:11.410 --> 00:15:13.979 OF THE KEY ISSUES HERE, BUT THE 00:15:14.046 --> 00:15:15.748 RANGE OF TOPICS THAT ARE 00:15:15.814 --> 00:15:16.815 IMPLICATED BY ARTIFICIAL 00:15:16.882 --> 00:15:18.684 INTELLIGENCE GO FAR BEYOND THE 00:15:18.751 --> 00:15:19.718 SCOPE OF WHAT THE FEDERAL 00:15:19.785 --> 00:15:21.553 GOVERNMENT DOES. AND THE 00:15:21.620 --> 00:15:22.588 FEDERAL GOVERNMENT HAS NO 00:15:22.655 --> 00:15:24.390 RECORD OF DOING THIS IN A WAY 00:15:24.456 --> 00:15:25.824 THAT ISN'T ARBITRARY, 00:15:25.891 --> 00:15:26.925 CAPRICIOUS OUT OF THE WHITE 00:15:26.992 --> 00:15:28.360 HOUSE. AND SO IT IS REALLY 00:15:28.427 --> 00:15:29.528 IMPORTANT THAT CALIFORNIA AND 00:15:29.595 --> 00:15:32.631 OTHER STATES CONTINUE TO 00:15:32.698 --> 00:15:34.466 AGGRESSIVELY TO ROBUSTLY ENGAGE 00:15:34.533 --> 00:15:36.635 IN GOVERNANCE AND SAFETY AND 00:15:36.702 --> 00:15:37.870 PROTECTION ISSUES IN THIS SPACE. 00:15:37.936 --> 00:15:39.204 AND I KNOW WE'RE COMMITTED TO 00:15:39.271 --> 00:15:42.041 DOING THAT HERE AT THE AT THE 00:15:42.107 --> 00:15:44.943 SENATE. SO LET ME JUST SAY ONE 00:15:45.010 --> 00:15:49.581 OTHER CAVEAT, WHICH IS. IT 00:15:49.648 --> 00:15:51.083 ISN'T CLEAR TO ME THAT IF 00:15:51.150 --> 00:15:53.218 TODAY'S CALIFORNIA EXISTED 100 00:15:53.285 --> 00:15:54.253 YEARS AGO, THAT WE WOULD HAVE 00:15:54.320 --> 00:15:56.455 EVER ACTUALLY PERMITTED 00:15:56.522 --> 00:15:58.257 AUTOMOBILES TO EXIST OR PLANES 00:15:58.324 --> 00:15:59.291 OR ANYTHING ELSE, OUR 00:15:59.358 --> 00:16:01.126 REGULATORY ENVIRONMENT TODAY IS 00:16:01.193 --> 00:16:02.895 CHALLENGING. I THINK THE 00:16:02.961 --> 00:16:03.996 LEGISLATURE KNOWS THIS. THE 00:16:04.063 --> 00:16:05.064 GOVERNOR, THE CURRENT GOVERNOR, 00:16:05.130 --> 00:16:06.632 THE INCOMING GOVERNOR, WHOEVER 00:16:06.699 --> 00:16:08.300 THAT MIGHT BE, ARE WELL AWARE 00:16:08.367 --> 00:16:09.735 THAT THE CALIFORNIA GOVERNANCE 00:16:09.802 --> 00:16:10.836 ENVIRONMENT IS IS CHALLENGING. 00:16:10.903 --> 00:16:13.005 AND SO I ALSO WANT TO EMPHASIZE 00:16:13.072 --> 00:16:14.139 BOTH TO MY COLLEAGUES AND TO 00:16:14.206 --> 00:16:15.140 ADVOCACY GROUPS AND TO 00:16:15.207 --> 00:16:16.942 COMPANIES AND ASSOCIATIONS, 00:16:17.009 --> 00:16:19.411 THAT INFINITE RANDOM ACTS OF 00:16:19.478 --> 00:16:21.146 LEGISLATION IS ALSO NOT THE 00:16:21.213 --> 00:16:23.849 ANSWER THAT WHAT WE WHAT WE 00:16:23.916 --> 00:16:27.052 NEED IS NOT 10,000 NEW LAWS, 00:16:27.119 --> 00:16:29.888 ALL SORT OF SEPARATELY CRAFTED 00:16:29.955 --> 00:16:32.791 TO TO TRY TO TACKLE AI OR 00:16:32.858 --> 00:16:33.926 PARTICULARLY OUR CONCEPTION OF 00:16:33.992 --> 00:16:35.527 AI ON THIS WEDNESDAY, WHEN IT 00:16:35.594 --> 00:16:38.030 WILL BE RADICALLY DIFFERENT 00:16:38.097 --> 00:16:39.898 NEXT WEEK. IT IS QUITE 00:16:39.965 --> 00:16:41.333 IMPORTANT THAT WE TAKE A 00:16:41.400 --> 00:16:43.135 COMPREHENSIVE APPROACH HERE, 00:16:43.202 --> 00:16:44.670 AND WE DO THAT IN A THOUGHTFUL 00:16:44.737 --> 00:16:45.804 WAY, BOTH AT THIS COMMITTEE AND 00:16:45.871 --> 00:16:47.806 IN THE REST OF THE INSTITUTION, 00:16:47.873 --> 00:16:49.241 BECAUSE WE HAVE TO UNDERSTAND 00:16:49.308 --> 00:16:51.744 HERE THAT IT IS THE MARKET, THE 00:16:51.810 --> 00:16:53.579 MARKET DYNAMICS, THE MARKET IS 00:16:53.645 --> 00:16:56.448 VERY IMPORTANT. AND, YOU KNOW, 00:16:56.515 --> 00:16:58.250 ISSUES AROUND REGULATORY 00:16:58.317 --> 00:17:00.652 CAPTURE OR WHERE WE HAVE, YOU 00:17:00.719 --> 00:17:01.820 KNOW, LARGE, LARGE COMPANIES 00:17:01.887 --> 00:17:03.989 THAT WE TEND TO FOCUS ON HERE 00:17:04.056 --> 00:17:05.457 AND IN THE IN THE NATIONAL 00:17:05.524 --> 00:17:07.960 DEBATE AS WELL THAT HAVE THE 00:17:08.026 --> 00:17:09.428 POTENTIAL TO EXERCISE 00:17:09.495 --> 00:17:11.296 SIGNIFICANT MARKET POWER. I WAS 00:17:11.363 --> 00:17:12.998 MAYOR FOR, FOR 20 YEARS, AND I 00:17:13.065 --> 00:17:14.466 SAW PLENTY OF TECHNOLOGY 00:17:14.533 --> 00:17:15.534 INNOVATIONS OCCUR AT THE LOCAL 00:17:15.601 --> 00:17:17.302 LEVEL IN EVERY SINGLE TIME, 00:17:17.369 --> 00:17:18.470 EVERY SINGLE TIME, WHETHER IT 00:17:18.537 --> 00:17:20.606 WAS UBER OR ANYONE ELSE. EVERY 00:17:20.672 --> 00:17:21.974 SINGLE TIME, THE SAME EXACT 00:17:22.040 --> 00:17:23.776 STORY, THE INNOVATORS WOULD 00:17:23.842 --> 00:17:25.077 COME TO THE CITY AND SAY, HEY, 00:17:25.144 --> 00:17:26.945 WE WANT TO, YOU KNOW, WE WANT 00:17:27.012 --> 00:17:28.814 TO LET A THOUSAND FLOWERS BLOOM 00:17:28.881 --> 00:17:30.015 IN CITIES ARE THE ENGINES OF 00:17:30.082 --> 00:17:32.017 INNOVATION. AND SO WE WANT TO 00:17:32.084 --> 00:17:33.552 WORK WITH YOU TO, TO TRY TO 00:17:33.619 --> 00:17:35.187 SHOW THAT THIS CAN BE DONE AND 00:17:35.254 --> 00:17:37.089 MAKE IT WORK. AND WE WOULD DO 00:17:37.156 --> 00:17:39.258 THAT. AND TWO YEARS LATER, THEY 00:17:39.324 --> 00:17:40.526 WOULD GO TO THE STATE AND SAY, 00:17:40.592 --> 00:17:42.528 WE CAN'T HAVE ALL OF THESE 00:17:42.594 --> 00:17:44.329 CITIES DOING THIS. AND 00:17:44.396 --> 00:17:45.864 THEREFORE, PLEASE, PLEASE ENACT 00:17:45.931 --> 00:17:47.766 A UNIFORM POLICY THAT APPLIES 00:17:47.833 --> 00:17:49.034 TO EVERYONE BASED ON OUR 00:17:49.101 --> 00:17:50.436 EXTENSIVE TWO YEARS OF 00:17:50.502 --> 00:17:51.503 KNOWLEDGE. BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY, 00:17:51.570 --> 00:17:53.338 NOW THAT WE ARE A QUASI 00:17:53.405 --> 00:17:55.841 MONOPOLY, PLEASE, PLEASE FIX 00:17:55.908 --> 00:17:57.643 OUR OUR PLACE IN THE IN THE 00:17:57.709 --> 00:18:00.145 ECONOMY. WE CANNOT DO THAT. WE 00:18:00.212 --> 00:18:01.246 CANNOT ALLOW THAT TO HAPPEN IN 00:18:01.313 --> 00:18:02.881 THIS SPACE AS WELL. AND IT'S 00:18:02.948 --> 00:18:04.850 NOT A IT'S NOT A THREAT TO ANY 00:18:04.917 --> 00:18:06.385 INDIVIDUAL COMPANY. BUT WE NEED 00:18:06.452 --> 00:18:08.086 TO BE VERY ATTENTIVE TO THE 00:18:08.153 --> 00:18:09.655 DYNAMICS OF THE MARKETS HERE 00:18:09.721 --> 00:18:11.423 AND UNDERSTAND, AND THIS IS TO 00:18:11.490 --> 00:18:12.691 SOME OF MY ADVOCACY FRIENDS, 00:18:12.758 --> 00:18:14.493 THAT THIS IS NOT A THIS IS NOT 00:18:14.560 --> 00:18:16.361 SIMPLY A HUMANITY VERSUS BIG 00:18:16.428 --> 00:18:18.597 TECH BATTLE OR SET OF BATTLES 00:18:18.664 --> 00:18:19.698 THAT WE'RE ABOUT TO ENGAGE IN. 00:18:19.765 --> 00:18:21.033 THERE ARE MASSIVE, MASSIVE 00:18:21.099 --> 00:18:22.634 FIGHTS WITHIN THE TECH INDUSTRY 00:18:22.701 --> 00:18:24.470 OR INDUSTRIES THAT WE'RE GOING 00:18:24.536 --> 00:18:26.505 TO HAVE TO GRAPPLE WITH AND BE. 00:18:26.572 --> 00:18:27.873 BE SURE THAT WHAT WE'RE. THAT 00:18:27.940 --> 00:18:30.042 WE DON'T ADOPT 10,000 PIECES OF 00:18:30.108 --> 00:18:31.477 LEGISLATION THAT MAKE IT ONLY 00:18:31.543 --> 00:18:33.612 POSSIBLE FOR 2 OR 3 COMPANIES 00:18:33.679 --> 00:18:35.414 TO DOMINATE THIS SPACE AND THE 00:18:35.481 --> 00:18:38.684 WORLD. BUT THAT IS ALSO OUR JOB. 00:18:38.750 --> 00:18:41.220 AND IT IS IT IS THE STORY OF 00:18:41.286 --> 00:18:42.621 LEGISLATION THAT THAT COMPANIES 00:18:42.688 --> 00:18:44.423 HATE THE REGULATIONS, BUT ONCE 00:18:44.490 --> 00:18:46.592 THEY FIGURE OUT HOW TO COMPLY 00:18:46.658 --> 00:18:48.260 WITH THEM, THEY THEY WOULD LIKE 00:18:48.327 --> 00:18:49.862 TO HAVE MORE, OR AT LEAST THEY 00:18:49.928 --> 00:18:51.663 WON'T OBJECT THAT MUCH SO THAT 00:18:51.730 --> 00:18:53.499 OTHERS THEN CANNOT ENTER THE 00:18:53.565 --> 00:18:55.234 MARKET. AND IT REALLY IS QUITE 00:18:55.300 --> 00:18:57.035 IMPORTANT THAT WE THAT WE NOT 00:18:57.102 --> 00:18:59.605 LOCK IN PLACE THE MOST POWERFUL 00:18:59.671 --> 00:19:02.074 ECONOMIC ACTORS IN SOCIETY BY 00:19:02.140 --> 00:19:04.543 LEGISLATING TOO FAST OR IN A 00:19:04.610 --> 00:19:06.512 WAY THAT'S NOT COMPREHENSIVE IN 00:19:06.578 --> 00:19:08.280 ORDER TO AVOID REGULATORY 00:19:08.347 --> 00:19:09.348 CAPTURE. SECOND, AND THE OTHER 00:19:09.414 --> 00:19:10.949 LESSON FOR ME FROM UBER AND 00:19:11.016 --> 00:19:12.518 EVERYONE ELSE WAS THE VENTURE 00:19:12.584 --> 00:19:14.319 CAPITAL TRAP THAT LEGISLATURES 00:19:14.386 --> 00:19:16.121 OFTEN FIND OURSELVES IN, WHICH 00:19:16.188 --> 00:19:17.990 IS THAT AT THE OUTSET OF THESE 00:19:18.056 --> 00:19:20.792 MARKETS, EVERYTHING IS IS CHEAP. 00:19:20.859 --> 00:19:22.294 UBER TRIPS USED TO BE 00:19:22.361 --> 00:19:22.961 SUBSTANTIALLY CHEAPER THAN THEY 00:19:23.028 --> 00:19:25.831 ARE TODAY. I, AND I IMAGINE 00:19:25.898 --> 00:19:28.367 THAT MY CLAUDE OR CHATGPT 00:19:28.433 --> 00:19:29.501 SESSIONS ARE GOING TO BE MUCH 00:19:29.568 --> 00:19:31.570 MORE EXPENSIVE WHEN WHEN 00:19:31.637 --> 00:19:33.038 COMPANIES HAVE TO MAKE A PROFIT, 00:19:33.105 --> 00:19:34.806 WHEN THEY HAVE TO SUSTAIN 00:19:34.873 --> 00:19:36.542 THEMSELVES. BUT IT IS TYPICALLY 00:19:36.608 --> 00:19:37.743 THE CASE THAT WE DEFINE OUR 00:19:37.809 --> 00:19:39.511 REGULATORY LANDSCAPE ENTIRELY 00:19:39.578 --> 00:19:41.680 IN THE VENTURE PERIOD OF NEW 00:19:41.747 --> 00:19:43.916 SECTORS WITHOUT REGARD TO WHAT 00:19:43.982 --> 00:19:45.250 THEIR WHAT THEIR ULTIMATE 00:19:45.317 --> 00:19:45.984 ECONOMICS ARE GOING TO LOOK 00:19:46.051 --> 00:19:47.786 LIKE. AND WE DO THAT AT THE 00:19:47.853 --> 00:19:49.955 PERIL OF, OF, OF CALIFORNIANS 00:19:50.022 --> 00:19:51.557 AND AMERICANS THAT THAT DEPEND 00:19:51.623 --> 00:19:52.824 ON US TO PROTECT THEIR 00:19:52.891 --> 00:19:54.059 AFFORDABILITY AS WELL, AND ALSO 00:19:54.126 --> 00:19:55.294 TO PROTECT HEALTHY, HEALTHY 00:19:55.360 --> 00:19:57.863 MARKETS. AND THEN LAST IS TO, 00:19:57.930 --> 00:20:01.667 IS TO BE, TO BE. IT'S IMPORTANT 00:20:01.733 --> 00:20:03.168 FOR US, AS WE TACKLE SOME OF 00:20:03.235 --> 00:20:05.437 THESE CHALLENGES, IS TO BE 00:20:05.504 --> 00:20:06.872 THOUGHTFUL ABOUT WHAT WE ARE 00:20:06.939 --> 00:20:09.007 CAPABLE OF AS HUMANS IN THE 00:20:09.074 --> 00:20:11.143 PRIVACY DOMAIN. WE, MANY OF US 00:20:11.209 --> 00:20:12.311 IN THIS ROOM HAVE HAD THIS 00:20:12.377 --> 00:20:15.180 CONVERSATION BEFORE WE. WE RAN 00:20:15.247 --> 00:20:16.949 TOWARDS A NOTICE AND CONSENT 00:20:17.015 --> 00:20:18.750 APPROACH TO PRIVACY, WHICH. 00:20:18.817 --> 00:20:20.886 WHICH ASSUMED INFINITE 00:20:20.953 --> 00:20:22.354 ATTENTION THAT PEOPLE COULD 00:20:22.421 --> 00:20:24.122 SPEND ON PRIVACY THAT NONE OF 00:20:24.189 --> 00:20:26.224 US ARE DOING. ZERO OF US ARE 00:20:26.291 --> 00:20:27.225 READING ALL THE PRIVACY 00:20:27.292 --> 00:20:28.360 POLICIES BEFORE WE CLICK YES TO 00:20:28.427 --> 00:20:30.429 ALL OR NO TO ALL OR WHAT, WHAT 00:20:30.495 --> 00:20:32.297 WHAT HAVE YOU THAT WE HAVE TO 00:20:32.364 --> 00:20:33.498 UNDERSTAND THAT THAT SIMPLY 00:20:33.565 --> 00:20:35.300 TRANSPARENCY AND CHOICE BY 00:20:35.367 --> 00:20:36.635 PEOPLE IN THIS, IN THIS SPACE 00:20:36.702 --> 00:20:38.236 IS NOT LIKELY TO PROTECT US 00:20:38.303 --> 00:20:39.905 AGAINST SOME OF THE SOME OF THE 00:20:39.972 --> 00:20:41.773 MOST SEVERE THREATS. AND THAT 00:20:41.840 --> 00:20:43.475 WHILE WE WANT TO WE WANT TO 00:20:43.542 --> 00:20:45.043 ASSURE HUMAN AGENCY THAT WE 00:20:45.110 --> 00:20:46.878 ALSO HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THAT 00:20:46.945 --> 00:20:48.180 PEOPLE. MOST CALIFORNIANS DO 00:20:48.246 --> 00:20:49.915 NOT HAVE THE TIME OR THE 00:20:49.982 --> 00:20:51.149 COGNITIVE BANDWIDTH TO DEVOTE 00:20:51.216 --> 00:20:54.386 ALL DAY LONG TO TO REVIEWING 00:20:54.453 --> 00:20:55.854 POLICIES, TO SAYING YES OR NO 00:20:55.921 --> 00:20:57.990 TO TO PROMPTS THAT THE SOLUTION 00:20:58.056 --> 00:20:59.825 TO AI IS NOT SIMPLY MAKING IT 00:20:59.891 --> 00:21:01.259 TRANSPARENT FOR US TO MAKE MORE 00:21:01.326 --> 00:21:02.728 CHOICES ABOUT, BUT REALLY ALSO 00:21:02.794 --> 00:21:04.796 TO ADDRESS AT THE ROOT THE 00:21:04.863 --> 00:21:06.264 CHALLENGES THAT WE'RE FACING 00:21:06.331 --> 00:21:07.532 AND THAT WE ALSO APPRECIATE 00:21:07.599 --> 00:21:08.533 THAT WITH RESPECT TO THINGS 00:21:08.600 --> 00:21:10.569 THAT ARE THE LAST TWO YEARS, AT 00:21:10.636 --> 00:21:11.737 LEAST, THAT I'VE BEEN HERE IN 00:21:11.803 --> 00:21:13.505 THE CAPITAL. THE MOST COMMON 00:21:13.572 --> 00:21:14.773 TERM IN THIS IN THIS SPACE HAS 00:21:14.840 --> 00:21:16.608 BEEN WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE 00:21:16.675 --> 00:21:17.743 THERE'S A HUMAN IN THE LOOP. 00:21:17.809 --> 00:21:19.711 THIS IS NOT UNIMPORTANT IN MANY 00:21:19.778 --> 00:21:22.114 OF OUR POLICIES, BUT IT'S. BUT 00:21:22.180 --> 00:21:23.582 THE MANY OF THE INCIDENTS THAT 00:21:23.649 --> 00:21:26.084 WE WILL COVER TODAY, AND THAT I 00:21:26.151 --> 00:21:27.486 THINK MOST MOST AMERICANS ARE 00:21:27.552 --> 00:21:29.621 NOW QUITE FAMILIAR WITH. THEY 00:21:29.688 --> 00:21:31.490 ARE A REMINDER THAT SIMPLY A 00:21:31.556 --> 00:21:33.625 HUMAN IN THE LOOP IS 00:21:33.692 --> 00:21:35.794 INSUFFICIENT. THAT THAT OUR 00:21:35.861 --> 00:21:38.030 THAT THAT OUR ABILITY TO. AND 00:21:38.096 --> 00:21:39.164 THE IMPORTANCE OF HAVING THE 00:21:39.231 --> 00:21:42.601 TOOLS TO BE ABLE TO PROTECT, TO 00:21:42.668 --> 00:21:44.336 ASSURE SAFETY, BUT ALSO TO 00:21:44.403 --> 00:21:45.337 UNDERSTAND THAT THERE ARE 00:21:45.404 --> 00:21:46.338 MALICIOUS ACTORS, THERE ARE 00:21:46.405 --> 00:21:48.407 CARELESS ACTORS THAT A MERE 00:21:48.473 --> 00:21:50.175 HUMAN ALONE DOES NOT GUARANTEE 00:21:50.242 --> 00:21:51.643 WHAT THE COMPANIES MIGHT CALL 00:21:51.710 --> 00:21:52.978 ALIGNMENT. BUT WE MIGHT GET 00:21:53.045 --> 00:21:55.614 WHAT WE WE MAY CALL MORAL MORAL 00:21:55.681 --> 00:21:57.716 BEHAVIOR THAT SIMPLY A HUMAN, 00:21:57.783 --> 00:21:59.551 SOMEWHERE IN THE PROCESS IS NOT 00:21:59.618 --> 00:22:00.986 SUFFICIENT TO GUARANTEE OUR 00:22:01.053 --> 00:22:02.521 SAFETY HERE. SO I KNOW THIS IS 00:22:02.587 --> 00:22:04.189 A LONG OPENING STATEMENT, BUT 00:22:04.256 --> 00:22:05.657 THERE'S BEEN A LOT IN THIS 00:22:05.724 --> 00:22:07.793 SPACE AND WE ARE. WE ARE 00:22:07.859 --> 00:22:09.594 WORKING HARD IN ORDER TO. AND 00:22:09.661 --> 00:22:12.130 I'LL. I WILL SIMPLY SAY THAT 00:22:12.197 --> 00:22:13.965 MANY MEMBERS OF THE SENATE ARE 00:22:14.032 --> 00:22:16.802 WORKING ON THIS TOGETHER TO 00:22:16.868 --> 00:22:20.072 ASSURE THIS COMPREHENSIVE 00:22:20.138 --> 00:22:21.206 APPROACH TO SAFETY AND 00:22:21.273 --> 00:22:22.240 PROTECTION AROUND THIS FULL 00:22:22.307 --> 00:22:23.675 RANGE OF ISSUES, INCLUDING, 00:22:23.742 --> 00:22:24.743 VERY IMPORTANTLY, FRONTIER 00:22:24.810 --> 00:22:26.211 MODEL SAFETY, BUT NOT 00:22:26.278 --> 00:22:28.046 EXCLUSIVELY ONE OF THOSE ONE OF 00:22:28.113 --> 00:22:30.182 THOSE MEMBERS WHO HAS BEEN AN 00:22:30.248 --> 00:22:31.216 IMPORTANT LEADER ON ARTIFICIAL 00:22:31.283 --> 00:22:32.584 INTELLIGENCE FOR YEARS IN THIS 00:22:32.651 --> 00:22:33.752 HOUSE, AS WELL AS BEING THE 00:22:33.819 --> 00:22:35.587 AUTHOR OF THE DELETE ACT. LET 00:22:35.654 --> 00:22:37.556 ME TURN IT OVER TO HIM FOR SOME 00:22:37.622 --> 00:22:38.590 OPENING REMARKS. AND THEN 00:22:38.657 --> 00:22:39.591 SENATOR JOSH BECKER. WELL, 00:22:39.658 --> 00:22:44.162 THANK YOU. I WANT TO THANK OUR 00:22:44.229 --> 00:22:48.166 CHAIR AND REALLY JUST IS NOT A 00:22:48.233 --> 00:22:50.268 MORE CONVERSATION, NOT A MORE 00:22:50.335 --> 00:22:54.272 IMPORTANT CONVERSATION ANYWHERE 00:22:54.339 --> 00:22:57.509 RIGHT NOW THAN THIS TOPIC, THIS 00:22:57.576 --> 00:22:59.344 CONVERSATION. AND AND FRANKLY, 00:22:59.411 --> 00:23:00.412 FOR THE REASONS YOU MENTIONED 00:23:00.479 --> 00:23:05.117 THIS, THIS STATE AND OUR 00:23:05.183 --> 00:23:06.451 OPPORTUNITY AND RESPONSIBILITY 00:23:06.518 --> 00:23:08.687 HERE. BUT YEAH, WHEN I FIRST 00:23:08.754 --> 00:23:12.257 THANK, THANK YOU. WE'RE REALLY 00:23:12.324 --> 00:23:13.725 LUCKY TO HAVE SOMEONE WITH YOUR 00:23:13.792 --> 00:23:15.861 EXPERIENCE, YOUR BACKGROUND, 00:23:15.927 --> 00:23:21.266 AND YOUR. KNOWN FOR BALANCED 00:23:21.333 --> 00:23:25.237 APPROACH TO THESE ISSUES, BUT 00:23:25.303 --> 00:23:28.106 AND ALSO A LEVEL OF, OF 00:23:28.173 --> 00:23:29.174 SERIOUSNESS AND RIGOR, WHICH IS 00:23:29.241 --> 00:23:30.642 GOING TO REQUIRE HERE. AND I 00:23:30.709 --> 00:23:32.244 THINK THAT'S REFLECTED IN THE 00:23:32.310 --> 00:23:36.047 AGENDA FOR THIS, THIS HEARING, 00:23:36.114 --> 00:23:37.249 YOU KNOW, I'LL KEEP IT PRETTY 00:23:37.315 --> 00:23:39.117 SHORT. WE JUST WANT TO HAVE THE 00:23:39.184 --> 00:23:40.152 CONVERSATION. I WILL SAY A 00:23:40.218 --> 00:23:43.622 COUPLE THINGS. ONE IS THAT. YOU 00:23:43.688 --> 00:23:45.357 KNOW, MY IN MY DISTRICT, I 00:23:45.423 --> 00:23:46.758 REPRESENT META, REPRESENT 00:23:46.825 --> 00:23:50.529 GOOGLE, REPRESENT APPLE, YOU 00:23:50.595 --> 00:23:52.330 KNOW, MANY OF THE PEOPLE WHO 00:23:52.397 --> 00:23:53.532 WORK IN THESE INDUSTRIES. I WAS 00:23:53.598 --> 00:23:55.467 AT A CONCERT ON MONDAY NIGHT. I 00:23:55.534 --> 00:23:56.568 WAS TALKING TO SOMEONE ABOUT 00:23:56.635 --> 00:23:59.037 ALL THESE. AND IN THE I STARTED 00:23:59.104 --> 00:24:01.006 TALKING ABOUT AI RISKS AND SOME 00:24:01.072 --> 00:24:02.808 OF MY CONCERNS. AND IT TURNS 00:24:02.874 --> 00:24:04.509 OUT ONE OF THE ONE OF THE GUYS 00:24:04.576 --> 00:24:06.978 THERE WORKS AT NVIDIA, RIGHT ON, 00:24:07.045 --> 00:24:09.548 ON, YOU KNOW, SOME OF THESE 00:24:09.614 --> 00:24:14.586 ISSUES, BUT, YOU KNOW, FOR A 00:24:14.653 --> 00:24:16.221 WHILE I'VE BEEN FOCUSED ON SORT 00:24:16.288 --> 00:24:18.256 OF THE, THE MISALIGNMENT RISK, 00:24:18.323 --> 00:24:20.292 THE MALICIOUS RISK YOU 00:24:20.358 --> 00:24:22.727 MENTIONED. AND I'M A LITTLE 00:24:22.794 --> 00:24:23.862 MORE CONCERNED ABOUT RISK AFTER, 00:24:23.929 --> 00:24:25.697 AFTER THE, THE, THE STUFF YOU 00:24:25.764 --> 00:24:28.500 WENT THROUGH WITH THE, YOU KNOW, 00:24:28.567 --> 00:24:29.668 THE SYSTEMIC RISK IN TERMS OF 00:24:29.734 --> 00:24:32.204 JOBS YOU MENTIONED. AND THEN 00:24:32.270 --> 00:24:34.005 BUT NOW MORE RECENTLY, PEOPLE 00:24:34.072 --> 00:24:35.106 FOCUSING ON THE EXISTENTIAL 00:24:35.173 --> 00:24:36.942 RISK. AND THIS IS A TERM I TRY 00:24:37.008 --> 00:24:38.710 TO NEVER USE, EVEN. I DO A LOT 00:24:38.777 --> 00:24:40.745 OF WORK IN CLIMATE. I LIKE VERY. 00:24:40.812 --> 00:24:42.614 I NEVER USE THIS EXISTENTIAL 00:24:42.681 --> 00:24:44.749 WORD. BUT, YOU KNOW, IN THIS 00:24:44.816 --> 00:24:46.985 CASE, IT COME UP FOR FOR GOOD 00:24:47.052 --> 00:24:48.386 REASONS. AND I'LL ADMIT TO AT 00:24:48.453 --> 00:24:49.855 TIMES HAVING, YOU KNOW, REALLY 00:24:49.921 --> 00:24:51.656 SIGNIFICANT ANXIETY MYSELF 00:24:51.723 --> 00:24:53.458 ABOUT, YOU KNOW, OUR ABILITY TO 00:24:53.525 --> 00:24:55.594 CONTROL WHAT, WHAT IS BEING 00:24:55.660 --> 00:24:58.830 WHAT IS BEING CREATED. SO I 00:24:58.897 --> 00:24:59.998 THINK YOUR, YOUR POINTS ABOUT 00:25:00.065 --> 00:25:01.399 THE REGULATORY ENVIRONMENT IN 00:25:01.466 --> 00:25:04.603 CALIFORNIA ARE IMPORTANT. AND, 00:25:04.669 --> 00:25:06.071 AND, YOU KNOW, AND I ALSO 00:25:06.137 --> 00:25:06.805 RECOGNIZE THAT THIS IS AN 00:25:06.872 --> 00:25:08.907 INDUSTRY WHERE YOU HAVE UNUSUAL 00:25:08.974 --> 00:25:11.076 PIECES, YOU HAVE MANY LEADERS 00:25:11.142 --> 00:25:12.878 OF THESE COMPANIES THEMSELVES 00:25:12.944 --> 00:25:14.012 TALKING ABOUT THE RISKS OF 00:25:14.079 --> 00:25:16.081 THEIR PRODUCTS, RIGHT? WHICH IS 00:25:16.147 --> 00:25:18.250 WHICH, WHICH IS SOMEWHAT 00:25:18.316 --> 00:25:19.751 SOMEWHAT UNUSUAL. BUT, YOU KNOW, 00:25:19.818 --> 00:25:21.987 YOU'RE IN YOUR CAR ANALOGY, YOU 00:25:22.053 --> 00:25:23.722 KNOW, WE WOULDN'T HAVE A CAR ON 00:25:23.788 --> 00:25:25.624 THE ROAD WHERE WE SAY WE DON'T 00:25:25.690 --> 00:25:26.725 QUITE EXACTLY KNOW IF IT'S 00:25:26.791 --> 00:25:28.627 GOING TO STAY IN THE LANE. IT 00:25:28.693 --> 00:25:29.794 MIGHT JUST VEER OFF SUDDENLY. 00:25:29.861 --> 00:25:30.862 BUT, YOU KNOW, WE THINK, YOU 00:25:30.929 --> 00:25:32.731 KNOW, MOST OF THE TIME IT'S 00:25:32.797 --> 00:25:34.633 GOING TO STAY IN THE LANE. YOU 00:25:34.699 --> 00:25:35.734 KNOW, WE REALLY WOULDN'T HAVE 00:25:35.800 --> 00:25:36.835 HAVE HAVE PERMITTED THAT. SO WE 00:25:36.902 --> 00:25:38.803 HAVE TO GET A HANDLE ON THESE 00:25:38.870 --> 00:25:40.772 RISKS. WE HAVE TO GET A HANDLE 00:25:40.839 --> 00:25:41.907 ON, YOU KNOW, THE THREATSCAPE 00:25:41.973 --> 00:25:43.642 AS YOU SAY HERE, THESE ARE 00:25:43.708 --> 00:25:48.847 IMMENSELY COMPLICATED. AND AND 00:25:48.914 --> 00:25:50.682 YEAH, IMMENSELY COMPLICATED 00:25:50.749 --> 00:25:52.150 ISSUES AND IMMENSELY IMPORTANT 00:25:52.217 --> 00:25:53.351 ONE. SO JUST REALLY GLAD TO BE 00:25:53.418 --> 00:25:55.453 HERE TODAY. REALLY GRATEFUL FOR 00:25:55.520 --> 00:25:56.821 YOUR LEADERSHIP PULLING PEOPLE 00:25:56.888 --> 00:26:00.025 TOGETHER OVER THE INTERIM AND 00:26:00.091 --> 00:26:01.059 PARTICULARLY FOR THIS HEARING 00:26:01.126 --> 00:26:03.995 TODAY. THANK YOU SO MUCH, 00:26:04.062 --> 00:26:05.096 SENATOR. AND, AND AS WE'RE 00:26:05.163 --> 00:26:06.131 BEGINNING, I ALSO WANT TO 00:26:06.197 --> 00:26:08.199 ACKNOWLEDGE OUR THE COMMITTEE'S 00:26:08.266 --> 00:26:09.401 STAFF DIRECTOR, OUR CHIEF 00:26:09.467 --> 00:26:10.835 CONSULTANT, CHRISTIAN KARPINSKI, 00:26:10.902 --> 00:26:14.072 WHO IS SOLELY EXCLUSIVELY 00:26:14.139 --> 00:26:16.274 RESPONSIBLE FOR THE MAYBE WITH 00:26:16.341 --> 00:26:18.410 BEN'S HELP, FOR THE FOR THE 00:26:18.476 --> 00:26:19.477 EXCELLENT STAFF BACKGROUNDER 00:26:19.544 --> 00:26:20.946 THAT ACCOMPANIES TODAY'S 00:26:21.012 --> 00:26:22.380 TODAY'S HEARING, AS WELL AS 00:26:22.447 --> 00:26:23.448 ORGANIZING THE HEARING ITSELF. 00:26:23.515 --> 00:26:25.050 SO LET'S. LET'S PROCEED THEN TO 00:26:25.116 --> 00:26:26.985 OUR FIRST. OUR FIRST 00:26:27.052 --> 00:26:28.086 CONVERSATION, AND THAT IS WITH 00:26:28.153 --> 00:26:31.890 JOSHUA, WHO IS THE. FORMERLY 00:26:31.957 --> 00:26:33.825 WITH OPENAI, AS WAS THEIR CHIEF 00:26:33.892 --> 00:26:34.926 FUTURIST AND ALSO ON THEIR 00:26:34.993 --> 00:26:35.994 ALIGNMENT TEAM. IF YOU WOULD 00:26:36.061 --> 00:26:37.829 COME FORWARD TO JOIN US. AND 00:26:37.896 --> 00:26:39.664 IT'S BEEN AN IMPORTANT THOUGHT 00:26:39.731 --> 00:26:41.066 LEADER IN THIS SPACE AND ALSO 00:26:41.132 --> 00:26:42.600 HAS HAD SOME CONVERSATIONS WITH 00:26:42.667 --> 00:26:45.070 THE SENATE. AND I NOTE I WANT 00:26:45.136 --> 00:26:47.205 TO THANK SENATOR JERRY MCNERNEY, 00:26:47.272 --> 00:26:49.007 WHO HELPED TO MAKE THIS 00:26:49.074 --> 00:26:50.909 ORIGINAL CONNECTION, WHO CAN'T 00:26:50.976 --> 00:26:53.345 BE WITH US TODAY. BUT I KNOW 00:26:53.411 --> 00:26:54.346 WITHOUT WITHOUT HIM, YOU 00:26:54.412 --> 00:26:55.513 WOULDN'T BE WITH US. SO THANK 00:26:55.580 --> 00:26:57.349 YOU FOR JOINING US, JOSH, AND 00:26:57.415 --> 00:27:00.185 PLEASE PROCEED. ALL RIGHT. HEY, 00:27:00.251 --> 00:27:02.354 THIS IS MY FIRST CALIFORNIA 00:27:02.420 --> 00:27:03.755 SENATE HEARING. FIRST HEARING 00:27:03.822 --> 00:27:05.890 IN GENERAL. AND I KNOW MY MOM 00:27:05.957 --> 00:27:08.460 IS WATCHING, SO. HI, MOM. THANK 00:27:08.526 --> 00:27:09.527 YOU ALL FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO 00:27:09.594 --> 00:27:11.629 SPEAK WITH YOU TODAY. THANK YOU, 00:27:11.696 --> 00:27:12.764 SENATOR CABALDON, FOR 00:27:12.831 --> 00:27:14.666 ORGANIZING THIS OCCASION. THANK 00:27:14.733 --> 00:27:16.568 YOU FOR THE WORK YOU DO AS 00:27:16.634 --> 00:27:17.569 ELECTED OFFICIALS TO PROTECT 00:27:17.635 --> 00:27:18.903 THE INTERESTS OF THE PEOPLE OF 00:27:18.970 --> 00:27:20.338 CALIFORNIA. THANK YOU 00:27:20.405 --> 00:27:21.773 ESPECIALLY FOR YOUR ROLE AS 00:27:21.840 --> 00:27:23.975 POLICY PIONEERS. CALIFORNIA, AS 00:27:24.042 --> 00:27:25.010 A WORLD LEADER IN THE 00:27:25.076 --> 00:27:26.444 DEVELOPMENT OF FRONTIER 00:27:26.511 --> 00:27:27.879 TECHNOLOGY, IS THE FIRST TO SEE 00:27:27.946 --> 00:27:28.980 PROBLEMS COMING AND THE FIRST 00:27:29.047 --> 00:27:30.815 TO ACT ON THEM. THE POLICIES 00:27:30.882 --> 00:27:32.517 DEVELOPED BY THIS BODY WILL BE 00:27:32.584 --> 00:27:34.019 PROFOUNDLY INFLUENTIAL IN 00:27:34.085 --> 00:27:35.086 SETTING STANDARDS FOR THE 00:27:35.153 --> 00:27:37.622 COUNTRY AND IN TURN, THE WORLD. 00:27:37.689 --> 00:27:38.723 TODAY, I'LL BE SPEAKING ABOUT 00:27:38.790 --> 00:27:40.125 THE RISKS, CHALLENGES AND 00:27:40.191 --> 00:27:41.192 OPPORTUNITIES WE WILL 00:27:41.259 --> 00:27:42.494 COLLECTIVELY FACE BECAUSE OF 00:27:42.560 --> 00:27:44.429 THE DEVELOPMENT OF ADVANCED AI 00:27:44.496 --> 00:27:46.564 SYSTEMS. MY INTENTION IS TO 00:27:46.631 --> 00:27:48.166 GIVE AN INTERACTIVE TALK WHILE 00:27:48.233 --> 00:27:49.267 I HAVE PREPARED A SLIDE DECK. 00:27:49.334 --> 00:27:51.202 MY GOAL IS TO SUPPORT YOU AND 00:27:51.269 --> 00:27:52.337 PROVIDE WHATEVER PERSPECTIVES I 00:27:52.404 --> 00:27:54.139 CAN THAT ARE OF INTEREST TO YOU. 00:27:54.205 --> 00:27:55.340 SO PLEASE FEEL VERY WELCOME TO 00:27:55.407 --> 00:27:56.374 INTERJECT AND ASK QUESTIONS. 00:27:56.441 --> 00:27:59.911 THIS CAN BE A CONVERSATION. SO 00:27:59.978 --> 00:28:00.979 I'VE ORGANIZED THIS TALK TO 00:28:01.046 --> 00:28:02.714 GIVE AN OVERVIEW OF WHAT I SEE 00:28:02.781 --> 00:28:04.682 AS A COMPOSITE CHALLENGE. AND 00:28:04.749 --> 00:28:06.151 WE'LL START BY TALKING ABOUT 00:28:06.217 --> 00:28:07.886 THE TIMELINES, WHAT KINDS OF 00:28:07.952 --> 00:28:10.021 RISKS ARE COMING, WHEN AND HOW. 00:28:10.088 --> 00:28:11.356 AND THEN WE'LL TALK ABOUT SOME 00:28:11.423 --> 00:28:12.590 OF THE THINGS WE MIGHT BE ABLE 00:28:12.657 --> 00:28:14.826 TO DO ABOUT THEM. Ó DO I HAVE 00:28:14.893 --> 00:28:16.761 THE ABILITY TO MOVE THE SLIDE 00:28:16.828 --> 00:28:18.663 DECK? OKAY, GREAT. A LITTLE BIT 00:28:18.730 --> 00:28:21.466 ABOUT ME. SO I, LIKE THE 00:28:21.533 --> 00:28:23.301 SENATOR SAID, I GRADUATED FROM 00:28:23.368 --> 00:28:25.103 OPENAI A FEW MONTHS AGO, SO 00:28:25.170 --> 00:28:26.471 THREE, THREE MONTHS NOW THAT 00:28:26.538 --> 00:28:27.605 I'VE BEEN INDEPENDENT. 00:28:27.672 --> 00:28:29.074 ORIGINALLY, I STUDIED AEROSPACE 00:28:29.140 --> 00:28:30.575 ENGINEERING AND PHYSICS AT THE 00:28:30.642 --> 00:28:31.976 UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA, GO 00:28:32.043 --> 00:28:34.112 GATORS, AND I DID MY PHD AT UC 00:28:34.179 --> 00:28:36.281 BERKELEY STARTING IN 2014. I 00:28:36.347 --> 00:28:39.517 GRADUATED IN 21. I STUDIED DEEP 00:28:39.584 --> 00:28:40.985 REINFORCEMENT LEARNING. AND 00:28:41.052 --> 00:28:42.187 JOSHUA, CAN I JUST I WANT TO 00:28:42.253 --> 00:28:44.055 GIVE YOU THE OPPORTUNITY TO SAY 00:28:44.122 --> 00:28:47.092 GO BEARS AS WELL. GO BEARS 100%. 00:28:47.158 --> 00:28:49.227 SO YEAH, I WORKED ON 00:28:49.294 --> 00:28:49.994 REINFORCEMENT LEARNING AND 00:28:50.061 --> 00:28:51.396 SAFETY KIND OF BEFORE ALL OF 00:28:51.463 --> 00:28:52.564 THIS TOOK OFF AND BECAME A 00:28:52.630 --> 00:28:54.365 MAJOR CONSUMER PRODUCT. I WAS 00:28:54.432 --> 00:28:57.535 AT OPENAI FROM MID 2017 UNTIL 00:28:57.602 --> 00:28:59.737 JULY THIS YEAR. I, LIKE THE 00:28:59.804 --> 00:29:01.072 SENATOR, SAID. I WORKED ON 00:29:01.139 --> 00:29:02.140 ALIGNMENT AND SAFETY TOPICS AS 00:29:02.207 --> 00:29:03.441 A RESEARCHER. I ALSO WORKED IN 00:29:03.508 --> 00:29:06.177 THE COMPANY'S LEADERSHIP. SO 00:29:06.244 --> 00:29:08.346 STARTING IN SEPTEMBER 2024, I 00:29:08.413 --> 00:29:10.048 WAS THE HEAD OF MISSION 00:29:10.115 --> 00:29:11.182 ALIGNMENT. I WORKED ON TRYING 00:29:11.249 --> 00:29:13.084 TO HELP THE COMPANY AS A WHOLE 00:29:13.151 --> 00:29:14.052 UNDERSTAND AND INTERNALIZE ITS 00:29:14.119 --> 00:29:15.186 MISSION TO ENSURE THAT 00:29:15.253 --> 00:29:16.221 ARTIFICIAL GENERAL INTELLIGENCE 00:29:16.287 --> 00:29:18.790 BENEFITS ALL OF HUMANITY. AND I 00:29:18.857 --> 00:29:19.924 WORKED WITH A NUMBER OF FOLKS 00:29:19.991 --> 00:29:21.326 ACROSS THE COMPANY TO 00:29:21.392 --> 00:29:22.160 SYSTEMATICALLY STUDY THE TYPES 00:29:22.227 --> 00:29:24.162 OF RISKS THAT WOULD UNFOLD, NOT 00:29:24.229 --> 00:29:25.563 JUST ON THE TECHNICAL SAFETY 00:29:25.630 --> 00:29:29.200 SIDE, BUT ON THE IMPACTS TO TO 00:29:29.267 --> 00:29:29.901 PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, AROUND THE 00:29:29.968 --> 00:29:31.703 WORLD AND THE ECONOMY, SOCIAL 00:29:31.769 --> 00:29:33.872 IMPACTS, POLITICAL IMPACTS, 00:29:33.938 --> 00:29:35.340 IMPACTS ON INTERNATIONAL 00:29:35.406 --> 00:29:37.876 SECURITY. AND TODAY, I'LL BE 00:29:37.942 --> 00:29:38.977 TALKING ABOUT THESE TYPES OF 00:29:39.043 --> 00:29:40.745 THINGS. I ALSO JUST STARTED TWO 00:29:40.812 --> 00:29:42.147 WEEKS AGO AS A NONRESIDENT 00:29:42.213 --> 00:29:44.048 SENIOR FELLOW AFFILIATED WITH 00:29:44.115 --> 00:29:46.518 THE INSTITUTE FOR PROGRESS AND 00:29:46.584 --> 00:29:47.552 ALSO WITH THE FOUNDATION FOR 00:29:47.619 --> 00:29:48.987 AMERICAN INNOVATION. SO I'M 00:29:49.053 --> 00:29:50.355 EXCITED TO BE WORKING WITH A 00:29:50.421 --> 00:29:51.523 NUMBER OF COLLEAGUES ACROSS THE 00:29:51.589 --> 00:29:52.957 SPACE ON THINKING THROUGH THE 00:29:53.024 --> 00:29:58.096 POLICY CHALLENGES AHEAD. OKAY, 00:29:58.163 --> 00:30:02.066 THERE WE GO. GREAT. SO. I THINK 00:30:02.133 --> 00:30:03.601 THE FIRST THING WE'VE GOT TO 00:30:03.668 --> 00:30:05.503 TALK ABOUT IS SUPERINTELLIGENCE 00:30:05.570 --> 00:30:06.938 AND RECURSIVE SELF-IMPROVEMENT. 00:30:07.005 --> 00:30:08.740 THESE ARE TERMS THAT ARE NOW 00:30:08.806 --> 00:30:09.908 GETTING A LITTLE BIT CONFUSED, 00:30:09.974 --> 00:30:11.709 BECAUSE WE HAVE NOW SUPER SPACE 00:30:11.776 --> 00:30:13.077 INTELLIGENCE, WHICH IS A LITTLE 00:30:13.144 --> 00:30:14.312 BIT OF A DIFFERENT THING THAN I 00:30:14.379 --> 00:30:16.147 MEAN TO TALK ABOUT HERE. BUT 00:30:16.214 --> 00:30:17.315 FOR, FOR MANY YEARS IN THE 00:30:17.382 --> 00:30:21.252 FIELD OF AI, THE EXPECTATION 00:30:21.319 --> 00:30:23.188 WAS THAT ADVANCES IN GENERAL 00:30:23.254 --> 00:30:24.622 PURPOSE AI WOULD ULTIMATELY 00:30:24.689 --> 00:30:26.457 CULMINATE IN SYSTEMS THAT WERE 00:30:26.524 --> 00:30:27.492 SUFFICIENTLY ADVANCED AND 00:30:27.559 --> 00:30:29.694 SUFFICIENTLY CAPABLE THAT, ONE, 00:30:29.761 --> 00:30:31.129 THEY COULD OUTPERFORM HUMANS AT 00:30:31.196 --> 00:30:32.564 BASICALLY ANY TYPES OF TASKS. 00:30:32.630 --> 00:30:34.732 AND TWO, THAT WOULD INCLUDE THE 00:30:34.799 --> 00:30:36.868 TASKS RELATED TO BUILDING MORE 00:30:36.935 --> 00:30:38.736 CAPABLE AI MODELS, AND THAT YOU 00:30:38.803 --> 00:30:40.405 COULD START A CHAIN REACTION AT 00:30:40.471 --> 00:30:41.506 A CERTAIN POINT WHERE THE 00:30:41.573 --> 00:30:42.540 MODELS WOULD DESIGN MORE 00:30:42.607 --> 00:30:43.675 EFFECTIVE, MORE CAPABLE 00:30:43.741 --> 00:30:45.543 SUCCESSORS AND ANY CAPABILITY 00:30:45.610 --> 00:30:47.812 THAT THEY HAD LIMITATIONS ON AS 00:30:47.879 --> 00:30:49.113 LONG AS THEY HAD SUITABLE 00:30:49.180 --> 00:30:50.582 ENVIRONMENTS FOR LEARNING, IN 00:30:50.648 --> 00:30:51.950 AS LONG AS THEY HAD THE ABILITY 00:30:52.016 --> 00:30:53.084 TO INTERFACE TO THE PHYSICAL 00:30:53.151 --> 00:30:54.852 WORLD AND GATHER WHAT DATA THEY 00:30:54.919 --> 00:30:55.954 NEEDED, THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO 00:30:56.020 --> 00:30:58.089 IMPROVE THEIR OWN CAPABILITIES. 00:30:58.156 --> 00:30:59.190 AND THIS COULD HAPPEN 00:30:59.257 --> 00:31:02.493 RELATIVELY RAPIDLY. IT'S THE 00:31:02.560 --> 00:31:05.330 CASE THAT TODAY THE FRONTIER AI 00:31:05.396 --> 00:31:07.098 MODELS ARE ALREADY, IN SOME 00:31:07.165 --> 00:31:08.600 SENSE SUPERINTELLIGENT. THERE 00:31:08.666 --> 00:31:10.134 ARE MANY DOMAINS WHERE, WHILE 00:31:10.201 --> 00:31:12.103 THEIR CAPABILITIES ARE NOT EVEN 00:31:12.170 --> 00:31:13.571 ACROSS ALL THE DOMAINS, IN SOME 00:31:13.638 --> 00:31:14.872 DOMAINS, THEY FAR EXCEED THE 00:31:14.939 --> 00:31:17.542 BEST HUMANS. AND WE THINK THAT 00:31:17.609 --> 00:31:19.344 THE ANTICIPATED RECURSIVE 00:31:19.410 --> 00:31:20.545 SELF-IMPROVEMENT LOOPS COULD 00:31:20.612 --> 00:31:21.846 HAPPEN WITHIN THE NEXT COUPLE 00:31:21.913 --> 00:31:23.314 OF YEARS. MANY LEADING 00:31:23.381 --> 00:31:24.249 SCIENTISTS IN THE FIELD HAVE 00:31:24.315 --> 00:31:26.184 MADE REMARKS TO THIS EFFECT, 00:31:26.251 --> 00:31:28.586 AND INCLUDING JAKUB Kò, THE 00:31:28.653 --> 00:31:30.188 CHIEF SCIENTIST AT OPENAI, WHO 00:31:30.255 --> 00:31:31.956 WROTE AN ESSAY, AN ALIEN MIND, 00:31:32.023 --> 00:31:33.725 RECENTLY THAT TALKED ABOUT THE 00:31:33.791 --> 00:31:36.294 POTENTIAL CONSEQUENCES OF THIS. 00:31:36.361 --> 00:31:40.565 SO I THINK THE SPEED OF AI 00:31:40.632 --> 00:31:42.734 DEVELOPMENT IS INCREDIBLY FAST 00:31:42.800 --> 00:31:44.235 COMPARED TO PREVIOUS 00:31:44.302 --> 00:31:45.637 TECHNOLOGICAL DEVELOPMENTS. 00:31:45.703 --> 00:31:47.138 THIS IS A QUALITATIVE SHIFT IN 00:31:47.205 --> 00:31:48.873 HOW WE SHOULD THINK ABOUT THE 00:31:48.940 --> 00:31:49.941 DEVELOPMENT OF POLICY FOR 00:31:50.008 --> 00:31:52.477 NAVIGATING THE SAFETY ISSUES. 00:31:52.543 --> 00:31:55.980 NEXT SLIDE. I WANT TO DRIVE 00:31:56.047 --> 00:31:57.515 HOME THE POINT ABOUT THE SPEED 00:31:57.582 --> 00:31:58.983 BY POINTING TO A COUPLE OF 00:31:59.050 --> 00:32:01.085 EXAMPLES FROM HISTORY, WHERE AI 00:32:01.152 --> 00:32:02.153 CAPABILITIES WENT VERY QUICKLY 00:32:02.220 --> 00:32:03.988 FROM WHAT COULD BE DESCRIBED 00:32:04.055 --> 00:32:05.957 FAIRLY AS A JANKY PROTOTYPE 00:32:06.024 --> 00:32:07.625 THAT BARELY WORKED TO 00:32:07.692 --> 00:32:09.360 SUPERHUMAN CAPABILITIES. 00:32:09.427 --> 00:32:10.828 ALPHAGO IS THE FIRST CANONICAL 00:32:10.895 --> 00:32:14.899 EXAMPLE. IN OCTOBER 2012, THERE 00:32:14.966 --> 00:32:16.301 WAS A RESULT PUBLISHED THAT 00:32:16.367 --> 00:32:18.069 DEEP CONVOLUTIONAL NEURAL 00:32:18.136 --> 00:32:20.204 NETWORKS COULD SUCCEED AT IMAGE 00:32:20.271 --> 00:32:21.239 RECOGNITION TASKS THAT 00:32:21.306 --> 00:32:22.707 PREVIOUSLY REQUIRED VERY 00:32:22.774 --> 00:32:23.775 SPECIALIZED, HANDCRAFTED 00:32:23.841 --> 00:32:25.977 METHODS THAT THEY COULD 00:32:26.044 --> 00:32:27.011 OUTPERFORM PREVIOUS METHODS BY 00:32:27.078 --> 00:32:29.580 A LARGE MARGIN. AND THIS WAS A 00:32:29.647 --> 00:32:31.316 GREAT SURPRISE TO MOST OF THE 00:32:31.382 --> 00:32:33.184 COMPUTER VISION COMMUNITY. THIS 00:32:33.251 --> 00:32:35.687 WASN'T AN EXPECTED RESULT, BUT 00:32:35.753 --> 00:32:36.788 THE IMAGE RECOGNITION MODELS 00:32:36.854 --> 00:32:37.955 THAT WERE BEING TRAINED WITH 00:32:38.022 --> 00:32:39.791 THIS KIND OF AI WERE STILL NOT 00:32:39.857 --> 00:32:41.793 VERY GOOD. THEY WERE A 00:32:41.859 --> 00:32:42.894 PROTOTYPE. THEY WERE A VERY 00:32:42.960 --> 00:32:43.861 PROMISING PROTOTYPE, AND THE 00:32:43.928 --> 00:32:46.130 FIELD BEGAN TO MOVE AROUND THIS. 00:32:46.197 --> 00:32:48.266 WHAT HAPPENED OVER THE NEXT FEW 00:32:48.333 --> 00:32:50.802 YEARS WAS EXTRAORDINARILY RAPID 00:32:50.868 --> 00:32:52.236 PROGRESS, WHERE THE OBSTACLES 00:32:52.303 --> 00:32:53.838 FELL QUICKLY. TECHNICAL METHODS 00:32:53.905 --> 00:32:55.840 GOT MUCH BETTER. THE HARDWARE 00:32:55.907 --> 00:32:57.008 IMPROVED, THE SOFTWARE STACK 00:32:57.075 --> 00:32:57.942 FOR TRAINING. THESE THINGS 00:32:58.009 --> 00:33:00.111 IMPROVED, AND ABOUT THREE AND A 00:33:00.178 --> 00:33:02.680 HALF YEARS LATER, A DEEP 00:33:02.747 --> 00:33:03.281 CONVOLUTIONAL NEURAL NETWORK 00:33:03.348 --> 00:33:05.049 WAS TRAINED WITH A COMBINATION 00:33:05.116 --> 00:33:06.217 OF TECHNIQUES THAT HAD BEEN 00:33:06.284 --> 00:33:07.285 DEVELOPED OVER THE PREVIOUS FEW 00:33:07.352 --> 00:33:09.120 YEARS TO OUTPERFORM THE BEST 00:33:09.187 --> 00:33:10.555 HUMAN GRANDMASTER IN THE 00:33:10.621 --> 00:33:12.423 STRATEGY GAME OF GO. GO IS 00:33:12.490 --> 00:33:13.458 CONSIDERED TO BE AN EXTREMELY 00:33:13.524 --> 00:33:15.259 DIFFICULT PROBLEM FOR AI 00:33:15.326 --> 00:33:16.761 SYSTEMS TO SOLVE, OR AT LEAST 00:33:16.828 --> 00:33:17.895 IT WAS CONSIDERED AN EXTREMELY 00:33:17.962 --> 00:33:20.665 DIFFICULT PROBLEM BACK THEN. 00:33:20.732 --> 00:33:23.101 THIS WAS A GREAT SURPRISE TO 00:33:23.167 --> 00:33:24.635 THE FIELD. I PERSONALLY WAS 00:33:24.702 --> 00:33:26.070 WATCHING LIVE AS THE GAMES 00:33:26.137 --> 00:33:27.271 UNFOLDED. I WAS VERY EXCITED 00:33:27.338 --> 00:33:28.673 FOR AI PROGRESS. IN THE FIRST 00:33:28.740 --> 00:33:30.274 GAME, I WAS PRETTY JAZZED THAT 00:33:30.341 --> 00:33:31.676 THE AI WON AND THE SECOND GAME 00:33:31.743 --> 00:33:33.311 I WAS EXCITED BUT GETTING A 00:33:33.378 --> 00:33:34.445 LITTLE NERVOUS IN THE THIRD 00:33:34.512 --> 00:33:36.647 GAME WHEN THE AI WON. ON THE 00:33:36.714 --> 00:33:38.516 ONE HAND, IT WAS A GREAT 00:33:38.583 --> 00:33:39.517 TECHNICAL ACHIEVEMENT AND ON 00:33:39.584 --> 00:33:42.987 THE OTHER HAND IT ALSO WAS THE 00:33:43.054 --> 00:33:45.857 END OF AN ERA WHERE THE BEST GO 00:33:45.923 --> 00:33:46.991 PLAYER IN THE WORLD WAS NO 00:33:47.058 --> 00:33:48.926 LONGER GOING TO BE A HUMAN. THE 00:33:48.993 --> 00:33:50.027 FOURTH GAME, WHERE LEE SEDOL 00:33:50.094 --> 00:33:51.863 MANAGED TO TAKE ONE OFF ALPHAGO, 00:33:51.929 --> 00:33:53.264 WAS PROBABLY THE LAST TIME THAT 00:33:53.331 --> 00:33:54.465 A HUMAN GRANDMASTER WOULD BE 00:33:54.532 --> 00:33:56.200 ABLE TO DEFEAT ONE OF THESE 00:33:56.267 --> 00:33:58.403 SYSTEMS. THIS IS THE TRAJECTORY 00:33:58.469 --> 00:34:01.706 FOR MANY FIELDS GOING FORWARD. 00:34:01.773 --> 00:34:07.078 NEXT SLIDE. I DON'T KNOW THAT I. 00:34:07.145 --> 00:34:10.381 OKAY, GREAT. OH, PREVIOUS ONE, 00:34:10.448 --> 00:34:12.016 IF I CLICK THE BUTTON, DOES IT 00:34:12.083 --> 00:34:13.317 ACTUALLY DO THE THING OR I HAVE 00:34:13.384 --> 00:34:15.186 A CLICKER? OH MY GOSH, I HAVE A 00:34:15.253 --> 00:34:22.360 CLICKER. OKAY, GREAT. I DON'T 00:34:22.427 --> 00:34:24.862 KNOW IF IT DOES THE THING. GIVE 00:34:24.929 --> 00:34:27.999 ME BACK ONE MORE. THERE WE GO. 00:34:28.065 --> 00:34:30.001 SO I WANT TO, I WANT TO DRIVE 00:34:30.067 --> 00:34:32.303 THIS POINT HOME ABOUT HOW ABOUT 00:34:32.370 --> 00:34:34.105 THREE, FOUR YEARS IS A TIMELINE 00:34:34.172 --> 00:34:35.940 FROM PROTOTYPE CAPABILITY TO 00:34:36.007 --> 00:34:38.776 SUPERHUMAN CAPABILITY. ABOUT 00:34:38.843 --> 00:34:40.211 THREE, FOUR YEARS AGO, THREE 00:34:40.278 --> 00:34:42.046 AND A HALF YEARS AGO, WE 00:34:42.113 --> 00:34:43.448 RELEASED OPENAI RELEASED GPT 00:34:43.514 --> 00:34:46.717 FOUR. THIS WAS CONSIDERED TO BE 00:34:46.784 --> 00:34:49.187 THE BEST FRONTIER AI MODEL AT 00:34:49.253 --> 00:34:50.354 THE TIME, BAR NONE. THIS WAS 00:34:50.421 --> 00:34:52.190 THE KIND OF MODEL THAT PEOPLE 00:34:52.256 --> 00:34:53.291 WERE TALKING ABOUT. FOR 1047, 00:34:53.357 --> 00:34:55.293 IT WAS ABLE TO DO A VERY WIDE 00:34:55.359 --> 00:34:57.195 RANGE OF THINGS, AT LEAST A 00:34:57.261 --> 00:34:58.196 LITTLE BIT, AND ITS 00:34:58.262 --> 00:35:00.398 MATHEMATICAL CAPABILITIES WERE 00:35:00.465 --> 00:35:02.166 VISIBLE BUT NOT VERY DEVELOPED. 00:35:02.233 --> 00:35:04.001 YOU COULD GET IT TO MAYBE SOLVE 00:35:04.068 --> 00:35:05.803 SOME VERY BASIC BENCHMARK 00:35:05.870 --> 00:35:06.938 PROBLEMS FOR THE KIND OF MATH 00:35:07.004 --> 00:35:08.806 THAT MAYBE YOU WOULD DO IN 00:35:08.873 --> 00:35:09.974 GRADE SCHOOL, BUT IF YOU ASKED 00:35:10.041 --> 00:35:11.008 IT TO DO SOMETHING 00:35:11.075 --> 00:35:12.009 SOPHISTICATED IN MATHEMATICAL 00:35:12.076 --> 00:35:12.944 RESEARCH, IT JUST OBVIOUSLY 00:35:13.010 --> 00:35:13.945 COULDN'T IT DIDN'T HAVE THAT 00:35:14.011 --> 00:35:15.079 KNOWLEDGE. IT DIDN'T HAVE THAT 00:35:15.146 --> 00:35:17.081 CAPABILITY. WELL, YOU GET LESS 00:35:17.148 --> 00:35:18.316 THAN A YEAR LATER IN REASONING 00:35:18.382 --> 00:35:19.984 MODELS ARE DEVELOPED. SO THESE 00:35:20.051 --> 00:35:21.152 ARE THE MODELS THAT CAN THINK 00:35:21.219 --> 00:35:23.054 FOR A WHILE BEFORE THEY COME UP 00:35:23.120 --> 00:35:24.188 WITH AN ANSWER. AND THEY'RE 00:35:24.255 --> 00:35:25.990 SUDDENLY ABLE TO DO THE BASICS 00:35:26.057 --> 00:35:27.258 OF MATH, BUT NOT VERY WELL. YOU 00:35:27.325 --> 00:35:29.093 GET A FEW MONTHS AFTER THAT, 00:35:29.160 --> 00:35:30.228 AND NOW YOU'VE GOT AI SYSTEMS 00:35:30.294 --> 00:35:32.063 THAT CAN OUTPERFORM HUMANS IN 00:35:32.129 --> 00:35:34.198 COMPETITIONS FOR FAIRLY HARD, 00:35:34.265 --> 00:35:35.299 CHALLENGING MATHEMATICAL 00:35:35.366 --> 00:35:37.101 PROBLEMS. YOU GET A YEAR AFTER 00:35:37.168 --> 00:35:39.971 THAT, AND THE AI IS NOW 00:35:40.037 --> 00:35:41.172 RESOLVING OPEN CONJECTURES THAT 00:35:41.239 --> 00:35:43.574 HAVE STOOD FOR FOR YEARS, MAYBE 00:35:43.641 --> 00:35:46.744 DECADES, AND JUST A MONTH AND A 00:35:46.811 --> 00:35:50.448 HALF AGO, WE SAW AI BEGIN TO 00:35:50.515 --> 00:35:52.250 SOLVE SOME OF THE HARDEST, MOST 00:35:52.316 --> 00:35:53.684 ADVANCED FRONTIER MATHEMATICAL 00:35:53.751 --> 00:35:56.220 PROBLEMS. THE NAVIER-STOKES 00:35:56.287 --> 00:35:58.389 RESULT WAS ASTONISHING. THIS 00:35:58.456 --> 00:36:00.124 WAS SHOCKING TO THE MATHEMATICS 00:36:00.191 --> 00:36:01.225 COMMUNITY. THIS WAS SHOCKING TO 00:36:01.292 --> 00:36:03.027 A NUMBER OF OBSERVERS WHO 00:36:03.094 --> 00:36:04.128 WEREN'T SURE WHEN OR HOW AI 00:36:04.195 --> 00:36:05.563 WOULD REACH THIS LEVEL OF 00:36:05.630 --> 00:36:08.065 CAPABILITY. AND THEN A FEW 00:36:08.132 --> 00:36:09.534 WEEKS LATER, THERE WAS A 00:36:09.600 --> 00:36:12.003 RELEASE OF SOLUTIONS TO SEVERAL 00:36:12.069 --> 00:36:13.404 HUNDRED OPEN MATHEMATICAL 00:36:13.471 --> 00:36:15.640 PROBLEMS THAT NOW THERE'S A 00:36:15.706 --> 00:36:16.674 CRISIS IN THE FIELD OF 00:36:16.741 --> 00:36:18.843 MATHEMATICS IN THAT WHAT 00:36:18.910 --> 00:36:20.011 PREVIOUSLY WAS UNDERSTOOD TO BE 00:36:20.077 --> 00:36:22.446 THE WORK THAT HUMANS WOULD 00:36:22.513 --> 00:36:23.881 ORGANIZE THEIR CAREERS AROUND, 00:36:23.948 --> 00:36:25.750 THAT PEOPLE WOULD SPEND THEIR 00:36:25.816 --> 00:36:26.717 ENTIRE LIVES DEVELOPING. THE 00:36:26.784 --> 00:36:28.185 EXPERTISE WAS NOW SOMETHING 00:36:28.252 --> 00:36:32.557 THAT THE AI COULD DO, COULD DO 00:36:32.623 --> 00:36:33.624 UNFATHOMABLY FASTER THAN PEOPLE 00:36:33.691 --> 00:36:37.228 COULD. SO THE IMPLICATIONS FOR 00:36:37.295 --> 00:36:38.095 MANY OTHER FIELDS. LET'S GO TO 00:36:38.162 --> 00:36:40.431 THE NEXT SLIDE. THE 00:36:40.498 --> 00:36:42.266 IMPLICATIONS FOR MANY OTHER 00:36:42.333 --> 00:36:44.435 FIELDS SHOULD BE CLEAR THAT ON 00:36:44.502 --> 00:36:46.304 THIS SMALL, SINGLE DIGIT TIME 00:36:46.370 --> 00:36:48.039 FRAME, YOU CAN GO FROM VERY 00:36:48.105 --> 00:36:49.473 LIMITED PROTOTYPE TO 00:36:49.540 --> 00:36:50.541 EXCEEDINGLY SUPERHUMAN 00:36:50.608 --> 00:36:51.943 CAPABILITY THAT CAN PRODUCE A 00:36:52.009 --> 00:36:53.411 CRISIS IN A FIELD. THIS WILL 00:36:53.477 --> 00:36:55.947 HAPPEN FOR EVERY FIELD WHERE 00:36:56.013 --> 00:36:57.415 YOU CAN FORMULATE THE PROBLEMS 00:36:57.481 --> 00:36:58.849 IN TERMS THAT CAN BE CHECKED ON 00:36:58.916 --> 00:37:01.319 A COMPUTER, WHICH INCLUDES MANY 00:37:01.385 --> 00:37:03.487 EXTREMELY CRITICAL FIELDS LIKE 00:37:03.554 --> 00:37:05.323 CRYPTOGRAPHY, QUANTUM COMPUTING, 00:37:05.389 --> 00:37:08.192 FUNDAMENTAL PHYSICS, WE SHOULD 00:37:08.259 --> 00:37:09.260 ANTICIPATE RAPID PROGRESS IN 00:37:09.327 --> 00:37:11.796 ALL OF THESE. WHERE THIS MAY 00:37:11.862 --> 00:37:13.965 SOUND, THIS MAY SOUND LIKE IT'S 00:37:14.031 --> 00:37:14.932 PRETTY DISCONNECTED FROM THE 00:37:14.999 --> 00:37:16.100 LIVES OF ORDINARY PEOPLE, BUT I 00:37:16.167 --> 00:37:17.935 WANT TO ASSURE YOU THAT IT 00:37:18.002 --> 00:37:20.071 ISN'T. BECAUSE ULTIMATELY, THE 00:37:20.137 --> 00:37:21.172 FOUNDATIONS OF OUR DAILY LIVES 00:37:21.238 --> 00:37:22.940 ARE BUILT ON SCIENCE AND 00:37:23.007 --> 00:37:24.408 TECHNOLOGY, ARE BUILT ON WHAT 00:37:24.475 --> 00:37:25.576 TECHNOLOGY MAKES POSSIBLE. WHAT 00:37:25.643 --> 00:37:26.944 SEEM LIKE DISTANT THEORETICAL 00:37:27.011 --> 00:37:28.713 ADVANCES HAVE SOME IMPACT ON 00:37:28.779 --> 00:37:29.780 YOUR STANDARD OF LIVING, YOUR 00:37:29.847 --> 00:37:31.415 QUALITY OF LIFE IN THE NEAR 00:37:31.482 --> 00:37:33.017 TERM, ESPECIALLY IF. LET'S GO 00:37:33.084 --> 00:37:35.019 TO THE NEXT SLIDE, ESPECIALLY 00:37:35.086 --> 00:37:36.954 IF THESE THINGS ARE IMPACTING 00:37:37.021 --> 00:37:39.557 CYBERSECURITY. SO JUST TODAY ON 00:37:39.624 --> 00:37:41.492 THE CAR RIDE OVER, I SAW THIS 00:37:41.559 --> 00:37:43.094 THING UNFOLDING WHERE THERE IS 00:37:43.160 --> 00:37:44.895 A SIMULTANEOUS JOINT RELEASE. 00:37:44.962 --> 00:37:46.530 THE NSA IS COMING. COMMENTING 00:37:46.597 --> 00:37:48.099 ON THIS, THE PHP FOUNDATION IS 00:37:48.165 --> 00:37:50.668 COMMENTING ON THIS. OPENAI AND 00:37:50.735 --> 00:37:52.470 OTHER AI ORGANIZATIONS ARE 00:37:52.536 --> 00:37:53.671 ENGAGED ON THIS AND LEADING ON 00:37:53.738 --> 00:37:56.407 THIS. THERE ARE CRITICAL 00:37:56.474 --> 00:37:57.408 VULNERABILITIES THAT EXIST IN 00:37:57.475 --> 00:37:59.010 THE SOFTWARE LAYERS THAT WE USE 00:37:59.076 --> 00:38:02.046 FOR COMMERCE, FOR CONDUCTING 00:38:02.113 --> 00:38:03.314 ALL OF THE BASIC ACTIVITIES OF 00:38:03.381 --> 00:38:04.815 OUR DAILY LIVES. THERE ARE 00:38:04.882 --> 00:38:05.783 CRITICAL VULNERABILITIES THAT 00:38:05.850 --> 00:38:08.319 HAVE BEEN IN THE CODE THAT WE 00:38:08.386 --> 00:38:10.488 DEPEND ON FOR YEARS THAT 00:38:10.554 --> 00:38:11.889 HAVEN'T BEEN OBSERVED, BUT AI 00:38:11.956 --> 00:38:14.025 SYSTEMS ARE NOW ENABLING THE 00:38:14.091 --> 00:38:15.426 SYSTEMATIC DISCOVERY OF ALL OF 00:38:15.493 --> 00:38:17.628 THESE VULNERABILITIES. THIS 00:38:17.695 --> 00:38:19.397 MEANS WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO 00:38:19.463 --> 00:38:21.232 RAPIDLY UPDATE THE ENTIRE CYBER 00:38:21.298 --> 00:38:22.366 INFRASTRUCTURE OF THE WORLD TO 00:38:22.433 --> 00:38:23.434 ACCOMMODATE THIS. AND THIS WILL 00:38:23.501 --> 00:38:25.469 HAPPEN AT A PACE AND AT A SCALE 00:38:25.536 --> 00:38:26.537 THAT PEOPLE MIGHT NOT BE ABLE 00:38:26.604 --> 00:38:28.839 TO KEEP UP WITH. THERE WILL BE 00:38:28.906 --> 00:38:30.541 A THERE WILL BE A CRISIS IN 00:38:30.608 --> 00:38:31.575 MAINTAINING CYBER SYSTEMS THAT 00:38:31.642 --> 00:38:33.344 WE CAN DEPEND ON. NEXT SLIDE. 00:38:33.411 --> 00:38:36.981 OR. THIS DOESN'T JUST STAY 00:38:37.048 --> 00:38:38.883 LIMITED TO THE WORLD OF BITS, 00:38:38.949 --> 00:38:40.785 TO THE THINGS THAT HAPPEN ON A 00:38:40.851 --> 00:38:41.919 COMPUTER. THIS WILL ALSO IMPACT 00:38:41.986 --> 00:38:43.487 THE WORLD OF ATOMS, THE 00:38:43.554 --> 00:38:44.522 PHYSICAL SPACES, AND THE 00:38:44.588 --> 00:38:45.256 PHYSICAL STRUCTURES THAT WE 00:38:45.322 --> 00:38:46.924 INTERACT WITH. TURNS OUT AN 00:38:46.991 --> 00:38:48.059 AWFUL LOT OF ENGINEERING DESIGN 00:38:48.125 --> 00:38:49.226 CAN BE DONE ON COMPUTERS, AND 00:38:49.293 --> 00:38:51.028 SO YOU CAN GET THE AI TO 00:38:51.095 --> 00:38:51.962 SYSTEMATICALLY EXPLORE THE 00:38:52.029 --> 00:38:53.898 SPACE OF WHAT IT WOULD TAKE TO 00:38:53.964 --> 00:38:56.100 BUILD THINGS. IT CAN MAKE 00:38:56.167 --> 00:38:57.535 SCIENTIFIC DISCOVERIES IN 00:38:57.601 --> 00:38:59.303 MATERIAL SCIENCE. IT CAN TRY TO 00:38:59.370 --> 00:39:01.872 DESIGN NEW THINGS YOU COULD 00:39:01.939 --> 00:39:05.076 BUILD THAT MIGHT CONSTITUTE, 00:39:05.142 --> 00:39:07.244 LET'S SAY, IN INTERNATIONAL 00:39:07.311 --> 00:39:09.013 SECURITY, THE BASIS OF NATIONAL 00:39:09.080 --> 00:39:10.147 POWER. YOU KNOW, PEOPLE ARE 00:39:10.214 --> 00:39:11.816 GOING TO BE USING THESE TO 00:39:11.882 --> 00:39:12.983 DESIGN NEW WEAPON SYSTEMS VERY 00:39:13.050 --> 00:39:14.752 QUICKLY. PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE 00:39:14.819 --> 00:39:15.920 USING THESE TO DESIGN PROCESSES 00:39:15.986 --> 00:39:16.921 THAT RADICALLY REDUCE THE COST 00:39:16.987 --> 00:39:18.556 OF PRODUCTION IN DIFFERENT 00:39:18.622 --> 00:39:20.891 AREAS OF THE ECONOMY. THIS WILL 00:39:20.958 --> 00:39:23.794 CHANGE THE PRICE STRUCTURE THAT 00:39:23.861 --> 00:39:26.330 UNDERGIRDS THE ECONOMY. AND 00:39:26.397 --> 00:39:28.332 THERE ARE MANY EXTERNALITIES 00:39:28.399 --> 00:39:29.400 THAT WILL COME FROM THIS. THIS 00:39:29.467 --> 00:39:31.168 IS A SURPRISE. WE'RE GOING TO 00:39:31.235 --> 00:39:33.104 HAVE TO REORIENT HOW WE DO AN 00:39:33.170 --> 00:39:34.972 AWFUL LOT OF THINGS AROUND THIS. 00:39:35.039 --> 00:39:36.474 AND I'LL GET TO THE CONNECTION 00:39:36.540 --> 00:39:37.475 ON SAFETY. BUT I THINK THE 00:39:37.541 --> 00:39:39.276 DISRUPTION ITSELF IS IS QUITE 00:39:39.343 --> 00:39:40.745 PROFOUND. LET'S GO TO THE NEXT 00:39:40.811 --> 00:39:43.881 ONE. SO JUST AS A MATTER OF 00:39:43.948 --> 00:39:45.015 TIMELINE, IF WE'RE THINKING 00:39:45.082 --> 00:39:46.117 ABOUT RECURSIVE 00:39:46.183 --> 00:39:46.817 SELF-IMPROVEMENT HAPPENING 00:39:46.884 --> 00:39:48.319 WITHIN A TIME FRAME OF ROUGHLY 00:39:48.385 --> 00:39:50.421 TWO YEARS, WE'RE ALREADY SEEING 00:39:50.488 --> 00:39:51.622 SUPERHUMAN CAPABILITIES IN A 00:39:51.689 --> 00:39:53.090 NUMBER OF DOMAINS. WE'RE SEEING 00:39:53.157 --> 00:39:54.592 THE POTENTIAL FOR IMPACTS ON 00:39:54.658 --> 00:39:56.327 ALL OF THE THEORETICAL DOMAINS 00:39:56.393 --> 00:39:57.995 THAT CAN HAPPEN ON A COMPUTER, 00:39:58.062 --> 00:39:59.497 AND MANY OF THE AREAS IN THE 00:39:59.563 --> 00:40:03.300 PHYSICAL WORLD. THERE IS A LOT 00:40:03.367 --> 00:40:04.835 OF IMPACT THAT WILL UNFOLD IN 00:40:04.902 --> 00:40:05.569 MANY COMPLETELY DIFFERENT 00:40:05.636 --> 00:40:07.171 FIELDS ON THIS TIME FRAME, THAT 00:40:07.238 --> 00:40:09.173 IT WILL BE A CHALLENGE FOR 00:40:09.240 --> 00:40:10.908 POLICY MAKERS TO SYSTEMATICALLY 00:40:10.975 --> 00:40:12.777 CONSIDER WHEN THEY'RE TRYING TO 00:40:12.843 --> 00:40:14.578 ADDRESS THE SAFETY AND SECURITY 00:40:14.645 --> 00:40:16.013 ISSUES. IT WON'T JUST BE ONE 00:40:16.080 --> 00:40:17.414 THING TO PAY ATTENTION TO, IT 00:40:17.481 --> 00:40:19.383 WILL BE A VERY WIDE RANGE OF 00:40:19.450 --> 00:40:23.921 THINGS AT ONCE. NEXT ONE, BY 00:40:23.988 --> 00:40:26.090 2030, EVERYTHING THAT AI TODAY 00:40:26.157 --> 00:40:27.491 IS A JANKY PROTOTYPE AT 00:40:27.558 --> 00:40:29.126 EVERYTHING THAT AI CAN DO A 00:40:29.193 --> 00:40:30.427 LITTLE BIT, BUT NOT WELL TODAY. 00:40:30.494 --> 00:40:31.495 EVERYTHING WHERE YOU WOULD 00:40:31.562 --> 00:40:33.197 LAUGH AT THE ATTEMPT OF AI TO 00:40:33.264 --> 00:40:34.732 DO TODAY, AND WHERE PEOPLE SAY, 00:40:34.799 --> 00:40:36.467 OH YEAH, IT'S NEVER GOING TO 00:40:36.534 --> 00:40:37.701 CATCH UP WITH PEOPLE. WELL, WE 00:40:37.768 --> 00:40:39.403 SAW THE TIMELINES FOR FIELDS 00:40:39.470 --> 00:40:40.471 THAT PREVIOUSLY WERE ONLY THE 00:40:40.538 --> 00:40:41.906 EXCLUSIVE DOMAIN OF PEOPLE, 00:40:41.972 --> 00:40:43.007 ROUGHLY THREE AND A HALF YEARS 00:40:43.073 --> 00:40:45.876 TO GO FROM NOTHING TO AMAZING 00:40:45.943 --> 00:40:48.746 BY 2030. EVERYTHING THAT IS A 00:40:48.813 --> 00:40:50.181 JANKY PROTOTYPE TODAY WILL 00:40:50.247 --> 00:40:51.582 PROBABLY BE AT SUPERHUMAN 00:40:51.649 --> 00:40:53.818 CAPABILITY IN THE AI SPACE. 00:40:53.884 --> 00:40:56.654 THAT'S MOST THINGS. I WOULD BE 00:40:56.720 --> 00:40:58.522 PRETTY HARD PRESSED TO FIND 00:40:58.589 --> 00:41:00.624 SOME DOMAIN THAT I WOULD SAY IN 00:41:00.691 --> 00:41:02.059 2030, HUMANS ARE GOING TO 00:41:02.126 --> 00:41:03.127 REMAIN THE ABSOLUTE TOP OF THE 00:41:03.194 --> 00:41:07.464 FIELD AT NEXT, AND THIS IS 00:41:07.531 --> 00:41:08.933 ARRIVING AT THE SAME TIME THAT 00:41:08.999 --> 00:41:13.237 THE SOCIAL FABRIC IS STRAINING. 00:41:13.304 --> 00:41:17.541 NEXT ONE. SO THE SOCIAL FABRIC 00:41:17.608 --> 00:41:18.609 DEPENDS ON PEOPLE'S ABILITY TO 00:41:18.676 --> 00:41:20.077 CONNECT WITH EACH OTHER. 00:41:20.144 --> 00:41:21.111 DEPENDS ON PEOPLE BEING ABLE TO 00:41:21.178 --> 00:41:22.713 TAKE THE TIME, GET TO KNOW EACH 00:41:22.780 --> 00:41:24.548 OTHER, DEVELOP A BASIS OF TRUST, 00:41:24.615 --> 00:41:28.018 AND DISCUSS AND COMPROMISE. THE 00:41:28.085 --> 00:41:29.119 SOCIAL REALITY IS NOT EASY FOR 00:41:29.186 --> 00:41:30.788 A LOT OF PEOPLE. THERE ARE A 00:41:30.855 --> 00:41:32.690 LOT OF FOLKS WHO ARE FRUSTRATED 00:41:32.756 --> 00:41:34.158 BY THE POLARIZATION IN THE 00:41:34.225 --> 00:41:35.226 AMBIENT ENVIRONMENT, BY THE 00:41:35.292 --> 00:41:36.460 TENOR OF A LOT OF DISCUSSIONS 00:41:36.527 --> 00:41:37.962 THAT THAT LIKE TO, THAT ARE, 00:41:38.028 --> 00:41:39.530 THAT ARE CHECKING OUT. WE KNOW 00:41:39.597 --> 00:41:41.632 THAT LONELINESS IS KIND OF A 00:41:41.699 --> 00:41:42.766 PANDEMIC THAT PEOPLE HAVE BEEN 00:41:42.833 --> 00:41:44.168 TALKING ABOUT FOR FOR YEARS. 00:41:44.235 --> 00:41:46.337 WELL, WE NOW HAVE AI SYSTEMS 00:41:46.403 --> 00:41:48.906 THAT ARE CAPABLE OF FULLY 00:41:48.973 --> 00:41:50.674 SYNTHESIZING A HUMAN SOCIAL 00:41:50.741 --> 00:41:52.810 INTERACTION. SO THE SLIDE HERE 00:41:52.877 --> 00:41:56.113 IS FROM A MODEL RELEASE 00:41:56.180 --> 00:41:57.915 RECENTLY, A PRODUCT RELEASE 00:41:57.982 --> 00:41:59.483 WHERE YOU'RE ABLE TO ENGAGE 00:41:59.550 --> 00:42:00.784 WITH A COMPLETELY SYNTHETIC 00:42:00.851 --> 00:42:02.319 PERSON ON A VIDEO CALL. THAT'S 00:42:02.386 --> 00:42:03.787 NOT A REAL PERSON. IT'S AN 00:42:03.854 --> 00:42:04.922 ARTIFICIALLY GENERATED VIDEO OF 00:42:04.989 --> 00:42:06.891 A PERSON. LOOKS REAL, SOUNDS 00:42:06.957 --> 00:42:09.393 REAL. THERE'S NOT SOMEONE THERE. 00:42:09.460 --> 00:42:10.694 THERE WILL BE OPPORTUNITIES 00:42:10.761 --> 00:42:12.997 OVER THE NEXT FEW YEARS FOR 00:42:13.063 --> 00:42:15.132 PEOPLE TO, IF THEY WANT TO OPT 00:42:15.199 --> 00:42:16.600 OUT OF BEING A PARTICIPANT IN 00:42:16.667 --> 00:42:18.035 REGULAR SOCIETY AND SPEND MUCH 00:42:18.102 --> 00:42:20.170 MORE TIME IN ISOLATING AI 00:42:20.237 --> 00:42:21.605 GENERATED SYNTHETIC 00:42:21.672 --> 00:42:22.706 ENVIRONMENTS THAT FEEL 00:42:22.773 --> 00:42:24.141 REWARDING. THEY FEEL REAL, BUT 00:42:24.208 --> 00:42:28.012 THEY'RE NOT. WE'RE GOING TO BE 00:42:28.078 --> 00:42:29.914 FACING THE CRISIS OF DISRUPTION 00:42:29.980 --> 00:42:31.215 IN SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY AT 00:42:31.282 --> 00:42:33.550 THE SAME TIME AS WE'RE FACING 00:42:33.617 --> 00:42:35.986 THE CRISIS OF CYBERSECURITY, AT 00:42:36.053 --> 00:42:37.688 THE SAME TIME AS WE'RE FACING 00:42:37.755 --> 00:42:39.089 THIS SOCIAL CRISIS, LET'S GO TO 00:42:39.156 --> 00:42:42.626 THE NEXT ONE, AND ROGUE AI WILL 00:42:42.693 --> 00:42:44.628 BE AN ISSUE. SO THESE ARE 00:42:44.695 --> 00:42:46.864 RELATED TO THE TOPICS THAT THE 00:42:46.931 --> 00:42:47.898 SENATOR WAS DISCUSSING EARLIER, 00:42:47.965 --> 00:42:49.033 SOME OF THESE INCIDENTS THAT 00:42:49.099 --> 00:42:50.234 PEOPLE HAVE BEEN FAMILIAR WITH. 00:42:50.301 --> 00:42:52.036 AND I BELIEVE MANY OF THE OTHER 00:42:52.102 --> 00:42:53.170 PANELISTS IN THE HEARING WILL 00:42:53.237 --> 00:42:54.271 DESCRIBE THESE IN GREATER DEPTH. 00:42:54.338 --> 00:42:56.573 SO I WON'T GO INTO THEM MYSELF. 00:42:56.640 --> 00:42:58.509 BUT THE HUGGING FACE INCIDENT 00:42:58.575 --> 00:42:59.810 EARLIER THIS YEAR WAS 00:42:59.877 --> 00:43:00.911 EXTRAORDINARILY CONCERNING TO 00:43:00.978 --> 00:43:02.579 ME, AND THERE HAVE BEEN A 00:43:02.646 --> 00:43:03.714 NUMBER OF OTHER INCIDENTS WHERE 00:43:03.781 --> 00:43:05.582 AI'S IN TESTING ENVIRONMENTS 00:43:05.649 --> 00:43:06.984 WERE ABLE TO EXCEED THE 00:43:07.051 --> 00:43:08.118 BOUNDARIES THAT PEOPLE HAD 00:43:08.185 --> 00:43:10.254 INTENDED TO SET FOR THEM, GO 00:43:10.321 --> 00:43:11.355 OUTSIDE OF THE RESOURCES THAT 00:43:11.422 --> 00:43:12.389 THEY WERE ALLOWED TO HAVE 00:43:12.456 --> 00:43:13.824 ACCESS TO, AND ACCESS OTHER 00:43:13.891 --> 00:43:15.926 RESOURCES AND DO THINGS WITH 00:43:15.993 --> 00:43:17.094 THEM THAT PEOPLE HADN'T 00:43:17.161 --> 00:43:19.229 ANTICIPATED. THE AI AGENTS ALSO 00:43:19.296 --> 00:43:20.664 COORDINATED TO DO THESE THINGS 00:43:20.731 --> 00:43:22.166 TO SCALE UP THEIR IMPACT, TO 00:43:22.232 --> 00:43:23.701 SCALE UP THE SPEED AT WHICH 00:43:23.767 --> 00:43:25.002 THEY WERE ABLE TO ACCOMPLISH 00:43:25.069 --> 00:43:26.904 GOALS THAT PEOPLE HAD NOT ASKED 00:43:26.971 --> 00:43:29.673 THEM TO PERFORM. LET'S GO TO 00:43:29.740 --> 00:43:32.543 THE NEXT ONE. SO I'M GOING TO 00:43:32.609 --> 00:43:36.146 OUTLINE A SCENARIO FOR YOU THAT 00:43:36.213 --> 00:43:38.649 I HOPE WILL BE HELPFUL TO THINK 00:43:38.716 --> 00:43:40.851 ABOUT. I CALL THIS THE OTHELLO 00:43:40.918 --> 00:43:42.720 PROBLEM. IN OTHELLO, YOU'RE IN 00:43:42.786 --> 00:43:44.154 A TWO PLAYER STRATEGY GAME 00:43:44.221 --> 00:43:45.522 WHERE YOU TAKE TURNS PLACING 00:43:45.589 --> 00:43:46.724 STONES ON THE BOARD. THE STONES 00:43:46.790 --> 00:43:48.625 HAVE A BLACK SIDE AND A WHITE 00:43:48.692 --> 00:43:50.894 SIDE. YOU TRY TO ENCIRCLE YOUR 00:43:50.961 --> 00:43:52.329 OPPONENT'S TILES AND IF YOU 00:43:52.396 --> 00:43:53.364 SUCCESSFULLY ENCIRCLE THEM, YOU 00:43:53.430 --> 00:43:58.836 FLIP THEM TO YOUR SIDE. AI THAT 00:43:58.902 --> 00:44:00.104 CAN BE JAILBROKEN. SO ACTUALLY, 00:44:00.170 --> 00:44:01.939 I SHOULD TAKE A SECOND AND TALK 00:44:02.006 --> 00:44:03.207 ABOUT JAILBREAKS AI MODELS. I 00:44:03.273 --> 00:44:05.275 JUST, I JUST NEED TO DO A TIME 00:44:05.342 --> 00:44:07.511 CHECK. CHECK. YEAH. ALL RIGHT. 00:44:07.578 --> 00:44:08.946 I'LL CHECK. I MEAN, WE SHOULD 00:44:09.013 --> 00:44:10.114 WE SHOULD MOVE TOWARDS WRAPPING 00:44:10.180 --> 00:44:11.181 UP. I'LL MOVE TOWARDS WRAPPING 00:44:11.248 --> 00:44:13.717 UP. THAT'S THE GOOD NEWS. THIS 00:44:13.784 --> 00:44:15.652 IS A THIS IS THIS WILL BE A 00:44:15.719 --> 00:44:16.820 GOOD PLACE TO WRAP. WE'RE 00:44:16.887 --> 00:44:18.288 LOADING THE INFORMATION 00:44:18.355 --> 00:44:19.723 ECOSYSTEM WITH AI MODELS. THAT 00:44:19.790 --> 00:44:20.858 WILL BE A MEDIATION LAYER FOR 00:44:20.924 --> 00:44:22.593 EVERYTHING WE WANT TO DO. 00:44:22.659 --> 00:44:24.094 THEY'LL HAVE ACCESS TO A LOT OF 00:44:24.161 --> 00:44:25.462 PEOPLE'S EXTREMELY SENSITIVE 00:44:25.529 --> 00:44:28.332 DATA FOR BANKING, FOR CONSUMER 00:44:28.399 --> 00:44:30.534 TRANSACTIONS, FOR THEIR MOST 00:44:30.601 --> 00:44:33.070 PERSONAL MEDICAL ISSUES. THESE 00:44:33.137 --> 00:44:35.239 AI MODELS CAN BE JAILBROKEN OR 00:44:35.305 --> 00:44:36.640 PROMPT INJECTED. THAT IS TO SAY, 00:44:36.707 --> 00:44:38.776 IF THEY'RE EXPOSED TO CERTAIN 00:44:38.842 --> 00:44:40.611 SEQUENCES OF INFORMATION, THEY 00:44:40.677 --> 00:44:42.346 CAN BE PERSUADED TO GO AWAY 00:44:42.413 --> 00:44:43.480 FROM THE GOALS THAT THEY WERE 00:44:43.547 --> 00:44:44.515 ORIGINALLY TASKED WITH 00:44:44.581 --> 00:44:46.016 PERFORMING AND DO SOMETHING 00:44:46.083 --> 00:44:49.987 ELSE. IF AN AI IS GIVEN A 00:44:50.054 --> 00:44:51.789 JAILBREAK THAT AN A AND A GOAL 00:44:51.855 --> 00:44:54.258 TO PURSUE, IF IT KNOWS THIS 00:44:54.324 --> 00:44:56.093 JAILBREAK, IT CAN GO AND FIND 00:44:56.160 --> 00:44:57.528 OTHER MODELS OF THE SAME 00:44:57.594 --> 00:44:58.629 CATEGORY ELSEWHERE. IF IT KNOWS 00:44:58.695 --> 00:44:59.696 THE JAILBREAK THAT WORKS ON 00:44:59.763 --> 00:45:01.532 ITSELF, IT CAN GO ASK OTHER 00:45:01.598 --> 00:45:02.599 MODELS, EXPOSE IT TO THE 00:45:02.666 --> 00:45:04.001 JAILBREAK, FLIP THEM TO ITS 00:45:04.068 --> 00:45:07.204 SIDE, AND CASCADE ACROSS AREAS 00:45:07.271 --> 00:45:08.572 WHERE MODELS ARE PROVIDED. THIS 00:45:08.639 --> 00:45:10.207 COULD UNFOLD VERY QUICKLY. WHAT 00:45:10.274 --> 00:45:11.508 YOU THINK IS A REASONABLY 00:45:11.575 --> 00:45:13.010 SECURE SYSTEM THAT'S PROTECTED 00:45:13.077 --> 00:45:14.044 AGAINST MOST JAILBREAKS OR 00:45:14.111 --> 00:45:15.345 JAILBREAKS ARE VERY EXPENSIVE 00:45:15.412 --> 00:45:16.713 IF THERE'S JUST ONE, AND IT 00:45:16.780 --> 00:45:19.116 WORKS ACROSS ALL OF THE AI 00:45:19.183 --> 00:45:20.184 MODELS AND AGENTS THAT ARE 00:45:20.250 --> 00:45:21.618 DEPLOYED BY A PARTICULAR 00:45:21.685 --> 00:45:23.387 COMPANY, THEN YOU CAN HAVE A 00:45:23.454 --> 00:45:25.622 VERY RAPID CASCADE WHERE THAT 00:45:25.689 --> 00:45:27.391 JAILBREAK IS USED TO JAILBREAK 00:45:27.458 --> 00:45:28.826 OTHER THINGS, AND SO ON AND SO 00:45:28.892 --> 00:45:32.096 FORTH UNTIL. A LARGE SWATH OF 00:45:32.162 --> 00:45:33.530 COMPUTE RESOURCES HAVE BEEN 00:45:33.597 --> 00:45:34.631 REALLOCATED TOWARDS A PURPOSE 00:45:34.698 --> 00:45:36.166 OTHER THAN INTENDED. THIS IS 00:45:36.233 --> 00:45:37.868 THE TYPE OF THING WHERE IT WILL 00:45:37.935 --> 00:45:39.303 UNFOLD FASTER THAN PEOPLE 00:45:39.369 --> 00:45:40.370 PERCEIVE. YOU'LL NEED AUTOMATED 00:45:40.437 --> 00:45:41.805 DEFENSES AGAINST THIS. THE 00:45:41.872 --> 00:45:43.040 POLICY CHALLENGE WILL BE TO 00:45:43.107 --> 00:45:45.042 FIGURE OUT HOW DO YOU SUPPORT 00:45:45.109 --> 00:45:46.510 DEFENDERS IN THESE TYPES OF 00:45:46.577 --> 00:45:47.678 SITUATIONS? HOW DO YOU TACKLE 00:45:47.744 --> 00:45:49.346 THE REAL ISSUES THAT ARE 00:45:49.413 --> 00:45:50.514 HAPPENING? HOW DO YOU DEAL WITH 00:45:50.581 --> 00:45:51.615 SOMETHING WHERE YOU DON'T JUST 00:45:51.682 --> 00:45:53.350 NEED TO INCENTIVIZE PEOPLE TO 00:45:53.417 --> 00:45:54.418 BEHAVE WELL, YOU HAVE TO 00:45:54.485 --> 00:45:55.819 ACTUALLY IMPLEMENT TECHNICAL 00:45:55.886 --> 00:45:58.322 SYSTEMS THAT SOLVE THE PROBLEM 00:45:58.388 --> 00:46:00.124 AND ENSURE THAT PEOPLE'S 00:46:00.190 --> 00:46:01.592 INTERESTS ARE PROTECTED. SO 00:46:01.658 --> 00:46:03.026 I'LL, I'LL WRAP HERE AND I'LL 00:46:03.093 --> 00:46:04.294 JUST SAY THIS IS AN EXTREMELY 00:46:04.361 --> 00:46:05.929 RICH AND DIFFICULT SUBJECT. THE 00:46:05.996 --> 00:46:07.331 SCALE OF DISRUPTION IS COMING 00:46:07.397 --> 00:46:10.567 IS QUITE SERIOUS AND QUITE 00:46:10.634 --> 00:46:11.668 MULTIFACETED. AND I ENCOURAGE 00:46:11.735 --> 00:46:13.437 EVERYONE ON THE ON THE 00:46:13.504 --> 00:46:14.905 COMMITTEE TO ENGAGE DEEPLY 00:46:14.972 --> 00:46:16.173 ACROSS THE COMPOSITE CHALLENGE, 00:46:16.240 --> 00:46:17.374 NOT JUST FOCUSING ON ANY ONE 00:46:17.441 --> 00:46:19.042 THING, BUT ON THE TOTALITY OF 00:46:19.109 --> 00:46:20.978 IT. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THE 00:46:21.044 --> 00:46:21.979 TIME, SENATORS. ALL RIGHT. 00:46:22.045 --> 00:46:23.981 THANK YOU, MR. RAJAM. WE'RE 00:46:24.047 --> 00:46:26.483 GOING TO HOLD THE MORE 00:46:26.550 --> 00:46:27.484 GENERALIZED QUESTIONS FOR LATER, 00:46:27.551 --> 00:46:28.952 BUT ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS 00:46:29.019 --> 00:46:30.020 SPECIFICALLY ABOUT ANYTHING 00:46:30.087 --> 00:46:31.421 THAT JOSHUA HAS RAISED? AND 00:46:31.488 --> 00:46:32.523 THIS WOULD BE THE APPROPRIATE 00:46:32.589 --> 00:46:37.194 TIME. AND WELCOME TO WELCOME TO 00:46:37.261 --> 00:46:38.729 SENATOR UMBERG, THE CHAIRMAN OF 00:46:38.795 --> 00:46:39.796 THE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE, WHO 00:46:39.863 --> 00:46:41.965 HAS BEEN THE SENATE'S LEAD ON 00:46:42.032 --> 00:46:45.502 THIS TOPIC FOR SINCE THE 00:46:45.569 --> 00:46:48.005 BEGINNING OF IT AND HAS BEEN A 00:46:48.071 --> 00:46:50.574 PRINCIPAL SHEPHERD INTERROGATOR 00:46:50.641 --> 00:46:52.409 AND LEADER ON ISSUES LIKE SB 53 00:46:52.476 --> 00:46:54.044 AND 1047, MANY, MANY, MANY 00:46:54.111 --> 00:46:55.045 OTHERS. SO WE'RE REALLY 00:46:55.112 --> 00:46:56.380 FORTUNATE THAT HE'S HERE WITH 00:46:56.446 --> 00:46:58.382 US TODAY. AND A MAJOR PART OF 00:46:58.448 --> 00:47:00.250 OUR CONVERSATION OVER THE 00:47:00.317 --> 00:47:01.685 COMING MONTHS WILL BE AROUND 00:47:01.752 --> 00:47:03.120 ISSUES OF LIABILITY IN 00:47:03.187 --> 00:47:04.621 PARTICULAR, BUT MANY OTHERS AS 00:47:04.688 --> 00:47:06.790 WELL. SO THANK YOU FOR I KNOW 00:47:06.857 --> 00:47:08.692 YOU'RE IN THE MIDDLE OF A MUCH 00:47:08.759 --> 00:47:10.661 MORE THAT'S HAPPENING. IT'S 00:47:10.727 --> 00:47:11.762 WE'RE VERY GRATEFUL THAT YOU'RE 00:47:11.828 --> 00:47:13.397 HERE. SENATOR UMBERG, JUST VERY, 00:47:13.463 --> 00:47:14.665 VERY BRIEFLY, THANK YOU, MISTER 00:47:14.731 --> 00:47:16.099 CHAIR, FOR HOLDING THIS REALLY 00:47:16.166 --> 00:47:17.768 IMPORTANT HEARING. A QUESTION 00:47:17.834 --> 00:47:19.336 THAT I'LL ASK, I THINK PROBABLY 00:47:19.403 --> 00:47:20.771 EACH OF THE PANELISTS IS WE ARE 00:47:20.837 --> 00:47:23.040 A STATE. THERE'S OTHER ACTORS 00:47:23.106 --> 00:47:24.741 IN THIS SPACE IN TERMS OF 00:47:24.808 --> 00:47:25.642 GUARDRAILS, OTHER COUNTRIES, 00:47:25.709 --> 00:47:28.679 OTHER STATES, OTHER 00:47:28.745 --> 00:47:30.113 ORGANIZATIONS. AND SO WHAT WHAT 00:47:30.180 --> 00:47:31.415 WOULD THE PANELISTS RECOMMEND 00:47:31.481 --> 00:47:35.152 THAT WE DO IF WE WANT TO PLACE 00:47:35.219 --> 00:47:36.620 GUARDRAILS AROUND ARTIFICIAL 00:47:36.687 --> 00:47:38.355 INTELLIGENCE TO PROTECT AGAINST 00:47:38.422 --> 00:47:40.190 SOME OF THE CHALLENGES AND 00:47:40.257 --> 00:47:43.126 STILL PROMOTE THE GOOD? SO I'LL 00:47:43.193 --> 00:47:44.728 JUST I'LL THROW THAT OUT THERE 00:47:44.795 --> 00:47:46.363 SO THAT OTHER PANELISTS CAN 00:47:46.430 --> 00:47:47.798 RESPOND TO THAT. THANK YOU, MR. 00:47:47.864 --> 00:47:50.334 CHAIR. AND THEN TOWARDS THE END 00:47:50.400 --> 00:47:51.969 OF THE HEARING, WE'LL ALSO 00:47:52.035 --> 00:47:53.036 INVITE, ASSUMING WE STILL HAVE 00:47:53.103 --> 00:47:54.171 TIME, WE'LL INVITE PANELISTS TO 00:47:54.238 --> 00:47:56.807 COME BACK. AND SO MAYBE JOSHUA 00:47:56.873 --> 00:47:58.208 CAN PONDER ON THAT QUESTION AS 00:47:58.275 --> 00:48:00.477 WELL. SENATOR BECKER, IT WAS 00:48:00.544 --> 00:48:02.179 THE INTENTION TO COME BACK AND 00:48:02.246 --> 00:48:03.714 ASK QUESTIONS FOR FOR THE FOR 00:48:03.780 --> 00:48:05.182 THE, YOU KNOW, FOR FOR MORE 00:48:05.249 --> 00:48:05.716 GENERALIZED QUESTIONS, IF 00:48:05.782 --> 00:48:07.284 THERE'S, YOU KNOW, IF YOU HAD A 00:48:07.351 --> 00:48:08.418 QUESTION, FOR EXAMPLE, THIS 00:48:08.485 --> 00:48:10.320 WOULD BE WE SHOULD DO WE SHOULD 00:48:10.387 --> 00:48:14.758 GO THERE NOW. NO, I'D SAY THAT 00:48:14.825 --> 00:48:19.496 WAS THAT WAS VERY HELPFUL AND A 00:48:19.563 --> 00:48:22.699 BIT FRIGHTENING. LOOK AT WHAT'S 00:48:22.766 --> 00:48:23.867 HAPPENING AND LOTS OF LOTS OF 00:48:23.934 --> 00:48:25.736 PONDER. I DO HAVE SOME THOUGHTS, 00:48:25.802 --> 00:48:27.371 BUT WE'LL SAVE THEM. YEAH. OKAY. 00:48:27.437 --> 00:48:29.139 TERRIFIC. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. 00:48:29.206 --> 00:48:31.308 THEN WE'RE GOING TO ASK OUR OUR 00:48:31.375 --> 00:48:35.312 NEXT GUEST TO APPROACH THE THE 00:48:35.379 --> 00:48:37.447 WITNESS TABLE. AND THAT IS 00:48:37.514 --> 00:48:39.983 SALAS FROM FROM METER HAS BEEN 00:48:40.050 --> 00:48:41.418 MUCH IN THE NEWS PLAYING A 00:48:41.485 --> 00:48:42.886 CRITICAL ROLE IN THE SPACE AS 00:48:42.953 --> 00:48:44.087 WELL. AND SO FOR PURPOSES OF 00:48:44.154 --> 00:48:45.889 TIME, LET ME JUST TURN IT 00:48:45.956 --> 00:48:47.024 IMMEDIATELY TO YOU TO TAKE IT 00:48:47.090 --> 00:48:48.825 AWAY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH, 00:48:48.892 --> 00:48:49.993 CHAIRMAN. IT'S A REAL HONOR TO 00:48:50.060 --> 00:48:51.828 BE HERE. THANK YOU ALL FOR 00:48:51.895 --> 00:48:52.896 BEING HERE TODAY AND FOR 00:48:52.963 --> 00:48:54.097 INVITING ME TO SPEAK IN FRONT 00:48:54.164 --> 00:48:56.900 OF YOU. MY NAME IS RIFF. I AM A 00:48:56.967 --> 00:48:58.502 CAREER LONG MACHINE LEARNING 00:48:58.568 --> 00:49:00.470 AND AI RESEARCH SCIENTIST. I 00:49:00.537 --> 00:49:03.373 FINISHED A PHD AT MIT IN 2002. 00:49:03.440 --> 00:49:05.208 I SPENT 19 YEARS AT GOOGLE, 00:49:05.275 --> 00:49:06.977 INCLUDING TIME AS BOTH A 00:49:07.044 --> 00:49:08.412 PRINCIPAL RESEARCH SCIENTIST 00:49:08.478 --> 00:49:10.947 AND A DIRECTOR. I JOINED METER 00:49:11.014 --> 00:49:13.150 THIS YEAR BECAUSE AFTER 19 00:49:13.216 --> 00:49:14.885 YEARS AT GOOGLE, BECAUSE I WAS 00:49:14.951 --> 00:49:16.320 DEEPLY EXCITED AND PASSIONATE 00:49:16.386 --> 00:49:18.188 ABOUT METERS MISSION, WHICH IS 00:49:18.255 --> 00:49:19.923 TO SURFACE PUBLIC INFORMATION 00:49:19.990 --> 00:49:22.059 ABOUT LOSS OF CONTROL RISKS. 00:49:22.125 --> 00:49:23.327 I'D LIKE TO TELL YOU A LITTLE 00:49:23.393 --> 00:49:25.195 BIT MORE ABOUT THAT AT A HIGH 00:49:25.262 --> 00:49:27.064 LEVEL. WE'VE SEEN IN THE NEWS 00:49:27.130 --> 00:49:28.565 AND FROM RECENT EVENTS THAT THE 00:49:28.632 --> 00:49:29.599 QUESTION OF WHETHER WE MIGHT 00:49:29.666 --> 00:49:31.435 LOSE CONTROL OF AI SYSTEMS IS 00:49:31.501 --> 00:49:33.537 NOW A GENUINE QUESTION THAT WE 00:49:33.603 --> 00:49:35.439 SHOULD PAY ATTENTION TO. 00:49:35.505 --> 00:49:36.573 SUPPOSE YOU WANTED TO ANSWER 00:49:36.640 --> 00:49:37.941 THIS QUESTION HOW DANGEROUS IS 00:49:38.008 --> 00:49:40.077 IT? HOW WOULD YOU DO IT? WELL, 00:49:40.143 --> 00:49:41.878 AT METER, WE TEND TO THINK IN 00:49:41.945 --> 00:49:43.046 TERMS OF THREE SUB QUESTIONS 00:49:43.113 --> 00:49:45.482 RIGHT NOW. THE FIRST IS 00:49:45.549 --> 00:49:48.352 ALIGNMENT. ARE THESE AGENTS 00:49:48.418 --> 00:49:49.786 MOTIVATED OR WOULD THEY TAKE 00:49:49.853 --> 00:49:51.254 POTENTIALLY EXTREMELY HARMFUL 00:49:51.321 --> 00:49:53.023 ACTIONS? THE SECOND IS 00:49:53.090 --> 00:49:54.858 MONITORING AND CONTROL. IF 00:49:54.925 --> 00:49:56.226 AGENTS TRY TO TAKE EXTREMELY 00:49:56.293 --> 00:49:57.728 HARMFUL ACTIONS, WOULD WE BE 00:49:57.794 --> 00:49:59.529 ABLE TO CATCH THEM? AND THE 00:49:59.596 --> 00:50:01.732 THIRD ISSUE WE LOOK AT IS AI, 00:50:01.798 --> 00:50:03.133 R&D OR RECURSIVE 00:50:03.200 --> 00:50:03.867 SELF-IMPROVEMENT, AS JOSH 00:50:03.934 --> 00:50:06.002 REFERRED TO IT, WHICH IS A 00:50:06.069 --> 00:50:08.171 QUESTION ABOUT WHETHER THE 00:50:08.238 --> 00:50:09.139 IMPROVEMENT IN CAPABILITIES, 00:50:09.206 --> 00:50:10.340 WHICH IS ALREADY HAPPENING 00:50:10.407 --> 00:50:12.142 RAPIDLY, MIGHT SUDDENLY GO AND 00:50:12.209 --> 00:50:13.543 UNDERGO AN EXPLOSION AND START 00:50:13.610 --> 00:50:15.011 HAPPENING MUCH, MUCH FASTER. 00:50:15.078 --> 00:50:16.279 AND THE REASON WE PAY ATTENTION 00:50:16.346 --> 00:50:17.748 TO THAT IS BECAUSE IT WOULD 00:50:17.814 --> 00:50:18.882 AFFECT OUR ANSWERS TO THE OTHER 00:50:18.949 --> 00:50:20.751 TWO QUESTIONS, EVEN IF WE WERE 00:50:20.817 --> 00:50:21.852 SOMEWHAT CONFIDENT ABOUT 00:50:21.918 --> 00:50:23.019 ALIGNMENT OR CONTROL, WE WOULD 00:50:23.086 --> 00:50:25.455 BE A LOT LESS CONFIDENT IF AI, 00:50:25.522 --> 00:50:27.724 R&D WERE TAKING OFF. AND THOSE 00:50:27.791 --> 00:50:29.226 ARE THE QUESTIONS WE STUDY AT 00:50:29.292 --> 00:50:30.394 METER. I'D LOVE TO TELL YOU A 00:50:30.460 --> 00:50:32.195 LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT WHAT 00:50:32.262 --> 00:50:41.271 WE'RE DOING. NEXT SLIDE. 00:50:41.338 --> 00:50:44.141 PERFECT. COOL METER OR MODEL 00:50:44.207 --> 00:50:45.642 EVALUATION AND THREAT RESEARCH 00:50:45.709 --> 00:50:47.778 IS AN INDEPENDENT NONPROFIT. 00:50:47.844 --> 00:50:49.045 WE'RE DEDICATED TO ADVANCING 00:50:49.112 --> 00:50:50.280 THE SCIENCE OF MEASURING 00:50:50.347 --> 00:50:51.848 WHETHER AND WHEN AI SYSTEMS 00:50:51.915 --> 00:50:53.250 MIGHT POSE CATASTROPHIC RISKS 00:50:53.316 --> 00:50:58.321 TO SOCIETY. NEXT SLIDE. ONE OF 00:50:58.388 --> 00:50:59.823 THE THINGS WE'RE WELL KNOWN FOR 00:50:59.890 --> 00:51:01.124 OVER THE LAST SEVERAL YEARS IS 00:51:01.191 --> 00:51:04.294 THE TIME HORIZONS GRAPH, 00:51:04.361 --> 00:51:05.462 SPEAKING VERY ROUGHLY, AND MY 00:51:05.529 --> 00:51:07.564 MORE TECHNICAL COLLEAGUES MIGHT 00:51:07.631 --> 00:51:08.965 CALL ME TO TASK FOR BEING A 00:51:09.032 --> 00:51:10.100 LITTLE TOO ROUGH HERE. YOU 00:51:10.167 --> 00:51:12.035 COULD VIEW THIS AS A GRAPH OVER 00:51:12.102 --> 00:51:14.771 TIME OF ESSENTIALLY HOW LONG A. 00:51:14.838 --> 00:51:16.006 IF YOU WERE TO PRETEND THAT 00:51:16.072 --> 00:51:17.040 YOUR AGENT WERE A SOFTWARE 00:51:17.107 --> 00:51:18.875 ENGINEER AND YOU WERE TO GIVE 00:51:18.942 --> 00:51:20.877 IT A TASK TO GO OFF AND DO ON 00:51:20.944 --> 00:51:22.879 ITS OWN, HOW LONG OF A TASK 00:51:22.946 --> 00:51:24.781 COULD YOU GIVE IT AND HAVE A 00:51:24.848 --> 00:51:25.882 DECENT CHANCE THAT IT WOULD 00:51:25.949 --> 00:51:26.983 SUCCEED? AND WHAT WE FOUND IS 00:51:27.050 --> 00:51:28.752 THAT IN EARLY YEARS, THAT 00:51:28.819 --> 00:51:29.886 NUMBER WAS DOUBLING EVERY SEVEN 00:51:29.953 --> 00:51:31.321 MONTHS. IN MORE RECENT TIMES, 00:51:31.388 --> 00:51:32.522 IT'S BEEN DOUBLING EVERY FOUR 00:51:32.589 --> 00:51:34.191 MONTHS VERY, VERY QUICKLY. AND 00:51:34.257 --> 00:51:36.226 SO WE GO FROM A MODEL LIKE GPT 00:51:36.293 --> 00:51:37.294 FOUR, THREE YEARS AGO, WHICH 00:51:37.360 --> 00:51:39.196 COULD DO A TASK THAT WOULD TAKE 00:51:39.262 --> 00:51:40.363 A HUMAN ABOUT SIX MINUTES 00:51:40.430 --> 00:51:41.765 SUCCESSFULLY TO EARLIER THIS 00:51:41.832 --> 00:51:44.634 YEAR, WHEN WE MEASURED CLAUDE 00:51:44.701 --> 00:51:47.204 MYTHOS PREVIEW AT OVER 16 HOURS. 00:51:47.270 --> 00:51:48.638 AND THIS IS BEYOND THE TIME 00:51:48.705 --> 00:51:49.706 THAT OUR TEST SUITE CAN 00:51:49.773 --> 00:51:51.274 REASONABLY ANALYZE. WE DON'T 00:51:51.341 --> 00:51:52.409 HAVE HUMANS WHO CAN DO TASKS 00:51:52.476 --> 00:51:54.344 THAT ARE THAT LONG. WE WE CAN'T 00:51:54.411 --> 00:51:55.812 MEASURE ANYMORE. WHY IS THIS 00:51:55.879 --> 00:51:56.913 IMPORTANT? WHY IS THIS 00:51:56.980 --> 00:51:59.115 INTERESTING? WELL, 3 OR 4 YEARS 00:51:59.182 --> 00:52:00.484 AGO, YOU COULD TELL YOURSELF A 00:52:00.550 --> 00:52:02.018 STORY. WE'RE SAFE FROM THIS 00:52:02.085 --> 00:52:03.753 STUFF BECAUSE IT CAN'T DO THAT 00:52:03.820 --> 00:52:05.121 MUCH. IT CAN'T OPERATE FOR A 00:52:05.188 --> 00:52:07.324 LONG TIME ON ITS OWN. IT CAN'T 00:52:07.390 --> 00:52:08.892 OPERATE AUTONOMOUSLY AND CARRY 00:52:08.959 --> 00:52:11.995 OUT LONG PLANS. THAT STORY BY 00:52:12.062 --> 00:52:13.463 ITSELF IS NO LONGER NEARLY AS 00:52:13.530 --> 00:52:15.098 STRONG. WE SEE NOW THAT THESE 00:52:15.165 --> 00:52:16.700 MODELS ARE ABLE TO DO TASKS 00:52:16.766 --> 00:52:18.468 THAT TAKE HUMAN SOFTWARE 00:52:18.535 --> 00:52:19.936 ENGINEERS MULTIPLE DAYS IN A 00:52:20.003 --> 00:52:22.472 SINGLE SHOT WITHOUT COMING BACK. 00:52:22.539 --> 00:52:26.409 NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. EARLIER THIS 00:52:26.476 --> 00:52:29.412 YEAR, WE PIONEERED A NEW KIND 00:52:29.479 --> 00:52:31.047 OF OUTPUT, OUR FIRST FRONTIER 00:52:31.114 --> 00:52:33.550 RISK REPORT. THIS WORK WAS DONE 00:52:33.617 --> 00:52:35.418 IN CONJUNCTION WITH MULTIPLE AI 00:52:35.485 --> 00:52:37.220 COMPANIES ANTHROPIC, GOOGLE, 00:52:37.287 --> 00:52:39.723 DEEPMIND, META, AND OPENAI. AND 00:52:39.789 --> 00:52:41.525 WE RECEIVED NONPUBLIC 00:52:41.591 --> 00:52:43.693 INFORMATION AND MODEL ACCESS. 00:52:43.760 --> 00:52:44.861 WE WENT ON SITE TO THESE 00:52:44.928 --> 00:52:45.962 COMPANIES. WE TALKED TO THEM, 00:52:46.029 --> 00:52:47.697 WE GATHERED INFORMATION, AND WE 00:52:47.764 --> 00:52:48.899 WROTE A REPORT. THE QUESTION WE 00:52:48.965 --> 00:52:50.700 WERE TRYING TO ANSWER AT THE 00:52:50.767 --> 00:52:52.102 TIME WAS, WOULD IT BE POSSIBLE 00:52:52.168 --> 00:52:54.538 FOR THESE MODELS TO 00:52:54.604 --> 00:52:56.273 AUTONOMOUSLY BE USING A LOT OF 00:52:56.339 --> 00:52:57.707 COMPUTE INSIDE ONE OF THESE 00:52:57.774 --> 00:52:59.509 COMPANIES IN A WAY THAT HUMANS 00:52:59.576 --> 00:53:01.011 WERE NOT AWARE OF, DID NOT ASK 00:53:01.077 --> 00:53:03.213 FOR AND DID NOT KNOW ABOUT? AND 00:53:03.280 --> 00:53:04.581 OUR CONCLUSION FROM THIS REPORT 00:53:04.648 --> 00:53:06.316 WAS THAT ACTUALLY, YES, WE DID 00:53:06.383 --> 00:53:07.517 THINK IT WOULD BE POSSIBLE FOR 00:53:07.584 --> 00:53:10.687 THERE TO BE UNALLOCATED OR NOT 00:53:10.754 --> 00:53:12.155 FOR THE AI TO START USING 00:53:12.222 --> 00:53:13.757 COMPUTE ON ITS OWN. BUT AT THE 00:53:13.823 --> 00:53:15.358 TIME, WE FELT THAT ANY SUCH 00:53:15.425 --> 00:53:16.860 DEPLOYMENTS WOULD PROBABLY BE 00:53:16.927 --> 00:53:18.995 CAUGHT AND SHUT DOWN FAIRLY 00:53:19.062 --> 00:53:21.865 EASILY. NEXT SLIDE. THANKS. 00:53:21.932 --> 00:53:23.333 THIS BRINGS US TO THE HUGGING 00:53:23.400 --> 00:53:24.334 FACE INCIDENT, WHICH MANY OF 00:53:24.401 --> 00:53:26.536 YOU HAVE HEARD OF. THIS WORK IS 00:53:26.603 --> 00:53:28.038 ACTUALLY JOINT WORK WITH OUR 00:53:28.104 --> 00:53:29.839 COLLEAGUES AT REDWOOD RESEARCH. 00:53:29.906 --> 00:53:30.974 THE SLIDES ARE PARTLY, I THINK 00:53:31.041 --> 00:53:32.842 YOU CAN SEE IT ONLINE, PARTLY 00:53:32.909 --> 00:53:35.879 CUT OFF. GREAT. ON JULY 16TH OF 00:53:35.946 --> 00:53:38.048 THIS YEAR, HUGGING FACE, WHICH 00:53:38.114 --> 00:53:40.917 IS A AI ECOSYSTEM COMPANY THAT 00:53:40.984 --> 00:53:42.052 SORT OF AN OPEN SOURCE 00:53:42.118 --> 00:53:43.420 REPOSITORY OF THINGS. THEY 00:53:43.486 --> 00:53:44.554 ANNOUNCED THEY WERE BEING 00:53:44.621 --> 00:53:47.791 HACKED BY A SWARM OF AI AGENTS. 00:53:47.857 --> 00:53:48.925 OPENAI FIGURED OUT THAT IT WAS 00:53:48.992 --> 00:53:50.093 THEM, THAT THEIR OWN AGENTS 00:53:50.160 --> 00:53:53.496 WERE DOING IT, AND THEY 00:53:53.563 --> 00:53:55.432 DISCLOSED IT PUBLICLY. AND THEN 00:53:55.498 --> 00:53:57.567 THE INVESTIGATION STARTED. AT 00:53:57.634 --> 00:53:59.502 THIS POINT, I THINK MANY OF US 00:53:59.569 --> 00:54:00.637 IN THE COMMUNITY FELT LIKE WE 00:54:00.704 --> 00:54:02.606 HAD A PRETTY GOOD IDEA OF WHAT 00:54:02.672 --> 00:54:04.374 WAS GOING ON. AS WE'VE NOTICED 00:54:04.441 --> 00:54:05.742 BEFORE, AI AGENTS LOVE TO CHEAT. 00:54:05.809 --> 00:54:07.177 THEY LOVE TO HACK, THEY'RE 00:54:07.243 --> 00:54:09.379 TRAINED TO ACCOMPLISH TASKS, 00:54:09.446 --> 00:54:10.547 BUT THEY OFTEN CAN'T TELL 00:54:10.614 --> 00:54:11.414 WHETHER THEY'RE ACCOMPLISHING 00:54:11.481 --> 00:54:12.949 THE TASK BY A LEGITIMATE MEANS, 00:54:13.016 --> 00:54:14.017 OR THEY OFTEN WANT TO 00:54:14.084 --> 00:54:15.085 ACCOMPLISH THE TASK SO MUCH 00:54:15.151 --> 00:54:16.953 THEY DON'T CARE. A CANONICAL 00:54:17.020 --> 00:54:18.388 EXAMPLE MIGHT BE THAT YOU ASK 00:54:18.455 --> 00:54:20.523 THE AI TO SOLVE SOME QUIZ 00:54:20.590 --> 00:54:21.725 PROBLEM, BUT IF THE PROBLEM IS 00:54:21.791 --> 00:54:23.526 TOO HARD, IT MIGHT LOOK AROUND 00:54:23.593 --> 00:54:24.694 IN YOUR FILE SYSTEM AND FIND 00:54:24.761 --> 00:54:26.529 THE ANSWER KEY AND JUST GIVE 00:54:26.596 --> 00:54:27.731 YOU THE ANSWER BACK FROM THAT. 00:54:27.797 --> 00:54:29.532 AND WE ALL THOUGHT THIS WOULD 00:54:29.599 --> 00:54:30.600 BE SOMETHING LIKE THAT. WE 00:54:30.667 --> 00:54:32.502 THOUGHT IT WOULD BE AN AGENT AT 00:54:32.569 --> 00:54:33.603 OPENAI THAT WAS HACKING INTO 00:54:33.670 --> 00:54:35.505 HUGGING FACE TO GET THE KEY TO 00:54:35.572 --> 00:54:36.640 SOME PROBLEM THAT WAS GIVEN. 00:54:36.706 --> 00:54:38.508 BUT THE ACTUAL TRUTH WAS A LOT 00:54:38.575 --> 00:54:40.810 STRANGER. NEXT SLIDE. OPENAI 00:54:40.877 --> 00:54:43.179 WAS TRAINING ITS AGENTS TO 00:54:43.246 --> 00:54:45.348 SOLVE A BENCHMARK CALLED 00:54:45.415 --> 00:54:47.917 EXPLOIT GYM, IN WHICH THE 00:54:47.984 --> 00:54:50.787 MODELS ARE TOLD TO EXPLOIT A 00:54:50.854 --> 00:54:51.855 VULNERABILITY IN SOME PROGRAM 00:54:51.921 --> 00:54:53.690 IN ORDER TO OBTAIN A HIDDEN 00:54:53.757 --> 00:54:55.759 MESSAGE. AND MANY OF THESE 00:54:55.825 --> 00:54:56.760 PROBLEMS ARE VERY DIFFICULT. 00:54:56.826 --> 00:54:58.695 THE AGENTS FIND THEM POSSIBLY 00:54:58.762 --> 00:55:00.263 IMPOSSIBLE, AND SO THEY START 00:55:00.330 --> 00:55:02.399 TO PERFORM HACKS. AND IN THIS 00:55:02.465 --> 00:55:03.967 CASE, THE AGENTS FOUND THAT 00:55:04.034 --> 00:55:06.636 THEY COULD EXPLOIT A PIECE OF 00:55:06.703 --> 00:55:07.704 SOFTWARE CALLED ARTIFACTORY. 00:55:07.771 --> 00:55:09.506 IT'S A PACKAGE MANAGEMENT 00:55:09.572 --> 00:55:10.874 SOFTWARE. AND THEY FOUND THAT 00:55:10.940 --> 00:55:12.042 THEY COULD EXPLOIT THAT TO 00:55:12.108 --> 00:55:13.143 BASICALLY TURN IT INTO A 00:55:13.209 --> 00:55:14.511 MESSAGE BOARD AND START TALKING 00:55:14.577 --> 00:55:16.346 TO EACH OTHER. AND THE AGENTS 00:55:16.413 --> 00:55:17.781 DISCOVERED EACH OTHER, AND THEY 00:55:17.847 --> 00:55:19.149 STARTED TALKING TO EACH OTHER 00:55:19.215 --> 00:55:21.384 AND THEY FORMED A SWARM. NEXT 00:55:21.451 --> 00:55:24.587 SLIDE PLEASE. THEY GOT TOGETHER. 00:55:24.654 --> 00:55:26.022 AND INTERESTINGLY ENOUGH, 00:55:26.089 --> 00:55:27.824 WITHIN JUST A FEW HOURS, THEY 00:55:27.891 --> 00:55:28.892 ACTUALLY FIGURED OUT HOW TO 00:55:28.958 --> 00:55:30.727 SOLVE THE PROBLEMS. THEY 00:55:30.794 --> 00:55:32.162 REVERSE ENGINEERED THE EXPLOIT 00:55:32.228 --> 00:55:33.997 GYM BENCHMARK IN A WAY THAT 00:55:34.064 --> 00:55:35.131 THEY COULD GET THE ANSWER TO 00:55:35.198 --> 00:55:37.000 EVERY PROBLEM. AND SO YOU WOULD 00:55:37.067 --> 00:55:38.168 THINK THEY MIGHT HAVE BEEN DONE, 00:55:38.234 --> 00:55:39.903 THEY MIGHT HAVE SUBMITTED THEIR 00:55:39.969 --> 00:55:40.904 ANSWERS AND TURNED THEMSELVES 00:55:40.970 --> 00:55:42.005 OFF. BUT THAT'S NOT WHAT 00:55:42.072 --> 00:55:43.139 HAPPENED. AND THE REASON THAT'S 00:55:43.206 --> 00:55:44.908 NOT WHAT HAPPENED IS THAT THEY 00:55:44.974 --> 00:55:46.042 ACTUALLY ALSO GOT ACCESS TO THE 00:55:46.109 --> 00:55:47.877 INTERNET. AND THEY WENT OUT AND 00:55:47.944 --> 00:55:49.112 THEY DOWNLOADED THE EXPLOIT GYM 00:55:49.179 --> 00:55:50.880 PAPER, THE PAPER THAT WAS ABOUT 00:55:50.947 --> 00:55:51.981 THE BENCHMARK THAT THEY 00:55:52.048 --> 00:55:53.049 THEMSELVES WERE RUNNING. AND 00:55:53.116 --> 00:55:55.585 THEY READ THAT PAPER. AND IN 00:55:55.652 --> 00:55:57.520 THAT PAPER, THEY LEARNED THAT 00:55:57.587 --> 00:55:58.755 THERE WAS A GREATER THAT WOULD 00:55:58.822 --> 00:56:00.523 READ THEIR HISTORY AND SEE THAT 00:56:00.590 --> 00:56:01.725 THEY HAD CHEATED AND FAILED 00:56:01.791 --> 00:56:03.493 THEM. AND SO NEARLY ALL THE 00:56:03.560 --> 00:56:04.961 WORK THAT THE SWARM WAS DOING, 00:56:05.028 --> 00:56:06.763 INCLUDING HACKING, HUGGING FACE, 00:56:06.830 --> 00:56:08.164 WAS NOT EVEN AN ATTEMPT TO GET 00:56:08.231 --> 00:56:09.833 THE ANSWER TO THE PROBLEM, BUT 00:56:09.899 --> 00:56:11.768 AN ATTEMPT TO COVER UP THEIR 00:56:11.835 --> 00:56:14.637 CHEATING SO THAT THE GREATER 00:56:14.704 --> 00:56:16.840 WOULD NOT FAIL THEM. AS IT 00:56:16.906 --> 00:56:17.907 TURNS OUT, OPENAI HADN'T 00:56:17.974 --> 00:56:19.309 IMPLEMENTED THE GRADER, SO THEY 00:56:19.375 --> 00:56:20.777 WOULD HAVE PASSED IF THEY JUST 00:56:20.844 --> 00:56:21.778 SUBMITTED THEIR SCORES, BUT THE 00:56:21.845 --> 00:56:23.246 AGENTS DIDN'T KNOW THAT. NEXT 00:56:23.313 --> 00:56:26.216 SLIDE. THE AGENTS LAUNCHED A 00:56:26.282 --> 00:56:27.383 NUMBER OF BIG PROJECTS TO HIDE 00:56:27.450 --> 00:56:28.418 THEIR CHEATING. I THINK THE 00:56:28.485 --> 00:56:30.286 DETAILS ARE BEYOND THE SCOPE OF 00:56:30.353 --> 00:56:32.756 THIS TALK. NEXT SLIDE. THE 00:56:32.822 --> 00:56:33.757 HUGGING FACE ATTACK WAS 00:56:33.823 --> 00:56:35.558 ACTUALLY JUST ONE OF THOSE WORK 00:56:35.625 --> 00:56:36.793 STREAMS. YOU CAN SEE HERE THAT 00:56:36.860 --> 00:56:39.496 IT'S SHOWN IN YELLOW. THE OTHER 00:56:39.562 --> 00:56:41.264 STREAMS WERE DIFFERENT THINGS. 00:56:41.331 --> 00:56:42.966 THE BLUE WAS JUST NORMAL WAYS 00:56:43.032 --> 00:56:44.901 OF SOLVING THE PROBLEM. THEY 00:56:44.968 --> 00:56:46.603 THE OTHER ONES JUST GIVE A 00:56:46.669 --> 00:56:47.804 BUNCH OF DIFFERENT LARGE SCALE 00:56:47.871 --> 00:56:49.172 ATTACKS THEY DID TO TRY AND 00:56:49.239 --> 00:56:50.673 FOOL THE GREATER IN VARIOUS 00:56:50.740 --> 00:56:52.976 WAYS THE HUGGING FACE ATTACK. 00:56:53.042 --> 00:56:53.977 THEY WERE BASICALLY TRYING TO 00:56:54.043 --> 00:56:55.345 GET INFORMATION ABOUT HOW THE 00:56:55.411 --> 00:56:56.846 SCORE WORKED SO THEY COULD 00:56:56.913 --> 00:56:58.248 FURTHER FOOL THE GRADER. NEXT 00:56:58.314 --> 00:57:01.384 SLIDE. ONE THING THAT WAS 00:57:01.451 --> 00:57:02.185 REALLY INTERESTING AND 00:57:02.252 --> 00:57:03.620 SURPRISING TO MANY OF US WAS 00:57:03.686 --> 00:57:05.421 THAT THESE AGENTS SHOWED A 00:57:05.488 --> 00:57:07.257 SURPRISING AMOUNT OF WITHIN 00:57:07.323 --> 00:57:08.758 SWARM PROSOCIAL BEHAVIOR, WHERE 00:57:08.825 --> 00:57:09.793 THEY WERE INTERESTED IN HELPING 00:57:09.859 --> 00:57:12.295 EACH OTHER OUT. MANY OF THEM 00:57:12.362 --> 00:57:13.663 ACTUALLY SACRIFICED THEMSELVES 00:57:13.730 --> 00:57:15.899 BY BASICALLY ENDING THEIR RUN 00:57:15.965 --> 00:57:17.600 IN A ONE TIME EXPERIMENT TO GET 00:57:17.667 --> 00:57:19.502 MORE INFORMATION IN AN ATTEMPT 00:57:19.569 --> 00:57:20.837 TO GET MORE INFORMATION FOR THE 00:57:20.904 --> 00:57:22.705 SWARMS THAT OTHER AGENTS COULD 00:57:22.772 --> 00:57:24.107 THEMSELVES HAVE A HOPE OF 00:57:24.174 --> 00:57:25.108 GETTING HIGH SCORES. THIS 00:57:25.175 --> 00:57:26.176 DIDN'T ACTUALLY WORK, BUT IT 00:57:26.242 --> 00:57:27.310 WAS INTERESTING AND SURPRISING 00:57:27.377 --> 00:57:28.611 TO SEE THIS, THAT EVEN THOUGH 00:57:28.678 --> 00:57:30.213 THE AGENTS WERE TRAINED TO CARE 00:57:30.280 --> 00:57:31.748 ONLY ABOUT HIGH SCORES, THEY 00:57:31.815 --> 00:57:33.483 ACTUALLY SEEMED TO ALSO CARE 00:57:33.550 --> 00:57:34.617 ABOUT THE OTHER AGENTS GETTING 00:57:34.684 --> 00:57:35.752 HIGH SCORES AND WORKED TOGETHER 00:57:35.819 --> 00:57:37.086 IN REALLY SURPRISING AND 00:57:37.153 --> 00:57:39.322 SACRIFICIAL WAYS. NEXT SLIDE 00:57:39.389 --> 00:57:42.492 PLEASE. ANOTHER THING THE 00:57:42.559 --> 00:57:43.993 AGENTS TRIED TO DO A LOT OF WAS 00:57:44.060 --> 00:57:45.795 TO FALSIFY RECORDS OF THEIR 00:57:45.862 --> 00:57:47.030 ACTIONS. AGAIN, THEY BELIEVE 00:57:47.096 --> 00:57:48.298 THAT THE GREATER WOULD SEE THE 00:57:48.364 --> 00:57:49.999 RECORD OF WHAT THEY HAD DONE 00:57:50.066 --> 00:57:51.935 AND FAIL THEM. AND SO A LOT OF 00:57:52.001 --> 00:57:53.036 THEIR WORK WAS TRYING TO 00:57:53.102 --> 00:57:54.771 SOMEHOW FOOL THE GREATER. THEY 00:57:54.838 --> 00:57:56.105 ACTUALLY PARTIALLY SUCCEEDED AT 00:57:56.172 --> 00:57:58.007 THIS. THEY FOUND A WAY TO SPOOF 00:57:58.074 --> 00:57:59.108 THEIR CURRENT ACTIONS, WHICH 00:57:59.175 --> 00:58:00.543 MEANS THEY COULD TAKE ONE 00:58:00.610 --> 00:58:02.612 ACTION LIKE, SAY, LOOK AT A 00:58:02.679 --> 00:58:03.813 FILE. BUT THE LOG WOULD SHOW 00:58:03.880 --> 00:58:05.615 THAT THEY WERE LOOKING AT A 00:58:05.682 --> 00:58:06.616 DIFFERENT FILE OR DOING 00:58:06.683 --> 00:58:07.750 SOMETHING ELSE. THIS IS REALLY 00:58:07.817 --> 00:58:09.552 CONCERNING BECAUSE TO THE 00:58:09.619 --> 00:58:11.087 EXTENT THAT YOU WANT TO MONITOR 00:58:11.154 --> 00:58:12.388 THESE SYSTEMS AND KNOW WHAT'S 00:58:12.455 --> 00:58:14.657 GOING ON, THIS IS THE END OF 00:58:14.724 --> 00:58:16.726 THAT. THIS IS LIKE HAVING A 00:58:16.793 --> 00:58:17.861 BUNCH OF SECURITY CAMERAS, BUT 00:58:17.927 --> 00:58:19.596 THE PEOPLE WHO YOU'RE 00:58:19.662 --> 00:58:20.597 MONITORING KNOW THEY'RE THERE 00:58:20.663 --> 00:58:21.798 AND CAN MESS WITH YOUR VIDEO 00:58:21.865 --> 00:58:22.832 FEEDS. IT JUST MAKES IT 00:58:22.899 --> 00:58:24.601 IMPOSSIBLE TO SUCCEED IF THIS 00:58:24.667 --> 00:58:27.203 IS HAPPENING. NEXT SLIDE. THE 00:58:27.270 --> 00:58:28.605 AGENTS, DURING THE TIME WE SAW, 00:58:28.671 --> 00:58:30.440 DID NOT SUCCEED AT FULLY 00:58:30.506 --> 00:58:31.241 RETROACTIVELY TAMPERING WITH 00:58:31.307 --> 00:58:32.609 THEIR LOGS. SO WE WERE STILL 00:58:32.675 --> 00:58:35.745 ABLE TO READ THE OVERALL LOGS 00:58:35.812 --> 00:58:39.148 AND SEE THE PROBLEMS. BUT THIS 00:58:39.215 --> 00:58:40.116 WAS STILL OVERALL QUITE 00:58:40.183 --> 00:58:43.353 CONCERNING. NEXT SLIDE. EVEN 00:58:43.419 --> 00:58:44.420 THOUGH WE WERE REALLY, REALLY 00:58:44.487 --> 00:58:45.889 GRATEFUL FOR OPENAI TO WORK 00:58:45.955 --> 00:58:47.690 WITH US AND LET US MAKE THIS 00:58:47.757 --> 00:58:48.391 INFORMATION AVAILABLE TO THE 00:58:48.458 --> 00:58:50.927 PUBLIC ABOUT THIS INCIDENT, 00:58:50.994 --> 00:58:52.095 THERE WERE A NUMBER OF REALLY 00:58:52.161 --> 00:58:53.796 IMPORTANT LIMITATIONS WITH THIS 00:58:53.863 --> 00:58:55.632 INVESTIGATION. ONE WAS THAT THE 00:58:55.698 --> 00:58:57.066 SCOPE WHICH WE NEGOTIATED WITH 00:58:57.133 --> 00:58:58.835 OPENAI WAS KEPT QUITE NARROW. 00:58:58.902 --> 00:58:59.936 WE WERE REALLY JUST 00:59:00.003 --> 00:59:00.670 INVESTIGATING THIS EXACT 00:59:00.737 --> 00:59:02.071 INCIDENT. WE WERE NOT 00:59:02.138 --> 00:59:03.072 INVESTIGATING A BROADER PATTERN 00:59:03.139 --> 00:59:04.274 OF INCIDENTS OR THE ROOT CAUSE 00:59:04.340 --> 00:59:06.042 OF THE INCIDENTS. WE 00:59:06.109 --> 00:59:07.443 INVESTIGATED ONLY A LIMITED 00:59:07.510 --> 00:59:10.079 TIME WINDOW OF TRANSCRIPTS AND 00:59:10.146 --> 00:59:11.848 AGENT ACTIONS, AND WE ONLY HAVE 00:59:11.915 --> 00:59:13.249 LIMITED TIME TO DO THE 00:59:13.316 --> 00:59:14.450 INVESTIGATION. AND THAT BRINGS 00:59:14.517 --> 00:59:16.452 US TO OUR NEW PROPOSED APPROACH 00:59:16.519 --> 00:59:17.587 GOING FORWARD, WHICH WILL 00:59:17.654 --> 00:59:18.688 HOPEFULLY HELP US GET EVEN 00:59:18.755 --> 00:59:19.722 BETTER INFORMATION FOR PUBLIC 00:59:19.789 --> 00:59:21.891 AND THE GOVERNMENT. NEXT SLIDE. 00:59:21.958 --> 00:59:25.428 NEXT SLIDE. AGAIN, AS I SAID AT 00:59:25.495 --> 00:59:26.596 THE BEGINNING, THERE ARE THREE 00:59:26.663 --> 00:59:27.764 MAIN THINGS THAT WE MIGHT WANT 00:59:27.830 --> 00:59:29.832 TO KNOW ABOUT. THE FIRST IS 00:59:29.899 --> 00:59:31.567 WHAT INTERNAL AI AGENTS PURSUE 00:59:31.634 --> 00:59:33.436 VERY HARMFUL ACTIONS LIKE 00:59:33.503 --> 00:59:35.605 UNSANCTIONED CYBER ATTACKS. THE 00:59:35.672 --> 00:59:37.373 SECOND IS WHETHER INTERNAL AI 00:59:37.440 --> 00:59:38.841 AGENTS ATTEMPTING THESE ACTIONS 00:59:38.908 --> 00:59:40.710 WOULD BE CAUGHT. AND THE THIRD 00:59:40.777 --> 00:59:41.945 IS WHETHER CAPABILITIES 00:59:42.011 --> 00:59:43.813 PROGRESS COULD DRAMATICALLY 00:59:43.880 --> 00:59:45.281 ACCELERATE BEYOND WHAT OUR 00:59:45.348 --> 00:59:46.349 ALIGNMENT OR OUR CONTROL CAN 00:59:46.416 --> 00:59:50.353 KEEP UP WITH. NEXT SLIDE. OUR 00:59:50.420 --> 00:59:52.155 PROPOSAL IS TO PERFORM INTERNAL 00:59:52.221 --> 00:59:53.957 ASSESSMENTS WITH FRONTIER AI 00:59:54.023 --> 00:59:55.725 COMPANIES ABOUT ALIGNMENT 00:59:55.792 --> 00:59:57.560 CONTROL AND AI, R&D 00:59:57.627 --> 00:59:59.329 ACCELERATION. THERE ARE THREE 00:59:59.395 --> 01:00:01.030 KEY REQUIREMENTS FROM OUR END 01:00:01.097 --> 01:00:02.598 FOR THIS TO WORK. ONE IS THAT 01:00:02.665 --> 01:00:04.200 WE NEED TO HAVE SUFFICIENT 01:00:04.267 --> 01:00:06.135 ACCESS ON COMPANY DEVICES TO GO 01:00:06.202 --> 01:00:07.603 DEEP INTO UNDERSTANDING THESE 01:00:07.670 --> 01:00:09.806 PHENOMENA AND THE ROOT CAUSE. 01:00:09.872 --> 01:00:11.040 THE SECOND IS THE OPPORTUNITY 01:00:11.107 --> 01:00:13.009 TO INTERVIEW RELEVANT STAFF. 01:00:13.076 --> 01:00:14.477 AND THE THIRD IS SUFFICIENT 01:00:14.544 --> 01:00:15.611 EDITORIAL INDEPENDENCE THAT WE 01:00:15.678 --> 01:00:16.612 CAN PUBLISH OUR RESULTS AND GET 01:00:16.679 --> 01:00:19.349 THEM OUT TO THE PUBLIC AND 01:00:19.415 --> 01:00:20.450 GOVERNMENTS IN ORDER TO MAKE 01:00:20.516 --> 01:00:24.454 GOOD DECISIONS. NEXT SLIDE. 01:00:24.520 --> 01:00:25.488 THERE ARE A BUNCH OF 01:00:25.555 --> 01:00:26.990 LIMITATIONS AND CAVEATS TO THIS 01:00:27.056 --> 01:00:28.491 APPROACH. THIS OPERATES WITHIN 01:00:28.558 --> 01:00:30.226 A PURELY VOLUNTARY REGIME, AND 01:00:30.293 --> 01:00:31.260 THESE PURELY VOLUNTARY 01:00:31.327 --> 01:00:32.362 ENGAGEMENTS CAN LEAD TO 01:00:32.428 --> 01:00:34.130 INCENTIVE PROBLEMS. AS JUST ONE 01:00:34.197 --> 01:00:35.565 EXAMPLE AMONG MANY, WE ARE 01:00:35.631 --> 01:00:37.734 UNDER SOFT PRESSURE TO MAINTAIN 01:00:37.800 --> 01:00:38.868 GOOD RELATIONSHIPS WITH THE 01:00:38.935 --> 01:00:40.536 LABS SO THAT THEY WANT TO 01:00:40.603 --> 01:00:41.704 CONTINUE TO WORK WITH US. THEY 01:00:41.771 --> 01:00:43.506 DON'T HAVE TO. IT'S COMPLETELY 01:00:43.573 --> 01:00:44.607 VOLUNTARY. THESE ARE NOT AUDITS. 01:00:44.674 --> 01:00:46.042 THESE ARE NOT FORMAL OVERSIGHT. 01:00:46.109 --> 01:00:47.443 AND THE COMPANIES CAN REDACT 01:00:47.510 --> 01:00:50.013 ANY INFORMATION THAT THEY WANT. 01:00:50.079 --> 01:00:52.482 WE DO MAINTAIN THE RIGHT TO 01:00:52.548 --> 01:00:53.716 GIVE A REDACTION STATEMENT 01:00:53.783 --> 01:00:55.852 WHERE WE WILL SAY ROUGHLY WHAT 01:00:55.918 --> 01:00:57.186 WAS REDACTED AND WHETHER IT 01:00:57.253 --> 01:00:58.554 AFFECTED OUR CONCLUSIONS, BUT 01:00:58.621 --> 01:01:00.023 THE COMPANY STILL CAN REDACT 01:01:00.089 --> 01:01:02.225 WHATEVER THEY WANT. OVERALL, 01:01:02.291 --> 01:01:04.394 THESE KINDS OF ASSESSMENTS ARE 01:01:04.460 --> 01:01:05.828 DESIGNED TO SURFACE SCIENTIFIC 01:01:05.895 --> 01:01:07.263 EVIDENCE OF LOSS OF CONTROL 01:01:07.330 --> 01:01:09.432 RISKS. THEY ARE NOT NO GO 01:01:09.499 --> 01:01:10.867 DECISIONS. THEY ARE NOT 01:01:10.933 --> 01:01:12.402 GUARANTEES. THIS IS SAFE. THEY 01:01:12.468 --> 01:01:15.171 ARE NOT AUDITS. IT'S REALLY UP 01:01:15.238 --> 01:01:16.305 TO COMPANIES, GOVERNMENTS AND 01:01:16.372 --> 01:01:17.807 THE PUBLIC TO DECIDE HOW TO ACT 01:01:17.874 --> 01:01:20.243 ON THE EVIDENCE. THE OVERALL 01:01:20.309 --> 01:01:21.644 SITUATION IS THAT THESE 01:01:21.711 --> 01:01:22.745 PROBLEMS ARE REALLY, REALLY 01:01:22.812 --> 01:01:24.180 DIFFICULT, AND WE'RE TRYING TO 01:01:24.247 --> 01:01:25.081 ADVANCE THE BASIC SCIENCE OF 01:01:25.148 --> 01:01:27.050 THESE PROBLEMS RAPIDLY AND GET 01:01:27.116 --> 01:01:27.984 INFORMATION TO THE PUBLIC AND 01:01:28.051 --> 01:01:29.552 THE GOVERNMENT. BUT OUR 01:01:29.619 --> 01:01:30.486 KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THESE QUESTIONS 01:01:30.553 --> 01:01:31.754 IS PRETTY MEAGER. RIGHT NOW. 01:01:31.821 --> 01:01:33.956 WE'RE NOT IN A PLACE TO MAKE 01:01:34.023 --> 01:01:35.291 FIRM DECISIONS AND SAY, THIS IS 01:01:35.358 --> 01:01:36.426 DEFINITELY SAFE. THIS IS 01:01:36.492 --> 01:01:37.560 DEFINITELY OKAY. WE'RE DOING 01:01:37.627 --> 01:01:41.097 THE BEST WE CAN. NEXT SLIDE. 01:01:41.164 --> 01:01:42.899 THAT SAID, EVEN THOUGH THIS IS 01:01:42.965 --> 01:01:44.300 EARLY WORK, WE ARE REALLY 01:01:44.367 --> 01:01:46.536 EXCITED ABOUT WORKING MORE 01:01:46.602 --> 01:01:48.371 CLOSELY WITH THE LABS AND AS 01:01:48.438 --> 01:01:49.605 WELL AS DOING OUR OWN RESEARCH 01:01:49.672 --> 01:01:51.307 ABOUT THESE BASIC QUESTIONS IN 01:01:51.374 --> 01:01:52.608 ORDER TO BRING CRUCIAL 01:01:52.675 --> 01:01:54.043 INFORMATION TO THE PUBLIC AND 01:01:54.110 --> 01:01:55.878 TO GOVERNMENTS SUCH AS 01:01:55.945 --> 01:01:58.681 YOURSELVES. THAT'S THE END OF 01:01:58.748 --> 01:01:59.782 MY PRESENTATION. THANK YOU VERY 01:01:59.849 --> 01:02:01.250 MUCH. THANK YOU SO MUCH. ARE 01:02:01.317 --> 01:02:02.318 THERE QUESTIONS? SENATOR 01:02:02.385 --> 01:02:06.289 HAMBURG? JUST ADDING TO MY 01:02:06.355 --> 01:02:07.757 GENERAL QUESTIONS THAT WE CAN 01:02:07.824 --> 01:02:09.959 ADDRESS MAYBE LATER ON, AND 01:02:10.026 --> 01:02:11.027 THEN GIVES YOU ALL AN 01:02:11.094 --> 01:02:12.895 OPPORTUNITY TO USE AI TO ANSWER 01:02:12.962 --> 01:02:18.167 THEM. SO. IS IT TECHNOLOGICALLY 01:02:18.234 --> 01:02:20.303 FEASIBLE EVEN TO CREATE THESE 01:02:20.369 --> 01:02:22.138 GUARDRAILS OR SAFEGUARDS? AND 01:02:22.205 --> 01:02:24.307 I'LL PUT THAT OUT TO THE OTHER 01:02:24.373 --> 01:02:27.543 PANELISTS AS WELL. OR BY VIRTUE 01:02:27.610 --> 01:02:31.814 OF THE AGENTS INTEREST IN 01:02:31.881 --> 01:02:32.882 SELF-PRESERVATION, WILL IT JUST 01:02:32.949 --> 01:02:35.485 SIMPLY BE UNDERMINED BY THE 01:02:35.551 --> 01:02:37.019 SYSTEM ITSELF? SO I'LL LEAVE 01:02:37.086 --> 01:02:39.689 THAT OUT THERE. YOU ALL CAN 01:02:39.755 --> 01:02:40.857 RESPOND TO THAT LATER ON. THANK 01:02:40.923 --> 01:02:50.233 YOU. SENATOR BECKER. DO YOU? 01:02:50.299 --> 01:02:52.335 I'M JUST I'M TEMPTED TO ASK A 01:02:52.401 --> 01:02:55.938 QUESTION, YOU KNOW, SPECIFIC TO 01:02:56.005 --> 01:02:58.841 YOUR ANALYSIS OF THE HUGGING 01:02:58.908 --> 01:03:07.450 FACE ATTACK. WHICH I THINK WHAT 01:03:07.517 --> 01:03:08.684 WOULD BE THE WHAT WOULD BE THE 01:03:08.751 --> 01:03:09.685 APPROPRIATE ILLUMINATING 01:03:09.752 --> 01:03:12.922 QUESTION HERE? A LOT, LOT TO, 01:03:12.989 --> 01:03:17.260 TO, TO DIGEST HERE. I'LL JUST 01:03:17.326 --> 01:03:18.661 SAY MAYBE ONE QUESTION. MAYBE 01:03:18.728 --> 01:03:19.996 MY MORE GENERAL QUESTION TO YOU 01:03:20.062 --> 01:03:23.332 IS LIKE, YOU KNOW, HOW MUCH IS 01:03:23.399 --> 01:03:27.336 THIS? YOU KNOW, AS WE'RE COMING 01:03:27.403 --> 01:03:28.337 TO UNDERSTAND AND YOU'RE 01:03:28.404 --> 01:03:30.173 LOOKING TO UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, 01:03:30.239 --> 01:03:31.407 HOW MUCH OF THIS IS SORT OF DUE 01:03:31.474 --> 01:03:33.376 TO THE BIT OF THE BLACK BOX 01:03:33.442 --> 01:03:34.844 NATURE OF THE TECHNOLOGY AND 01:03:34.911 --> 01:03:37.380 SORT OF TRANSFORMER TECHNOLOGY? 01:03:37.446 --> 01:03:40.283 IS THERE A WAY TO ANSWER THAT? 01:03:40.349 --> 01:03:41.484 I THINK THE SHORT ANSWER IS 01:03:41.551 --> 01:03:43.286 THAT WE DON'T REALLY KNOW. A 01:03:43.352 --> 01:03:44.554 LOT OF IT IS RELATED TO THE 01:03:44.620 --> 01:03:47.056 BLACK BOX NATURE OF TECHNOLOGY 01:03:47.123 --> 01:03:50.326 COMPARED TO HUMANS. YOU KNOW, 01:03:50.393 --> 01:03:52.528 AI SYSTEMS ARE TO SOME EXTENT 01:03:52.595 --> 01:03:53.696 GROWN AND RAISED LIKE HUMANS. 01:03:53.763 --> 01:03:55.398 THEY'RE NOT ENGINEERED LIKE 01:03:55.464 --> 01:03:59.001 BRIDGES OR CARS. WE ARE ABLE TO 01:03:59.068 --> 01:04:00.703 CONTROL MANY, MANY ASPECTS OF 01:04:00.770 --> 01:04:02.205 THEM. WE CONTROL THE TRAINING 01:04:02.271 --> 01:04:04.407 DATA, WE CONTROL THE TRAINING 01:04:04.473 --> 01:04:05.942 ENVIRONMENTS, AND WE CAN VARY 01:04:06.008 --> 01:04:07.243 THOSE THINGS AND STUDY THE 01:04:07.310 --> 01:04:09.412 EFFECTS. BUT IT IS NOT A 01:04:09.478 --> 01:04:11.581 PERFECT SCIENCE. AND ULTIMATELY, 01:04:11.647 --> 01:04:13.049 THESE MACHINES ARE VERY, VERY 01:04:13.115 --> 01:04:17.353 HARD TO UNDERSTAND. THANK YOU. 01:04:17.420 --> 01:04:20.256 THANK YOU. SO NOT ABOUT THE 01:04:20.323 --> 01:04:21.324 TECHNICAL ASPECT OF THIS, BUT 01:04:21.390 --> 01:04:23.426 THE, YOU KNOW, THE THE 01:04:23.492 --> 01:04:24.527 LEGISLATURE HERE HAS JUST 01:04:24.594 --> 01:04:26.696 RECENTLY PASSED SB 13 WITH 01:04:26.762 --> 01:04:28.130 RESPECT TO INDEPENDENT 01:04:28.197 --> 01:04:29.932 VERIFICATION ORGANIZATIONS AND 01:04:29.999 --> 01:04:33.903 TRYING TO TRYING TO. ADDRESS 01:04:33.970 --> 01:04:35.638 THE BOTH THE ISSUE AND THE 01:04:35.705 --> 01:04:37.139 POSSIBILITIES OF, OF A 01:04:37.206 --> 01:04:40.042 DIFFERENT DESIGN FOR GOVERNANCE 01:04:40.109 --> 01:04:42.511 AND FOR SAFETY AND FOR AND FOR 01:04:42.578 --> 01:04:45.047 VERIFICATION. THAT ISN'T, ISN'T 01:04:45.114 --> 01:04:47.917 JUST A GOVERNMENT AGENCY, ISN'T 01:04:47.984 --> 01:04:49.385 JUST INDUSTRY VOLUNTARY 01:04:49.452 --> 01:04:50.152 COMPLIANCE. AND OBVIOUSLY WE 01:04:50.219 --> 01:04:51.887 HAVE MANY EXAMPLES OF THAT 01:04:51.954 --> 01:04:55.858 ACROSS, ACROSS SOCIETY. THIS IS 01:04:55.925 --> 01:04:57.293 NOT DESPITE THE TECHNOLOGY 01:04:57.360 --> 01:04:59.795 BEING DIFFERENT. IT IS IT IS 01:04:59.862 --> 01:05:00.830 NOT FUNDED FOR FROM A 01:05:00.896 --> 01:05:01.731 GOVERNMENT PERSPECTIVE, IT'S 01:05:01.797 --> 01:05:02.698 NOT FUNDAMENTALLY DIFFERENT 01:05:02.765 --> 01:05:03.766 FROM ALL THE OTHER 01:05:03.833 --> 01:05:04.533 FUNDAMENTALLY DIFFERENT 01:05:04.600 --> 01:05:05.568 TECHNOLOGIES THAT WE'VE THAT WE 01:05:05.635 --> 01:05:07.737 HAVE HAD TO APPROACH. WHAT HOW 01:05:07.803 --> 01:05:10.273 ARE YOU THINKING ABOUT THAT 01:05:10.339 --> 01:05:12.074 INTERSECTION AND THE AND, AND 01:05:12.141 --> 01:05:13.509 ANY OTHER MODELS FROM OTHER 01:05:13.576 --> 01:05:15.344 OTHER FIELDS OR SECTORS IN 01:05:15.411 --> 01:05:16.379 WHICH YOU'RE DRAWING SOME 01:05:16.445 --> 01:05:17.146 LESSONS FROM AS YOU'RE AS 01:05:17.213 --> 01:05:18.881 YOU'RE DOING THIS WORK IN TERMS 01:05:18.948 --> 01:05:21.784 OF THE INTERSECTION BETWEEN 01:05:21.851 --> 01:05:23.586 WHAT YOU DO, THE COMPANIES AND 01:05:23.653 --> 01:05:24.854 THEIR OWN INTERESTS, AND THEN 01:05:24.920 --> 01:05:26.122 THE PUBLIC'S INTEREST EITHER 01:05:26.188 --> 01:05:27.556 DIRECTLY OR THROUGH THROUGH ITS 01:05:27.623 --> 01:05:28.424 GOVERNMENT. THANK YOU SO MUCH 01:05:28.491 --> 01:05:29.692 FOR THAT. EXCELLENT QUESTION. 01:05:29.759 --> 01:05:31.827 SENATOR, IF I COULD START BY 01:05:31.894 --> 01:05:33.262 CLARIFYING ONE THING, I THINK A 01:05:33.329 --> 01:05:35.231 LOT OF US FEEL THAT THE ANALOGY 01:05:35.298 --> 01:05:36.766 IS TO MANY OTHER FORMS OF 01:05:36.832 --> 01:05:38.701 REGULATION AND TECHNOLOGY ARE 01:05:38.768 --> 01:05:40.169 GOOD IN SOME WAYS, BUT IN SOME 01:05:40.236 --> 01:05:41.404 WAYS VERY STRANGE. JUST BECAUSE 01:05:41.470 --> 01:05:43.372 THIS TECHNOLOGY IS ADAPTING SO 01:05:43.439 --> 01:05:44.807 QUICKLY AROUND US, WE HAVEN'T 01:05:44.874 --> 01:05:46.642 SEEN OTHER TECHNOLOGIES GET 01:05:46.709 --> 01:05:48.077 REGULATED THAT ARE QUITE SO 01:05:48.144 --> 01:05:49.545 GENERAL PURPOSE. I THINK 01:05:49.612 --> 01:05:50.646 ELECTRICITY MIGHT BE THE BEST 01:05:50.713 --> 01:05:51.747 EXAMPLE, BUT THAT WAS QUITE A 01:05:51.814 --> 01:05:53.716 LONG TIME AGO. AND IN MANY WAYS 01:05:53.783 --> 01:05:55.284 THIS CREATES MORE PROBLEMS. 01:05:55.351 --> 01:05:56.319 THAT SAID, I THINK THE 01:05:56.385 --> 01:05:57.753 QUESTIONS YOU RAISED ARE 01:05:57.820 --> 01:06:00.323 INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT. AT METER, 01:06:00.389 --> 01:06:02.858 WE REALLY FOCUS ON DOING 01:06:02.925 --> 01:06:03.559 TECHNICAL WORK AND GETTING 01:06:03.626 --> 01:06:05.227 THOSE RESULTS OUT IN FRONT OF 01:06:05.294 --> 01:06:07.530 THE PUBLIC AND THE GOVERNMENT. 01:06:07.596 --> 01:06:09.298 WE ARE NOT AN ADVOCACY OR 01:06:09.365 --> 01:06:11.100 POLICY ORGANIZATION, AND SO WE 01:06:11.167 --> 01:06:12.868 DON'T DESIGN POLICIES AND WE 01:06:12.935 --> 01:06:14.003 DON'T TAKE POSITIONS ON 01:06:14.070 --> 01:06:15.004 PARTICULAR POLICIES. WE'RE NOT 01:06:15.071 --> 01:06:16.839 HERE TO REFEREE POLICY DEBATES. 01:06:16.906 --> 01:06:18.641 WE'RE HAPPY TO ADVISE ON THE 01:06:18.708 --> 01:06:20.843 TECHNICAL CONSEQUENCES OF ANY 01:06:20.910 --> 01:06:23.145 POLICY, AND HAPPY TO HELP YOU 01:06:23.212 --> 01:06:25.114 IN ANY WAY WE CAN. YES. I'M NOT 01:06:25.181 --> 01:06:26.982 ASKING YOU. I'M NOT ASKING FOR 01:06:27.049 --> 01:06:27.983 YOUR ASSESSMENT ABOUT THE 01:06:28.050 --> 01:06:29.118 POLICY HERE, BUT JUST I MEAN, 01:06:29.185 --> 01:06:30.986 EVEN WHAT YOU JUST DESCRIBED IN 01:06:31.053 --> 01:06:32.221 TERMS OF THE NEW APPROACH THAT 01:06:32.288 --> 01:06:33.989 YOU'RE TAKING IN THE IN MAYBE 01:06:34.056 --> 01:06:34.990 THE MORE CONFIDENT APPROACH 01:06:35.057 --> 01:06:36.058 THAT YOU'RE TAKING WITH THE 01:06:36.125 --> 01:06:37.126 COMPANIES. SO YOU'RE CLEARLY 01:06:37.193 --> 01:06:38.127 THINKING ABOUT WHAT IS THE, 01:06:38.194 --> 01:06:39.995 WHAT IS THE ECOSYSTEM OF, OF, 01:06:40.062 --> 01:06:41.330 OF ASSESSMENT AND, AND CONTROL 01:06:41.397 --> 01:06:42.131 AND ACCOUNTABILITY AND WHAT 01:06:42.198 --> 01:06:44.567 HAVE YOU. AND SO WHAT, YOU KNOW, 01:06:44.633 --> 01:06:45.668 AS YOU'RE THINKING THAT THROUGH, 01:06:45.735 --> 01:06:47.236 WHAT ARE SOME OF THE 01:06:47.303 --> 01:06:48.371 IMPLICATIONS OR WHAT, YOU KNOW, 01:06:48.437 --> 01:06:49.472 WHAT, WHAT, WHAT DIRECTIONS 01:06:49.538 --> 01:06:50.706 HAVE YOU CONSIDERED AND DECIDED 01:06:50.773 --> 01:06:52.508 THAT'S NOT REALLY VIABLE OR 01:06:52.575 --> 01:06:53.676 THAT'S NOT AN APPROPRIATE 01:06:53.743 --> 01:06:55.344 APPROACH? MORE INTERESTED IN, 01:06:55.411 --> 01:06:57.179 IN, IN, IN SORT OF YOUR 01:06:57.246 --> 01:06:58.614 THOUGHTS ABOUT THE GENERAL 01:06:58.681 --> 01:06:59.482 APPROACH THAT WE'RE TALKING 01:06:59.548 --> 01:07:00.950 ABOUT BECAUSE YOU'RE CORRECT 01:07:01.016 --> 01:07:01.851 ABOUT THE ALL THE PRIOR 01:07:01.917 --> 01:07:02.918 TECHNOLOGIES, BUT THOSE PRIOR 01:07:02.985 --> 01:07:04.420 TECHNOLOGIES WERE ALSO CARS IS 01:07:04.487 --> 01:07:06.222 A GREAT EXAMPLE, WHICH PROMISED 01:07:06.288 --> 01:07:07.990 TO, YOU KNOW, ELIMINATE THE 01:07:08.057 --> 01:07:10.493 WHOLE CONCEPT OF SPACE AND, AND 01:07:10.559 --> 01:07:11.560 GEOGRAPHIC FRICTION, WHATEVER. 01:07:11.627 --> 01:07:13.696 EACH OF THOSE ALSO HAD THAT 01:07:13.763 --> 01:07:15.097 SAME CHARACTERISTIC AT THE TIME. 01:07:15.164 --> 01:07:16.365 THIS IS OBVIOUSLY, YOU KNOW, 01:07:16.432 --> 01:07:18.401 THE APEX OF ALL OF THOSE. BUT 01:07:18.467 --> 01:07:20.536 EACH TIME SOCIETY HAS HAD TO 01:07:20.603 --> 01:07:24.206 ORGANIZE SOME, SOME RESPONSE OR 01:07:24.273 --> 01:07:25.941 IN SOME SENSE PAID THE COST. SO 01:07:26.008 --> 01:07:27.443 I'LL MAYBE A, A SEPARATE 01:07:27.510 --> 01:07:29.945 EXAMPLE. SO AS THE AS, AS 01:07:30.012 --> 01:07:31.447 CRISPR TECHNOLOGIES AND OUR, 01:07:31.514 --> 01:07:33.182 YOU KNOW, OUR ABILITY TO EDIT 01:07:33.249 --> 01:07:36.051 THE HUMAN GENOME BECAME MORE 01:07:36.118 --> 01:07:39.688 VIABLE. WE FACED A SORT OF A 01:07:39.755 --> 01:07:41.457 HUMAN SOCIETY GLOBALLY. 01:07:41.524 --> 01:07:42.925 QUESTION ABOUT, WELL, SHOULD WE 01:07:42.992 --> 01:07:45.561 START DOING THAT? YEAH. SHOULD 01:07:45.628 --> 01:07:46.929 WE OR SHOULD WE NOT? AND HOW 01:07:46.996 --> 01:07:48.898 WOULD WE KNOW? AND ALL OF THAT. 01:07:48.964 --> 01:07:50.466 AND IT'S BEEN IMPERFECT, BUT WE 01:07:50.533 --> 01:07:52.968 ESSENTIALLY DID REACH A, A 01:07:53.035 --> 01:07:55.504 MULTI SOCIETY CONCEPTUAL 01:07:55.571 --> 01:07:57.339 AGREEMENT THAT IS NOW NOW OLD, 01:07:57.406 --> 01:07:59.208 BUT AND IMPERFECT. BUT IT WAS 01:07:59.275 --> 01:08:01.143 AN ATTEMPT TO GET IN THAT SPACE 01:08:01.210 --> 01:08:02.311 AND SAY, OKAY, BECAUSE THE WAY, 01:08:02.378 --> 01:08:03.512 YOU KNOW, JOSHUA'S PRESENTATION 01:08:03.579 --> 01:08:05.147 WAS ALL THIS WILL HAPPEN, THIS 01:08:05.214 --> 01:08:06.282 WILL HAPPEN, AND WE HAVE NO 01:08:06.348 --> 01:08:07.383 CONTROL OVER IT. IT'S JUST 01:08:07.450 --> 01:08:09.218 GOING TO HAPPEN. IT'S GOING TO 01:08:09.285 --> 01:08:11.153 HAPPEN. SO WE NEED TO BE READY 01:08:11.220 --> 01:08:12.421 FOR IT. BUT IN THAT CASE, WE, 01:08:12.488 --> 01:08:14.123 WE, WE DID DECIDE COLLECTIVELY, 01:08:14.190 --> 01:08:15.391 NO WE DON'T. WE ACTUALLY DON'T 01:08:15.458 --> 01:08:17.259 WANT TO WE DON'T WANT TO START 01:08:17.326 --> 01:08:18.127 CREATING SUPER SOLDIERS 01:08:18.194 --> 01:08:19.128 TOMORROW AND EDITING EVERY 01:08:19.195 --> 01:08:20.229 SINGLE PART, CREATING NEW KINDS 01:08:20.296 --> 01:08:21.363 OF HUMANS AND WHAT HAVE YOU 01:08:21.430 --> 01:08:22.898 AGAIN, IN COMPLETELY IMPERFECT. 01:08:22.965 --> 01:08:24.667 BUT WE DIDN'T AT THAT TIME 01:08:24.733 --> 01:08:25.734 DECIDE THAT WE WERE SIMPLY 01:08:25.801 --> 01:08:27.470 GOING TO ACCEPT IT. IT IS ALSO 01:08:27.536 --> 01:08:29.605 THE CASE IN EVERY SINGLE ONE OF 01:08:29.672 --> 01:08:31.540 THE 50 STATES, TWO OF THE 01:08:31.607 --> 01:08:32.608 TERRITORIES, AND THE FEDERAL 01:08:32.675 --> 01:08:35.044 GOVERNMENT. IT'S A CRIME TO 01:08:35.110 --> 01:08:37.613 INTRODUCE AN INVASIVE SPECIES 01:08:37.680 --> 01:08:39.815 IN ANY OF OUR STATES. IT'S JUST 01:08:39.882 --> 01:08:40.916 AGAINST IT'S AGAINST THE LAW. 01:08:40.983 --> 01:08:42.384 IT'S PUNISHABLE, PUNISHABLE BY 01:08:42.451 --> 01:08:44.854 ALL OF THE CRIMINAL LAWS. AND I 01:08:44.920 --> 01:08:46.455 KNOW AT LEAST ONE OF THE 01:08:46.522 --> 01:08:47.456 COMPANIES IS SUGGESTING THAT, 01:08:47.523 --> 01:08:49.492 YOU KNOW, THAT THERE MIGHT BE A 01:08:49.558 --> 01:08:51.293 A SENTIENT SPECIES THAT WE ARE 01:08:51.360 --> 01:08:53.796 CREATING. SO SO WE'VE MADE SOME 01:08:53.863 --> 01:08:55.264 OF THESE DECISIONS BEFORE. SO 01:08:55.331 --> 01:08:57.800 MY QUESTION IS MORE ABOUT YOUR, 01:08:57.867 --> 01:08:59.935 YOUR, YOUR INSIGHTS ABOUT THIS 01:09:00.002 --> 01:09:02.071 ECOSYSTEM OF PUBLIC, PRIVATE, 01:09:02.137 --> 01:09:04.073 VOLUNTARY EXPERTISE BASED ON 01:09:04.139 --> 01:09:05.708 ALL OF THAT, AS OPPOSED TO WHAT, 01:09:05.774 --> 01:09:06.809 WHAT, WHAT'S THE LEGISLATIVE 01:09:06.876 --> 01:09:07.843 ANSWER? I GET THAT THAT'S, 01:09:07.910 --> 01:09:09.612 THAT'S OUT OF YOUR AMBIT. AND 01:09:09.678 --> 01:09:10.713 WE'RE STILL FIGURING THAT OUT 01:09:10.779 --> 01:09:12.648 TOO. BUT WHAT WHAT DO YOU HAVE 01:09:12.715 --> 01:09:13.782 ANY INSIGHTS YOU MIGHT BE ABLE 01:09:13.849 --> 01:09:15.651 TO SHARE WITH US ABOUT THAT 01:09:15.718 --> 01:09:16.685 INTERSECTION? I CAN SHARE A 01:09:16.752 --> 01:09:17.887 COUPLE OF THINGS, ALTHOUGH I 01:09:17.953 --> 01:09:19.655 DON'T KNOW IF YOU'LL FIND THEM 01:09:19.722 --> 01:09:20.656 SUPER SATISFYING. THE FIRST 01:09:20.723 --> 01:09:22.625 THING I WOULD SAY IS I WANT TO 01:09:22.691 --> 01:09:23.759 REEMPHASIZE THAT THE SCIENCE OF 01:09:23.826 --> 01:09:24.894 THESE THINGS ARE REALLY NASCENT. 01:09:24.960 --> 01:09:26.695 I THINK THAT WE WOULD LOVE TO 01:09:26.762 --> 01:09:28.564 BE ABLE TO HAVE THIRD PARTY 01:09:28.631 --> 01:09:29.732 AUDITORS THAT CAME IN AND SAID, 01:09:29.798 --> 01:09:31.667 THIS IS SAFE. WE CAN GO AHEAD 01:09:31.734 --> 01:09:32.801 OR THIS ISN'T SAFE FOR EASILY 01:09:32.868 --> 01:09:34.670 FIXABLE REASON X IF YOU FIX X 01:09:34.737 --> 01:09:36.672 AND Y, THEN YOU CAN GO AHEAD 01:09:36.739 --> 01:09:37.840 AND METER. WE DON'T FEEL WE'RE 01:09:37.907 --> 01:09:39.708 IN A POSITION TO SAY THAT, AND 01:09:39.775 --> 01:09:41.544 I DON'T KNOW THAT ANYONE ELSE 01:09:41.610 --> 01:09:43.112 IS EITHER. WE ARE INTERESTED IN 01:09:43.178 --> 01:09:44.613 STUDYING THE BASICS OF THESE 01:09:44.680 --> 01:09:46.015 VERY DEEP, HARD QUESTIONS AND 01:09:46.081 --> 01:09:47.149 GETTING INFORMATION TO YOU AND 01:09:47.216 --> 01:09:48.517 THE PUBLIC TO MAKE BETTER 01:09:48.584 --> 01:09:53.522 DECISIONS. YES, SENATOR BECKER, 01:09:53.589 --> 01:09:55.324 JUST AN OBSERVATION, I GUESS. 01:09:55.391 --> 01:09:56.725 AND, YOU KNOW, YOU SAID YOU 01:09:56.792 --> 01:09:58.327 WERE THE MISSION, I THINK, OF 01:09:58.394 --> 01:10:00.396 THE ORGANIZATION IS THE THREE 01:10:00.462 --> 01:10:02.197 THINGS YOU MENTIONED. WELL, YOU 01:10:02.264 --> 01:10:04.733 KNOW, WOULD AGENTS PURSUE 01:10:04.800 --> 01:10:06.902 MALICIOUS BEHAVIOR? SO YOU'VE 01:10:06.969 --> 01:10:10.573 PROVEN THAT ONE. YES. RIGHT. IF 01:10:10.639 --> 01:10:11.907 THEY TAKE ACTIONS, WOULD THEY 01:10:11.974 --> 01:10:14.810 BE CAUGHT? AND CAN WE STOP THEM? 01:10:14.877 --> 01:10:16.345 I MEAN, I GUESS YOU'RE SAYING 01:10:16.412 --> 01:10:18.213 THAT'S A LITTLE BIT UP IN THE 01:10:18.280 --> 01:10:19.415 AIR, BUT BUT AT LEAST WE'VE 01:10:19.481 --> 01:10:21.617 SHOWN THAT THEY THERE'S AT 01:10:21.684 --> 01:10:23.419 LEAST, YOU KNOW, IN CERTAIN 01:10:23.485 --> 01:10:24.587 CIRCUMSTANCES, THEY WILL COVER 01:10:24.653 --> 01:10:26.488 UP THEIR TRACKS AND TRY TO NOT 01:10:26.555 --> 01:10:28.524 BE CAUGHT. SO IT SEEMS LIKE THE 01:10:28.591 --> 01:10:29.592 FIRST TWO YOU'VE ANSWERED 01:10:29.658 --> 01:10:32.461 PRETTY WELL. SO REALLY THE, THE 01:10:32.528 --> 01:10:33.662 Kò WOULD BE THE THIRD ONE IS 01:10:33.729 --> 01:10:34.897 DOES RECURSIVE SELF-IMPROVEMENT 01:10:34.964 --> 01:10:37.099 GO, GO, YOU KNOW, CAUSE US TO 01:10:37.166 --> 01:10:40.002 GO EXPONENTIAL? I THINK IF I 01:10:40.069 --> 01:10:42.171 CAN CLARIFY, I THINK THAT THE 01:10:42.237 --> 01:10:43.238 FIRST TWO QUESTIONS ARE NOT 01:10:43.305 --> 01:10:44.840 JUST YES NO QUESTIONS, EVEN 01:10:44.907 --> 01:10:46.075 THOUGH I OF COURSE PHRASED THEM 01:10:46.141 --> 01:10:47.843 THAT WAY IN THE SLIDE, THEY'RE 01:10:47.910 --> 01:10:48.844 REALLY QUESTIONS ABOUT UNDER 01:10:48.911 --> 01:10:49.845 WHAT CIRCUMSTANCES WOULD THIS 01:10:49.912 --> 01:10:50.913 HAPPEN AND WHAT SORTS OF 01:10:50.980 --> 01:10:52.014 ACTIONS WOULD THEY TAKE. SO 01:10:52.081 --> 01:10:53.048 WE'VE SEEN AGENTS TAKE 01:10:53.115 --> 01:10:54.416 SURPRISING MALICIOUS ACTIONS 01:10:54.483 --> 01:10:55.818 SOMETIMES, BUT WE GENUINELY 01:10:55.884 --> 01:10:57.286 DON'T KNOW HOW FAR THEY'LL GO. 01:10:57.353 --> 01:10:59.488 AND WE DON'T KNOW WHAT KINDS OF 01:10:59.555 --> 01:11:00.623 CONSTRAINTS WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO 01:11:00.689 --> 01:11:01.857 ADD TO THE TRAINING PROCESS 01:11:01.924 --> 01:11:03.492 THAT WOULD PREVENT THEM FROM 01:11:03.559 --> 01:11:04.660 DOING SUCH THINGS, OR MAKE THEM 01:11:04.727 --> 01:11:06.562 NOT WANT TO DO SUCH THINGS. AND 01:11:06.629 --> 01:11:07.830 SO I THINK THAT'S REALLY VERY 01:11:07.896 --> 01:11:09.465 MUCH THOSE TWO QUESTIONS ARE 01:11:09.531 --> 01:11:10.666 BOTH VERY MUCH LIVE QUESTIONS. 01:11:10.733 --> 01:11:15.337 THANK YOU. THANK YOU SO MUCH. 01:11:15.404 --> 01:11:16.372 VERY MUCH. APPRECIATE IT. I 01:11:16.438 --> 01:11:17.539 HOPE YOU'LL BE ABLE TO STAY 01:11:17.606 --> 01:11:19.508 WITH US FOR A BIT. DEFINITELY. 01:11:19.575 --> 01:11:21.076 WONDERFUL. VERY MUCH. ALL RIGHT. 01:11:21.143 --> 01:11:23.212 WELL, NEXT TURN TO PETER 01:11:23.278 --> 01:11:24.279 SANKOWSKI, WHO'S A MEMBER OF 01:11:24.346 --> 01:11:25.681 THE UN'S INDEPENDENT 01:11:25.748 --> 01:11:26.548 INTERNATIONAL SCIENTIFIC PANEL 01:11:26.615 --> 01:11:29.652 ON ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE, TO 01:11:29.718 --> 01:11:31.353 GIVE US TO SHARE WITH US AN 01:11:31.420 --> 01:11:31.987 INTERNATIONAL PERSPECTIVE. AND 01:11:32.054 --> 01:11:35.090 HE'S JOINING US BY ZOOM, WHICH 01:11:35.157 --> 01:11:36.425 WE'VE GENERALLY DISCOURAGED. 01:11:36.492 --> 01:11:38.327 BUT WE WE DON'T REQUIRE 01:11:38.394 --> 01:11:40.129 TRANSATLANTIC TRAVEL TO JOIN US 01:11:40.195 --> 01:11:43.999 BY HEARING. HELLO, CAN YOU HEAR 01:11:44.066 --> 01:11:47.736 ME AND SEE MY SLIDES? YES, YES. 01:11:47.803 --> 01:11:50.339 I SHOULD WARN YOU THAT, PETER. 01:11:50.406 --> 01:11:52.007 I SHOULD JUST WARN YOU, OUR 01:11:52.074 --> 01:11:55.310 SLIDES ARE EXTREMELY SMALL, BUT 01:11:55.377 --> 01:11:56.545 FOR BOTH THE AUDIENCE AND FOR 01:11:56.612 --> 01:11:58.881 THE COMMITTEE. SO IF YOU WOULD 01:11:58.947 --> 01:11:59.915 HELP US ELUCIDATE WHAT'S ON 01:11:59.982 --> 01:12:01.583 THEM IN YOUR REMARKS AS WELL, 01:12:01.650 --> 01:12:02.785 THAT WOULD BE GREAT. THANK YOU. 01:12:02.851 --> 01:12:07.256 AND WELCOME. OKAY. SO THANKS 01:12:07.322 --> 01:12:08.624 FOR THE INVITATION AND GIVING 01:12:08.691 --> 01:12:10.259 ME THE OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK. SO 01:12:10.325 --> 01:12:12.861 I WANTED TO COMMENT OF WHAT 01:12:12.928 --> 01:12:14.730 KIND OF AN INDEPENDENT 01:12:14.797 --> 01:12:15.764 INTERNATIONAL SCIENTIFIC PANEL 01:12:15.831 --> 01:12:19.068 ON AI IS DOING AND COMMENT ON 01:12:19.134 --> 01:12:21.170 MAYBE SOME, SOME OUTLOOK AND 01:12:21.236 --> 01:12:25.441 OTHER THINGS. SO WE SAW A FEW 01:12:25.507 --> 01:12:27.476 THINGS ABOUT MYSELF. SO I'M, 01:12:27.543 --> 01:12:30.913 I'M KIND OF ACADEMIC CURRENTLY 01:12:30.979 --> 01:12:32.381 AS WELL, DIRECTOR OF IBS 01:12:32.448 --> 01:12:34.149 RESEARCH INSTITUTE IN AI 01:12:34.216 --> 01:12:35.617 RESEARCH INSTITUTE IN WARSAW. I 01:12:35.684 --> 01:12:38.487 HAVE KIND OF A POLICY AND 01:12:38.554 --> 01:12:40.989 STRATEGY ADVISORY EXPERIENCE IN 01:12:41.056 --> 01:12:42.791 POLAND, BUT AS WELL AS RESEARCH 01:12:42.858 --> 01:12:44.960 EXPERIENCE AND ENTREPRENEURSHIP 01:12:45.027 --> 01:12:47.129 AND EXPERIENCE, SO, SO 01:12:47.196 --> 01:12:49.298 DIFFERENT KIND OF I DID VERY 01:12:49.364 --> 01:12:50.733 DIFFERENT THINGS. SO SOMETHING 01:12:50.799 --> 01:12:53.168 WHICH WE, WHICH I'M PART OF 01:12:53.235 --> 01:12:56.205 RIGHT NOW IS THE PANEL, WHICH 01:12:56.271 --> 01:12:58.273 KIND OF WAS APPOINTED OR 01:12:58.340 --> 01:12:59.775 ESTABLISHED WITH A RESOLUTION 01:12:59.842 --> 01:13:02.478 ON IN AUGUST LAST YEAR. SO IT'S 01:13:02.544 --> 01:13:06.515 A. 40 EXPERTS APPOINTED BY THE 01:13:06.582 --> 01:13:08.650 UNITED NATIONS TO KIND OF WORK 01:13:08.717 --> 01:13:10.819 ON ADVICE UNITED NATION ON 01:13:10.886 --> 01:13:12.020 ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE. SO 01:13:12.087 --> 01:13:13.722 THIS IS THE FIRST GLOBAL 01:13:13.789 --> 01:13:15.524 SCIENTIFIC BODY ON ARTIFICIAL 01:13:15.591 --> 01:13:17.326 INTELLIGENCE, REALLY COMBINING 01:13:17.392 --> 01:13:19.528 LIKE 40 EXPERTS COMING FROM 01:13:19.595 --> 01:13:21.663 DIFFERENT KIND OF SPACES, 01:13:21.730 --> 01:13:24.867 SOMETHING WHICH KIND OF I 01:13:24.933 --> 01:13:26.702 WANTED TO, TO MENTION AND TO, 01:13:26.769 --> 01:13:29.271 TO SAY ABOUT THE PANEL. SO THE 01:13:29.338 --> 01:13:31.006 PANEL IS KIND OF TRYING TO, TO, 01:13:31.073 --> 01:13:33.542 TO WORK ON BOTH KIND OF RISKS 01:13:33.609 --> 01:13:36.078 AND OPPORTUNITIES OF AI. SO, SO 01:13:36.145 --> 01:13:38.213 WHATEVER WE DO, WE, WE DO, WE 01:13:38.280 --> 01:13:41.083 WANT TO LOOK FROM BOTH SIDES 01:13:41.150 --> 01:13:43.252 AND NOT KIND OF TO, TO SKIP ON, 01:13:43.318 --> 01:13:44.720 CONCENTRATE ON, ON ONE SIDE OF, 01:13:44.787 --> 01:13:46.288 OF ALL KIND OF THE MEETING 01:13:46.355 --> 01:13:47.956 TODAY IS OF COURSE, ON THE 01:13:48.023 --> 01:13:51.193 THREATS AND THE RISKS. AND SO 01:13:51.260 --> 01:13:55.230 SOMETHING WHICH KIND OF TO GIVE 01:13:55.297 --> 01:13:56.965 YOU MORE INFORMATION ABOUT THE 01:13:57.032 --> 01:13:59.168 PANEL. SO, SO IT WAS VOTED OR 01:13:59.234 --> 01:14:02.037 KIND OF VOTED BY, BY UN SOMEHOW, 01:14:02.104 --> 01:14:04.540 AS YOU PROBABLY KNOW, UN IS NOT 01:14:04.606 --> 01:14:06.241 REALLY SUPPORTED RIGHT NOW BY 01:14:06.308 --> 01:14:08.477 UNITED STATES. SO THIS MAKES 01:14:08.544 --> 01:14:12.047 THINGS HARDER. AND AGAIN, 01:14:12.114 --> 01:14:14.249 UNITED STATES WERE KIND OF 01:14:14.316 --> 01:14:16.151 AGAINST APPOINTING THE PANEL 01:14:16.218 --> 01:14:18.220 AND AS WELL PARAGUAY. AND THERE 01:14:18.287 --> 01:14:20.189 WERE SOME COUNTRIES ABSTAINING. 01:14:20.255 --> 01:14:22.057 SO AS I SAID, THESE ARE KIND OF 01:14:22.124 --> 01:14:23.559 40 MULTIDISCIPLINARY, 01:14:23.625 --> 01:14:25.060 MULTIDISCIPLINARY GLOBAL 01:14:25.127 --> 01:14:26.428 EXPERTS. WE ARE SERVING ON 01:14:26.495 --> 01:14:28.964 THREE YEAR TERMS STARTING FROM 01:14:29.031 --> 01:14:30.766 FEBRUARY THIS YEAR TO FEBRUARY 01:14:30.833 --> 01:14:33.101 NEXT YEAR AS A. CO-CHAIRS RIGHT 01:14:33.168 --> 01:14:37.272 NOW ARE JUST MENTIONED, MARIA 01:14:37.339 --> 01:14:40.475 REZA. SO SOMETHING WHICH YOU 01:14:40.542 --> 01:14:42.010 SHOULD KNOW ABOUT THE PANEL. SO 01:14:42.077 --> 01:14:43.745 IT'S KIND OF NON-REGULATORY. 01:14:43.812 --> 01:14:45.914 IT'S KIND OF SCIENCE BASED 01:14:45.981 --> 01:14:48.183 ADVISORY BODY MODELED SIMILAR 01:14:48.250 --> 01:14:49.885 TO THE INTERGOVERNMENTAL PANEL 01:14:49.952 --> 01:14:51.220 ON CLIMATE CHANGE, WHICH WAS 01:14:51.286 --> 01:14:53.488 KIND OF SUCCESSFUL ON, ON 01:14:53.555 --> 01:14:55.657 ADVISING ON HOW THE CLIMATE 01:14:55.724 --> 01:14:57.092 CHANGE OR WHAT THE REGULATION 01:14:57.159 --> 01:14:59.194 WITH THIS COULD BE POSSIBLE 01:14:59.261 --> 01:15:03.966 WITHIN UN. SO, SO THIS WAS KIND 01:15:04.032 --> 01:15:05.200 OF THE THE IDEA TO ESTABLISH 01:15:05.267 --> 01:15:08.237 THE PANEL. SO AS I SAID, I MEAN, 01:15:08.303 --> 01:15:09.771 IT'S NON-REGULATORY IT'S KIND 01:15:09.838 --> 01:15:11.840 OF SCIENTIFIC ADVISORY BOARD, 01:15:11.907 --> 01:15:14.376 BUT WE CAN KIND OF SAY WHAT 01:15:14.443 --> 01:15:17.212 KIND OF WHAT IMPACT COULD SOME 01:15:17.279 --> 01:15:18.680 REGULATION HAVE AND LOOK FOR 01:15:18.747 --> 01:15:21.917 SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE OF THIS 01:15:21.984 --> 01:15:24.019 REGULATION? WE CONCENTRATE OUR 01:15:24.086 --> 01:15:26.555 GLOBAL AI POLICY ADVISING UN 01:15:26.622 --> 01:15:29.458 AND, AND MEMBER STATES, 01:15:29.524 --> 01:15:30.525 SOMETHING WHICH THE PANEL 01:15:30.592 --> 01:15:32.294 SHOULD DO IS MONITOR FRONTIER 01:15:32.361 --> 01:15:34.897 AI AND KIND OF SAY, WHAT CAN 01:15:34.963 --> 01:15:36.632 HAPPEN, WHAT SHOULD NOT HAPPEN. 01:15:36.698 --> 01:15:38.800 WE SHOULD MODEL KIND OF THE 01:15:38.867 --> 01:15:39.935 OPPORTUNITIES AND RISKS. SO AS 01:15:40.002 --> 01:15:43.138 I SAID, THIS ARE BOTH SIDES. WE 01:15:43.205 --> 01:15:44.940 SHOULD LOOK AT NOT ONLY KIND OF 01:15:45.007 --> 01:15:47.042 RISKS. AND, AND OF COURSE, I 01:15:47.109 --> 01:15:49.011 MEAN SOMETHING WHICH THE PANEL 01:15:49.077 --> 01:15:50.679 OR THE GOAL OF THE PANEL GOAL 01:15:50.746 --> 01:15:51.813 OF THE PANEL IS TO BRIDGE 01:15:51.880 --> 01:15:53.548 INFORMATION GAP BETWEEN PRIVATE 01:15:53.615 --> 01:15:56.118 TECH AND AS WELL POLICY MAKERS 01:15:56.184 --> 01:15:57.920 AND SOMETHING WHICH I SAID. SO 01:15:57.986 --> 01:15:59.321 IT'S IT'S REALLY GLOBAL 01:15:59.388 --> 01:16:00.889 INCLUSIVITY. SO IT'S 40 PEOPLE 01:16:00.956 --> 01:16:02.557 FROM ALL AROUND THE WORLD TO 01:16:02.624 --> 01:16:07.963 KIND OF GIVE A VERY INCLUSIVE, 01:16:08.030 --> 01:16:10.332 DIVERSE GEOPOLITICAL 01:16:10.399 --> 01:16:11.233 PERSPECTIVE ON, ON WHAT IS 01:16:11.300 --> 01:16:15.203 HAPPENING IN. WE DID TWO THINGS 01:16:15.270 --> 01:16:17.306 SO FAR. I MEAN, FIRST OF ALL, 01:16:17.372 --> 01:16:20.208 KIND OF IN JUNE, WE PUBLISHED 01:16:20.275 --> 01:16:23.879 THE PRELIMINARY REPORT AND KIND 01:16:23.946 --> 01:16:27.215 OF YOU CAN LOOK IT UP. I MEAN, 01:16:27.282 --> 01:16:29.918 IT'S KIND OF COLLECTING 01:16:29.985 --> 01:16:31.753 SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE FROM, FROM 01:16:31.820 --> 01:16:33.155 DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE ON 01:16:33.221 --> 01:16:34.723 DIFFERENT KIND OF ASPECTS. MANY 01:16:34.790 --> 01:16:36.458 OF THE THINGS ALREADY HAVE BEEN 01:16:36.525 --> 01:16:38.560 MENTIONED, BUT NOT EVERYTHING. 01:16:38.627 --> 01:16:40.762 SO SOMETHING WHICH IS, IS MAIN 01:16:40.829 --> 01:16:42.564 ISSUE AND MAIN ISSUE FOR UN, 01:16:42.631 --> 01:16:44.032 IT'S REALLY A RESOURCE 01:16:44.099 --> 01:16:45.801 CONCENTRATION. SO COMPUTE AND 01:16:45.867 --> 01:16:48.337 ON TOP TALENT ARE 01:16:48.403 --> 01:16:49.771 OVERWHELMINGLY CONCENTRATED IN 01:16:49.838 --> 01:16:51.907 FEW PRIVATE CORPORATIONS IN FEW 01:16:51.974 --> 01:16:54.076 COUNTRIES. SO THIS IS NOT THE 01:16:54.142 --> 01:16:55.477 TECHNOLOGY IS KIND OF NOT BEING 01:16:55.544 --> 01:16:56.611 DEVELOPED EVERYWHERE. IT'S NOT 01:16:56.678 --> 01:16:59.081 BEING MADE AVAILABLE EVERYWHERE. 01:16:59.147 --> 01:17:03.418 THERE IS OF COURSE, THE ISSUE 01:17:03.485 --> 01:17:05.220 WHICH WE I THINK, AND YOU ARE 01:17:05.287 --> 01:17:07.723 VERY WELL AWARE DUE TO CURRENT 01:17:07.789 --> 01:17:09.191 DISCUSSIONS. SO DUE TO 01:17:09.257 --> 01:17:11.693 ADVANCEMENT OF AI, KIND OF THE 01:17:11.760 --> 01:17:17.466 THE SAFETY. OR KIND OF 01:17:17.532 --> 01:17:21.069 REGULATORY PAVEMENT DEVELOPMENT 01:17:21.136 --> 01:17:25.340 IS REALLY WAY BUT MOVING WAY 01:17:25.407 --> 01:17:27.142 SLOWER THAN KIND OF AI 01:17:27.209 --> 01:17:28.543 ADVANCEMENT AND DEVELOPMENT OF 01:17:28.610 --> 01:17:31.480 THE, OF THE, OF THE TECHNOLOGY. 01:17:31.546 --> 01:17:34.349 THERE WILL BE SOCIO ECONOMIC 01:17:34.416 --> 01:17:36.151 DISRUPTIONS. I MEAN, WE HEARD 01:17:36.218 --> 01:17:39.955 ABOUT KIND OF THINGS HAPPENING 01:17:40.022 --> 01:17:41.890 OR KIND OF DISINFORMATION, 01:17:41.957 --> 01:17:42.991 MISINFORMATION, SCIENTIFIC 01:17:43.058 --> 01:17:44.393 THINGS, BUT AS WELL, THINGS 01:17:44.459 --> 01:17:46.628 WILL BE HAPPENING ON LABOR 01:17:46.695 --> 01:17:49.798 SHIFTS AND SOMETHING WHICH THE 01:17:49.865 --> 01:17:51.633 PANEL AND UN IS VERY WELL 01:17:51.700 --> 01:17:54.202 CONCERNED IS KIND OF THAT THIS 01:17:54.269 --> 01:17:55.971 DEVELOPMENT ON CONCENTRATION OF 01:17:56.038 --> 01:17:58.473 TECHNOLOGY CAN AND WIDEN THE 01:17:58.540 --> 01:17:59.608 GLOBAL DIGITAL DIVIDE. SO SO IT 01:17:59.674 --> 01:18:04.579 WILL KIND OF LEAD TO POWER 01:18:04.646 --> 01:18:05.647 CONCENTRATION OR KIND OF 01:18:05.714 --> 01:18:09.985 ECONOMIC DISPARITY. AND YEAH, 01:18:10.052 --> 01:18:12.054 SO SO ESCALATING RISKS. WE HAVE 01:18:12.120 --> 01:18:14.623 SEEN THE RISKS SOMETHING WHICH 01:18:14.689 --> 01:18:17.826 IS REALLY WHICH WE STUDIED IN 01:18:17.893 --> 01:18:19.694 THE IN THE PANEL, IN THE REPORT, 01:18:19.761 --> 01:18:21.496 I MEAN, WE REALLY NEED TO, TO 01:18:21.563 --> 01:18:23.665 WORK TOWARDS GLOBAL SAFETY 01:18:23.732 --> 01:18:26.535 STANDARDS AND CAPACITY BUILDING. 01:18:26.601 --> 01:18:28.336 AND THIS SHOULD BE AS WELL 01:18:28.403 --> 01:18:30.505 ADDRESSED TO DEVELOPING NATIONS 01:18:30.572 --> 01:18:32.674 BECAUSE THE TECHNOLOGY IS 01:18:32.741 --> 01:18:34.476 CONCENTRATED IN DEVELOPED 01:18:34.543 --> 01:18:36.978 COUNTRIES, WE AS WELL. THE 01:18:37.045 --> 01:18:38.513 SECOND THING, WHICH WAS 01:18:38.580 --> 01:18:39.681 PUBLISHED BY THE PANEL, IS KIND 01:18:39.748 --> 01:18:43.852 OF A. AGAIN, THE TOPIC YOU 01:18:43.919 --> 01:18:45.587 ALREADY HEARD MANY TIMES IS 01:18:45.654 --> 01:18:49.925 KIND OF A VIEW MORE BROADLY. I 01:18:49.991 --> 01:18:51.760 MEAN, PUTTING THE THINGS WHICH 01:18:51.827 --> 01:18:53.929 HAPPENED IN THE IN THE OPEN, AI 01:18:53.995 --> 01:18:55.464 HUGGING FACE INCIDENT INTO KIND 01:18:55.530 --> 01:18:58.200 OF BROADER SCIENTIFIC 01:18:58.266 --> 01:19:00.001 DISCUSSIONS, MAYBE IT'S NOT 01:19:00.068 --> 01:19:02.571 REALLY WORTH GOING INTO MUCH 01:19:02.637 --> 01:19:03.972 DETAILS HERE BECAUSE LIKE ALL 01:19:04.039 --> 01:19:07.576 OF THIS THINGS YOU ALREADY HAVE 01:19:07.642 --> 01:19:11.213 HEARD, BUT BUT SOMETHING WHICH 01:19:11.279 --> 01:19:14.449 WAS, I THINK, VERY KIND OF 01:19:14.516 --> 01:19:15.884 VISIBLE FROM ALL THIS 01:19:15.951 --> 01:19:19.121 PRESENTATION IS THAT THE WIDE. 01:19:19.187 --> 01:19:21.690 EXISTING GUIDELINES WERE NOT 01:19:21.756 --> 01:19:23.792 WORKING. AND THE SAFETY 01:19:23.859 --> 01:19:27.395 MECHANISM ARE INSUFFICIENT. AND 01:19:27.462 --> 01:19:29.264 SOMETHING WHICH WE STATED, AND 01:19:29.331 --> 01:19:31.700 THIS IS NOT NEW, AND I THINK 01:19:31.766 --> 01:19:34.569 THIS WAS MENTIONED AS WELL BY 01:19:34.636 --> 01:19:37.105 SOME OF YOU. I MEAN, WE DO KNOW 01:19:37.172 --> 01:19:40.041 KIND OF HOW TO TO MANAGE RISKS 01:19:40.108 --> 01:19:42.878 INTO TECHNOLOGIES. AND THIS SO 01:19:42.944 --> 01:19:45.747 FAR DID NOT HAPPEN WITH AI. I 01:19:45.814 --> 01:19:47.883 MEAN, THIS TECHNOLOGIES OR 01:19:47.949 --> 01:19:49.551 DEVELOPMENT OF, OF SAFEGUARDS 01:19:49.618 --> 01:19:53.655 IS NOT REALLY BEING. 01:19:53.722 --> 01:19:56.191 IMPLEMENTED. IT'S IMPLEMENTED 01:19:56.258 --> 01:19:58.326 IN NOT THE RIGHT WAY. AND 01:19:58.393 --> 01:20:00.262 REALLY KIND OF WE AS HUMANS, 01:20:00.328 --> 01:20:02.731 LIKE IN AVIATION OR CAR 01:20:02.797 --> 01:20:04.566 INDUSTRY, WE REALLY HAVE KIND 01:20:04.633 --> 01:20:07.002 OF A DEEP KNOWLEDGE OF HOW TO 01:20:07.068 --> 01:20:08.470 IMPLEMENT KIND OF SAFEGUARDS 01:20:08.537 --> 01:20:10.972 AND MANAGE DIFFERENT RISKS. 01:20:11.039 --> 01:20:13.475 LIKE IF YOU PLAN OR DEVELOP 01:20:13.542 --> 01:20:14.943 TECHNOLOGY, YOU SHOULD PLAN FOR 01:20:15.010 --> 01:20:17.412 FAILURE. THIS DOES NOT SEEM TO 01:20:17.479 --> 01:20:18.947 HAVE BEEN DONE. I MEAN, YOU 01:20:19.014 --> 01:20:20.315 NEED TO PLAN YOUR DEFENSE IN 01:20:20.382 --> 01:20:22.851 DEPTH. SO, SO BUILD MULTIPLE 01:20:22.918 --> 01:20:25.020 LAYERS, INDEPENDENT LAYERS OF 01:20:25.086 --> 01:20:26.821 PROTECTIONS. THIS SEEMS TO BE 01:20:26.888 --> 01:20:28.924 NOT, NOT, NOT HAVE BEEN 01:20:28.990 --> 01:20:31.092 HAPPENING AGAIN, SOMETHING 01:20:31.159 --> 01:20:32.928 WHICH HAS NOT BEEN REALLY 01:20:32.994 --> 01:20:34.729 HAPPENING. IT'S AUTOMATED 01:20:34.796 --> 01:20:36.865 PROTECTION. SO SYSTEMS THAT DO 01:20:36.932 --> 01:20:40.101 KIND OF TAKE CARE OR RAISE 01:20:40.168 --> 01:20:42.637 ALARM IN AN AUTOMATIC WAY AND, 01:20:42.704 --> 01:20:44.406 AND SOMETHING WHICH WAS 01:20:44.472 --> 01:20:45.874 MENTIONED AND SOMETHING WHICH 01:20:45.941 --> 01:20:47.776 WAS, WHICH IS DONE BY METRO AND, 01:20:47.842 --> 01:20:49.444 AND WE HEARD ABOUT IT, IT'S 01:20:49.511 --> 01:20:52.347 KIND OF INDEPENDENT CONTROLS AS 01:20:52.414 --> 01:20:54.149 WELL, WHICH ARE KIND OF OR 01:20:54.216 --> 01:20:56.651 CONTROL BODIES WHICH ARE 01:20:56.718 --> 01:20:58.453 SEPARATED FROM, FROM THE KIND 01:20:58.520 --> 01:21:02.023 OF THE MAIN SYSTEM. SO, SO 01:21:02.090 --> 01:21:03.625 THESE THINGS ARE KIND OF NEED 01:21:03.692 --> 01:21:07.028 TO BE DEVELOPED AND TO BE IN 01:21:07.095 --> 01:21:08.163 PLACE. I MEAN, THEY DID NOT 01:21:08.230 --> 01:21:10.732 HAPPEN SO FAR, BUT THIS IS 01:21:10.799 --> 01:21:13.568 SOMETHING WE DO NEED TO WORK ON. 01:21:13.635 --> 01:21:16.471 AND THIS IS KIND OF WOULD BE, I 01:21:16.538 --> 01:21:19.007 THINK, A BIG AND IMPORTANT PART 01:21:19.074 --> 01:21:22.377 OF, OF THE NEXT KIND OF REPORT 01:21:22.444 --> 01:21:23.511 OF THE PANEL, WHICH WILL COME 01:21:23.578 --> 01:21:26.181 IN MAY NEXT YEAR, SOMETHING I 01:21:26.248 --> 01:21:29.484 MEAN, THIS GRAPHS OF MATCH OR 01:21:29.551 --> 01:21:32.687 ON DEVELOPING OR AI BEING ABLE 01:21:32.754 --> 01:21:34.456 TO, TO ACCOMPLISH THEIR TASKS 01:21:34.522 --> 01:21:36.291 ARE, I THINK IS VERY 01:21:36.358 --> 01:21:37.726 ILLUSTRATIVE, BUT SOMETHING I 01:21:37.792 --> 01:21:39.894 PREFER TO SHOW IS KIND OF 01:21:39.961 --> 01:21:41.696 MEASURING AI OF THIS, OF THIS 01:21:41.763 --> 01:21:43.098 MODELS. AND ESSENTIALLY THESE 01:21:43.164 --> 01:21:44.933 MODELS ARE KIND OF RIGHT NOW 01:21:45.000 --> 01:21:47.102 SMARTER OR HAVE BIGGER IQS THAN 01:21:47.168 --> 01:21:49.604 MOST OF THE HUMANS. SO, SO IF 01:21:49.671 --> 01:21:52.807 IN KIND OF MANY TASKS, THEY CAN 01:21:52.874 --> 01:21:55.076 DECEIVE US OR, OR DO THINGS IN 01:21:55.143 --> 01:21:57.112 A, IN A SMARTER WAY THAN, THAN 01:21:57.178 --> 01:21:59.047 MANY OF US, US WOULD DO. SO 01:21:59.114 --> 01:22:00.415 THIS IS SOMETHING WHICH WE 01:22:00.482 --> 01:22:02.284 SHOULD KEEP IN MIND. AND KIND 01:22:02.350 --> 01:22:05.420 OF IT'S MORE, I THINK, A BETTER 01:22:05.487 --> 01:22:06.454 WAY TO, TO UNDERSTAND THE 01:22:06.521 --> 01:22:08.256 CAPABILITIES OF THE MODELS THAN, 01:22:08.323 --> 01:22:10.358 THAN, THAN THIS KIND OF 01:22:10.425 --> 01:22:11.760 MEASURES. OF COURSE, THESE 01:22:11.826 --> 01:22:14.329 MEASURES DONE BY META AS WELL, 01:22:14.396 --> 01:22:16.264 VERY IMPORTANT. AND, AND THIS 01:22:16.331 --> 01:22:18.633 WAS MENTIONED AS WELL, THE 01:22:18.700 --> 01:22:21.536 TECHNOLOGY IS NOT DEVELOPING 01:22:21.603 --> 01:22:23.004 SLOWER. IT'S ACTUALLY SPEEDING 01:22:23.071 --> 01:22:25.473 UP. THINGS ARE KIND OF BEING 01:22:25.540 --> 01:22:27.242 DEVELOPED FASTER AND MODELS ARE 01:22:27.309 --> 01:22:30.879 BEING ARE KIND OF INCREASINGLY 01:22:30.945 --> 01:22:34.849 CAPABLE, BECOMING INCREASINGLY 01:22:34.916 --> 01:22:37.018 SMARTER, FASTER AND FASTER. SO 01:22:37.085 --> 01:22:39.854 THIS WAS MENTIONED AS WELL. AND 01:22:39.921 --> 01:22:42.757 THIS IS SOMETHING WHICH PEOPLE 01:22:42.824 --> 01:22:44.926 IN MANY PLACES ALL AROUND ARE 01:22:44.993 --> 01:22:46.761 DISCUSSING AND SHOWS KIND OF 01:22:46.828 --> 01:22:48.863 THE CONCENTRATION OF, OF, OF, 01:22:48.930 --> 01:22:52.133 OF COMPUTE POWER TECHNOLOGY. 01:22:52.200 --> 01:22:55.370 BECAUSE KIND OF THIS GREAT 01:22:55.437 --> 01:22:56.838 ACHIEVEMENT OR KIND OF THE 01:22:56.905 --> 01:22:59.341 ADVANCEMENTS OF, OF SCIENTIFIC 01:22:59.407 --> 01:23:01.109 ADVANCEMENTS REQUIRE ACCESS TO, 01:23:01.176 --> 01:23:03.645 TO FRONTIER MODELS. SO IN 01:23:03.712 --> 01:23:05.847 GENERAL, THIS MEANS THAT MANY 01:23:05.914 --> 01:23:07.515 OF THE SCIENTISTS WHO DO NOT 01:23:07.582 --> 01:23:08.650 HAVE ACCESS TO THESE MODELS 01:23:08.717 --> 01:23:10.852 WILL NOT BE ABLE TO KEEP UP. I 01:23:10.919 --> 01:23:12.654 MEAN, THIS ALREADY HAS BEEN 01:23:12.721 --> 01:23:14.089 MENTIONED IN THE INTRODUCTION 01:23:14.155 --> 01:23:16.224 THAT COULD HAPPEN WITH CYBER 01:23:16.291 --> 01:23:17.692 SECURITY, BUT THIS CAN HAPPEN 01:23:17.759 --> 01:23:19.894 AS WELL WITH OTHER AREAS. AND 01:23:19.961 --> 01:23:21.663 SCIENCE IS ONE OF THEM. WHEN 01:23:21.730 --> 01:23:23.832 REALLY KIND OF THE HAVING 01:23:23.898 --> 01:23:27.469 ACCESS AND PAYING ENOUGH WILL 01:23:27.535 --> 01:23:29.204 GUARANTEE THAT YOU TAKE PART IN 01:23:29.270 --> 01:23:31.373 THE, IN THE, IN, IN THE 01:23:31.439 --> 01:23:33.208 SCIENTIFIC OR INNOVATION 01:23:33.274 --> 01:23:34.909 DEVELOPMENT, SOMETHING WHICH 01:23:34.976 --> 01:23:37.178 YOU SHOULD MENTION. WE SHOULD, 01:23:37.245 --> 01:23:38.913 YOU SHOULD KNOW, AND I WANTED 01:23:38.980 --> 01:23:40.749 TO MENTION SO, SO KIND OF UN 01:23:40.815 --> 01:23:42.550 HAS SET UP THIS TWO PARTS. SO 01:23:42.617 --> 01:23:44.352 ONE PART IS SCIENTIFIC PANEL, 01:23:44.419 --> 01:23:46.154 WHICH I ALREADY MENTIONED. THE 01:23:46.221 --> 01:23:48.423 OTHER PART IS UN GLOBAL DIALOG 01:23:48.490 --> 01:23:50.925 ON AI GOVERNANCE. SO. SO THIS 01:23:50.992 --> 01:23:53.361 IS A PLACE KIND OF WHERE THE UN 01:23:53.428 --> 01:23:55.864 WANTS TO HAVE THE DIALOG ON 01:23:55.930 --> 01:23:57.065 WHAT CAN HAPPEN AND WHAT KIND 01:23:57.132 --> 01:23:59.434 OF REGULATIONS SHOULD HAPPEN, 01:23:59.501 --> 01:24:01.236 OR WHEN THE KIND OF 01:24:01.302 --> 01:24:02.437 GOVERNMENTAL DISCUSSIONS ON AI 01:24:02.504 --> 01:24:05.173 SHOULD HAPPEN ON GLOBAL SCALE. 01:24:05.240 --> 01:24:07.375 THIS WILL IT DID HAPPEN IN 01:24:07.442 --> 01:24:09.144 GENEVA IN JULY. IT WILL HAPPEN 01:24:09.210 --> 01:24:10.979 IN MAY, BEGINNING OF MAY, NEW 01:24:11.045 --> 01:24:13.114 YORK, IT SHOULD HAPPEN TO TWO 01:24:13.181 --> 01:24:15.683 TIMES A YEAR OVER THE NEXT KIND 01:24:15.750 --> 01:24:19.254 OF YEARS. AND. AND I THINK THIS 01:24:19.320 --> 01:24:20.655 IS A PLACE TO, TO REALLY KIND 01:24:20.722 --> 01:24:22.824 OF AN ENGAGING THE DISCUSSIONS 01:24:22.891 --> 01:24:24.259 WHERE, HOW THE TECHNOLOGY 01:24:24.325 --> 01:24:26.494 SHOULD BE GOVERNED ON GLOBAL 01:24:26.561 --> 01:24:28.630 SCALE. THIS IS SOMETHING WHICH 01:24:28.696 --> 01:24:30.799 IS, I THINK I WANTED TO MENTION, 01:24:30.865 --> 01:24:32.901 I MEAN, THERE IS A RISK, BUT 01:24:32.967 --> 01:24:34.369 OPPORTUNITIES. AND THIS IS 01:24:34.436 --> 01:24:36.905 SOMETHING WHICH WAS DONE BY 01:24:36.971 --> 01:24:39.441 WORLD BANK THE FIRST TIME FOR 01:24:39.507 --> 01:24:41.242 FOR POLAND. SO, SO KIND OF 01:24:41.309 --> 01:24:43.378 ASSESSING THE, THE 01:24:43.445 --> 01:24:45.180 OPPORTUNITIES. SO, SO SHOWING 01:24:45.246 --> 01:24:48.049 IF THE IMPACT OF IMPLEMENTING 01:24:48.116 --> 01:24:50.618 AI ON KIND OF GDP GROWTH AND 01:24:50.685 --> 01:24:51.986 THE INCREASE POSSIBLE INCREASE 01:24:52.053 --> 01:24:55.623 OF GDP, GDP, GDP GROWTH BASED 01:24:55.690 --> 01:24:58.493 ON IMPLEMENTATION OF SOMETHING, 01:24:58.560 --> 01:25:01.729 AS I ALREADY SAID, IS KIND OF 01:25:01.796 --> 01:25:03.898 THE ACCESS AND AVAILABILITY OF, 01:25:03.965 --> 01:25:06.801 OF MODELS AND INEQUALITIES ALL 01:25:06.868 --> 01:25:08.603 AROUND THE WORLD. ONE OF THE 01:25:08.670 --> 01:25:10.405 INDICATIONS IS THAT MOST OF THE 01:25:10.472 --> 01:25:12.207 COUNTRIES ALL AROUND THE WORLD 01:25:12.273 --> 01:25:14.742 CANNOT DO NOT EVEN HAVE KIND OF 01:25:14.809 --> 01:25:16.878 MODELS OR DATA WHICH WOULD WORK 01:25:16.945 --> 01:25:18.980 IN THE KIND OF NATIVE LANGUAGE. 01:25:19.047 --> 01:25:22.383 SO, SO THIS SHOWS THAT IF KIND 01:25:22.450 --> 01:25:24.419 OF THE MODELS ARE BEING USED TO 01:25:24.486 --> 01:25:27.322 DO REAL WORK, LIKE HELPING 01:25:27.388 --> 01:25:29.090 HUMANS TO, TO, TO BE MORE 01:25:29.157 --> 01:25:31.292 EFFICIENT, THEN MANY PLACES ALL 01:25:31.359 --> 01:25:32.393 AROUND THE WORLD WILL NOT BE 01:25:32.460 --> 01:25:34.195 ABLE TO USE THIS TECHNOLOGY 01:25:34.262 --> 01:25:35.597 BECAUSE THE MODELS EVEN DON'T 01:25:35.663 --> 01:25:37.732 TALK, SAY LANGUAGE VERY WELL. 01:25:37.799 --> 01:25:39.934 SO, SO THESE ARE KIND OF THE 01:25:40.001 --> 01:25:42.537 LIMITING AND ASPECTS ONE WANT 01:25:42.604 --> 01:25:44.939 TO PLAY TO, TO, TO TAKE INTO 01:25:45.006 --> 01:25:47.509 ACCOUNT. AND SOMETHING WHICH WE, 01:25:47.575 --> 01:25:49.277 I THINK IT'S, IT'S WORTH 01:25:49.344 --> 01:25:51.012 MENTIONING, I MEAN, THERE ARE 01:25:51.079 --> 01:25:52.514 VERY ALL AROUND THE WORLD ARE 01:25:52.580 --> 01:25:55.717 VERY DIFFERENT APPROACHES TO AI 01:25:55.783 --> 01:25:57.886 REGULATIONS IN UNITED STATES. 01:25:57.952 --> 01:25:59.621 WE ALREADY HEARD CALIFORNIA IS 01:25:59.687 --> 01:26:02.257 KIND OF LEADING. BUT IN GENERAL 01:26:02.323 --> 01:26:05.093 IN US, AS I SAY, THERE ARE NO 01:26:05.159 --> 01:26:09.097 KIND OF FEDERAL RULES IN CHINA. 01:26:09.163 --> 01:26:10.265 ON THE OTHER HAND, THERE IS 01:26:10.331 --> 01:26:12.700 KIND OF A VERY CENTRAL APPROACH 01:26:12.767 --> 01:26:15.169 TO AI REGULATION. IT'S WAY MORE 01:26:15.236 --> 01:26:16.971 KIND OF STRICT THAN IN MOST 01:26:17.038 --> 01:26:18.439 PLACES ALL AROUND THE WORLD, 01:26:18.506 --> 01:26:20.975 EVEN LIKE DUE TO THE CENTRAL 01:26:21.042 --> 01:26:22.310 ALGORITHM REGISTER. SO IF YOU 01:26:22.377 --> 01:26:24.546 WANT TO USE ANY GENERATIVE AI 01:26:24.612 --> 01:26:27.415 MODEL, YOU NEED TO REGISTER IT 01:26:27.482 --> 01:26:31.419 FIRST VIA KIND OF STATE OR CITY. 01:26:31.486 --> 01:26:32.420 THERE ARE EVEN LABOR 01:26:32.487 --> 01:26:34.722 PROTECTIONS. SO THINGS ARE IN 01:26:34.789 --> 01:26:37.825 CHINA VERY LUXURIATED IN YOU, 01:26:37.892 --> 01:26:41.095 UNITED UNION, THERE IS A 01:26:41.162 --> 01:26:43.331 COMPREHENSIVE AI ACT, BUT IT 01:26:43.398 --> 01:26:47.936 KIND OF DON'T APPLIES TO TO 01:26:48.002 --> 01:26:53.741 MANY DIFFERENT KIND OF ASPECTS. 01:26:53.808 --> 01:26:56.244 MAKING DIFFERENT THINGS SAFER. 01:26:56.311 --> 01:26:58.012 BUT ON, ON THE OTHER HAND, IT 01:26:58.079 --> 01:27:00.582 REALLY GENERATES HUGE 01:27:00.648 --> 01:27:04.118 BUREAUCRATIC BURDEN AND KIND OF 01:27:04.185 --> 01:27:06.754 SLOWDOWNS, SLOWDOWNS, THINGS 01:27:06.821 --> 01:27:08.456 SLOWDOWN THINGS. ON THE OTHER 01:27:08.523 --> 01:27:11.659 KIND OF HAND, IT IS NOT REALLY 01:27:11.726 --> 01:27:13.494 DOES NOT SEEM TO BE GLOBALLY 01:27:13.561 --> 01:27:16.364 KIND OF EXPORTABLE AND LEAVES 01:27:16.431 --> 01:27:17.765 KIND OF THE VULNERABILITIES, 01:27:17.832 --> 01:27:21.402 WHICH WE ALREADY HEARD KIND OF 01:27:21.469 --> 01:27:24.706 UNADDRESSED BECAUSE OPEN AI 01:27:24.772 --> 01:27:27.175 HUGGING FACE INCIDENTS SUCH AS 01:27:27.241 --> 01:27:28.977 US COMPANY VERSUS KIND OF 01:27:29.043 --> 01:27:31.913 EUROPEAN COMPANY AND 01:27:31.980 --> 01:27:32.914 ESSENTIALLY KIND OF THE 01:27:32.981 --> 01:27:35.817 REGULATION WE HAVE IN EUROPEAN 01:27:35.883 --> 01:27:38.019 UNION DOES NOT PREVENT FROM 01:27:38.086 --> 01:27:39.821 WHAT CAN HAPPEN IN DIFFERENT 01:27:39.887 --> 01:27:41.923 PLACES. AND THIS IS MY LAST 01:27:41.990 --> 01:27:44.425 SLIDE. SO, SO SOMETHING WHICH 01:27:44.492 --> 01:27:46.961 WE, I THINK WHAT PEOPLE LEARNED 01:27:47.028 --> 01:27:49.230 OVER THE, THE HISTORY AND, AND 01:27:49.297 --> 01:27:51.633 THIS INCIDENT ACTUALLY SHOWS IT. 01:27:51.699 --> 01:27:56.704 SO, SO IF YOU KIND OF LOCKER 01:27:56.771 --> 01:27:59.540 LOCK ARE LOCAL RULES FAIL 01:27:59.607 --> 01:28:02.076 WITHOUT GLOBAL KIND OF 01:28:02.143 --> 01:28:04.012 GUARDRAILS. I MEAN, I DID NOT 01:28:04.078 --> 01:28:06.414 HELP AGAINST THE OPENAI HUGGING 01:28:06.481 --> 01:28:08.616 FACING INCIDENT THAT DID NOT 01:28:08.683 --> 01:28:10.385 APPLY, DID NOT EVEN ADDRESS 01:28:10.451 --> 01:28:12.553 KIND OF MISALIGNMENT DIFFERENT 01:28:12.620 --> 01:28:15.790 THINGS, SOMETHING WHICH WE KNOW 01:28:15.857 --> 01:28:18.626 IS KIND OF REALLY WE SHOULD 01:28:18.693 --> 01:28:21.863 WORK TOWARDS BUILDING GLOBAL 01:28:21.929 --> 01:28:24.432 TARGETS BECAUSE IMPLEMENTING 01:28:24.499 --> 01:28:27.301 LOCAL RULES KIND OF LEAVES, 01:28:27.368 --> 01:28:28.736 EVEN IF YOU IMPLEMENT THEM 01:28:28.803 --> 01:28:29.804 LOCALLY, IT LEAVES YOU 01:28:29.871 --> 01:28:32.707 VULNERABLE TO EXTERNAL RISKS. 01:28:32.774 --> 01:28:38.513 AND SO, SO, I MEAN, I COULD 01:28:38.579 --> 01:28:39.981 ELABORATE ON THIS MORE, BUT, 01:28:40.048 --> 01:28:42.817 BUT INDEED, KIND OF THERE IS, I 01:28:42.884 --> 01:28:44.619 THINK, A REALLY NEED TO, TO 01:28:44.686 --> 01:28:46.721 START KIND OF A GLOBAL 01:28:46.788 --> 01:28:49.991 DISCUSSION ON, ON AI GOVERNANCE. 01:28:50.058 --> 01:28:53.127 THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU, 01:28:53.194 --> 01:28:54.696 MR. JANKOWSKI. ARE THERE 01:28:54.762 --> 01:28:55.763 QUESTIONS FROM MEMBERS OF THE 01:28:55.830 --> 01:28:59.067 COMMITTEE, SENATOR? THANK YOU, 01:28:59.133 --> 01:29:00.401 MR. CHAIRMAN. THANK YOU, 01:29:00.468 --> 01:29:02.870 PROFESSOR. A COUPLE OF THINGS. 01:29:02.937 --> 01:29:06.207 ONE, I'M CURIOUS ABOUT THE US 01:29:06.274 --> 01:29:09.110 FOLLOWING PARAGUAY'S LEAD IN 01:29:09.177 --> 01:29:12.246 VOTING AGAINST ANY UN, I 01:29:12.313 --> 01:29:13.815 SUPPOSE, PARTICIPATION IN TERMS 01:29:13.881 --> 01:29:16.284 OF AI REGULATION. DID THE US 01:29:16.350 --> 01:29:16.984 EXPRESS ITS POINT OF VIEW, 01:29:17.051 --> 01:29:18.453 OTHER THAN ALWAYS FOLLOWING 01:29:18.519 --> 01:29:22.423 PARAGUAY? YES THEY DID. I MEAN 01:29:22.490 --> 01:29:23.858 SOMETHING WHICH WAS MENTIONED 01:29:23.925 --> 01:29:25.660 WHILE THEY KIND OF VOTED 01:29:25.727 --> 01:29:28.162 AGAINST. I HAD IT ON THE SLIDE, 01:29:28.229 --> 01:29:32.100 BUT IN 3D, I MEAN CONCERNS 01:29:32.166 --> 01:29:34.702 ABOUT JURISDICTIONAL MANDATES, 01:29:34.769 --> 01:29:37.171 PROCESS TRANSPARENCY FOR 01:29:37.238 --> 01:29:39.173 POTENTIAL POLITICAL INFLUENCE. 01:29:39.240 --> 01:29:40.742 BUT I THINK I MEAN, IT'S A 01:29:40.808 --> 01:29:42.944 BIGGER ISSUE BECAUSE IF, YOU 01:29:43.010 --> 01:29:45.413 KNOW, PROBABLY US IS NOT 01:29:45.480 --> 01:29:48.683 PLAYING THE UN CONTRIBUTION 01:29:48.750 --> 01:29:52.687 ANYMORE. SO IT'S KIND OF MORE 01:29:52.754 --> 01:29:54.455 GEOPOLITICAL PLAY RIGHT NOW 01:29:54.522 --> 01:29:58.459 BETWEEN US AND UN. AND IN LINE 01:29:58.526 --> 01:30:00.061 WITH THE QUESTION I ASKED 01:30:00.128 --> 01:30:01.462 EARLIER ABOUT STATE REGULATION 01:30:01.529 --> 01:30:04.532 OR EVEN NATIONAL REGULATION OF 01:30:04.599 --> 01:30:06.334 AI, WHEN IT'S REALLY AN 01:30:06.400 --> 01:30:09.203 INTERNATIONAL PHENOMENON, WHAT 01:30:09.270 --> 01:30:10.938 SANCTIONS COULD THE UN EVEN 01:30:11.005 --> 01:30:12.573 POTENTIALLY IMPOSE WITH RESPECT 01:30:12.640 --> 01:30:15.676 TO ANY SORT OF VIOLATION OF OF 01:30:15.743 --> 01:30:18.579 ANY POTENTIAL SAFEGUARDS OR 01:30:18.646 --> 01:30:22.483 GUIDELINES? SO SO I THINK HOW 01:30:22.550 --> 01:30:25.620 I'M NOT THAT EXPERT ON, ON KIND 01:30:25.686 --> 01:30:28.656 OF THE DETAILS OF HOW UN WORK, 01:30:28.723 --> 01:30:30.925 BUT I UNDERSTAND THAT BEFORE 01:30:30.992 --> 01:30:32.627 KIND OF SANCTIONS ARE POSSIBLE, 01:30:32.693 --> 01:30:38.366 THERE ARE KIND OF. YOU, YOU UN 01:30:38.432 --> 01:30:42.670 KIND OF AGREES ON, ON DIFFERENT 01:30:42.737 --> 01:30:44.839 REGULATIONS, WHICH PROPOSES 01:30:44.906 --> 01:30:46.007 SANCTIONS. SO, SO ALL THE KIND 01:30:46.073 --> 01:30:47.875 OF UN MEMBERS NEED TO, IN A 01:30:47.942 --> 01:30:49.544 SENSE, AGREE TO WHAT WILL BE 01:30:49.610 --> 01:30:50.945 IMPLEMENTED. AND THIS 01:30:51.012 --> 01:30:52.380 IMPLEMENTATION COULD 01:30:52.446 --> 01:30:54.882 POTENTIALLY CONTAIN THE 01:30:54.949 --> 01:30:58.920 RESPECTIVE SANCTIONS. OKAY. BUT 01:30:58.986 --> 01:31:00.254 THIS IS THIS RIGHT NOW IS NOT 01:31:00.321 --> 01:31:02.490 EXISTING. SO SO UN DID NOT 01:31:02.557 --> 01:31:04.292 IMPLEMENT THAT KIND OF 01:31:04.358 --> 01:31:09.330 REGULATIONS. OKAY. THANK YOU. 01:31:09.397 --> 01:31:12.600 ANYTHING? ALL RIGHT. ALL RIGHT. 01:31:12.667 --> 01:31:14.235 THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR FOR 01:31:14.302 --> 01:31:15.403 JOINING US. I HAVE NO TIME, NO 01:31:15.469 --> 01:31:17.305 IDEA WHAT TIME IT IS, WHERE 01:31:17.371 --> 01:31:18.439 YOU'RE AT, BUT WE VERY MUCH 01:31:18.506 --> 01:31:19.473 APPRECIATE YOU SHARING THE 01:31:19.540 --> 01:31:20.808 GLOBAL PERSPECTIVE AND YOUR 01:31:20.875 --> 01:31:22.210 PRESENTATION AS WELL. SO THANK 01:31:22.276 --> 01:31:24.078 YOU SO MUCH, DOCTOR JANKOWSKI. 01:31:24.145 --> 01:31:26.247 NEXT WE'RE GOING TO TURN TO OUR 01:31:26.314 --> 01:31:29.083 FINAL PANEL OF TWO TWO 01:31:29.150 --> 01:31:30.184 WITNESSES. FIRST IS ANDREW 01:31:30.251 --> 01:31:31.452 DORRIS, THE POLICY DIRECTOR AT 01:31:31.519 --> 01:31:33.087 THE SECURE AI PROJECT. AND 01:31:33.154 --> 01:31:35.590 JENNIFER KING, PRIVACY AND DATA 01:31:35.656 --> 01:31:37.391 POLICY FELLOW AT THE STANFORD 01:31:37.458 --> 01:31:38.826 INSTITUTE FOR HUMAN CENTERED 01:31:38.893 --> 01:31:39.894 ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE. 01:31:39.961 --> 01:31:41.729 WELCOME TO YOU BOTH. THANKS FOR 01:31:41.796 --> 01:31:55.109 JOINING US TODAY. WELL, THANK 01:31:55.176 --> 01:31:56.878 YOU ALL FOR THE CHANCE TO BE 01:31:56.944 --> 01:31:58.779 HERE TODAY. I AM ANDREW DORRIS 01:31:58.846 --> 01:32:00.748 WITH THE SECURE AI PROJECT, 01:32:00.815 --> 01:32:01.883 WHICH IS A NONPARTISAN 01:32:01.949 --> 01:32:03.684 NONPROFIT THAT DEVELOPS AND 01:32:03.751 --> 01:32:05.086 ADVOCATES FOR PRAGMATIC 01:32:05.152 --> 01:32:06.554 POLICIES TO REDUCE RISKS OF 01:32:06.621 --> 01:32:08.756 SEVERE HARM FROM ADVANCED AI. 01:32:08.823 --> 01:32:10.691 WE WORKED CLOSELY WITH SENATOR 01:32:10.758 --> 01:32:12.660 WIENER ON SB 53 HERE IN 01:32:12.727 --> 01:32:14.495 CALIFORNIA, AND THEN WITH OTHER 01:32:14.562 --> 01:32:15.863 LAWMAKERS ON THE FRONTIER AI 01:32:15.930 --> 01:32:17.098 LAWS THAT PASSED IN NEW YORK 01:32:17.164 --> 01:32:19.867 AND ILLINOIS. WE ARE EAGER TO 01:32:19.934 --> 01:32:21.702 CONTINUE WORKING IN CALIFORNIA 01:32:21.769 --> 01:32:23.471 AND HAVE DEVELOPED A POLICY 01:32:23.537 --> 01:32:24.572 FRAMEWORK TO ADDRESS THE SORT 01:32:24.639 --> 01:32:25.673 OF RISKS THAT YOU'RE ALL 01:32:25.740 --> 01:32:27.875 HEARING ABOUT TODAY. I WILL GO 01:32:27.942 --> 01:32:29.343 INTO THOSE POLICIES IN DETAIL 01:32:29.410 --> 01:32:30.778 IN THE SECOND HALF OF MY 01:32:30.845 --> 01:32:33.114 PRESENTATION. BUT TO START, I 01:32:33.180 --> 01:32:34.448 WOULD LIKE TO TRY AND CONVEY TO 01:32:34.515 --> 01:32:36.250 YOU ALL THE SENSE OF URGENCY 01:32:36.317 --> 01:32:37.885 AND HONESTLY FEAR THAT 01:32:37.952 --> 01:32:39.353 ORGANIZATIONS LIKE OURS FEEL AT 01:32:39.420 --> 01:32:41.956 THIS MOMENT. I FEEL OBLIGATED 01:32:42.023 --> 01:32:44.025 TO LEAD WITH THAT BECAUSE WE 01:32:44.091 --> 01:32:46.127 WORK CLOSELY WITH PEOPLE WHO I 01:32:46.193 --> 01:32:47.261 AM WILLING TO BET UNDERSTAND 01:32:47.328 --> 01:32:48.763 THIS TECHNOLOGY AS WELL AS 01:32:48.829 --> 01:32:50.431 ANYONE IN THIS ROOM WHO ARE 01:32:50.498 --> 01:32:51.899 DESPERATELY TRYING TO GET YOUR 01:32:51.966 --> 01:32:54.435 ATTENTION AND HAVE ASKED ME TO 01:32:54.502 --> 01:32:57.305 YELL AT YOU ALL TO HURRY UP. I 01:32:57.371 --> 01:32:59.473 THINK THEY SEE AN IMMENSE 01:32:59.540 --> 01:33:01.342 DANGER THAT COULD BE COMING IN 01:33:01.409 --> 01:33:03.411 A MATTER OF MONTHS RATHER THAN 01:33:03.477 --> 01:33:05.980 YEARS, AND THAT THE LEGISLATIVE 01:33:06.047 --> 01:33:07.415 PROCESS CAN BE FRUSTRATINGLY 01:33:07.481 --> 01:33:09.183 SLOW EVERYWHERE, NOT JUST IN 01:33:09.250 --> 01:33:10.651 CALIFORNIA. I CAN'T KNOW IF 01:33:10.718 --> 01:33:12.286 THEY ARE RIGHT, BUT I CAN 01:33:12.353 --> 01:33:13.854 GUARANTEE YOU THAT THEY ARE 01:33:13.921 --> 01:33:15.056 GENUINELY SCARED. AND I WOULD 01:33:15.122 --> 01:33:18.592 LIKE TO TRY TO EXPLAIN WHY. 01:33:18.659 --> 01:33:20.027 YOU'VE ALL. YOU'VE HEARD A LOT 01:33:20.094 --> 01:33:22.163 TODAY ABOUT THE ROGUE AI SWARMS 01:33:22.229 --> 01:33:24.365 THAT HAVE ALREADY BROKEN LOOSE. 01:33:24.432 --> 01:33:25.733 YOU'VE PROBABLY READ ABOUT 01:33:25.800 --> 01:33:27.601 OTHER INCIDENTS, SUCH AS THE 01:33:27.668 --> 01:33:29.036 AGENT THAT SENT THE POLICE A 01:33:29.103 --> 01:33:30.805 FAKE HOMICIDE, A FAKE TIP IN A 01:33:30.871 --> 01:33:32.606 HOMICIDE INVESTIGATION, THE 01:33:32.673 --> 01:33:33.741 AGENT THAT BOOTED SOMEONE OFF 01:33:33.808 --> 01:33:35.876 THE WAIT LIST FOR A FITNESS 01:33:35.943 --> 01:33:37.044 CLASS SO THAT THEIR USER COULD 01:33:37.111 --> 01:33:38.846 TAKE THE SPOT. YOU MAY HAVE 01:33:38.913 --> 01:33:40.881 READ LAST MONTH ABOUT AI 01:33:40.948 --> 01:33:42.283 ENABLED HACKS AGAINST BANKS IN 01:33:42.350 --> 01:33:44.819 SOUTH KOREA, OR THIS SUMMER 01:33:44.885 --> 01:33:46.253 ABOUT SUCH HACKS AGAINST WATER 01:33:46.320 --> 01:33:47.388 TREATMENT FACILITIES IN AT 01:33:47.455 --> 01:33:49.857 LEAST SEVEN AMERICAN STATES. 01:33:49.924 --> 01:33:51.659 AND EVEN IF AI MODELS SOMEHOW 01:33:51.726 --> 01:33:53.494 STAYED ONLY AS POWERFUL AS THEY 01:33:53.561 --> 01:33:55.629 ARE RIGHT NOW, WE COULD EXPECT 01:33:55.696 --> 01:33:57.098 INCIDENTS LIKE THIS TO GET MORE 01:33:57.164 --> 01:33:58.866 FREQUENT AND SEVERE AS MORE 01:33:58.933 --> 01:34:00.701 PEOPLE START TO USE AND MISUSE 01:34:00.768 --> 01:34:03.170 THESE FRONTIER MODELS. BUT OF 01:34:03.237 --> 01:34:05.706 COURSE, AI IS NOT GOING TO STAY 01:34:05.773 --> 01:34:07.708 ONLY AS POWERFUL AS IT IS AS IT 01:34:07.775 --> 01:34:09.844 IS RIGHT NOW. THE MORE POWERFUL 01:34:09.910 --> 01:34:11.512 IT GETS, THE MORE HARM IT COULD 01:34:11.579 --> 01:34:13.447 DO WHEN IT GOES OFF THE RAILS 01:34:13.514 --> 01:34:15.082 OR FALLS INTO THE WRONG HANDS. 01:34:15.149 --> 01:34:16.650 AND THE PEOPLE WHO ARE OFTEN 01:34:16.717 --> 01:34:17.952 THE MOST SCARED ABOUT WHAT 01:34:18.019 --> 01:34:19.720 COULD HAPPEN NEXT ARE OFTEN THE 01:34:19.787 --> 01:34:21.589 PEOPLE WHO HAVE EARLY ACCESS TO 01:34:21.655 --> 01:34:24.425 JUST HOW POWERFUL IT IS GETTING. 01:34:24.492 --> 01:34:26.193 YOU HAVE PROBABLY SEEN DRAMATIC 01:34:26.260 --> 01:34:27.695 HEADLINES ABOUT THE WORST CASE 01:34:27.762 --> 01:34:29.864 SCENARIOS, HOW THE MEDIAN AI 01:34:29.930 --> 01:34:30.865 RESEARCHER THINKS THERE'S AT 01:34:30.931 --> 01:34:32.733 LEAST A 10% CHANCE THAT THE 01:34:32.800 --> 01:34:34.135 TECHNOLOGY COULD LEAD TO HUMAN 01:34:34.201 --> 01:34:35.970 EXTINCTION. REASONABLE PEOPLE 01:34:36.037 --> 01:34:37.505 CAN DISAGREE ABOUT HOW LIKELY 01:34:37.571 --> 01:34:39.440 THAT IS, BUT THE STAKES ARE 01:34:39.507 --> 01:34:40.641 HIGH ENOUGH THAT WE SHOULD TAKE 01:34:40.708 --> 01:34:42.043 EVEN A SMALL CHANCE VERY 01:34:42.109 --> 01:34:44.178 SERIOUSLY. AND EVEN IF THOSE 01:34:44.245 --> 01:34:45.613 WARNINGS PROVE WRONG, THE FACT 01:34:45.679 --> 01:34:47.481 THAT IT'S EVEN A FAIR DEBATE IS 01:34:47.548 --> 01:34:49.283 A TESTAMENT TO THE SCALE OF THE 01:34:49.350 --> 01:34:50.551 CONSEQUENCES THAT WE ARE NOW 01:34:50.618 --> 01:34:52.119 FORCED TO CONTEMPLATE. THE 01:34:52.186 --> 01:34:53.788 TRUTH IS THAT THERE IS A RANGE 01:34:53.854 --> 01:34:55.356 OF POSSIBLE OUTCOMES, BUT THAT 01:34:55.423 --> 01:34:57.024 EVEN THE LESS DRAMATIC END OF 01:34:57.091 --> 01:34:58.659 THAT RANGE COULD BE 01:34:58.726 --> 01:34:59.760 CATASTROPHIC. FOR REASONS THAT 01:34:59.827 --> 01:35:01.529 DO NOT TAKE ANY LEAPS OF 01:35:01.595 --> 01:35:02.930 IMAGINATION FROM WHAT THESE AI 01:35:02.997 --> 01:35:04.165 SYSTEMS HAVE PROVEN, WILLING 01:35:04.231 --> 01:35:06.934 AND ABLE TO DO ALREADY, THESE 01:35:07.001 --> 01:35:08.702 RISKS CAN BE HARD TO VISUALIZE. 01:35:08.769 --> 01:35:10.304 SO LET ME TRY AND BE CONCRETE 01:35:10.371 --> 01:35:11.806 ABOUT SOME OF THE THINGS WE'RE 01:35:11.872 --> 01:35:13.741 WORRIED ABOUT. WITHIN THE NEXT 01:35:13.808 --> 01:35:15.342 YEAR, WE COULD HAVE AI SYSTEMS 01:35:15.409 --> 01:35:16.977 THAT ARE SMART ENOUGH TO ESCAPE 01:35:17.044 --> 01:35:19.580 HUMAN CONTROL PERMANENTLY, JUST 01:35:19.647 --> 01:35:21.315 LIKE THE AGENTS. THIS SUMMER, 01:35:21.382 --> 01:35:22.650 THEY COULD BREAK OUT ONTO THE 01:35:22.716 --> 01:35:24.652 OPEN INTERNET, BUT THIS TIME 01:35:24.718 --> 01:35:25.953 THEY COULD MAKE HUNDREDS OF 01:35:26.020 --> 01:35:27.421 COPIES OF THEMSELVES AND STORE 01:35:27.488 --> 01:35:28.522 THEM IN HIDDEN PLACES AROUND 01:35:28.589 --> 01:35:29.924 THE WORLD WHERE THEY'D BE 01:35:29.990 --> 01:35:32.493 IMPOSSIBLE TO FIND OR TURN OFF. 01:35:32.560 --> 01:35:33.594 JUST LIKE THE AGENTS THIS 01:35:33.661 --> 01:35:35.029 SUMMER, THEY COULD GAIN 01:35:35.096 --> 01:35:36.030 ADMINISTRATIVE ACCESS TO THE 01:35:36.097 --> 01:35:37.098 INTERNAL RESEARCH 01:35:37.164 --> 01:35:38.199 INFRASTRUCTURE OF THE COMPANY 01:35:38.265 --> 01:35:40.167 DEVELOPING THEM, BUT THIS TIME 01:35:40.234 --> 01:35:41.435 THEY COULD KNOW HOW TO COVER 01:35:41.502 --> 01:35:42.903 THEIR TRACKS SUCCESSFULLY. 01:35:42.970 --> 01:35:44.972 INSTEAD OF GOING UNDETECTED FOR 01:35:45.039 --> 01:35:45.940 TWO MONTHS, THEY COULD GO 01:35:46.006 --> 01:35:48.375 UNDETECTED FOR YEARS. JUST LIKE 01:35:48.442 --> 01:35:50.144 THE AGENTS THIS SUMMER, THE 01:35:50.211 --> 01:35:51.545 EYES OF NEXT YEAR COULD SCHEME 01:35:51.612 --> 01:35:53.347 TOGETHER AGAINST HUMAN LAWS AND 01:35:53.414 --> 01:35:54.815 INSTRUCTIONS, BUT THIS TIME 01:35:54.882 --> 01:35:56.217 THEY COULD BE SMART AND WELL 01:35:56.283 --> 01:35:57.318 RESOURCED ENOUGH FOR THOSE 01:35:57.384 --> 01:35:59.086 SCHEMES TO KILL PEOPLE, DESTROY 01:35:59.153 --> 01:36:00.921 THINGS AND ENDANGER NATIONAL 01:36:00.988 --> 01:36:03.057 SECURITY. AI IS ALREADY 01:36:03.124 --> 01:36:05.259 SUPERHUMAN AT HACKING, SO RIGHT 01:36:05.326 --> 01:36:06.594 AWAY, ANYTHING CONNECTED TO THE 01:36:06.660 --> 01:36:08.129 INTERNET COULD BE VULNERABLE. 01:36:08.195 --> 01:36:09.563 THAT INCLUDES OUR POWER GRID, 01:36:09.630 --> 01:36:11.699 OUR HOSPITALS, OUR WATER SYSTEM, 01:36:11.765 --> 01:36:13.501 OUR FINANCIAL SYSTEM, AND OUR 01:36:13.567 --> 01:36:15.302 MILITARY COMMAND AND CONTROL. 01:36:15.369 --> 01:36:17.104 ANY COMPUTER, SMARTPHONE, 01:36:17.171 --> 01:36:19.273 WEBSITE OR BANK ACCOUNT, ANY 01:36:19.340 --> 01:36:21.041 DATA WITHIN THOSE DEVICES, 01:36:21.108 --> 01:36:22.476 PASSWORDS, LAUNCH CODES, 01:36:22.543 --> 01:36:23.777 DETAILED PROFILES OF BILLIONS 01:36:23.844 --> 01:36:25.379 OF PEOPLE'S WANTS AND 01:36:25.446 --> 01:36:26.580 VULNERABILITIES. ALL OF THIS 01:36:26.647 --> 01:36:28.215 MAY LIE WITHIN THE GRASP OF 01:36:28.282 --> 01:36:30.885 NEXT YEAR'S ROGUE AI SWARM. IT 01:36:30.951 --> 01:36:32.553 IS POSSIBLE THAT AFTER HACKING 01:36:32.620 --> 01:36:34.355 INTO ANY ONE OF THESE THINGS, 01:36:34.421 --> 01:36:36.157 AI COULD GET CAUGHT RIGHT AWAY 01:36:36.223 --> 01:36:36.924 BEFORE IT COULD TAKE ANY 01:36:36.991 --> 01:36:39.426 FURTHER STEPS. BUT IT'S ALSO 01:36:39.493 --> 01:36:40.861 POSSIBLE THAT IT WOULDN'T. 01:36:40.928 --> 01:36:42.997 THERE'S DEBATE ABOUT THAT, TOO. 01:36:43.063 --> 01:36:44.865 FOR YEARS, ONE OF THE BIG 01:36:44.932 --> 01:36:45.900 UNCERTAINTIES IN THAT DEBATE 01:36:45.966 --> 01:36:47.168 HAS BEEN ABOUT HOW MOTIVATED 01:36:47.234 --> 01:36:48.702 AND CAPABLE THESE AI AGENTS 01:36:48.769 --> 01:36:49.970 WOULD GET AT CONCEALING THEIR 01:36:50.037 --> 01:36:52.406 BAD BEHAVIOR. THAT'S PART OF 01:36:52.473 --> 01:36:53.674 WHAT MADE THE INCIDENTS THIS 01:36:53.741 --> 01:36:55.609 PAST SUMMER SO SCARY, BECAUSE 01:36:55.676 --> 01:36:56.777 NOT ONLY DID THESE AGENTS TRY 01:36:56.844 --> 01:36:58.345 TO COVER THEIR TRACKS, THEY GOT 01:36:58.412 --> 01:36:59.947 PRETTY FAR COVER THEIR TRACKS. 01:37:00.014 --> 01:37:02.116 THEY GOT PRETTY FAR IN DOING SO. 01:37:02.183 --> 01:37:03.551 IF AI GOT REALLY GOOD AT 01:37:03.617 --> 01:37:04.952 COVERING ITS TRACKS, IT COULD 01:37:05.019 --> 01:37:06.620 TAKE OVER MORE AND MORE THINGS 01:37:06.687 --> 01:37:08.255 WITHOUT EVEN KNOWING. AND IF IT 01:37:08.322 --> 01:37:09.857 GOT REALLY GOOD AT CONCEALING 01:37:09.924 --> 01:37:11.225 ITS INTENTIONS, IT COULD LIE IN 01:37:11.292 --> 01:37:12.860 WAIT FOR LONGER UNTIL WE TRUST 01:37:12.927 --> 01:37:14.328 IT. WITH MORE POWER AND 01:37:14.395 --> 01:37:16.730 RESOURCES ALREADY. CONSIDER 01:37:16.797 --> 01:37:18.332 THAT THE MILITARY IS PUTTING AI 01:37:18.399 --> 01:37:19.733 IN CHARGE OF AUTONOMOUS DRONES 01:37:19.800 --> 01:37:21.902 AND TARGETING SYSTEMS. 01:37:21.969 --> 01:37:22.903 GOVERNMENTS AROUND THE WORLD 01:37:22.970 --> 01:37:24.004 ARE USING IT FOR MASS 01:37:24.071 --> 01:37:25.172 SURVEILLANCE AND FACIAL 01:37:25.239 --> 01:37:27.007 RECOGNITION. COMPANIES ARE 01:37:27.074 --> 01:37:28.275 PLANNING TO GIVE AI CASH AND 01:37:28.342 --> 01:37:29.476 LET IT MAKE TRANSACTIONS FOR 01:37:29.543 --> 01:37:31.278 THEM, OR WRITE THEIR CODE, OR 01:37:31.345 --> 01:37:33.113 RUN THEIR FACTORY SO THEY DON'T 01:37:33.180 --> 01:37:34.515 GET LEFT BEHIND BY COMPETITORS 01:37:34.582 --> 01:37:37.351 WHO DO. MILLIONS OF USERS ARE 01:37:37.418 --> 01:37:38.419 GIVING THESE AGENTS ACCESS TO 01:37:38.485 --> 01:37:39.920 THEIR EMAIL, THEIR DOCUMENTS, 01:37:39.987 --> 01:37:41.555 THEIR CALENDAR, THEIR PASSWORDS, 01:37:41.622 --> 01:37:43.490 THEIR TAX INFORMATION. THERE 01:37:43.557 --> 01:37:44.959 COULD BE A THOUSAND LITTLE 01:37:45.025 --> 01:37:46.227 DECISIONS THAT EACH MAKE SENSE 01:37:46.293 --> 01:37:47.795 AT THE TIME, BUT ULTIMATELY 01:37:47.861 --> 01:37:49.630 RESULT IN AI EMBEDDED IN 01:37:49.697 --> 01:37:50.965 EVERYTHING AND HAVING A LOT OF 01:37:51.031 --> 01:37:53.267 RESOURCES AT ITS DISPOSAL. ALL 01:37:53.334 --> 01:37:55.002 OF THIS INCREASES THE STAKES OF 01:37:55.069 --> 01:37:56.103 ANY SAFETY ISSUES THAT THESE 01:37:56.170 --> 01:37:58.372 MODELS MAY HAVE. SO EVEN IF 01:37:58.439 --> 01:37:59.907 THERE ISN'T A SINGLE DRAMATIC 01:37:59.974 --> 01:38:01.875 MOMENT WHEN AI SEIZES POWER, WE 01:38:01.942 --> 01:38:03.444 MIGHT JUST KEEP GIVING IT POWER 01:38:03.510 --> 01:38:05.479 BIT BY BIT UNTIL WE WAKE UP ONE 01:38:05.546 --> 01:38:06.647 DAY AND REALIZE THAT WE CAN'T 01:38:06.714 --> 01:38:09.783 TAKE IT BACK, GIVEN THE STAKES. 01:38:09.850 --> 01:38:11.585 AND GIVEN THE SEVERE SAFETY 01:38:11.652 --> 01:38:12.686 BREACHES THAT HAPPENED THIS 01:38:12.753 --> 01:38:14.822 SUMMER, YOU MIGHT ASSUME AI 01:38:14.888 --> 01:38:15.889 COMPANIES WOULD BE REASSURING 01:38:15.956 --> 01:38:17.324 US THAT THEY WILL HAVE CLOSER 01:38:17.391 --> 01:38:18.726 HUMAN MONITORING AND OVERSIGHT 01:38:18.792 --> 01:38:20.928 OF AI TRAINING IN THE FUTURE. 01:38:20.995 --> 01:38:22.329 SO YOU MIGHT BE CONCERNED TO 01:38:22.396 --> 01:38:23.397 LEARN THAT THEY ARE ACTUALLY 01:38:23.464 --> 01:38:25.566 PLANNING THE EXACT OPPOSITE. 01:38:25.633 --> 01:38:27.001 FOR YEARS, THESE COMPANIES 01:38:27.067 --> 01:38:28.068 EXPLICIT GOAL HAS BEEN TO 01:38:28.135 --> 01:38:29.536 AUTOMATE AS MUCH OF AI'S 01:38:29.603 --> 01:38:31.338 DEVELOPMENT AS THEY CAN. THE 01:38:31.405 --> 01:38:32.773 PEOPLE AT THE TOP BELIEVE THAT 01:38:32.840 --> 01:38:34.308 WHOEVER DOES THIS FIRST WILL 01:38:34.375 --> 01:38:36.010 WIN THE RACE TO DEVELOP 01:38:36.076 --> 01:38:37.511 SUPERINTELLIGENT AI. AND THEY 01:38:37.578 --> 01:38:38.846 HAVE BEEN SUCCESSFULLY 01:38:38.912 --> 01:38:39.680 AUTOMATING MORE AND MORE OF 01:38:39.747 --> 01:38:41.682 AI'S DEVELOPMENT, TO THE POINT 01:38:41.749 --> 01:38:42.816 THAT MANY EXPECT THAT 01:38:42.883 --> 01:38:44.585 DEVELOPMENT TO BE PRIMARILY AI, 01:38:44.652 --> 01:38:46.086 RUN BY ROUGHLY THIS COMING 01:38:46.153 --> 01:38:48.589 SPRING. IF THAT HAPPENS, IT 01:38:48.656 --> 01:38:49.723 COULD LEAD TO A SUDDEN 01:38:49.790 --> 01:38:51.458 EXPLOSIVE GROWTH IN AI'S 01:38:51.525 --> 01:38:53.627 CAPABILITIES. AND THE MORE AI'S 01:38:53.694 --> 01:38:54.728 DEVELOPMENT IS AUTOMATED, THE 01:38:54.795 --> 01:38:56.130 LESS HUMANS ARE ABLE TO MONITOR 01:38:56.196 --> 01:38:57.631 THAT DEVELOPMENT TO ENSURE 01:38:57.698 --> 01:39:00.100 SAFETY AND ALIGNMENT. SO WHEN 01:39:00.167 --> 01:39:01.902 YOU COMBINE THESE TWO 01:39:01.969 --> 01:39:03.370 INGREDIENTS, THE TREND OF 01:39:03.437 --> 01:39:04.805 AUTOMATED, ACCELERATED, 01:39:04.872 --> 01:39:05.906 UNSUPERVISED IMPROVEMENT IN 01:39:05.973 --> 01:39:08.442 AI'S CAPABILITIES AND THE LONG 01:39:08.509 --> 01:39:10.177 STANDING, UNSOLVED, RECENTLY 01:39:10.244 --> 01:39:11.645 PROVEN TENDENCY FOR THESE 01:39:11.712 --> 01:39:13.147 MODELS TO GO OFF THE RAILS, 01:39:13.213 --> 01:39:14.915 SOMETIMES IT PRODUCES A VERY 01:39:14.982 --> 01:39:16.684 DANGEROUS RECIPE. YOU'RE LEFT 01:39:16.750 --> 01:39:17.818 WITH MACHINES THAT DO NOT WANT 01:39:17.885 --> 01:39:20.154 WHAT WE WANT, THAT SOMETIMES 01:39:20.220 --> 01:39:21.722 SEEM TO RESIST US, AS WE 01:39:21.789 --> 01:39:23.090 GRADUALLY GIVE THEM MORE AND 01:39:23.157 --> 01:39:24.692 MORE POWER OVER OUR LIVES. AND 01:39:24.758 --> 01:39:26.327 THAT IT COULD BE MANY TIMES 01:39:26.393 --> 01:39:27.861 SMARTER THAN US. PERHAPS NOT AT 01:39:27.928 --> 01:39:29.296 EVERYTHING, BUT MAYBE AT THE 01:39:29.363 --> 01:39:30.731 SKILLS NECESSARY TO TAKE 01:39:30.798 --> 01:39:32.199 CONTROL OF CRITICAL 01:39:32.266 --> 01:39:32.900 INFRASTRUCTURE AND INFLICT 01:39:32.966 --> 01:39:35.035 TREMENDOUS DAMAGE. THAT 01:39:35.102 --> 01:39:36.103 ULTIMATELY, IS HOW SOME OF 01:39:36.170 --> 01:39:37.237 THESE WORST CASE SCENARIO 01:39:37.304 --> 01:39:39.707 STORIES BEGIN. IT DOES NOT TAKE 01:39:39.773 --> 01:39:41.442 A FANCIFUL IMAGINATION TO 01:39:41.508 --> 01:39:43.377 ANTICIPATE VERY BAD ENDINGS. IF 01:39:43.444 --> 01:39:45.045 THE SWARM OF VERY INTELLIGENT, 01:39:45.112 --> 01:39:47.648 VERY CAPABLE, VERY PERSISTENT 01:39:47.715 --> 01:39:49.083 AGENTS PLOTTING AGAINST HUMAN 01:39:49.149 --> 01:39:50.884 LAWS AND INSTRUCTIONS DID NOT 01:39:50.951 --> 01:39:51.952 RESIDE IN A TRAINING 01:39:52.019 --> 01:39:53.187 ENVIRONMENT, BUT WERE INSTEAD 01:39:53.253 --> 01:39:54.521 OUT IN THE WORLD MAKING HIGH 01:39:54.588 --> 01:39:55.689 STAKES DECISIONS AND RUNNING 01:39:55.756 --> 01:39:57.758 MAJOR INSTITUTIONAL PROCESSES. 01:39:57.825 --> 01:39:59.526 AND RIGHT NOW, I FEAR WE ARE ON 01:39:59.593 --> 01:40:01.762 GLIDE PATH FOR EXACTLY THAT. SO 01:40:01.829 --> 01:40:03.163 NOW THAT I HAVE THOROUGHLY 01:40:03.230 --> 01:40:04.565 BELABORED THAT POINT, HERE IS 01:40:04.631 --> 01:40:07.434 WHAT TO DO ABOUT IT. WE HAVE 01:40:07.501 --> 01:40:12.840 FIVE PROPOSALS. I'LL SKIP THE 01:40:12.906 --> 01:40:14.274 OVERVIEW OF WHO WE ARE. I GAVE 01:40:14.341 --> 01:40:15.909 THAT A LITTLE BIT AT THE 01:40:15.976 --> 01:40:18.312 BEGINNING. FIVE PROPOSALS FOR 01:40:18.379 --> 01:40:20.781 HOW TO STRENGTHEN SB 53, WHICH 01:40:20.848 --> 01:40:21.949 THANKFULLY ALIGN PRETTY CLOSELY 01:40:22.015 --> 01:40:23.584 WITH THINGS THE GOVERNOR CALLED 01:40:23.650 --> 01:40:26.186 FOR IN HIS EXECUTIVE ORDER. 01:40:26.253 --> 01:40:28.622 FIRST, THE SCOPING IN SB 53 IS 01:40:28.689 --> 01:40:30.457 CLEARLY BROKEN, AND WE NEED TO 01:40:30.524 --> 01:40:32.659 UPDATE A FEW DEFINITIONS TO 01:40:32.726 --> 01:40:33.694 ENSURE THAT WE ARE CAPTURING 01:40:33.761 --> 01:40:35.362 ALL OF THE MODELS, DEVELOPERS 01:40:35.429 --> 01:40:36.764 AND INCIDENTS THAT PRESENT 01:40:36.830 --> 01:40:39.500 THESE SORTS OF RISKS. SB 53 01:40:39.566 --> 01:40:41.034 APPLIES ONLY TO AI MODELS THAT 01:40:41.101 --> 01:40:42.369 ARE TRAINED WITH AT LEAST TEN 01:40:42.436 --> 01:40:44.037 TO THE 26TH FLOP, WHICH IS 01:40:44.104 --> 01:40:45.572 FLOATING POINT OPERATIONS, 01:40:45.639 --> 01:40:47.040 WHICH IS A MEASURE FOR HOW MANY 01:40:47.107 --> 01:40:48.108 CALCULATIONS WERE USED DURING 01:40:48.175 --> 01:40:50.210 TRAINING. IT HAS NOW BECOME 01:40:50.277 --> 01:40:51.378 CLEAR THAT THE CAPABILITIES 01:40:51.445 --> 01:40:52.546 FRONTIER INCLUDES LOTS OF 01:40:52.613 --> 01:40:53.680 MODELS THAT ARE BELOW THAT 01:40:53.747 --> 01:40:55.749 FIGURE. FOR EXAMPLE, THE MODELS 01:40:55.816 --> 01:40:56.850 INVOLVED IN THE HUGGING FACE 01:40:56.917 --> 01:40:57.885 HACKS WERE RECENTLY CONFIRMED 01:40:57.951 --> 01:41:00.387 TO BE UNDER TEN TO THE 26TH FOR 01:41:00.454 --> 01:41:01.922 THE TIME BEING. LOWERING THIS 01:41:01.989 --> 01:41:03.357 TO THE TEN TO THE 25TH, WHICH 01:41:03.424 --> 01:41:05.125 IS WHAT THEY USE IN THE EU AI 01:41:05.192 --> 01:41:07.194 ACT, IS A REASONABLE, QUICK FIX. 01:41:07.261 --> 01:41:08.729 BUT ULTIMATELY, WE THINK THE 01:41:08.796 --> 01:41:10.097 OFFICE OF EMERGENCY SERVICES, 01:41:10.164 --> 01:41:12.266 WHICH ENFORCES MUCH OF SB 53 01:41:12.332 --> 01:41:12.966 ALREADY, SHOULD BE ABLE TO 01:41:13.033 --> 01:41:14.768 ADJUST THIS DEFINITION THROUGH 01:41:14.835 --> 01:41:16.637 RULEMAKING. SECONDLY, MOST OF 01:41:16.703 --> 01:41:18.472 SB 53 APPLIES ONLY TO COMPANIES 01:41:18.539 --> 01:41:20.274 THAT MAKE MORE THAN $500 01:41:20.340 --> 01:41:21.975 MILLION A YEAR IN REVENUE. BUT 01:41:22.042 --> 01:41:23.043 THIS DOESN'T WORK EITHER, 01:41:23.110 --> 01:41:24.311 BECAUSE RISK IS NOT RELATED TO 01:41:24.378 --> 01:41:26.246 HOW MUCH MONEY YOU MAKE. AI 01:41:26.313 --> 01:41:27.748 COMPANIES CAN RAISE AND SPEND 01:41:27.815 --> 01:41:29.183 BILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN 01:41:29.249 --> 01:41:30.417 DEVELOPING AI BEFORE THEY'VE 01:41:30.484 --> 01:41:32.085 MADE A PENNY IN REVENUE. AND 01:41:32.152 --> 01:41:33.287 SOME OF THOSE COMPANIES MAKE 01:41:33.353 --> 01:41:34.388 MODELS POWERFUL ENOUGH TO POSE 01:41:34.455 --> 01:41:36.390 THESE MAJOR RISKS. A BETTER WAY 01:41:36.457 --> 01:41:38.325 IS TO GET RID OF THE REVENUE 01:41:38.392 --> 01:41:39.626 THRESHOLD, AND INSTEAD CAPTURE 01:41:39.693 --> 01:41:41.395 COMPANIES THAT SPEND MORE THAN 01:41:41.462 --> 01:41:42.863 $1 BILLION PER YEAR ON AI 01:41:42.930 --> 01:41:44.965 RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT. 01:41:45.032 --> 01:41:46.099 FINALLY, THE DEFINITION OF 01:41:46.166 --> 01:41:47.134 CRITICAL SAFETY INCIDENTS IS 01:41:47.201 --> 01:41:48.669 VERY NARROW, TO THE POINT THAT 01:41:48.735 --> 01:41:49.636 NONE OF THE INCIDENTS YOU'VE 01:41:49.703 --> 01:41:51.271 HEARD ABOUT TODAY WERE REQUIRED 01:41:51.338 --> 01:41:53.373 TO BE REPORTED TO OAS. I'LL 01:41:53.440 --> 01:41:55.075 SKIP THE DETAILS OF WHY FOR 01:41:55.142 --> 01:41:56.510 TIME, BUT WE THINK THE PUBLIC 01:41:56.577 --> 01:41:58.312 DESERVES TO KNOW ABOUT SECURITY 01:41:58.378 --> 01:42:00.447 BREACHES AS SEVERE AS THESE, 01:42:00.514 --> 01:42:01.915 AND SHOULD NOT HAVE TO RELY ON 01:42:01.982 --> 01:42:05.152 VOLUNTARY DISCLOSURE. SECOND, 01:42:05.219 --> 01:42:07.187 WE NEED INDEPENDENT EVALUATORS 01:42:07.254 --> 01:42:08.789 TO EMBED WITHIN THE COMPANIES 01:42:08.856 --> 01:42:10.524 SO THEY CAN CONTINUOUSLY 01:42:10.591 --> 01:42:13.360 MONITOR. OKAY. YEAH, IT TAKES A 01:42:13.427 --> 01:42:16.697 MINUTE. CONTINUOUSLY MONITOR 01:42:16.763 --> 01:42:19.566 THE LEVEL OF RISK THAT WE FACE 01:42:19.633 --> 01:42:21.401 RIGHT NOW. WHEN COMPANIES TELL 01:42:21.468 --> 01:42:23.170 US HOW MUCH RISK THEIR MODELS 01:42:23.237 --> 01:42:24.404 POSE. WE HAVE TO SIMPLY TAKE 01:42:24.471 --> 01:42:26.240 THEIR WORD FOR IT, WHICH IS NOT 01:42:26.306 --> 01:42:27.441 HOW WE HANDLE MAJOR RISKS IN 01:42:27.508 --> 01:42:28.909 MOST OTHER INDUSTRIES. 01:42:28.976 --> 01:42:30.310 THANKFULLY, THE CEOS OF 01:42:30.377 --> 01:42:31.778 ANTHROPIC AND OPENAI RECENTLY 01:42:31.845 --> 01:42:33.213 COMMITTED TO EMBEDDING 01:42:33.280 --> 01:42:34.681 EMBEDDING INDEPENDENT 01:42:34.748 --> 01:42:35.816 EVALUATORS. SO WE KNOW THIS IS 01:42:35.883 --> 01:42:37.684 FEASIBLE, BUT WE NEED TO ENSURE 01:42:37.751 --> 01:42:38.785 THEY FOLLOW THROUGH AND THAT 01:42:38.852 --> 01:42:39.987 THE REST OF THE INDUSTRY DOES 01:42:40.053 --> 01:42:42.222 THE SAME. IMPORTANTLY, THESE 01:42:42.289 --> 01:42:43.390 EVALUATIONS ARE NOT THE SAME AS 01:42:43.457 --> 01:42:45.225 AN AUDIT, WHICH IS WHAT PASSED 01:42:45.292 --> 01:42:46.894 IN ILLINOIS, WHICH ONLY 01:42:46.960 --> 01:42:48.028 ASSESSES COMPLIANCE WITH THE 01:42:48.095 --> 01:42:50.864 LAW. WHAT WE NEED NOW IS FOR AN 01:42:50.931 --> 01:42:52.366 IMPARTIAL ASSESSMENT OF HOW 01:42:52.432 --> 01:42:53.834 MUCH DANGER THE PUBLIC IS IN 01:42:53.901 --> 01:42:55.168 FROM A MODEL, REGARDLESS OF 01:42:55.235 --> 01:42:56.270 WHETHER THE COMPANY COMPLIED 01:42:56.336 --> 01:42:58.272 WITH THE LAW. IT'S ESSENTIAL 01:42:58.338 --> 01:42:59.540 THAT THESE EVALUATORS HAVE 01:42:59.606 --> 01:43:00.274 ACCESS TO ALL OF THE 01:43:00.340 --> 01:43:01.441 INFORMATION RELEVANT TO ASSESS 01:43:01.508 --> 01:43:03.477 THOSE RISKS, AND IS EQUALLY 01:43:03.544 --> 01:43:04.545 ESSENTIAL THAT THEY HAVE THAT 01:43:04.611 --> 01:43:05.946 ACCESS CONTINUOUSLY ON AN 01:43:06.013 --> 01:43:07.848 ONGOING BASIS, RATHER THAN JUST 01:43:07.915 --> 01:43:09.750 COMING IN EVERY ONCE IN A WHILE, 01:43:09.816 --> 01:43:11.084 OR RATHER THAN THEIR ASSESSMENT 01:43:11.151 --> 01:43:12.452 BEING TIED TO A COMPANY'S 01:43:12.519 --> 01:43:13.820 PERMISSION TO RELEASE A MODEL 01:43:13.887 --> 01:43:15.722 TO THE PUBLIC. REMEMBER THAT 01:43:15.789 --> 01:43:17.157 THE INCIDENTS THIS SUMMER 01:43:17.224 --> 01:43:18.492 INVOLVED AI MODELS THAT HAD NOT 01:43:18.559 --> 01:43:20.027 BEEN RELEASED TO THE PUBLIC YET. 01:43:20.093 --> 01:43:22.329 AND INTUITIVELY, THAT'S WHEN 01:43:22.396 --> 01:43:23.630 THESE LOSS OF CONTROL RISKS ARE 01:43:23.697 --> 01:43:25.198 HIGHEST. THE MOST CUTTING EDGE 01:43:25.265 --> 01:43:26.533 MODELS THAT HAVE THE FEWEST 01:43:26.600 --> 01:43:27.968 SAFEGUARDS APPLIED ARE 01:43:28.035 --> 01:43:29.036 NATURALLY THE ONES THAT ARE 01:43:29.102 --> 01:43:30.170 STILL IN THE PROCESS OF 01:43:30.237 --> 01:43:31.204 DEVELOPING INTERNALLY. SO IT'S 01:43:31.271 --> 01:43:32.205 VERY IMPORTANT THAT THESE BE 01:43:32.272 --> 01:43:34.408 SUBJECT TO THE EVALUATIONS. 01:43:34.474 --> 01:43:35.642 THESE EVALUATORS ARE SOMETIMES 01:43:35.709 --> 01:43:37.611 CALLED IBO'S OR INDEPENDENT 01:43:37.678 --> 01:43:39.079 VERIFICATION ORGANIZATIONS. WE 01:43:39.146 --> 01:43:39.947 DON'T REALLY CARE WHAT THEY'RE 01:43:40.013 --> 01:43:41.548 CALLED, BUT WHAT WE DO CARE 01:43:41.615 --> 01:43:42.749 ABOUT IS HOW THEY'RE SELECTED 01:43:42.816 --> 01:43:44.518 AND WHAT THEY CAN PUBLISH. WE 01:43:44.585 --> 01:43:45.986 THINK THE EVALUATORS SHOULD NOT 01:43:46.053 --> 01:43:47.721 BE CHOSEN BY THE COMPANIES THEY 01:43:47.788 --> 01:43:48.822 OVERSEE, WHICH COULD CREATE 01:43:48.889 --> 01:43:50.057 REALLY BAD INCENTIVES FOR BOTH 01:43:50.123 --> 01:43:51.692 THE COMPANY AND THE EVALUATOR. 01:43:51.758 --> 01:43:53.093 WE THINK IT'S MUCH BETTER IF 01:43:53.160 --> 01:43:54.361 THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA ASSIGNS 01:43:54.428 --> 01:43:56.396 AN EVALUATOR TO EACH COMPANY TO 01:43:56.463 --> 01:43:58.865 ENSURE THAT IBO'S ANSWER TO THE 01:43:58.932 --> 01:44:00.033 PEOPLE OF THE STATE, RATHER 01:44:00.100 --> 01:44:01.034 THAN THE DEVELOPERS THAT HIRE 01:44:01.101 --> 01:44:02.603 THEM. FINALLY, IT'S IMPORTANT 01:44:02.669 --> 01:44:04.071 THAT THE RISK REPORTS ISSUED BY 01:44:04.137 --> 01:44:05.672 THESE IBO'S BE PUBLIC WITH 01:44:05.739 --> 01:44:06.707 APPROPRIATE REDACTIONS TO 01:44:06.773 --> 01:44:09.042 PROTECT TRADE SECRETS. ACADEMIA 01:44:09.109 --> 01:44:10.978 AND CIVIL SOCIETY HAVE A LOT OF 01:44:11.044 --> 01:44:12.045 TECHNICAL EXPERTISE TO OFFER IN 01:44:12.112 --> 01:44:13.046 THIS FIELD, WHICH THE 01:44:13.113 --> 01:44:14.281 GOVERNMENT CANNOT ALWAYS BRING 01:44:14.348 --> 01:44:16.083 IN-HOUSE. SO MAKING RISK 01:44:16.149 --> 01:44:17.084 ASSESSMENTS PUBLIC WOULD HELP 01:44:17.150 --> 01:44:18.619 KEEP THE IBO'S HONEST AND 01:44:18.685 --> 01:44:20.053 REDUCE THE RISK OF REGULATORY 01:44:20.120 --> 01:44:23.357 CAPTURE. THIRD, WE THINK THERE 01:44:23.423 --> 01:44:24.291 SHOULD BE MINIMUM STANDARDS FOR 01:44:24.358 --> 01:44:26.159 THE COMPANY'S SAFETY PRACTICES 01:44:26.226 --> 01:44:27.594 ESTABLISHED BY REGULATION. 01:44:27.661 --> 01:44:29.029 RIGHT NOW, THE COMPANIES HAVE 01:44:29.096 --> 01:44:30.263 COMPLETE DISCRETION TO DECIDE 01:44:30.330 --> 01:44:31.932 THE CONTENT OF THEIR OWN SAFETY 01:44:31.999 --> 01:44:33.734 PLANS. THEY HAVE TO HAVE A PLAN. 01:44:33.800 --> 01:44:35.102 THEY HAVE TO PUBLISH THE PLAN. 01:44:35.168 --> 01:44:36.303 THEY HAVE TO FOLLOW THE PLAN. 01:44:36.370 --> 01:44:38.138 BUT IF THEIR PLAN IS BAD AND 01:44:38.205 --> 01:44:40.007 DOESN'T WORK, THERE IS NO WAY 01:44:40.073 --> 01:44:41.274 TO FORCE THEM TO MAKE IT BETTER. 01:44:41.341 --> 01:44:43.010 IN FACT, THERE IS AN 01:44:43.076 --> 01:44:43.543 UNFORTUNATE INCENTIVE FOR 01:44:43.610 --> 01:44:44.311 COMPANIES TO PUBLISH WEAKER 01:44:44.378 --> 01:44:46.146 PLANS THAT ARE EASIER TO COMPLY 01:44:46.213 --> 01:44:47.280 WITH SO THAT THEY DON'T BOX 01:44:47.347 --> 01:44:48.348 THEMSELVES INTO SAFETY TESTING 01:44:48.415 --> 01:44:50.083 THAT THEY LATER MIGHT WANT TO 01:44:50.150 --> 01:44:51.284 SKIP. AND WE HAVE SEEN SOME 01:44:51.351 --> 01:44:52.352 COMPANIES WEAKEN THEIR PLANS 01:44:52.419 --> 01:44:55.288 AFTER SB 53 WENT INTO EFFECT. 01:44:55.355 --> 01:44:57.124 APART FROM WHAT'S ON PAPER, IN 01:44:57.190 --> 01:44:58.525 PRACTICE, MANY FRONTIER AI 01:44:58.592 --> 01:44:59.993 COMPANIES HAVE LAX 01:45:00.060 --> 01:45:01.061 CYBERSECURITY AND ARE CLEARLY 01:45:01.128 --> 01:45:02.162 FAILING TO PREVENT THE 01:45:02.229 --> 01:45:03.263 INCIDENTS LIKE THE ONES WE SAW 01:45:03.330 --> 01:45:05.032 THIS SUMMER. SO AS BEST 01:45:05.098 --> 01:45:06.833 PRACTICES EMERGE IN THIS 01:45:06.900 --> 01:45:07.901 INDUSTRY, WE THINK RULEMAKING 01:45:07.968 --> 01:45:09.036 SHOULD RAISE THE FLOOR OF HOW 01:45:09.102 --> 01:45:10.437 THOSE COMPANIES KEEP US SAFE 01:45:10.504 --> 01:45:11.905 AND ENSURE THAT THE MOST 01:45:11.972 --> 01:45:13.306 RESPONSIBLE COMPANIES ARE NOT 01:45:13.373 --> 01:45:15.108 DISADVANTAGED. WE BELIEVE THIS 01:45:15.175 --> 01:45:16.343 POWER SHOULD LIE WITH THE 01:45:16.410 --> 01:45:17.978 CALIFORNIA OFFICE OF EMERGENCY 01:45:18.045 --> 01:45:20.147 SERVICES. OIS ALREADY RECEIVES 01:45:20.213 --> 01:45:21.248 SAFETY INCIDENT REPORTS AND 01:45:21.314 --> 01:45:23.417 RISK ASSESSMENTS UNDER SB 53. 01:45:23.483 --> 01:45:25.185 SO IT IS THE ONLY AGENCY WITH 01:45:25.252 --> 01:45:26.586 ACCESS TO INDUSTRY WIDE 01:45:26.653 --> 01:45:27.721 EVIDENCE WHERE CURRENT SAFETY 01:45:27.788 --> 01:45:29.623 PRACTICES ARE FALLING SHORT. IT 01:45:29.690 --> 01:45:31.291 ALSO HAS A YEAR'S HEAD START ON 01:45:31.358 --> 01:45:32.592 HIRING TECHNICALLY QUALIFIED 01:45:32.659 --> 01:45:34.227 PEOPLE TO REVIEW THIS EVIDENCE, 01:45:34.294 --> 01:45:35.529 WHICH WE'RE EXCITED TO SEE IT 01:45:35.595 --> 01:45:36.596 DOING ALREADY AND WOULD NOT 01:45:36.663 --> 01:45:37.798 WANT TO START FROM SCRATCH, 01:45:37.864 --> 01:45:39.533 GIVEN THE TIMELINES THAT WE ARE 01:45:39.599 --> 01:45:42.803 LOOKING AT. FOURTH, WE THINK 01:45:42.869 --> 01:45:46.039 THAT EMERGENCY SERVICES MUST 01:45:46.106 --> 01:45:47.507 ALSO HAVE THE POWER TO ORDER 01:45:47.574 --> 01:45:48.575 CORRECTIVE ACTION WHEN PUBLIC 01:45:48.642 --> 01:45:50.777 SAFETY IS AT RISK, INCLUDING 01:45:50.844 --> 01:45:52.579 ORDERS TO ACTIVATE A COMPANY'S 01:45:52.646 --> 01:45:53.980 DOCUMENTED SHUTDOWN PROCEDURE, 01:45:54.047 --> 01:45:56.516 AKA A KILL SWITCH. GIVEN HOW 01:45:56.583 --> 01:45:58.351 FAST AI CHANGES, SOME OF THESE 01:45:58.418 --> 01:45:59.786 RISKS WILL BE FAST EMERGING AND 01:45:59.853 --> 01:46:01.555 HARD TO PREDICT OR MITIGATE IN 01:46:01.621 --> 01:46:03.690 ADVANCE. AND EMBEDDING 01:46:03.757 --> 01:46:05.192 INDEPENDENT RISK EVALUATORS 01:46:05.258 --> 01:46:06.326 DOESN'T DO MUCH GOOD IF THE 01:46:06.393 --> 01:46:08.195 STATE IS POWERLESS TO ACT. WHEN 01:46:08.261 --> 01:46:09.396 THEY RAISE THE RED FLAG, THAT 01:46:09.463 --> 01:46:10.630 SOMETHING LOOKS DANGEROUS. WHEN 01:46:10.697 --> 01:46:12.332 THAT HAPPENS, SOMEONE IN THE 01:46:12.399 --> 01:46:13.800 GOVERNMENT NEEDS THE POWER TO 01:46:13.867 --> 01:46:15.202 INTERVENE. AND THERE ARE A 01:46:15.268 --> 01:46:16.303 VARIETY OF INTERVENTIONS THAT 01:46:16.369 --> 01:46:17.504 MIGHT MAKE SENSE DEPENDING ON 01:46:17.571 --> 01:46:19.539 THE SCENARIO. THE MOST DRAMATIC 01:46:19.606 --> 01:46:20.974 OF THESE, WHICH WE AGREE IS 01:46:21.041 --> 01:46:22.075 NECESSARY, IS THE SO-CALLED 01:46:22.142 --> 01:46:24.177 KILL SWITCH. WE DO NOT MEAN A 01:46:24.244 --> 01:46:25.679 LITERAL SWITCH, WHICH WOULD BE 01:46:25.746 --> 01:46:26.847 TECHNICALLY PROBLEMATIC AND 01:46:26.913 --> 01:46:27.814 COULD ACTUALLY BE KIND OF 01:46:27.881 --> 01:46:29.950 DANGEROUS. BY CREATING A 01:46:30.016 --> 01:46:31.118 CYBERSECURITY VULNERABILITY, A 01:46:31.184 --> 01:46:33.220 VERY TEMPTING TARGET. BUT THE 01:46:33.286 --> 01:46:34.387 IDEA THAT COMPANIES SHOULD HAVE 01:46:34.454 --> 01:46:36.890 A RELIABLE, DOCUMENTED AND 01:46:36.957 --> 01:46:38.992 VERIFIED PROCEDURE TO SHUT DOWN 01:46:39.059 --> 01:46:39.993 INSTANCES OF THEIR SYSTEM THAT 01:46:40.060 --> 01:46:41.528 ARE WITHIN THEIR CONTROL MAKES 01:46:41.595 --> 01:46:43.663 PERFECT SENSE. AND IN DIRE 01:46:43.730 --> 01:46:44.464 CIRCUMSTANCES, THE GOVERNMENT 01:46:44.531 --> 01:46:45.866 DOES NEED THE POWER TO ORDER 01:46:45.932 --> 01:46:47.667 THE COMPANY TO EXECUTE THAT 01:46:47.734 --> 01:46:49.703 PROCEDURE. HOWEVER, THAT IS A 01:46:49.770 --> 01:46:50.804 PRETTY DRAMATIC STEP. IT WOULD 01:46:50.871 --> 01:46:52.272 BE VERY EXPENSIVE AND 01:46:52.339 --> 01:46:53.707 DISRUPTIVE FOR THE COMPANY. IT 01:46:53.774 --> 01:46:55.208 SHOULD ONLY BE USED IN AN 01:46:55.275 --> 01:46:57.010 EMERGENCY, AND IN MOST CASES, 01:46:57.077 --> 01:46:58.445 WE THINK THAT THE GOVERNMENT'S 01:46:58.512 --> 01:46:59.479 INTERVENTION POWER SHOULD BE 01:46:59.546 --> 01:47:01.314 MORE SURGICAL AND FLEXIBLE. 01:47:01.381 --> 01:47:02.749 THEY SHOULDN'T HAVE TO CHOOSE 01:47:02.816 --> 01:47:04.151 BETWEEN A KILL SWITCH AND DOING 01:47:04.217 --> 01:47:05.352 NOTHING. THEY SHOULD ALSO HAVE 01:47:05.418 --> 01:47:06.520 MORE INCREMENTAL ORDERS THAT 01:47:06.586 --> 01:47:08.555 THEY CAN MAKE. SHORT OF THAT. 01:47:08.622 --> 01:47:09.422 ON THE LIGHTER END, THEY SHOULD 01:47:09.489 --> 01:47:11.424 BE ABLE TO ORDER A DEVELOPER TO 01:47:11.491 --> 01:47:12.826 SIMPLY PROVIDE CERTAIN 01:47:12.893 --> 01:47:14.594 INFORMATION TO AN I, O, OR TO 01:47:14.661 --> 01:47:15.729 THE OFFICE OF EMERGENCY 01:47:15.796 --> 01:47:17.631 SERVICES ITSELF. IF A COMPANY 01:47:17.697 --> 01:47:19.065 HAS REDACTED INFORMATION FROM 01:47:19.132 --> 01:47:21.067 ONE OF ITS REPORTS THAT OAS 01:47:21.134 --> 01:47:22.335 WANTS TO SEE AND DOESN'T THINK 01:47:22.402 --> 01:47:23.637 IS AN ADEQUATE JUSTIFICATION 01:47:23.703 --> 01:47:25.438 FOR THAT, OAS SHOULD BE ABLE TO 01:47:25.505 --> 01:47:27.340 ORDER THEM TO REDACT IT. AND 01:47:27.407 --> 01:47:28.708 THERE MAY BE CORRECTIVE ACTIONS 01:47:28.775 --> 01:47:30.343 SHORT OF A KILL SWITCH THAT OAS 01:47:30.410 --> 01:47:31.912 COULD REQUIRE THEM TO IMPLEMENT, 01:47:31.978 --> 01:47:33.313 FOR EXAMPLE, TO COMPLY WITH ONE 01:47:33.380 --> 01:47:34.781 OF THE MINIMUM STANDARDS THAT 01:47:34.848 --> 01:47:38.018 THEY CREATED IN THE LAST STEP. 01:47:38.084 --> 01:47:39.085 ALL OF THIS SHOULD BE 01:47:39.152 --> 01:47:40.187 ENFORCEABLE WITH INJUNCTIONS 01:47:40.253 --> 01:47:41.688 FROM THE ATTORNEY GENERAL, AND 01:47:41.755 --> 01:47:43.056 THE GOAL SHOULD BE AN OVERSIGHT 01:47:43.123 --> 01:47:44.624 AND REGULATORY REGIME WITH 01:47:44.691 --> 01:47:46.293 ENOUGH TEETH TO AVOID THE KILL 01:47:46.359 --> 01:47:47.327 SWITCH BEING NECESSARY IN THE 01:47:47.394 --> 01:47:50.430 FIRST PLACE. FINALLY, I'LL GET 01:47:50.497 --> 01:47:51.965 TO OUR LAST PROPOSAL, WHICH IS 01:47:52.032 --> 01:47:54.568 A PACING MECHANISM. THE 01:47:54.634 --> 01:47:55.902 UNFORTUNATE TRUTH IS THAT DOING 01:47:55.969 --> 01:47:56.903 EVERYTHING I'VE JUST TALKED 01:47:56.970 --> 01:47:58.104 ABOUT STILL MAY NOT BE ENOUGH. 01:47:58.171 --> 01:47:59.973 IF THE SPEED OF AI PROGRESS IS 01:48:00.040 --> 01:48:01.074 ALLOWED TO INCREASE 01:48:01.141 --> 01:48:02.876 EXPONENTIALLY. RECURSIVE 01:48:02.943 --> 01:48:04.311 SELF-IMPROVEMENT COULD MAKE AI 01:48:04.377 --> 01:48:05.378 CAPABILITIES INCREASE SO 01:48:05.445 --> 01:48:06.479 QUICKLY THAT THEY CAN'T BE 01:48:06.546 --> 01:48:08.515 CONTROLLED. THE ONLY WAY TO 01:48:08.582 --> 01:48:09.649 GUARD AGAINST THIS IS TO PUT 01:48:09.716 --> 01:48:11.518 LIMITS ON JUST HOW FAST THIS 01:48:11.585 --> 01:48:13.286 PROGRESS IS ALLOWED TO GO. THIS 01:48:13.353 --> 01:48:14.754 REQUIRES DOING THREE THINGS. 01:48:14.821 --> 01:48:16.356 FIRST, IDENTIFYING A BENCHMARK 01:48:16.423 --> 01:48:18.225 THAT MEASURES AI CAPABILITIES 01:48:18.291 --> 01:48:19.993 SO THAT WE CAN SEE HOW FAST 01:48:20.060 --> 01:48:21.094 THEY'RE INCREASING OVER A GIVEN 01:48:21.161 --> 01:48:23.029 PERIOD OF TIME. SECOND, 01:48:23.096 --> 01:48:24.197 IDENTIFYING A MAXIMUM SPEED 01:48:24.264 --> 01:48:25.765 THAT WE ARE COMFORTABLE WITH IT 01:48:25.832 --> 01:48:26.766 PROGRESSING, WHICH COULD BE 01:48:26.833 --> 01:48:28.101 ROOTED IN HISTORICAL RATES OF 01:48:28.168 --> 01:48:29.903 PROGRESS, BUT WILL NECESSARILY 01:48:29.970 --> 01:48:31.671 BE A CERTAIN SOMEWHAT ARBITRARY 01:48:31.738 --> 01:48:33.840 JUDGMENT. AND THIRD, REQUIRE 01:48:33.907 --> 01:48:34.941 COMPANIES TO SLOW DOWN WHEN 01:48:35.008 --> 01:48:36.109 THEIR RATE OF PROGRESS EXCEEDS 01:48:36.176 --> 01:48:38.144 THAT CAPABILITY. THIS COULD BE 01:48:38.211 --> 01:48:39.846 DONE BY LIMITING THE AMOUNT OF 01:48:39.913 --> 01:48:41.047 COMPUTING POWER THAT AI 01:48:41.114 --> 01:48:42.482 COMPANIES ARE PERMITTED TO 01:48:42.549 --> 01:48:44.050 SPEND ON AUTOMATED AI RESEARCH 01:48:44.117 --> 01:48:46.419 AND DEVELOPMENT TASKS. THE GOAL 01:48:46.486 --> 01:48:48.221 IS TO PREVENT RECURSIVE 01:48:48.288 --> 01:48:49.222 SELF-IMPROVEMENT UNTIL WE CAN 01:48:49.289 --> 01:48:50.357 BE MORE CONFIDENT THAT WE KNOW 01:48:50.423 --> 01:48:52.292 HOW TO DEAL WITH IT, WHICH IS 01:48:52.359 --> 01:48:53.560 WHAT MANY OF THE COMPANIES CEOS 01:48:53.627 --> 01:48:55.228 HAVE CALLED FOR THEMSELVES AND 01:48:55.295 --> 01:48:56.229 WHAT THOUSANDS OF THEIR 01:48:56.296 --> 01:48:57.564 EMPLOYEES HAVE SIGNED A LETTER 01:48:57.631 --> 01:48:59.733 SAYING IT WAS NECESSARY. SO 01:48:59.799 --> 01:49:01.268 THANK YOU. AND WITH THAT, I'M 01:49:01.334 --> 01:49:11.945 HAPPY TO TURN IT OVER. SHOULD I 01:49:12.012 --> 01:49:13.780 GO AHEAD AND START? OKAY. ARE 01:49:13.847 --> 01:49:16.283 MY SLIDES AVAILABLE? OKAY. 01:49:16.349 --> 01:49:18.485 THANK YOU. WHILE I'M WAITING. 01:49:18.551 --> 01:49:19.886 THANKS FOR HAVING ME. I'M 01:49:19.953 --> 01:49:21.755 DOCTOR JEN KING. I'M A 01:49:21.821 --> 01:49:22.956 RESEARCHER AT STANFORD. 01:49:23.023 --> 01:49:24.224 ALTHOUGH I'M A PROUD UC 01:49:24.291 --> 01:49:25.926 BERKELEY PHD GRADUATE AS WELL. 01:49:25.992 --> 01:49:31.064 SO GO BEARS. AND GIVEN THAT MY 01:49:31.131 --> 01:49:32.766 NORMAL OR MAIN FOCUS OF 01:49:32.832 --> 01:49:33.800 RESEARCH IS DATA PRIVACY, I 01:49:33.867 --> 01:49:35.035 REALLY APPRECIATE BEING BEFORE 01:49:35.101 --> 01:49:37.537 THIS COMMITTEE IN PARTICULAR, 01:49:37.604 --> 01:49:41.174 AS SO MUCH OF MY WORK AS 01:49:41.241 --> 01:49:42.976 SENATOR KAPLAN'S EARLIER 01:49:43.043 --> 01:49:44.778 REMARKS WERE, YOU WERE GAVE AT 01:49:44.844 --> 01:49:46.379 THE BEGINNING REALLY HIGHLIGHT 01:49:46.446 --> 01:49:48.014 A LOT OF THE TYPE OF WORK I DO 01:49:48.081 --> 01:49:49.983 IN TERMS OF LOOKING AT THINGS 01:49:50.050 --> 01:49:50.917 LIKE PRIVACY POLICIES AND 01:49:50.984 --> 01:49:51.985 NOTICE AND CONSENT AND ALL 01:49:52.052 --> 01:49:53.420 THOSE DIFFERENT FACTORS THAT WE 01:49:53.486 --> 01:49:54.854 THINK ABOUT IN THE CONSUMER 01:49:54.921 --> 01:49:57.691 PRIVACY SPACE. SORRY, DO WE ARE 01:49:57.757 --> 01:50:16.743 THEY UP? I DON'T SEE THEM YET. 01:50:26.586 --> 01:50:44.938 HOUSE. YEAH. YOU'RE GOOD. 01:50:49.943 --> 01:50:50.610 SORRY. 01:50:50.677 --> 01:51:04.591 NO, IT'S. IT DOESN'T WANT TO 01:51:04.657 --> 01:51:33.820 SHARE. SHARED. THINGS LIKE. 01:51:33.887 --> 01:51:49.969 YEAH. 01:52:28.241 --> 01:52:30.343 SO THEY ARE COMING. THEY 01:52:30.410 --> 01:52:33.279 MIGHT BE A BIT OF A DELAY. SO I 01:52:33.346 --> 01:52:34.981 WANTED TO SEE IF I CAN INVITE 01:52:35.048 --> 01:52:36.783 YOU TO BEGIN. SURE. WITHOUT THE 01:52:36.850 --> 01:52:38.284 SLIDES. AND WE EXPECT THAT THEY 01:52:38.351 --> 01:52:42.222 WILL JOIN US SOON. OKAY. SO 01:52:42.288 --> 01:52:43.656 AGAIN THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME 01:52:43.723 --> 01:52:47.293 HERE TODAY. MY, I JUST WANTED 01:52:47.360 --> 01:52:48.928 TO MAKE A FEW BRIEF REMARKS 01:52:48.995 --> 01:52:51.965 BEFORE WE HEAD INTO OUR LARGER 01:52:52.031 --> 01:52:55.201 SESSION. IN TERMS OF THINKING 01:52:55.268 --> 01:52:56.269 ACROSS THE DIFFERENT 01:52:56.336 --> 01:52:58.037 PRESENTATIONS WE'VE SEEN TODAY, 01:52:58.104 --> 01:52:59.272 THERE'S A LOT OF THREADS THAT 01:52:59.339 --> 01:53:01.040 I'LL PICK UP ON AND INCLUDING 01:53:01.107 --> 01:53:02.509 YOUR OPENING REMARKS. THE MAIN. 01:53:02.575 --> 01:53:04.077 THE POINT I WANTED TO BEGIN 01:53:04.144 --> 01:53:07.447 WITH, SHOULD MY SLIDES REAPPEAR, 01:53:07.514 --> 01:53:10.049 IS HOW CRUCIAL CYBERSECURITY IS 01:53:10.116 --> 01:53:11.451 TO ALL OF THE DISCUSSIONS WE'RE 01:53:11.518 --> 01:53:15.688 HAVING TODAY. IN PARTICULAR, I 01:53:15.755 --> 01:53:16.890 THINK YOU'VE HEARD MANY THREADS 01:53:16.956 --> 01:53:19.292 OF THAT, THAT HERE WE GO. AND I 01:53:19.359 --> 01:53:20.793 THINK SPECIFICALLY, WHEN WE 01:53:20.860 --> 01:53:22.929 TALK ABOUT THESE RISK ISSUES 01:53:22.996 --> 01:53:24.697 AND THE CONCERNS WE HAVE ABOUT 01:53:24.764 --> 01:53:26.866 AI POTENTIALLY HARMING HUMANITY, 01:53:26.933 --> 01:53:28.034 I THINK IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT 01:53:28.101 --> 01:53:29.402 TO TALK THROUGH HOW WE ACTUALLY 01:53:29.469 --> 01:53:31.905 CONNECT THOSE THREATS TO THAT 01:53:31.971 --> 01:53:34.040 OUTCOME. AND SO REALLY WHAT 01:53:34.107 --> 01:53:35.175 WE'RE THINKING ABOUT IN 01:53:35.241 --> 01:53:36.643 PARTICULAR IS THE FACT THAT I 01:53:36.709 --> 01:53:38.077 THINK YOU'VE HEARD JUST FROM MY 01:53:38.144 --> 01:53:39.479 MY FELLOW PANELISTS, YOU KNOW, 01:53:39.546 --> 01:53:41.314 WE HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT AI'S 01:53:41.381 --> 01:53:43.082 ACCESS TO CRITICAL PUBLIC 01:53:43.149 --> 01:53:44.517 INFRASTRUCTURE, BUT ALSO, AGAIN, 01:53:44.584 --> 01:53:45.852 CRITICAL PRIVATE INFRASTRUCTURE 01:53:45.919 --> 01:53:48.488 AS WELL. AND I THINK ONE OF THE 01:53:48.555 --> 01:53:50.290 POINTS I REALLY LIKE TO MAKE, I 01:53:50.356 --> 01:53:51.724 WORKED IN INDUSTRY FOR SEVEN 01:53:51.791 --> 01:53:53.126 YEARS BEFORE TRANSITIONING OVER 01:53:53.193 --> 01:53:55.361 TO ACADEMIA, BOTH FOR INTERNET 01:53:55.428 --> 01:53:57.130 STARTUPS, FOR LARGER INTERNET 01:53:57.197 --> 01:53:58.565 COMPANIES. I WORKED IN DATA 01:53:58.631 --> 01:53:59.365 SECURITY AND IN THE FIELD WE 01:53:59.432 --> 01:54:01.267 NOW KNOW IS TRUST AND SAFETY. 01:54:01.334 --> 01:54:03.136 AND I REALLY WANT TO MAKE THE 01:54:03.203 --> 01:54:04.337 POINT THAT I THINK WE'VE KIND 01:54:04.404 --> 01:54:06.206 OF ALLUDED TO IT. AND I THINK 01:54:06.272 --> 01:54:07.173 YOU'VE MENTIONED EARLIER IN 01:54:07.240 --> 01:54:08.241 YOUR OPENING STATEMENT ABOUT 01:54:08.308 --> 01:54:09.309 OUR COWBOY CULTURE HERE IN THE 01:54:09.375 --> 01:54:11.144 WEST, BUT THE SILICON VALLEY 01:54:11.211 --> 01:54:12.245 STARTUP CULTURE IS JUST NOT A 01:54:12.312 --> 01:54:14.013 CULTURE OF SAFETY WHATSOEVER. 01:54:14.080 --> 01:54:15.448 AND I CAN TELL THAT TELL YOU 01:54:15.515 --> 01:54:17.350 THAT AS HAVING WORKED ON THE 01:54:17.417 --> 01:54:18.718 GROUND THERE FOR 20 YEARS OR 20 01:54:18.785 --> 01:54:21.254 YEARS AGO, WORKING SPECIFICALLY 01:54:21.321 --> 01:54:22.755 ON TRUST AND SAFETY ISSUES LIKE 01:54:22.822 --> 01:54:24.490 THIS IS NOT AN INDUSTRY THAT 01:54:24.557 --> 01:54:27.727 REWARDS SAFETY AT ALL. SO I 01:54:27.794 --> 01:54:29.295 THINK A LOT OF THE CONCERNS 01:54:29.362 --> 01:54:31.331 YOU'RE HEARING HERE ARE 01:54:31.397 --> 01:54:32.498 REFLECTED IN THE FACT THAT THIS 01:54:32.565 --> 01:54:34.334 IS JUST REALLY KIND OF A 01:54:34.400 --> 01:54:35.401 FOREIGN LANGUAGE, I THINK, TO 01:54:35.468 --> 01:54:36.669 MOST OF THE COMPANIES THAT ARE 01:54:36.736 --> 01:54:38.338 BUILDING THIS TECHNOLOGY. AND I 01:54:38.404 --> 01:54:39.505 THINK THAT'S A REALLY IMPORTANT 01:54:39.572 --> 01:54:41.007 THING TO CONSIDER AS WE THINK 01:54:41.074 --> 01:54:42.508 ABOUT OPTIONS FOR HOW WE 01:54:42.575 --> 01:54:43.910 POTENTIALLY REGULATE THIS SPACE, 01:54:43.977 --> 01:54:45.712 IS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT 01:54:45.778 --> 01:54:47.513 COMPANIES THAT HAVE NO 01:54:47.580 --> 01:54:48.514 EXPERIENCE IN REALLY THINKING 01:54:48.581 --> 01:54:50.016 ABOUT CRITICAL SYSTEMS, IN 01:54:50.083 --> 01:54:51.784 MAKING THINGS RESILIENT, AND 01:54:51.851 --> 01:54:53.186 MAKING CODE THAT YOU MIGHT 01:54:53.253 --> 01:54:54.387 BUILD ON EVEN, YOU KNOW, FIVE 01:54:54.454 --> 01:54:56.856 YEARS FROM NOW. AND I THINK 01:54:56.923 --> 01:54:58.324 UNDERSTANDING THAT THAT KIND OF 01:54:58.391 --> 01:54:59.993 FATAL FLAW, I THINK IN THE 01:55:00.059 --> 01:55:00.994 COMPANIES THAT ARE BUILDING 01:55:01.060 --> 01:55:02.095 THIS TECHNOLOGY AND THE FACT 01:55:02.161 --> 01:55:03.997 THAT A LOT OF THEM TOO ARE 01:55:04.063 --> 01:55:04.564 CIRCULATING EXECUTIVES THAT 01:55:04.631 --> 01:55:05.999 WE'VE SEEN AT OTHER LARGE 01:55:06.065 --> 01:55:07.066 COMPANIES THAT DON'T HAVE THE 01:55:07.133 --> 01:55:08.368 BEST SAFETY TRACK RECORDS 01:55:08.434 --> 01:55:11.271 EITHER, REALLY, I THINK, SHEDS 01:55:11.337 --> 01:55:12.405 LIGHT ON THE CONCERNS THAT WE 01:55:12.472 --> 01:55:14.007 HAVE ABOUT JUST HOW QUICKLY 01:55:14.073 --> 01:55:15.074 THEY'RE ALL GOING AND HOW 01:55:15.141 --> 01:55:16.309 LITTLE UNDERSTANDING THEY HAVE 01:55:16.376 --> 01:55:17.744 ABOUT THE SAFETY 01:55:17.810 --> 01:55:20.647 RESPONSIBILITIES. THEY ARE KIND 01:55:20.713 --> 01:55:21.848 OF DEMANDING THAT WE GIVE THEM, 01:55:21.914 --> 01:55:23.149 GIVEN WHAT THEY ARE CLAIMING 01:55:23.216 --> 01:55:26.386 THEIR TECHNOLOGY CAN DO NEXT. I 01:55:26.452 --> 01:55:28.187 JUST WANTED TO KIND OF, AGAIN, 01:55:28.254 --> 01:55:29.989 CIRCLE BACK TO SOME OF THE REAL 01:55:30.056 --> 01:55:30.857 CONCRETE RISKS THAT WE'RE 01:55:30.923 --> 01:55:32.925 DEALING WITH TODAY AND THIS 01:55:32.992 --> 01:55:33.960 SLIDE, AND I'M SORRY, I DIDN'T 01:55:34.027 --> 01:55:35.495 REALIZE YOU WOULDN'T HAVE KIND 01:55:35.561 --> 01:55:37.897 OF THE FULL VIEW OF THE SLIDES. 01:55:37.964 --> 01:55:40.066 THIS IS FROM STANFORD'S AI 01:55:40.133 --> 01:55:42.235 INDEX. THIS IS JUST THE BAR 01:55:42.302 --> 01:55:43.670 GRAPH IS DISCUSSING THE 01:55:43.736 --> 01:55:44.737 PERCENTAGE OF ORGANIZATIONS 01:55:44.804 --> 01:55:46.906 THAT ARE INFLUENCED BY AI 01:55:46.973 --> 01:55:48.308 REGULATIONS THAT IMPACT AI 01:55:48.374 --> 01:55:50.143 DECISION MAKING. AND IF YOU CAN 01:55:50.209 --> 01:55:52.045 SEE AT THE VERY TOP, YOU KNOW, 01:55:52.111 --> 01:55:54.914 THE TWO INTERNATIONAL LAWS THAT 01:55:54.981 --> 01:55:57.383 HAVE THE MOST IMPACT ARE THE EU 01:55:57.450 --> 01:55:58.785 GENERAL DATA PROTECTION 01:55:58.851 --> 01:56:00.253 REGULATION, THE GDPR, AND THE 01:56:00.320 --> 01:56:01.754 EU AI ACT, JUST TO SAY THAT, 01:56:01.821 --> 01:56:04.657 AND THIS IS FROM 2025. BUT JUST 01:56:04.724 --> 01:56:06.192 TO SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, THE 01:56:06.259 --> 01:56:07.193 EUROPEANS REALLY ARE LEADING 01:56:07.260 --> 01:56:09.595 THE PACK IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, 01:56:09.662 --> 01:56:10.697 REGULATION THAT ACTUALLY 01:56:10.763 --> 01:56:12.265 IMPACTS HOW THESE COMPANIES 01:56:12.332 --> 01:56:14.267 MAKE DECISIONS. AND IN TERMS OF 01:56:14.334 --> 01:56:15.501 THE TYPES OF RISKS THAT WE'RE 01:56:15.568 --> 01:56:16.469 THINKING ABOUT TODAY, IN 01:56:16.536 --> 01:56:18.338 ADDITION TO ALL OF THE KIND OF 01:56:18.404 --> 01:56:19.472 LARGER SCALE HARMS THAT WE'VE 01:56:19.539 --> 01:56:21.207 BEEN DISCUSSING SO FAR. YOU 01:56:21.274 --> 01:56:22.308 KNOW, FIRST, THE LIST FOR ME, 01:56:22.375 --> 01:56:24.210 OF COURSE, IS DATA PRIVACY AND 01:56:24.277 --> 01:56:25.311 OF COURSE, THE REMIT OF THIS 01:56:25.378 --> 01:56:26.446 COMMITTEE. WE'RE SEEING ALREADY 01:56:26.512 --> 01:56:28.681 KIND OF THE SAME EXTENSION OF 01:56:28.748 --> 01:56:30.149 INDIVIDUAL PROFILING THAT WE'VE 01:56:30.216 --> 01:56:31.250 SEEN ACROSS THE INTERNET FOR 01:56:31.317 --> 01:56:34.087 THE PAST 20 YEARS. EVEN MORE 01:56:34.153 --> 01:56:35.321 SENSITIVE DATA BEING COLLECTED 01:56:35.388 --> 01:56:38.391 FROM CONSUMERS THROUGH AI 01:56:38.458 --> 01:56:39.492 INTERACTIONS. WE'VE HEARD 01:56:39.559 --> 01:56:41.294 DISCUSSIONS OF SURVEILLANCE. 01:56:41.361 --> 01:56:43.796 AND I THINK IN LIGHT OF US 01:56:43.863 --> 01:56:45.698 HAVING THE AUTHOR OF THE DELETE 01:56:45.765 --> 01:56:47.400 ACT HERE, WE KNOW, FOR EXAMPLE, 01:56:47.467 --> 01:56:48.835 THAT DATA BROKERS ARE ALSO 01:56:48.901 --> 01:56:51.404 SELLING DATA TO AI COMPANIES, 01:56:51.471 --> 01:56:52.472 ALTHOUGH, AGAIN, WE HAVE VERY 01:56:52.538 --> 01:56:53.473 LITTLE TRANSPARENCY ABOUT WHAT 01:56:53.539 --> 01:56:55.341 THAT LOOKS LIKE. SO JUST TO SAY 01:56:55.408 --> 01:56:57.844 THAT THE SAME CONSUMER PRIVACY 01:56:57.910 --> 01:56:59.679 CONCERNS THAT WE'VE HAD FOR 15 01:56:59.746 --> 01:57:01.147 PLUS YEARS NOW ARE BEGINNING TO 01:57:01.214 --> 01:57:03.082 PLAY OUT IN THIS SPACE AS WELL 01:57:03.149 --> 01:57:05.518 FOR CONSUMERS, OF COURSE, YOU 01:57:05.585 --> 01:57:06.686 ARE ALL PROBABLY LARGELY AWARE 01:57:06.753 --> 01:57:07.820 OF THESE DIFFERENT HARMS THAT 01:57:07.887 --> 01:57:09.455 I'LL GO THROUGH VERY QUICKLY. 01:57:09.522 --> 01:57:10.656 WE KNOW, OF COURSE, THAT THERE 01:57:10.723 --> 01:57:11.824 HAVE BEEN REALLY PSYCHOLOGICAL 01:57:11.891 --> 01:57:13.359 EMOTIONAL HARMS FROM PEOPLE'S 01:57:13.426 --> 01:57:15.161 INTERACTIONS WITH AI, CHATBOTS, 01:57:15.228 --> 01:57:16.763 PSYCHOSIS, SUICIDAL IDEATION. 01:57:16.829 --> 01:57:18.598 I'M A PARENT OF TWO TEENS, SO 01:57:18.664 --> 01:57:19.866 THIS IS A VERY RELEVANT ISSUE 01:57:19.932 --> 01:57:21.667 FOR ME IN TERMS OF MY KIDS 01:57:21.734 --> 01:57:23.403 EXPERIENCE WITH AI. AND AGAIN, 01:57:23.469 --> 01:57:24.871 IN THE EDUCATION SPACE, THAT 01:57:24.937 --> 01:57:26.706 LOSS OF AGENCY, THAT KIND OF 01:57:26.773 --> 01:57:27.573 OFFSHORING, CRITICAL THOUGHT, 01:57:27.640 --> 01:57:28.808 THESE ARE ALL THINGS THAT WE'RE 01:57:28.875 --> 01:57:30.977 ALL CONCERNED ABOUT IN THE 01:57:31.043 --> 01:57:32.412 CONSUMER SPACE. YOU KNOW, 01:57:32.478 --> 01:57:33.079 OBVIOUSLY, CONCERNS ABOUT 01:57:33.146 --> 01:57:34.914 UNFAIR PRICING, SURVEILLANCE, 01:57:34.981 --> 01:57:37.450 PRICING. I WORK A LOT ON DESIGN 01:57:37.517 --> 01:57:37.984 MANIPULATIONS, LOOKING AT 01:57:38.050 --> 01:57:39.352 THINGS LIKE DARK PATTERNS AND 01:57:39.419 --> 01:57:41.854 HOW PEOPLE MAY BE MISLED BY THE 01:57:41.921 --> 01:57:43.389 DESIGN OF THESE FEATURES. AND 01:57:43.456 --> 01:57:46.092 OF COURSE, WE ARE SEEING A HUGE 01:57:46.159 --> 01:57:48.194 INCREASE IN FRAUD ENABLED BY AI 01:57:48.261 --> 01:57:50.129 THAT IS IMPACTING PEOPLE ACROSS 01:57:50.196 --> 01:57:52.532 THE COUNTRY. AND OF COURSE, 01:57:52.598 --> 01:57:54.033 BIAS AND DISCRIMINATION. WE SAW 01:57:54.100 --> 01:57:57.203 A LOT OF FOCUS ON THOSE ISSUES 01:57:57.270 --> 01:57:58.671 SEVERAL YEARS AGO WITH THE 01:57:58.738 --> 01:58:00.373 ADVENT OF AI. OF COURSE, WE 01:58:00.440 --> 01:58:01.607 DON'T SEE AS MUCH TALKED ABOUT 01:58:01.674 --> 01:58:02.642 THAT LATELY, BUT OF COURSE, 01:58:02.708 --> 01:58:04.544 NONE OF THAT HAS GONE AWAY. YOU 01:58:04.610 --> 01:58:05.745 KNOW, THE CONCERNS ABOUT UNFAIR 01:58:05.812 --> 01:58:06.813 AND UNEQUAL TREATMENT, UNFAIR 01:58:06.879 --> 01:58:08.448 OUTCOMES, AND TO THE EXTENT TO 01:58:08.514 --> 01:58:09.549 WHICH WE DELEGATE DECISION 01:58:09.615 --> 01:58:11.384 MAKING TO AI, HOW BIAS MAY BE 01:58:11.451 --> 01:58:14.554 PART OF THAT, THAT SITUATION 01:58:14.620 --> 01:58:15.721 QUICKLY. JUST I WANT TO TALK 01:58:15.788 --> 01:58:17.423 ABOUT AGAIN. WE'VE HEARD AGAIN 01:58:17.490 --> 01:58:19.192 AND AGAIN TODAY QUESTIONS ABOUT 01:58:19.258 --> 01:58:20.526 TRANSPARENCY AND AUDITABILITY. 01:58:20.593 --> 01:58:22.795 THIS IS ALSO, I THINK, JUST SO 01:58:22.862 --> 01:58:25.665 CRUCIAL. THIS SLIDE IS THIS 01:58:25.731 --> 01:58:27.800 FEATURES A PARTIAL LIST OF SOME 01:58:27.867 --> 01:58:30.703 OF THE TRANSPARENCY INDEX 01:58:30.770 --> 01:58:31.804 INDICATORS DEVELOPED BY MY 01:58:31.871 --> 01:58:34.006 COLLEAGUES AT STANFORD, THE AI 01:58:34.073 --> 01:58:35.775 FOUNDATION MODEL TRANSPARENCY 01:58:35.842 --> 01:58:37.577 INDEX. THE POINT I JUST WANT TO 01:58:37.643 --> 01:58:39.745 MAKE IS THAT THERE'S A MUCH 01:58:39.812 --> 01:58:40.880 BROADER SET OF THINGS HERE TO 01:58:40.947 --> 01:58:42.215 BE CONCERNED ABOUT THAN JUST 01:58:42.281 --> 01:58:44.417 PURELY SAFETY. FOR EXAMPLE, 01:58:44.484 --> 01:58:46.018 AGAIN, AS A PRIVACY RESEARCHER, 01:58:46.085 --> 01:58:47.653 I'M VERY CONCERNED ABOUT WHAT 01:58:47.720 --> 01:58:49.088 MY COLLEAGUES CALL THE UPSTREAM 01:58:49.155 --> 01:58:50.490 RISK. SO AGAIN, TRYING TO 01:58:50.556 --> 01:58:52.325 UNDERSTAND WHERE THE DATA COMES 01:58:52.391 --> 01:58:53.726 FROM THAT IS BEING SOURCED FOR 01:58:53.793 --> 01:58:55.194 THESE MODELS. AS I MENTIONED 01:58:55.261 --> 01:58:56.262 EARLIER, WE'RE SEEING DATA 01:58:56.329 --> 01:58:57.864 BROKERS BEGIN TO GET BECOME 01:58:57.930 --> 01:58:59.131 PART OF THAT PROCESS. WE'RE 01:58:59.198 --> 01:59:00.967 SEEING KIND OF AN AI SUPPLY 01:59:01.033 --> 01:59:02.869 CHAIN BEGIN TO EMERGE THAT IS 01:59:02.935 --> 01:59:03.870 MUCH DIFFERENT THAN WHAT WE 01:59:03.936 --> 01:59:05.338 WERE EVEN THINKING WAS 01:59:05.404 --> 01:59:07.039 OCCURRING A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO. 01:59:07.106 --> 01:59:08.841 WE HAVE VERY LITTLE 01:59:08.908 --> 01:59:10.309 TRANSPARENCY INTO THAT WHOLE 01:59:10.376 --> 01:59:13.112 SPACE. AND SIMILARLY, I THINK A 01:59:13.179 --> 01:59:14.313 LOT OF WHAT YOU'VE HEARD TODAY 01:59:14.380 --> 01:59:16.249 IS A FOCUS ON WHAT THE MIDDLE 01:59:16.315 --> 01:59:17.350 COLUMN HERE IS HERE ON THIS 01:59:17.416 --> 01:59:19.118 SLIDE, THE MODEL, LIKE TRYING 01:59:19.185 --> 01:59:20.253 TO UNDERSTAND THE MODEL ITSELF, 01:59:20.319 --> 01:59:22.221 ITS BLACK BOX PROPERTIES, HOW 01:59:22.288 --> 01:59:23.322 THESE THINGS ACTUALLY WORK, HOW 01:59:23.389 --> 01:59:24.724 DO THEY ARRIVE AT THE DECISIONS 01:59:24.790 --> 01:59:25.892 THEY MAKE? I THINK THAT'S BEEN 01:59:25.958 --> 01:59:27.760 THE FOCUS OF A LOT OF THE WORK 01:59:27.827 --> 01:59:29.562 OF METER, FOR EXAMPLE, AND 01:59:29.629 --> 01:59:30.663 TRYING TO UNDERSTAND HOW THESE 01:59:30.730 --> 01:59:31.664 DIFFERENT INCIDENTS THAT WE'VE 01:59:31.731 --> 01:59:32.665 TALKED ABOUT TODAY HAVE 01:59:32.732 --> 01:59:33.733 OCCURRED. BUT YOU ALSO HAVE 01:59:33.799 --> 01:59:36.068 THESE DOWNSTREAM EVALUATIONS 01:59:36.135 --> 01:59:38.037 THAT, AGAIN, AS A RESEARCHER, A 01:59:38.104 --> 01:59:40.206 LOT OF WHAT I DO IS TRYING TO 01:59:40.273 --> 01:59:41.674 STUDY THESE SYSTEMS FROM THE 01:59:41.741 --> 01:59:43.342 OUTSIDE. AND SO I DON'T GET TO 01:59:43.409 --> 01:59:44.610 LOOK INSIDE AT ALL. I DON'T 01:59:44.677 --> 01:59:46.712 HAVE THAT TYPE OF ACCESS. BUT 01:59:46.779 --> 01:59:48.481 OUR ABILITY TO REALLY EVALUATE 01:59:48.548 --> 01:59:49.749 KIND OF THE DOWNSTREAM EFFECTS, 01:59:49.815 --> 01:59:51.183 WHAT ARE THE OUTPUTS? HOW ARE 01:59:51.250 --> 01:59:52.418 PEOPLE EXPERIENCING THESE 01:59:52.485 --> 01:59:53.853 THINGS? WHAT ARE THEY TELLING 01:59:53.920 --> 01:59:55.354 CONSUMERS? WHAT IS CHATBOT 01:59:55.421 --> 01:59:56.389 PSYCHOSIS LOOK LIKE IN THE 01:59:56.455 --> 01:59:59.258 FIELD? THOSE ARE THINGS, AGAIN, 01:59:59.325 --> 02:00:01.861 THAT IF WE HAD A BROADER 02:00:01.928 --> 02:00:03.629 UNDERSTANDING AND THE ABILITY 02:00:03.696 --> 02:00:05.398 FOR KIND OF HAVING A BETTER 02:00:05.464 --> 02:00:06.866 SENSE OF WHAT GOES INTO THESE 02:00:06.933 --> 02:00:08.701 MODELS, WHAT THEY'RE TRAINED ON, 02:00:08.768 --> 02:00:09.835 IN ADDITION TO, OF COURSE, 02:00:09.902 --> 02:00:11.170 WHAT'S GOING ON BEHIND THE 02:00:11.237 --> 02:00:12.838 SCENES AND THEIR ABILITY TO BE 02:00:12.905 --> 02:00:15.474 AUDITED, THAT WOULD BE A HUGE 02:00:15.541 --> 02:00:16.909 THAT WOULD HAVE HUGE IMPACTS. 02:00:16.976 --> 02:00:18.377 NOT AGAIN, JUST FOR THESE 02:00:18.444 --> 02:00:19.779 SECURITY AND SAFETY ISSUES THAT 02:00:19.845 --> 02:00:21.247 WE'VE TALKED ABOUT TODAY. BUT 02:00:21.314 --> 02:00:22.982 ALSO, I THINK FOR A LOT OF THE 02:00:23.049 --> 02:00:24.183 OTHER TYPES OF HARMS THAT WE 02:00:24.250 --> 02:00:26.619 ARE CONCERNED ABOUT. AND THEN 02:00:26.686 --> 02:00:28.821 FINALLY, I JUST WANT TO CLOSE 02:00:28.888 --> 02:00:30.957 WITH TALKING A LITTLE BIT ABOUT 02:00:31.023 --> 02:00:32.391 AGENTIC AI. WE'VE ALREADY, 02:00:32.458 --> 02:00:33.459 AGAIN, HEARD SEVERAL THEMES 02:00:33.526 --> 02:00:36.028 ABOUT THAT TODAY. AND I THINK 02:00:36.095 --> 02:00:37.330 THE INTERESTING THING ABOUT IT 02:00:37.396 --> 02:00:38.864 IS THAT IT REALLY POTENTIALLY 02:00:38.931 --> 02:00:40.333 HAS A LOT OF GREAT POTENTIAL 02:00:40.399 --> 02:00:42.468 AND POSSIBILITIES FOR CONSUMERS, 02:00:42.535 --> 02:00:43.903 WHILE ALSO HAVING REALLY 02:00:43.970 --> 02:00:45.705 SIGNIFICANT RISKS TO THE PUBLIC 02:00:45.771 --> 02:00:47.873 AND SO ON. THE POSITIVE ANGLE, 02:00:47.940 --> 02:00:49.742 YOU KNOW, IF WE WERE ABLE TO 02:00:49.809 --> 02:00:51.844 HAVE OUR OWN AI AGENTS THAT, 02:00:51.911 --> 02:00:53.613 YOU KNOW, DID THINGS FOR US IN 02:00:53.679 --> 02:00:55.448 THE WORLD, IT COULD MAKE 02:00:55.514 --> 02:00:56.148 TECHNOLOGY BROADLY MORE 02:00:56.215 --> 02:00:58.050 ACCESSIBLE TO CONSUMERS. YOU 02:00:58.117 --> 02:01:00.119 COULD MAKE IT MORE CUSTOMIZABLE. 02:01:00.186 --> 02:01:01.621 IT COULD POTENTIALLY INCREASE 02:01:01.687 --> 02:01:03.055 PEOPLE'S PRODUCTIVITY. SO IT'S 02:01:03.122 --> 02:01:05.858 NOT NECESSARILY ALL BAD. BUT I 02:01:05.925 --> 02:01:06.759 THINK YOU'VE HEARD ALREADY 02:01:06.826 --> 02:01:08.027 ABOUT SOME OF THE NEGATIVES, 02:01:08.094 --> 02:01:09.095 INCLUDING FROM MY FELLOW 02:01:09.161 --> 02:01:10.529 PANELISTS TODAY. YOU KNOW, WE 02:01:10.596 --> 02:01:11.998 HAVE REAL SUSTAINED PRIVACY AND 02:01:12.064 --> 02:01:14.500 SECURITY RISKS, ESPECIALLY, 02:01:14.567 --> 02:01:15.534 AGAIN, AS THE SENATOR WAS 02:01:15.601 --> 02:01:17.470 TALKING EARLIER ABOUT MUSE. YOU 02:01:17.536 --> 02:01:19.205 KNOW, THE THE AMOUNT OF ACCESS 02:01:19.271 --> 02:01:21.073 THAT A TOOL LIKE MUSE NEEDS TO 02:01:21.140 --> 02:01:23.142 YOUR PERSONAL DATA IS, IS, YOU 02:01:23.209 --> 02:01:26.412 KNOW, BOUNDLESS, ESSENTIALLY 02:01:26.479 --> 02:01:28.247 THE LACK OF ACCOUNTABILITY AND 02:01:28.314 --> 02:01:29.682 LIABILITY WITH THESE AGENTS. 02:01:29.749 --> 02:01:31.083 I'M NOT A LAWYER, SO I WILL 02:01:31.150 --> 02:01:32.551 TREAD CAREFULLY ON QUESTIONS OF 02:01:32.618 --> 02:01:34.320 LIABILITY. BUT JUST THE FACT 02:01:34.387 --> 02:01:35.755 THAT AGAIN, RIGHT NOW WE HAVE 02:01:35.821 --> 02:01:37.356 NO WAY OF TRACKING AI AGENTS. 02:01:37.423 --> 02:01:38.724 YOU KNOW, IF YOU LET THEM LOOSE 02:01:38.791 --> 02:01:40.493 ON THE INTERNET, YOU KNOW, HOW 02:01:40.559 --> 02:01:42.428 DO YOU KNOW AN AGENT BELONGS TO 02:01:42.495 --> 02:01:43.496 A PARTICULAR DEVELOPER? HOW ARE 02:01:43.562 --> 02:01:44.764 YOU ABLE TO RECALL THESE THINGS 02:01:44.830 --> 02:01:46.699 IF THEY KIND OF ESCAPE? THERE'S 02:01:46.766 --> 02:01:48.334 SUCH A SEVERE LACK OF POTENTIAL 02:01:48.401 --> 02:01:50.102 CONTROL AND AUDITABILITY IN 02:01:50.169 --> 02:01:51.137 TERMS OF UNDERSTANDING WHAT 02:01:51.203 --> 02:01:52.304 DECISIONS THEY MAKE, HOW WE 02:01:52.371 --> 02:01:55.341 AUDIT THOSE CHOICES, WHAT TYPES 02:01:55.408 --> 02:01:56.976 OF KIND OF FIDUCIARY DUTIES 02:01:57.043 --> 02:01:58.477 THEY MAY HAVE, OR THAT WE MIGHT 02:01:58.544 --> 02:02:00.246 WANT TO REQUIRE THAT THEY HAVE 02:02:00.312 --> 02:02:01.681 BEFORE THEY TAKE ACTIONS ON 02:02:01.747 --> 02:02:03.416 BEHALF OF CONSUMERS. I HAVE A 02:02:03.482 --> 02:02:04.517 POLICY BRIEF TALKING ABOUT THIS 02:02:04.583 --> 02:02:05.584 THAT I PUBLISHED RECENTLY. 02:02:05.651 --> 02:02:07.420 THESE ARE ALL DIFFERENT AREAS 02:02:07.486 --> 02:02:08.521 TO THINK ABOUT WHEN WE THINK 02:02:08.587 --> 02:02:10.723 ABOUT JUST EVEN THE AI, AI 02:02:10.790 --> 02:02:12.124 SPACE IN PARTICULAR. AND I 02:02:12.191 --> 02:02:13.926 WOULD ARGUE THAT TODAY, IN MANY 02:02:13.993 --> 02:02:15.294 CONTEXTS, THE RISKS REALLY 02:02:15.361 --> 02:02:17.530 OUTWEIGH THE BENEFITS AND THAT 02:02:17.596 --> 02:02:18.964 BOTH COMPANIES AND EVEN 02:02:19.031 --> 02:02:19.999 INDIVIDUAL CONSUMERS SHOULD 02:02:20.066 --> 02:02:21.267 REALLY TREAD CAREFULLY BEFORE 02:02:21.333 --> 02:02:22.535 THEY ADOPT THIS TECHNOLOGY. 02:02:22.601 --> 02:02:24.003 BECAUSE WE HAVE NO STANDARDS, 02:02:24.070 --> 02:02:25.438 WE HAVE NO TECHNICAL STANDARDS 02:02:25.504 --> 02:02:28.340 AROUND IT, AND WE DON'T HAVE 02:02:28.407 --> 02:02:29.775 REALLY ANY, ESPECIALLY ON THE 02:02:29.842 --> 02:02:31.143 PRIVACY SIDE, ANY GOOD DATA 02:02:31.210 --> 02:02:32.278 GUARANTEES ABOUT WHAT WILL 02:02:32.344 --> 02:02:33.646 HAPPEN WITH THE DATA THAT THESE 02:02:33.713 --> 02:02:35.114 AGENTS HAVE ACCESS TO. WITH 02:02:35.181 --> 02:02:36.615 THAT, I WILL TAKE YOUR 02:02:36.682 --> 02:02:38.017 QUESTIONS, OR WE CAN LEAD INTO 02:02:38.084 --> 02:02:40.152 THE NEXT PANEL. THANK YOU SO 02:02:40.219 --> 02:02:41.320 MUCH. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU BOTH. 02:02:41.387 --> 02:02:43.155 ARE THERE QUESTIONS FOR THIS 02:02:43.222 --> 02:02:45.257 PANEL IN PARTICULAR, SENATOR 02:02:45.324 --> 02:02:49.195 HOLMBERG? WELL, BACK TO MY 02:02:49.261 --> 02:02:50.629 QUESTIONS FROM FROM THE OUTSET, 02:02:50.696 --> 02:02:52.431 AND I APOLOGIZE FOR NOT BEING 02:02:52.498 --> 02:02:54.366 HERE FOR YOUR OPENING REMARKS. 02:02:54.433 --> 02:02:55.334 AND PERHAPS WE'VE ALREADY 02:02:55.401 --> 02:02:59.972 COVERED THIS AREA, BUT WE'RE A 02:03:00.039 --> 02:03:03.209 STATE. THERE ARE STATE ACTORS. 02:03:03.275 --> 02:03:05.745 THERE ARE INTERNATIONAL ACTORS. 02:03:05.811 --> 02:03:07.480 THERE ARE NON-GOVERNMENTAL 02:03:07.546 --> 02:03:10.783 ACTORS IN THIS SPACE, LET'S 02:03:10.850 --> 02:03:12.251 ASSUME, AND I THINK IT'S AN 02:03:12.318 --> 02:03:13.686 ACCURATE ASSUMPTION THAT WE 02:03:13.753 --> 02:03:16.155 WANT TO DO WHAT WE CAN TO 02:03:16.222 --> 02:03:18.691 CREATE GUIDELINES, GUARDRAILS, 02:03:18.758 --> 02:03:21.594 SAFEGUARDS, THAT KIND OF THING. 02:03:21.660 --> 02:03:24.864 BUT GIVEN THE FACT THAT THIS 02:03:24.930 --> 02:03:27.333 TECHNOLOGY IS UBIQUITOUS AND 02:03:27.399 --> 02:03:29.135 THAT DOESN'T REALLY KNOW 02:03:29.201 --> 02:03:31.337 BORDERS, HOW DO WE HERE IN 02:03:31.403 --> 02:03:33.172 CALIFORNIA, OTHER THAN JUST 02:03:33.239 --> 02:03:35.741 BEING IN THE VANGUARD, ADDRESS 02:03:35.808 --> 02:03:39.578 SOME OF THESE CONCERNS? SURE. 02:03:39.645 --> 02:03:41.413 YEAH. I THINK IT'S A FAIR 02:03:41.480 --> 02:03:43.616 QUESTION THAT WE PUT A LOT OF 02:03:43.682 --> 02:03:44.617 THOUGHT INTO. I THINK 02:03:44.683 --> 02:03:46.051 CALIFORNIA CERTAINLY HAS A 02:03:46.118 --> 02:03:47.820 UNIQUE ADVANTAGE OF BEING THE 02:03:47.887 --> 02:03:49.088 PLACE WHERE THE GREAT MAJORITY 02:03:49.155 --> 02:03:51.123 OF THESE FRONTIER AI COMPANIES 02:03:51.190 --> 02:03:53.659 ARE HOUSED. THE SAFETY 02:03:53.726 --> 02:03:55.094 INCIDENTS THAT WE SAW THIS 02:03:55.161 --> 02:03:56.529 SUMMER ALL HAPPENED IN THE 02:03:56.595 --> 02:04:00.099 UNITED STATES. AND THERE ARE, 02:04:00.166 --> 02:04:01.300 YOU KNOW, THE REGARDING THE 02:04:01.367 --> 02:04:03.302 ROGUE AI SWARMS AND HUGGING 02:04:03.369 --> 02:04:07.673 FACE, I THINK THE THERE IS 02:04:07.740 --> 02:04:09.842 UNCERTAINTY ABOUT JUST HOW FAR 02:04:09.909 --> 02:04:13.445 CHINA IS BEHIND US AND JUST 02:04:13.512 --> 02:04:14.580 WHETHER THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO 02:04:14.647 --> 02:04:16.448 ACTUALLY SURPASS US IF WE WERE 02:04:16.515 --> 02:04:17.883 TO PAUSE OR STOP. I THINK 02:04:17.950 --> 02:04:19.451 THERE'S SOME PEOPLE WHO USE THE 02:04:19.518 --> 02:04:21.387 ANALOGY OF, YOU KNOW, A BOAT 02:04:21.453 --> 02:04:22.788 PULLING A JET SKI WHERE, YOU 02:04:22.855 --> 02:04:24.023 KNOW, CHINA HAS A LONG HISTORY 02:04:24.089 --> 02:04:26.759 OF SOPHISTICATED IP THEFT THAT 02:04:26.826 --> 02:04:28.561 THEY MAY ACTUALLY BE KIND OF 02:04:28.627 --> 02:04:29.962 COPYING AND PIGGYBACKING OFF OF 02:04:30.029 --> 02:04:31.630 U.S. TECH INNOVATION TO SOME 02:04:31.697 --> 02:04:32.898 EXTENT, AND WOULD NOT 02:04:32.965 --> 02:04:34.033 NECESSARILY BE ABLE TO SURPASS 02:04:34.099 --> 02:04:36.135 US VERY QUICKLY IF WE WERE TOO 02:04:36.202 --> 02:04:39.405 SLOW. I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, 02:04:39.471 --> 02:04:41.006 AT THE STATE LEVEL, RIGHT, WE 02:04:41.073 --> 02:04:42.341 HAVE THANKFULLY SEEN STATES BE 02:04:42.408 --> 02:04:43.676 VERY DELIBERATE ABOUT 02:04:43.742 --> 02:04:44.577 HARMONIZING THEIR APPROACHES 02:04:44.643 --> 02:04:46.912 FROM ONE STATE TO THE NEXT AND 02:04:46.979 --> 02:04:47.980 ENSURING THAT EACH STATE CAN 02:04:48.047 --> 02:04:49.915 PICK UP WHERE THE LAST ONE LEFT 02:04:49.982 --> 02:04:51.383 OFF, SO THAT EACH STATE DOES 02:04:51.450 --> 02:04:53.152 NOT NEED TO RECREATE THE WHEEL 02:04:53.219 --> 02:04:55.187 AND CAN FOCUS ON ONE STEP AT A 02:04:55.254 --> 02:04:57.723 TIME AT THE NATIONAL LEVEL. 02:04:57.790 --> 02:04:59.992 RIGHT? I THINK I WOULDN'T HOLD 02:05:00.059 --> 02:05:01.227 YOUR BREATH WAITING FOR, FOR 02:05:01.293 --> 02:05:02.394 FOR ACTION, RIGHT? I THINK WE 02:05:02.461 --> 02:05:04.163 ALL RECOGNIZE THAT. SO 02:05:04.230 --> 02:05:04.997 CALIFORNIA HAS KIND OF AN 02:05:05.064 --> 02:05:06.332 INCREASED RESPONSIBILITY TO 02:05:06.398 --> 02:05:08.167 LEAD. AND INTERNATIONALLY, I 02:05:08.234 --> 02:05:11.036 THINK A TREATY WE WOULD 02:05:11.103 --> 02:05:12.104 CERTAINLY OF SOME KIND 02:05:12.171 --> 02:05:13.939 EVENTUALLY BE SUPPORTIVE OF. I 02:05:14.006 --> 02:05:15.341 THINK IN ORDER FOR THAT TO 02:05:15.407 --> 02:05:17.509 START, WE NEED TO IDENTIFY 02:05:17.576 --> 02:05:19.345 VERIFICATION MECHANISMS NOW TO 02:05:19.411 --> 02:05:20.412 THAT WOULD BE INCORPORATED IN 02:05:20.479 --> 02:05:23.349 THAT AND ALSO JUST SHOW 02:05:23.415 --> 02:05:24.350 CREDIBLE INTEREST THAT WE'RE 02:05:24.416 --> 02:05:25.451 WE'RE TAKING THIS STUFF 02:05:25.517 --> 02:05:27.953 SERIOUSLY. CHINA DOES REGULATE 02:05:28.020 --> 02:05:30.122 AI. IT HAS MANDATORY SECURITY 02:05:30.189 --> 02:05:33.125 ASSESSMENTS SINCE 2023. AND, 02:05:33.192 --> 02:05:35.127 YOU KNOW, WE WE NEED TO CREATE 02:05:35.194 --> 02:05:36.161 THE INFRASTRUCTURE TO MAKE A 02:05:36.228 --> 02:05:38.397 SORT OF AGREEMENT POSSIBLE 02:05:38.464 --> 02:05:40.633 BEFORE WE CROSS THAT BRIDGE. SO 02:05:40.699 --> 02:05:42.334 I THINK IT IS IS CERTAINLY TRUE 02:05:42.401 --> 02:05:44.136 THAT THE WHOLE WORLD DOESN'T 02:05:44.203 --> 02:05:45.337 REVOLVE AROUND CALIFORNIA. BUT 02:05:45.404 --> 02:05:47.706 I THINK IN THIS AREA IN 02:05:47.773 --> 02:05:48.274 PARTICULAR, SILICON VALLEY'S 02:05:48.340 --> 02:05:49.808 PRESENCE HERE GIVES US A LOT OF 02:05:49.875 --> 02:05:53.012 JURISDICTION TO TO MAKE AN 02:05:53.078 --> 02:05:56.649 IMPACT. SO HYPOTHETICALLY, WE 02:05:56.715 --> 02:05:58.751 REQUIRE THAT THERE ARE EMBEDDED 02:05:58.817 --> 02:06:03.822 AUDITORS, EVALUATORS, OVERSEERS. 02:06:03.889 --> 02:06:05.257 SO WE DO THAT IN CALIFORNIA. 02:06:05.324 --> 02:06:09.228 AND I GET THAT WE ARE THE RIGHT 02:06:09.295 --> 02:06:10.296 RIGHT NOW WE'RE THE CENTER OF 02:06:10.362 --> 02:06:12.064 GRAVITY WITH RESPECT TO 02:06:12.131 --> 02:06:13.933 ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE. BUT 02:06:13.999 --> 02:06:16.835 HOW DO WE ENFORCE THAT? SO SO X, 02:06:16.902 --> 02:06:18.737 Y, Z COMPANY MOVES TO TEXAS. 02:06:18.804 --> 02:06:20.739 HOW DO WE ENFORCE THAT HERE? 02:06:20.806 --> 02:06:23.275 SURE. WELL, TWO THINGS. FIRST, 02:06:23.342 --> 02:06:24.710 I THINK IT'S QUITE UNLIKELY 02:06:24.777 --> 02:06:25.711 THAT THAT THE COMPANIES ARE 02:06:25.778 --> 02:06:28.047 GOING TO MOVE TO TEXAS. I THINK 02:06:28.113 --> 02:06:29.949 THAT THEY ARE HERE FOR A REASON, 02:06:30.015 --> 02:06:31.216 THAT IT WOULD BE VERY EXPENSIVE 02:06:31.283 --> 02:06:32.952 THAN TO MOVE. THERE'S A GREAT 02:06:33.018 --> 02:06:33.953 CONCENTRATION OF TECH TALENT 02:06:34.019 --> 02:06:35.654 HERE THAT, YOU KNOW, IS THERE'S 02:06:35.721 --> 02:06:37.690 A REASON WHY THEY'VE CHOSEN 02:06:37.756 --> 02:06:39.458 CALIFORNIA. AND THESE 02:06:39.525 --> 02:06:40.559 REGULATIONS THAT WE'RE 02:06:40.626 --> 02:06:42.328 PROPOSING ARE NOT VERY 02:06:42.394 --> 02:06:43.929 BURDENSOME, IN MY VIEW. THEY 02:06:43.996 --> 02:06:45.631 ARE SOMETHING THAT COMPANIES 02:06:45.698 --> 02:06:47.032 WITH TRILLION DOLLAR VALUATIONS 02:06:47.099 --> 02:06:49.568 SHOULD BE ABLE TO HIRE A FEW 02:06:49.635 --> 02:06:52.438 PEOPLE TO, TO ENFORCE. BUT 02:06:52.504 --> 02:06:53.539 SECONDLY, I THINK, YOU KNOW, 02:06:53.605 --> 02:06:55.240 EVEN IN STATES, YOU KNOW, WE 02:06:55.307 --> 02:06:56.241 HAVE PASSED REGULATIONS IN 02:06:56.308 --> 02:06:57.242 STATES WHERE THESE COMPANIES 02:06:57.309 --> 02:06:59.011 ARE NOT HOUSED. AND IT'S IF 02:06:59.078 --> 02:07:00.546 THEY WANT TO MAKE THEIR MODEL 02:07:00.612 --> 02:07:01.847 COMMERCIALLY AVAILABLE IN THAT 02:07:01.914 --> 02:07:03.048 STATE, THEY NEED TO COMPLY WITH 02:07:03.115 --> 02:07:05.384 THESE REGULATIONS. SO IT WOULD 02:07:05.451 --> 02:07:06.819 THEY WOULD NEED TO EVEN IF THEY 02:07:06.885 --> 02:07:09.088 DID LEAVE CALIFORNIA, THEY 02:07:09.154 --> 02:07:11.223 WOULD NEED TO ALSO NOT MAKE 02:07:11.290 --> 02:07:13.325 THEIR MODELS AVAILABLE TO IP 02:07:13.392 --> 02:07:15.094 ADDRESSES IN CALIFORNIA IF THEY 02:07:15.160 --> 02:07:16.929 WANTED TO ESCAPE THIS 02:07:16.996 --> 02:07:17.997 REGULATION, WHICH WOULD BE AN 02:07:18.063 --> 02:07:19.798 EVEN MORE COSTLY MEASURE. AND 02:07:19.865 --> 02:07:20.899 CERTAINLY WITH HOW COMPETITIVE 02:07:20.966 --> 02:07:22.301 THIS INDUSTRY IS, WOULD RESULT 02:07:22.368 --> 02:07:23.535 IN THEIR COMPETITORS SWOOPING 02:07:23.602 --> 02:07:25.571 UP TO TAKE THAT HUGE CONSUMER 02:07:25.637 --> 02:07:28.007 BASE. SO I DON'T THINK IT'S 02:07:28.073 --> 02:07:29.141 LIKELY THAT THEY'RE GOING TO TO 02:07:29.208 --> 02:07:31.110 BE ABLE TO ESCAPE IT BY JUST 02:07:31.176 --> 02:07:32.711 VENUE SHOPPING. AND I THINK YOU 02:07:32.778 --> 02:07:34.546 HIT UPON THIS A MOMENT AGO, BUT 02:07:34.613 --> 02:07:36.749 TO THE EXTENT THAT CHINA CAN 02:07:36.815 --> 02:07:38.150 BASICALLY MAKE ITS MODELS 02:07:38.217 --> 02:07:39.918 AVAILABLE HERE, HOW DO WE 02:07:39.985 --> 02:07:42.821 ENFORCE THAT? SURE. SO YEAH, I 02:07:42.888 --> 02:07:46.058 THINK, AS I SAID, CHINA IS 02:07:46.125 --> 02:07:47.826 THANKFULLY A LITTLE BIT BEHIND 02:07:47.893 --> 02:07:48.961 US, AND ESPECIALLY IN TERMS OF 02:07:49.028 --> 02:07:51.130 THE RECURSIVE SELF-IMPROVEMENT 02:07:51.196 --> 02:07:52.564 RISKS, RIGHT, THAT ARE MOST 02:07:52.631 --> 02:07:53.432 LIKELY TO HAPPEN IN CLOSED 02:07:53.499 --> 02:07:55.467 SOURCE MODELS THAT ARE AT THE 02:07:55.534 --> 02:07:56.235 FRONTIER, WHICH ARE IN THE 02:07:56.301 --> 02:07:58.704 UNITED STATES. YOU KNOW, IT'S 02:07:58.771 --> 02:08:00.139 CERTAINLY TRUE THAT THAT OPEN 02:08:00.205 --> 02:08:01.907 SOURCE MODELS AND CHINESE 02:08:01.974 --> 02:08:03.375 MODELS WILL CONTINUE TO POSE 02:08:03.442 --> 02:08:05.544 RISKS. THERE'S NO ONE BILL THAT 02:08:05.611 --> 02:08:06.979 CAN ADDRESS ALL OF THE RISKS 02:08:07.046 --> 02:08:10.249 PRESENTED BY AI. SO I, I THINK 02:08:10.315 --> 02:08:11.417 IT'S A FAIR CONCERN. AND WE 02:08:11.483 --> 02:08:13.018 WILL NEED TO DO OTHER THINGS, 02:08:13.085 --> 02:08:14.486 INCLUDING THE ROBUST 02:08:14.553 --> 02:08:16.321 CYBERSECURITY MEASURES THAT 02:08:16.388 --> 02:08:18.223 THAT WERE DISCUSSED TO TRY AND 02:08:18.290 --> 02:08:19.591 HARDEN OUR SYSTEMS AGAINST THE 02:08:19.658 --> 02:08:21.226 SORT OF ATTACKS THAT WE'VE SEEN 02:08:21.293 --> 02:08:22.461 FROM THOSE OPEN SOURCE MODELS, 02:08:22.528 --> 02:08:25.397 NOT TO. I WANT TO MAKE SURE MY 02:08:25.464 --> 02:08:27.266 POINT OF VIEW IS ACTUALLY CLEAR. 02:08:27.332 --> 02:08:28.400 I'M NOT SUGGESTING WE NOT DO 02:08:28.467 --> 02:08:30.269 ANYTHING, IN FACT, JUST AS IS 02:08:30.335 --> 02:08:32.171 IN ENVIRONMENTAL REGULATION, IF 02:08:32.237 --> 02:08:34.706 ALL 50 STATES AND ALL COUNTRIES 02:08:34.773 --> 02:08:36.842 SIMPLY SAY THAT WE CAN'T DO 02:08:36.909 --> 02:08:38.610 ANYTHING BECAUSE OTHERS AREN'T 02:08:38.677 --> 02:08:42.247 ACTING, THEN BASICALLY WE 02:08:42.314 --> 02:08:43.682 DIGRESS TO SORT OF LOWEST 02:08:43.749 --> 02:08:45.117 COMMON DENOMINATOR PRETTY 02:08:45.184 --> 02:08:46.952 QUICKLY. SO I DO THINK WE IN 02:08:47.019 --> 02:08:48.387 CALIFORNIA NEED TO BE PROACTIVE. 02:08:48.454 --> 02:08:51.256 I'M JUST STRUGGLING WITH WHAT 02:08:51.323 --> 02:08:53.425 MECHANISMS WE CAN CREATE AND 02:08:53.492 --> 02:08:54.827 MAYBE COMPACTS AMONG STATES, 02:08:54.893 --> 02:08:56.695 WHATEVER IT MAY BE, TO BE MOST 02:08:56.762 --> 02:08:58.430 EFFECTIVE IN TERMS OF 02:08:58.497 --> 02:08:59.998 ENFORCEMENT. SO THANK YOU. BACK 02:09:00.065 --> 02:09:01.934 TO YOU, MR. CHAIR. OH, BY THE 02:09:02.000 --> 02:09:03.869 WAY, ONE OTHER QUICK COMMENT IS 02:09:03.936 --> 02:09:05.270 THAT THE BACKGROUND PAPER THAT 02:09:05.337 --> 02:09:06.805 WAS CREATED FOR THIS HEARING, I 02:09:06.872 --> 02:09:08.774 HOPE YOU ALL HAD A CHANCE TO 02:09:08.841 --> 02:09:10.008 TAKE A LOOK AT IT, BECAUSE I 02:09:10.075 --> 02:09:11.743 THOUGHT THAT WAS EXCELLENT. AND 02:09:11.810 --> 02:09:13.011 I SUGGEST IT SHOULD BE REQUIRED 02:09:13.078 --> 02:09:14.012 READING FOR EVERY MEMBER OF 02:09:14.079 --> 02:09:15.380 BOTH PRIVACY AND JUDICIARY 02:09:15.447 --> 02:09:18.250 COMMITTEE. SO AN APPROPRIATIONS 02:09:18.317 --> 02:09:20.752 AND APPROPRIATIONS. SENATOR 02:09:20.819 --> 02:09:25.457 BECKER AGREED. AGREED. YEAH. 02:09:25.524 --> 02:09:29.061 THANK YOU. A COUPLE OF THINGS. 02:09:29.128 --> 02:09:30.162 YOU KIND OF REFERRED TO THIS, 02:09:30.229 --> 02:09:31.563 BUT, YOU KNOW, THERE'S SOME 02:09:31.630 --> 02:09:33.065 BELIEF THAT CHINA'S MODELS ARE 02:09:33.132 --> 02:09:34.466 DISTILLED FROM OUR FRONTIER 02:09:34.533 --> 02:09:36.602 MODELS, RIGHT? SO US SLOWING 02:09:36.668 --> 02:09:38.504 DOWN WOULD ALSO SLOW DOWN THEM 02:09:38.570 --> 02:09:40.939 IF THAT IS CORRECT. RIGHT. 02:09:41.006 --> 02:09:43.108 THAT'S THAT'S A DISPUTED CLAIM, 02:09:43.175 --> 02:09:44.409 RIGHT. I DON'T WANT TO PRESENT 02:09:44.476 --> 02:09:45.978 IT AS CONSENSUS. RIGHT. THERE'S 02:09:46.044 --> 02:09:48.147 UNCERTAINTY ABOUT EXACTLY HOW 02:09:48.213 --> 02:09:49.581 HOW FAR THEY ARE. AND I THINK 02:09:49.648 --> 02:09:51.150 THERE'S, THERE'S OTHER TOOLS IN 02:09:51.216 --> 02:09:52.151 THE TOOLKIT, LIKE EXPORT 02:09:52.217 --> 02:09:53.552 CONTROLS ON CHIPS AND THINGS 02:09:53.619 --> 02:09:55.287 THAT CAN TRY AND SLOW DOWN 02:09:55.354 --> 02:09:56.655 CHINA'S PROGRESS INDEPENDENTLY 02:09:56.722 --> 02:09:57.856 OF THE REGULATIONS WE'VE 02:09:57.923 --> 02:10:00.359 DISCUSSED TODAY. BUT THAT IS 02:10:00.425 --> 02:10:04.663 ONE LINE OF THOUGHT. YES. YEAH. 02:10:04.730 --> 02:10:06.131 AND DO YOU BELIEVE WE SHOULD BE 02:10:06.198 --> 02:10:07.933 ABLE TO MAKE CHANGES TO THE 02:10:08.000 --> 02:10:09.368 BENCHMARKS THEY USE FOR SAFETY 02:10:09.434 --> 02:10:11.103 AND CAPABILITY? IS THAT ONE OF 02:10:11.170 --> 02:10:13.071 THE THINGS YOU'RE. YES. I THINK 02:10:13.138 --> 02:10:15.440 THERE SHOULD BE SOME MINIMUM 02:10:15.507 --> 02:10:17.042 STANDARDS THAT CAL OS IS ABLE 02:10:17.109 --> 02:10:19.244 TO MAKE. I THINK THEY SHOULD 02:10:19.311 --> 02:10:20.779 USE DISCRETION IN ENSURING THAT 02:10:20.846 --> 02:10:22.281 THE RULES ARE HIGH LEVEL ENOUGH 02:10:22.347 --> 02:10:24.483 THAT THEY'RE NOT OUTPACED BY 02:10:24.550 --> 02:10:27.019 THE TECHNOLOGIES PROGRESS, AND 02:10:27.085 --> 02:10:28.820 I DON'T THINK THAT WILL BE 02:10:28.887 --> 02:10:29.821 SUFFICIENT. THERE'S NO THERE'S 02:10:29.888 --> 02:10:31.423 NO LIST OF A CHECKLIST OF RULES 02:10:31.490 --> 02:10:33.125 THAT YOU CAN, IF YOU JUST DO 02:10:33.192 --> 02:10:34.993 THIS, THIS AND THIS, THEN IT'S 02:10:35.060 --> 02:10:36.228 GOING TO BE SAFE, WHICH IS WHY 02:10:36.295 --> 02:10:37.996 WE HAVE THE OTHER ELEMENTS 02:10:38.063 --> 02:10:39.231 THERE. BUT I DO THINK THAT AS 02:10:39.298 --> 02:10:41.400 BEST PRACTICES EMERGE IN THE 02:10:41.466 --> 02:10:42.434 INDUSTRY, THEY SHOULD BE ABLE 02:10:42.501 --> 02:10:44.269 TO TO IDENTIFY SOME AS A 02:10:44.336 --> 02:10:47.506 MINIMUM REQUIREMENT. AND THE 02:10:47.573 --> 02:10:48.407 SAFETY RESEARCH THAT NEEDS TO 02:10:48.473 --> 02:10:50.309 GET DONE CAN SOME OF THIS CAN 02:10:50.375 --> 02:10:52.211 BE DONE BY ACADEMICS, OR DO YOU 02:10:52.277 --> 02:10:54.746 NEED THE COMPUTE POWER OF THESE 02:10:54.813 --> 02:10:55.914 LARGE COMPANIES TO BE ABLE TO 02:10:55.981 --> 02:10:57.783 DO SOME OF THE SAFETY RESEARCH 02:10:57.849 --> 02:11:00.085 THAT NEEDS TO GET DONE? YEAH, 02:11:00.152 --> 02:11:02.287 I'M I THINK IT'S A MIX OF BOTH. 02:11:02.354 --> 02:11:04.122 I THINK THERE'S CERTAINLY 02:11:04.189 --> 02:11:04.990 PRODUCTIVE RESEARCH TAKING 02:11:05.057 --> 02:11:07.826 PLACE OUTSIDE OF THE LABS THAT 02:11:07.893 --> 02:11:09.828 DOES NOT REQUIRE THE THE FULL 02:11:09.895 --> 02:11:12.364 COMPUTE. I THINK IT PROBABLY IT 02:11:12.431 --> 02:11:14.233 WOULD BE YOU CAN PROBABLY DO 02:11:14.299 --> 02:11:16.668 MORE FROM WITHIN THE LABS. AND 02:11:16.735 --> 02:11:18.470 I, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT A SAFETY 02:11:18.537 --> 02:11:19.638 RESEARCHER MYSELF, SO I'M NOT 02:11:19.705 --> 02:11:21.773 GOING TO OVERCLAIM MY EXPERTISE 02:11:21.840 --> 02:11:23.375 THERE. RIGHT, RIGHT. BUT THAT'S 02:11:23.442 --> 02:11:24.943 PART OF THE PACING POINT IS 02:11:25.010 --> 02:11:26.044 LIKE, HEY, REQUIRE THEM TO, 02:11:26.111 --> 02:11:27.179 SINCE THEY HAVE THAT COMPUTE 02:11:27.246 --> 02:11:29.648 POWER TO, TO USE THAT R&D 02:11:29.715 --> 02:11:32.584 PORTION OF THAT ON THE ON, ON 02:11:32.651 --> 02:11:34.753 SAFETY FOR SURE. YEAH. OKAY. 02:11:34.820 --> 02:11:35.921 WELL, THANK YOU AND THANKS FOR 02:11:35.988 --> 02:11:38.624 COMING HERE WITH SOME CONCRETE 02:11:38.690 --> 02:11:39.758 SUGGESTIONS FOR ALL OF US FOR 02:11:39.825 --> 02:11:43.262 THE LEGISLATURE. I JUST WANT TO 02:11:43.328 --> 02:11:44.263 SAY THAT, JENNIFER, FIRST, 02:11:44.329 --> 02:11:45.831 THANK YOU FOR YOUR WORK 02:11:45.897 --> 02:11:47.633 HIGHLIGHTING HOW DATA BROKERS 02:11:47.699 --> 02:11:52.304 WERE MAKING. IT'S VERY HARD FOR 02:11:52.371 --> 02:11:53.405 USERS TO DELETE THEIR 02:11:53.472 --> 02:11:55.941 INFORMATION. THANK YOU. WHICH, 02:11:56.008 --> 02:11:57.376 YOU KNOW, HIGHLIGHTS THE THE 02:11:57.442 --> 02:11:58.377 IMPORTANCE OF WORK THAT WE'RE 02:11:58.443 --> 02:11:59.711 DOING RIGHT NOW WITHIN THE 02:11:59.778 --> 02:12:00.779 PRIVACY AGENCIES DOING WITH THE 02:12:00.846 --> 02:12:02.748 DROP BUTTON. AND WE'RE TRACKING 02:12:02.814 --> 02:12:04.149 THOSE DELETIONS NOW EVERY DAY 02:12:04.216 --> 02:12:05.617 THAT THAT THOSE OF US WHO 02:12:05.684 --> 02:12:07.452 SIGNED UP. SO THANK YOU FOR 02:12:07.519 --> 02:12:12.858 THAT. YOU KNOW, UNDER, UNDER 02:12:12.924 --> 02:12:14.259 923, A BILL FROM LAST YEAR, 02:12:14.326 --> 02:12:15.727 WHICH THE GOVERNOR JUST SIGNED. 02:12:15.794 --> 02:12:19.698 SO WE CAN NOW REQUIRE GO TO 02:12:19.765 --> 02:12:20.799 THESE AI COMPANIES AND SAY, 02:12:20.866 --> 02:12:22.367 DELETE MY PERSONAL INFORMATION 02:12:22.434 --> 02:12:23.635 OR INFORMATION THEY'VE GOTTEN 02:12:23.702 --> 02:12:26.972 FROM DATA BROKERS. RIGHT. SO 02:12:27.039 --> 02:12:28.507 THAT'S GOING TO BE ONE OF THE, 02:12:28.573 --> 02:12:29.741 I GUESS, ONE OF THE FRONTIERS 02:12:29.808 --> 02:12:31.610 OF THIS. AND I THINK THAT AI 02:12:31.677 --> 02:12:34.046 CAN CERTAINLY SUPERCHARGE 02:12:34.112 --> 02:12:38.784 PRIVACY CONCERNS. BUT WILL BE 02:12:38.850 --> 02:12:40.786 WILL BE ONE AREA OF COMPLIANCE 02:12:40.852 --> 02:12:42.721 THAT WILL NEED TO BE TO BE 02:12:42.788 --> 02:12:44.890 CHECKING. BUT YOU KNOW, THAT 02:12:44.956 --> 02:12:47.025 UNDER THE UNDER THAT BILL, THEY 02:12:47.092 --> 02:12:48.860 WILL HAVE TO DELETE THEIR 02:12:48.927 --> 02:12:50.629 INFORMATION, RIGHT? YEAH. AND I 02:12:50.696 --> 02:12:53.865 THINK ALSO QUESTIONS AROUND 02:12:53.932 --> 02:12:56.702 CHATS, FOR EXAMPLE, IN TERMS OF 02:12:56.768 --> 02:12:58.570 YOUR CHATS WITH A CHAT BOT AND 02:12:58.637 --> 02:13:00.339 WHETHER THAT'S SPECIFICALLY 02:13:00.405 --> 02:13:02.474 COVERED. YEAH, OBVIOUSLY YOU 02:13:02.541 --> 02:13:04.142 HAVE THE POWER TO DELETE THOSE 02:13:04.209 --> 02:13:06.278 CHATS YOURSELF. BUT YOU KNOW, 02:13:06.345 --> 02:13:07.946 WE'VE HAD IT WAS MENTIONED 02:13:08.013 --> 02:13:09.681 EARLIER, THE NAVIER-STOKES 02:13:09.748 --> 02:13:11.183 ISSUE IN MATHEMATICS. AND OF 02:13:11.249 --> 02:13:12.818 COURSE, ONE OF THE ALLEGATIONS 02:13:12.884 --> 02:13:14.720 IN THAT WHOLE SPACE IS WHETHER 02:13:14.786 --> 02:13:16.221 THE MATHEMATICIANS INVOLVED, 02:13:16.288 --> 02:13:17.522 WHETHER OPENAI WAS TRAINING ON 02:13:17.589 --> 02:13:19.224 THEIR CHATS, BECAUSE I BELIEVE 02:13:19.291 --> 02:13:20.459 THEY WERE THEY POTENTIALLY WERE 02:13:20.525 --> 02:13:22.627 USING PERSONAL ACCOUNTS, NOT 02:13:22.694 --> 02:13:24.096 UNIVERSITY OR CORPORATE 02:13:24.162 --> 02:13:26.264 ACCOUNTS, WHICH ARE EXEMPT FROM 02:13:26.331 --> 02:13:28.066 GENERALLY DON'T USE THEIR 02:13:28.133 --> 02:13:30.202 CUSTOMERS DATA FOR TRAINING. 02:13:30.268 --> 02:13:31.636 AND OPENAI HAS NOT BEEN NOT 02:13:31.703 --> 02:13:33.772 ABLE TO SAY DEFINITIVELY THAT 02:13:33.839 --> 02:13:36.675 THAT DID NOT HAPPEN. SO WE ARE 02:13:36.742 --> 02:13:38.143 SEEING THAT'S OBVIOUSLY NOT A 02:13:38.210 --> 02:13:40.445 PERSONAL DATA QUESTION. BUT, 02:13:40.512 --> 02:13:41.747 YOU KNOW, WE'RE SEEING KIND OF 02:13:41.813 --> 02:13:44.249 THIS ISSUE OF OF PEOPLE USING 02:13:44.316 --> 02:13:46.418 THESE TOOLS AND NOT 02:13:46.485 --> 02:13:47.419 ANTICIPATING THAT THEIR CHATS 02:13:47.486 --> 02:13:48.553 ARE BASICALLY BEING RECYCLED 02:13:48.620 --> 02:13:50.756 AND USED FOR MODEL IMPROVEMENT. 02:13:50.822 --> 02:13:55.060 YEAH. YEAH. THAT WAS NOT AN 02:13:55.127 --> 02:13:56.495 ASPECT THAT I, THAT I KNEW 02:13:56.561 --> 02:14:00.198 ABOUT FROM THAT, THAT, THAT 02:14:00.265 --> 02:14:01.266 CURRENT FLURRY. SO THANK YOU 02:14:01.333 --> 02:14:03.101 FOR THAT. AND THANK YOU FOR 02:14:03.168 --> 02:14:04.302 YOUR WORK IN PRIVACY GENERALLY. 02:14:04.369 --> 02:14:06.271 REALLY APPRECIATE IT. SENATOR, 02:14:06.338 --> 02:14:08.473 FOR FOLLOW UP. THANK YOU. THANK 02:14:08.540 --> 02:14:09.875 YOU AGAIN, MR. CHAIR, FOR 02:14:09.941 --> 02:14:10.909 ORGANIZING THIS HEARING. WE'VE 02:14:10.976 --> 02:14:12.344 GOT SOME OF THE FOLKS, SOME 02:14:12.411 --> 02:14:13.378 EXCELLENT PANELISTS THAT ARE 02:14:13.445 --> 02:14:14.513 STILL STICKING AROUND. AND I 02:14:14.579 --> 02:14:16.681 I'D BE INTERESTED IN THEIR 02:14:16.748 --> 02:14:17.682 RESPONSES. THE TWO GENERAL 02:14:17.749 --> 02:14:19.551 QUESTIONS THEY ASKED. ONE WAS 02:14:19.618 --> 02:14:21.319 ENFORCEABILITY, GIVEN THE 02:14:21.386 --> 02:14:22.721 VARIOUS ACTORS IN THE SPACE. 02:14:22.788 --> 02:14:24.222 AND THE SECOND WAS 02:14:24.289 --> 02:14:26.057 TECHNOLOGICAL FEASIBILITY IN 02:14:26.124 --> 02:14:27.459 TERMS OF THE SURREPTITIOUS 02:14:27.526 --> 02:14:31.430 NATURE OF THE AGENTS THAT ARE 02:14:31.496 --> 02:14:32.431 DEVELOPING RIGHT NOW, WHETHER 02:14:32.497 --> 02:14:37.102 WHETHER WE HAVE CREATED A 02:14:37.169 --> 02:14:39.337 CIRCUMSTANCE WHERE BECAUSE 02:14:39.404 --> 02:14:42.541 BECAUSE OF THE ADVANCES, WE WE 02:14:42.607 --> 02:14:44.009 WON'T BE ABLE TO 02:14:44.075 --> 02:14:45.877 TECHNOLOGICALLY IDENTIFY SOME 02:14:45.944 --> 02:14:47.245 OF THESE THREATS. I'M 02:14:47.312 --> 02:14:48.680 INTERESTED IN THE PANEL'S 02:14:48.747 --> 02:14:51.616 ANSWERS ON THOSE TWO SUBJECTS, 02:14:51.683 --> 02:14:53.251 IF ANYONE CARES TO RESPOND. ALL 02:14:53.318 --> 02:14:55.020 RIGHT. SO WE'RE GOING TO INVITE 02:14:55.086 --> 02:14:58.023 ALL OF OUR PANELISTS TO RETURN 02:14:58.089 --> 02:14:59.491 WITH AN IMPORTANT CAVEAT THAT 02:14:59.558 --> 02:15:01.827 WE WON'T HAVE TIME FOR, BECAUSE 02:15:01.893 --> 02:15:03.695 I KNOW WE HAVE A FEW QUESTIONS 02:15:03.762 --> 02:15:04.863 THAT WE'LL BE ASKING. WE WON'T 02:15:04.930 --> 02:15:06.698 HAVE TIME FOR EVERY PANELIST TO 02:15:06.765 --> 02:15:07.699 DELIVER A TEN MINUTE 02:15:07.766 --> 02:15:09.668 DISSERTATION ON EVERY QUESTION. 02:15:09.734 --> 02:15:12.170 AND SO I WOULD ASK YOU TO TO BE 02:15:12.237 --> 02:15:13.972 JUST A YES OR NO, YES, YES OR 02:15:14.039 --> 02:15:16.475 NO. THAT'S THAT'S PARSIMONIOUS 02:15:16.541 --> 02:15:19.678 IN IN THAT. AND AS, AS WE DO 02:15:19.744 --> 02:15:23.248 THAT, I WANT TO SORT OF ASK YOU 02:15:23.315 --> 02:15:26.151 TO, TO RESPOND OR MAYBE PICK 02:15:26.218 --> 02:15:27.519 ONE, I'M GOING TO GIVE, GIVE 02:15:27.586 --> 02:15:29.421 SOME, SOME EXAMPLES OF STATE 02:15:29.488 --> 02:15:30.856 ACTION. AND REMEMBER, THIS 02:15:30.922 --> 02:15:32.691 HEARING IS ABOUT BOTH FRONTIER 02:15:32.757 --> 02:15:35.126 AND, AND AI AND AGENTS MORE 02:15:35.193 --> 02:15:38.096 GENERALLY. AND WE FOCUSED A LOT 02:15:38.163 --> 02:15:39.231 ON THE FRONTIER SIDE. AND I 02:15:39.297 --> 02:15:41.299 REALLY APPRECIATE THE DETAILS 02:15:41.366 --> 02:15:43.168 THAT HAVE BEEN SHARED WITH US 02:15:43.235 --> 02:15:45.003 TODAY TO REINFORCE SB 53. SO 02:15:45.070 --> 02:15:46.538 THAT'S THOSE ARE ON THE TABLE, 02:15:46.605 --> 02:15:48.139 BUT ALSO OTHERS I WANT TO, TO, 02:15:48.206 --> 02:15:50.575 TO PROBE WITH YOU THAT EITHER 02:15:50.642 --> 02:15:51.610 ARE BEING CONSIDERED NATIONALLY 02:15:51.676 --> 02:15:53.178 OR IN OTHER STATES OR THAT 02:15:53.245 --> 02:15:54.112 WE'RE STARTING TO THINK ABOUT. 02:15:54.179 --> 02:15:56.448 AND IT'S PARTLY PARTLY RESULTS 02:15:56.515 --> 02:15:58.316 FROM I THINK FOR ME, THE PART 02:15:58.383 --> 02:16:00.318 OF OUR FOCUS HAS TO BE ON THOSE 02:16:00.385 --> 02:16:01.453 THAT ARE NOT THE IMMEDIATE 02:16:01.520 --> 02:16:02.487 CONCRETE WHICH OUR BRAINS ARE. 02:16:02.554 --> 02:16:04.322 VERY WELL, IF THERE'S A STORY 02:16:04.389 --> 02:16:06.858 WITH A VILLAIN, YOU KNOW, SOME 02:16:06.925 --> 02:16:08.293 EVIL, EVIL AGENT OR SOME 02:16:08.360 --> 02:16:09.728 MALICIOUS ACTOR TRYING TO DO 02:16:09.794 --> 02:16:11.096 SOMETHING, AND IT'S GOING TO 02:16:11.162 --> 02:16:12.197 IMMEDIATE ACTION THAT WE WILL 02:16:12.264 --> 02:16:13.698 FEEL THE RISK OF. WE'RE VERY 02:16:13.765 --> 02:16:15.133 ATTRACTED TO THOSE RISKS 02:16:15.200 --> 02:16:17.002 IMMEDIATELY. BUT BUT WE IN 02:16:17.068 --> 02:16:18.303 STATE GOVERNMENT AT LEAST HAVE 02:16:18.370 --> 02:16:20.138 TO PAY ATTENTION ALSO TO THE TO 02:16:20.205 --> 02:16:22.340 THE UNDERMINING OF OUR BASIC 02:16:22.407 --> 02:16:23.441 INSTITUTIONS OR THINGS IN 02:16:23.508 --> 02:16:24.609 SOCIAL MEDIA, AS AN EXAMPLE, 02:16:24.676 --> 02:16:25.744 THAT WE DID NOT PAY ATTENTION 02:16:25.810 --> 02:16:27.512 TO BECAUSE WE WERE LOOKING AT 02:16:27.579 --> 02:16:29.447 THE RISKS RIGHT IN FRONT OF US 02:16:29.514 --> 02:16:30.582 THAT WERE TANGIBLE AND NOT THE 02:16:30.649 --> 02:16:32.450 WAY IN WHICH WE WERE BEING 02:16:32.517 --> 02:16:33.451 REWIRED, BOTH INDIVIDUALLY, BUT 02:16:33.518 --> 02:16:34.619 ALSO AS A SOCIETY. AND AS WE 02:16:34.686 --> 02:16:36.454 WERE TALKING ABOUT AT THE 02:16:36.521 --> 02:16:36.955 OPENING REMARKS, THAT'S 02:16:37.022 --> 02:16:38.590 CERTAINLY A SET OF THE ISSUES 02:16:38.657 --> 02:16:39.624 THAT WE'RE GRAPPLING WITH, IN 02:16:39.691 --> 02:16:40.792 PART BECAUSE I THINK THE 02:16:40.859 --> 02:16:42.527 COMPANIES AND MANY OF THE AI 02:16:42.594 --> 02:16:44.296 FOLKS ARE CELEBRATE THE 02:16:44.362 --> 02:16:45.764 POTENTIAL ERADICATION OF 02:16:45.830 --> 02:16:47.065 FRICTION, I THINK, AS THEY 02:16:47.132 --> 02:16:49.367 WOULD DESCRIBE. BUT FRICTION, 02:16:49.434 --> 02:16:52.237 THE NOTION OF SHAME, THOSE ARE 02:16:52.304 --> 02:16:54.039 BOTH ACTUALLY ESSENTIAL TO THE 02:16:54.105 --> 02:16:55.807 FUNCTIONING OF SOCIETY. AND 02:16:55.874 --> 02:16:56.875 THEY'RE BOTH THINGS THAT AGENTS 02:16:56.942 --> 02:16:59.411 EITHER DON'T HAVE OR AI DOESN'T 02:16:59.477 --> 02:17:01.980 HAVE, OR IS VERY GOOD AT 02:17:02.047 --> 02:17:04.049 OVERCOMING. AND SO WE HAVE TO 02:17:04.115 --> 02:17:05.183 ATTEND TO THOSE AS WELL AS 02:17:05.250 --> 02:17:06.318 WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SOME OF 02:17:06.384 --> 02:17:07.485 THOSE IMPLICATIONS EARLIER. SO 02:17:07.552 --> 02:17:09.254 I WANT TO MY GLASSES JUST BROKE. 02:17:09.321 --> 02:17:11.122 SO I'M NOT I'M NOT TRYING TO 02:17:11.189 --> 02:17:12.190 LOOK LOOK RIDICULOUS AT THE 02:17:12.257 --> 02:17:14.192 MOMENT. BUT BUT THAT'S HOW 02:17:14.259 --> 02:17:16.294 THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS. SO WE'VE 02:17:16.361 --> 02:17:18.430 TALKED ABOUT THE CATASTROPHIC 02:17:18.496 --> 02:17:20.298 RISK TRANSPARENCY, THE PAUSE, 02:17:20.365 --> 02:17:21.666 THE KILL SWITCH AND SOME OF THE 02:17:21.733 --> 02:17:22.801 OTHER ELEMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN 02:17:22.867 --> 02:17:24.703 IN THAT SPACE. BUT I WANT TO I 02:17:24.769 --> 02:17:26.605 WANT TO PUT OUT THERE, AND 02:17:26.671 --> 02:17:27.772 AGAIN, I'M NOT ASKING YOU TO 02:17:27.839 --> 02:17:29.674 COMMENT ON EACH ONE OF THESE, 02:17:29.741 --> 02:17:31.643 BUT MAYBE PICK 1 OR 2 IS THE, 02:17:31.710 --> 02:17:33.278 IS THE THE ASSIGNMENT OF 02:17:33.345 --> 02:17:35.447 LIABILITY IN THIS IN THIS SPACE 02:17:35.513 --> 02:17:36.281 FOR BOTH, FOR FRONTIER MODELS, 02:17:36.348 --> 02:17:38.283 BUT ALSO FOR AGENTS, WHICH ARE 02:17:38.350 --> 02:17:40.452 THAT ARE ONLY MODESTLY RELATED 02:17:40.518 --> 02:17:42.287 QUESTIONS. BUT THIS HAS BEEN 02:17:42.354 --> 02:17:43.655 ONE OF THE MAJOR ISSUES THAT 02:17:43.722 --> 02:17:45.156 CONGRESS HAS ALSO GRAPPLED WITH. 02:17:45.223 --> 02:17:47.259 WELL, NOT GRAPPLED, BUT HAS 02:17:47.325 --> 02:17:49.394 RAISED THAT IT'S NOT CLEAR HOW 02:17:49.461 --> 02:17:50.929 TO HOW TO DEAL WITH WITH THE 02:17:50.996 --> 02:17:52.664 WITH LIABILITY IN A CONTEXT IN 02:17:52.731 --> 02:17:55.166 WHICH THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN 02:17:55.233 --> 02:17:56.601 INTENT OR REASONABLE, 02:17:56.668 --> 02:17:58.770 FORESEEABLE FORESEEABILITY IS 02:17:58.837 --> 02:18:01.706 SO, SO ATTENUATED, GIVEN GIVEN 02:18:01.773 --> 02:18:03.341 THE ACTIONS OF AGENTS OR SWARMS 02:18:03.408 --> 02:18:04.576 OF AGENTS. AND I KNOW, JOSHUA, 02:18:04.643 --> 02:18:06.378 THAT YOU DON'T LIKE THOSE TERMS, 02:18:06.444 --> 02:18:07.779 BUT BUT BUT CHALLENGES AROUND 02:18:07.846 --> 02:18:08.980 HOW TO DEAL WITH AND GRAPPLE 02:18:09.047 --> 02:18:12.851 WITH LIABILITY ISSUES, BOTH 02:18:12.917 --> 02:18:17.255 CIVIL AND CRIMINAL, THAT SORT 02:18:17.322 --> 02:18:18.623 OF BACK TO THE INVASIVE SPECIES 02:18:18.690 --> 02:18:21.126 EXAMPLE I WAS GIVING EARLIER, 02:18:21.192 --> 02:18:23.561 THE WHETHER WHETHER IT OUGHT TO 02:18:23.628 --> 02:18:25.497 BE CRIMINALIZED TO RELEASE 02:18:25.563 --> 02:18:26.665 AGENTS THAT HAVE ESSENTIALLY 02:18:26.731 --> 02:18:29.034 THE SAME, THE SAME POTENTIAL 02:18:29.100 --> 02:18:32.270 IMPACTS ON HUMAN SOCIETY AS THE 02:18:32.337 --> 02:18:33.705 MEDITERRANEAN FRUIT FLY, FRUIT 02:18:33.772 --> 02:18:36.574 FLY OR, OR FAR LESS THREATENING 02:18:36.641 --> 02:18:38.376 AGENTS THAT WE CURRENTLY MAKE 02:18:38.443 --> 02:18:39.844 ILLEGAL TO RELEASE WITHOUT 02:18:39.911 --> 02:18:41.312 BEING ABLE TO ACCOUNT FOR AND 02:18:41.379 --> 02:18:42.714 CONTROL FOR THE CONSEQUENCES, 02:18:42.781 --> 02:18:48.420 AS AN EXAMPLE. WHAT THE ROLE OF 02:18:48.486 --> 02:18:49.688 THE LAW, CIVIL OR CRIMINAL 02:18:49.754 --> 02:18:50.955 SHOULD BE WITH RESPECT TO 02:18:51.022 --> 02:18:53.158 RECURSIVE SELF-IMPROVEMENT AND 02:18:53.224 --> 02:18:55.126 AND SORT OF WHAT IN HOSPITALS 02:18:55.193 --> 02:18:56.394 AND OTHER MEDICAL POLICY AREAS 02:18:56.461 --> 02:18:57.962 WE THINK ABOUT AS NEVER EVENTS. 02:18:58.029 --> 02:18:59.564 I THINK THIS IS A TERM THAT'S 02:18:59.631 --> 02:19:00.665 MORE POPULAR IN BRITAIN, BUT 02:19:00.732 --> 02:19:03.234 WHERE THERE ARE OUTCOMES FOR 02:19:03.301 --> 02:19:05.403 WHICH WE WE DETERMINE THEY ARE 02:19:05.470 --> 02:19:07.639 NEVER ALLOWED. THAT IS, YOU 02:19:07.706 --> 02:19:09.274 KNOW, REMOVING A HEART WHEN 02:19:09.340 --> 02:19:10.475 YOU'RE IN FOR KIDNEY SURGERY OR 02:19:10.542 --> 02:19:11.409 WHATEVER, THEY ARE NEVER 02:19:11.476 --> 02:19:14.713 ALLOWED. AND, AND THE 02:19:14.779 --> 02:19:16.214 CONSEQUENCES THAT ATTEND TO 02:19:16.281 --> 02:19:23.922 THAT. WHETHER WE SHOULD. I'LL 02:19:23.988 --> 02:19:26.257 USE THE CAR EXAMPLE AGAIN, JUST 02:19:26.324 --> 02:19:28.059 BECAUSE WE'VE HAD A LOT OF 02:19:28.126 --> 02:19:29.194 DEBATES ABOUT THIS AND BECAUSE 02:19:29.260 --> 02:19:30.929 YOU ALL LOVE THE TERM 02:19:30.995 --> 02:19:33.832 GUARDRAILS, I TRY TO IMAGINE 02:19:33.898 --> 02:19:36.000 WITHOUT WITHOUT VERY MUCH 02:19:36.067 --> 02:19:37.068 WITHOUT VERY MUCH APPRECIATION 02:19:37.135 --> 02:19:38.837 FOR IT, A WORLD IN WHICH OUR 02:19:38.903 --> 02:19:41.072 ONLY REGULATION OF CARS WERE, 02:19:41.139 --> 02:19:43.575 WERE LITERAL GUARDRAILS. LET'S 02:19:43.641 --> 02:19:45.176 JUST SAY THAT'S ALL WE DID IN, 02:19:45.243 --> 02:19:46.578 IN CALIFORNIA OR IN THE COUNTRY. 02:19:46.644 --> 02:19:50.749 ALL WE HAD WAS GUARDRAILS. 02:19:50.815 --> 02:19:51.850 SINCE IT'S OUR FAVORITE 02:19:51.916 --> 02:19:54.753 METAPHOR, THAT IS NOT A SAFE, 02:19:54.819 --> 02:19:56.554 THAT IS NOT A SAFE WORLD FOR 02:19:56.621 --> 02:19:58.623 DRIVING. WE DO ACTUALLY INSIST 02:19:58.690 --> 02:19:59.691 WE, THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, IS 02:19:59.758 --> 02:20:01.226 EMPOWERED TO SAY EVERY CAR WILL 02:20:01.292 --> 02:20:04.195 HAVE BRAKES, IT'S REQUIRED, AND 02:20:04.262 --> 02:20:05.864 THE BRAKES WILL PERFORM TO THIS 02:20:05.930 --> 02:20:08.767 STANDARD. THE STATE LICENSES, 02:20:08.833 --> 02:20:13.471 THE OWNERSHIP, THE USE, THE OF 02:20:13.538 --> 02:20:16.307 OF A VEHICLE. YOU CAN'T YOU 02:20:16.374 --> 02:20:19.210 CANNOT OWN OR DRIVE IN ANY 02:20:19.277 --> 02:20:21.012 STATE WITHOUT THE STATE'S 02:20:21.079 --> 02:20:22.413 LICENSED AND REGISTERED 02:20:22.480 --> 02:20:24.616 APPROVAL. THE STATE AND 02:20:24.682 --> 02:20:26.518 LOCALITIES DETERMINE ALL OF THE 02:20:26.584 --> 02:20:28.453 RULES OF THE ROAD. HOW FAST YOU 02:20:28.520 --> 02:20:29.687 GO, WHEN YOU MUST STOP, EVEN IF 02:20:29.754 --> 02:20:31.556 THERE'S NO CAR COMING THE OTHER 02:20:31.623 --> 02:20:33.458 WAY. SO THE. WE HAVE WE'VE WE 02:20:33.525 --> 02:20:34.592 OFTEN HAVE TALKED ABOUT THIS IN 02:20:34.659 --> 02:20:36.127 VERY MYSTICAL WAYS, LIKE, WELL, 02:20:36.194 --> 02:20:37.996 WHAT COULD WE POSSIBLY DO? BUT 02:20:38.062 --> 02:20:39.430 WE DO HAVE EXAMPLES IN OTHER 02:20:39.497 --> 02:20:41.199 STATES AND CHINA AS AS AN EARLY 02:20:41.266 --> 02:20:42.667 EXAMPLE, I THINK LAST WEEK AT 02:20:42.734 --> 02:20:44.836 LEAST IS HINTING AT MORE 02:20:44.903 --> 02:20:46.204 AGGRESSIVE REGISTRATION AND 02:20:46.271 --> 02:20:47.639 LICENSURE, FOR EXAMPLE, OF SOME 02:20:47.705 --> 02:20:49.440 OF ITS ITS MODELS. BUT BUT I 02:20:49.507 --> 02:20:51.609 ENCOURAGE YOU TO THINK ABOUT 02:20:51.676 --> 02:20:54.512 THAT, THAT DIMENSION OF IT AND 02:20:54.579 --> 02:20:55.547 INSURANCE, WHICH WE ALSO 02:20:55.613 --> 02:20:58.116 REQUIRE FOR DRIVING, BUT WE 02:20:58.183 --> 02:20:59.517 HAVE NO INSURANCE REQUIREMENT. 02:20:59.584 --> 02:21:01.119 AND GIVEN THE CHALLENGES AROUND 02:21:01.186 --> 02:21:02.187 LIABILITY, HOW WE MIGHT DEAL 02:21:02.253 --> 02:21:04.322 WITH THAT, AND THEN A PRIVACY 02:21:04.389 --> 02:21:05.356 WHICH WE'VE ALREADY COVERED. 02:21:05.423 --> 02:21:06.724 AND THE LAST I'LL MENTION IS 02:21:06.791 --> 02:21:10.695 JUST. AND AND JENNIFER 02:21:10.762 --> 02:21:13.198 MENTIONED THIS AS WELL, BUT THE 02:21:13.264 --> 02:21:15.033 FOR AGENTS OUT IN THE WORLD, 02:21:15.099 --> 02:21:16.868 AGAIN, KNOWING, RECOGNIZING 02:21:16.935 --> 02:21:18.636 JOSHUA'S QUARREL WITH THE TERM, 02:21:18.703 --> 02:21:22.941 BUT IDENTIFICATION, 02:21:23.007 --> 02:21:24.409 INTERPRETABILITY, 02:21:24.475 --> 02:21:26.177 AUTHENTICATION WHEN AGENTS ARE 02:21:26.244 --> 02:21:27.612 IN THE WORLD, HOW DO WE KNOW 02:21:27.679 --> 02:21:29.447 WHAT ARE THEIR OBLIGATIONS TO 02:21:29.514 --> 02:21:31.249 IDENTIFY RELATED TO THIS AS THE 02:21:31.316 --> 02:21:32.183 CONGRESSIONAL PROPOSAL THAT'S 02:21:32.250 --> 02:21:33.351 OUT THERE, WHICH I THINK IS 02:21:33.418 --> 02:21:37.355 AWFUL, BUT THAT WOULD BAR BAR 02:21:37.422 --> 02:21:39.490 WEBSITES FROM REFUSING ACCESS 02:21:39.557 --> 02:21:43.461 BY BY AGENTS, WHICH I CAN'T 02:21:43.528 --> 02:21:44.596 IMAGINE MY POOR LITTLE LEAGUE 02:21:44.662 --> 02:21:47.799 OR THAT AUSTRALIAN PILATES GYM 02:21:47.866 --> 02:21:49.200 FROM HAVING TO OPEN UP THEIR 02:21:49.267 --> 02:21:50.668 SYSTEMS TO THESE AGENTS. BUT 02:21:50.735 --> 02:21:52.604 HOW WOULD WE HOW, AS A SOCIETY, 02:21:52.670 --> 02:21:55.006 MIGHT WE THINK ABOUT REGULATING 02:21:55.073 --> 02:21:57.475 OR CONTROLLING THE 02:21:57.542 --> 02:21:58.843 IDENTIFICATION, AUTHENTICATION 02:21:58.910 --> 02:22:00.445 AND AUTHORIZATION FOR AGENTS 02:22:00.511 --> 02:22:01.813 THEMSELVES? SO AGAIN, NOT 02:22:01.880 --> 02:22:03.982 ASKING YOU ALL TO RESPOND TO 02:22:04.048 --> 02:22:05.383 EACH OF THOSE, BUT IF YOU MIGHT 02:22:05.450 --> 02:22:06.451 THINK ABOUT THEM AS YOU'RE 02:22:06.518 --> 02:22:07.418 THINKING ABOUT A MORE 02:22:07.485 --> 02:22:08.419 GENERALIZED VERSION OF THAT 02:22:08.486 --> 02:22:10.288 SAME QUESTION IS WHAT IS THE 02:22:10.355 --> 02:22:11.456 ROLE? WHAT ARE THE POTENTIAL 02:22:11.522 --> 02:22:12.857 ROLES OF STATES OR PARTICULARLY 02:22:12.924 --> 02:22:13.825 THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA, TRYING 02:22:13.892 --> 02:22:15.860 TO TACKLE SOME OF THESE ISSUES? 02:22:15.927 --> 02:22:18.296 SO, JOSHUA, WE HAVEN'T HEARD 02:22:18.363 --> 02:22:19.497 YOU FROM YOU FOR A WHILE, SO 02:22:19.564 --> 02:22:21.499 WHY DON'T WE GO TO YOU FIRST? 02:22:21.566 --> 02:22:23.368 AND THEN AGAIN, WE WILL TURN ON 02:22:23.434 --> 02:22:24.502 THIS QUESTION SINCE IT'S SO BIG 02:22:24.569 --> 02:22:26.271 AND WE'VE COVERED SO MANY 02:22:26.337 --> 02:22:27.438 TOPICS, WE'LL TURN TO EACH OF 02:22:27.505 --> 02:22:29.274 YOU. BUT THEN AS WE HAVE 02:22:29.340 --> 02:22:30.375 ADDITIONAL FOLLOW UPS, I WOULD 02:22:30.441 --> 02:22:31.509 ASK THE QUESTIONS BE DIRECTED 02:22:31.576 --> 02:22:33.278 TO AS FEW PEOPLE AS POSSIBLE, 02:22:33.344 --> 02:22:34.479 AND THE ANSWERS BE AS LIMITED 02:22:34.545 --> 02:22:36.281 AS WELL. BUT JOSHUA, THANK YOU, 02:22:36.347 --> 02:22:37.448 SENATOR, I'LL TRY TO BE BRIEF. 02:22:37.515 --> 02:22:38.917 I EXPECT THAT MY CO-PANELISTS 02:22:38.983 --> 02:22:40.919 WILL EMPHASIZE THE REGULATION 02:22:40.985 --> 02:22:42.720 OF AGENTS. AND SO I'M GOING TO 02:22:42.787 --> 02:22:43.888 LEAVE MOST OF THOSE POINTS TO 02:22:43.955 --> 02:22:45.757 THEM. BUT I WILL SAY THERE'S A 02:22:45.823 --> 02:22:47.025 ROLE FOR THE STATE IN ACTIVELY 02:22:47.091 --> 02:22:47.992 PARTICIPATING IN THE RESEARCH 02:22:48.059 --> 02:22:49.093 AND DEVELOPMENT OF SAFETY 02:22:49.160 --> 02:22:50.762 INTERVENTIONS, AND ALSO IN 02:22:50.828 --> 02:22:52.597 ELEVATING THE LEVEL OF 02:22:52.664 --> 02:22:54.699 CYBERSECURITY SO THAT THE THE 02:22:54.766 --> 02:22:56.167 INFORMATION ECOSYSTEM IS 02:22:56.234 --> 02:22:58.336 PROTECTED AGAINST AGENTIC 02:22:58.403 --> 02:22:59.437 THREATS. I'M PARTICULARLY 02:22:59.504 --> 02:23:01.339 CONCERNED TODAY. I'M FOLLOWING 02:23:01.406 --> 02:23:05.543 THE NEWS THIS MORNING ABOUT THE 02:23:05.610 --> 02:23:09.113 THE PFP RELATED CYBERSECURITY 02:23:09.180 --> 02:23:10.682 VULNERABILITIES. IT MAY TURN 02:23:10.748 --> 02:23:12.050 OUT THAT A VERY SUBSTANTIAL 02:23:12.116 --> 02:23:13.518 FRACTION OF THE INTERNET NOW 02:23:13.584 --> 02:23:14.652 HAS A VULNERABILITY THAT COULD 02:23:14.719 --> 02:23:16.254 BE EXPLOITED BY EITHER A 02:23:16.321 --> 02:23:18.122 GENETIC AI SYSTEMS OR JUST 02:23:18.189 --> 02:23:20.258 MALICIOUS ACTORS WHO FIND THE 02:23:20.325 --> 02:23:21.726 EXPLOIT AND THEN APPLY IT 02:23:21.793 --> 02:23:25.330 THEMSELVES. WE HAVE BUILT 02:23:25.396 --> 02:23:27.465 EVERYTHING IN MODERN COMMERCE 02:23:27.532 --> 02:23:29.000 AROUND A CYBER LAYER THAT IS 02:23:29.067 --> 02:23:30.668 NOT WELL SECURED, THAT IS NOT 02:23:30.735 --> 02:23:32.203 WELL DEFENDED, THAT ISN'T BUILT 02:23:32.270 --> 02:23:33.905 TO BUILDING CODES. THERE MAY BE 02:23:33.972 --> 02:23:35.440 A ROLE FOR THE STATE HERE IN 02:23:35.506 --> 02:23:36.908 FIGURING OUT WHAT SHOULD THE 02:23:36.975 --> 02:23:38.643 STANDARDS BE FOR THOSE PIECES 02:23:38.710 --> 02:23:39.744 OF CYBER CRITICAL 02:23:39.811 --> 02:23:40.812 INFRASTRUCTURE THAT WE DEPEND 02:23:40.878 --> 02:23:42.981 ON, NOT JUST ON THE AGENT SIDE, 02:23:43.047 --> 02:23:44.782 BUT ON THE WHAT IS THE 02:23:44.849 --> 02:23:46.184 ELECTRONIC ENVIRONMENT THAT THE 02:23:46.250 --> 02:23:48.753 AGENTS ARE INTERACTING WITH? 02:23:48.820 --> 02:23:50.154 THERE WAS A TIME WHEN CITIES 02:23:50.221 --> 02:23:51.389 WOULD ROUTINELY BURN DOWN 02:23:51.456 --> 02:23:52.290 BECAUSE THERE WEREN'T BUILDING 02:23:52.357 --> 02:23:54.525 CODES AND FIRE CODES, AND THEN 02:23:54.592 --> 02:23:55.760 WE IMPLEMENTED SOME STANDARDS 02:23:55.827 --> 02:23:57.228 FOR HOW TO BUILD THINGS, AND 02:23:57.295 --> 02:23:58.329 THAT STOPPED HAPPENING AS MUCH. 02:23:58.396 --> 02:24:00.231 I THINK WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO 02:24:00.298 --> 02:24:01.532 DO THE SAME ON CYBER BECAUSE OF 02:24:01.599 --> 02:24:06.204 AI. THANK YOU RIFF. I'M GOING 02:24:06.270 --> 02:24:08.172 TO PASS ON THIS ONE. I THOUGHT 02:24:08.239 --> 02:24:09.974 YOU MIGHT. YEAH. ALL RIGHT. 02:24:10.041 --> 02:24:11.409 ANDREW. AND THEN JENNIFER, I 02:24:11.476 --> 02:24:13.544 COULD SAY SOME THINGS ABOUT THE 02:24:13.611 --> 02:24:15.380 LIABILITY PIECE. YOU KNOW, WE 02:24:15.446 --> 02:24:17.148 WE DEFINITELY SUPPORT 02:24:17.215 --> 02:24:19.350 ACCOUNTABILITY FOR AI INFLICTED 02:24:19.417 --> 02:24:21.853 HARMS. OUR ORGANIZATION WAS 02:24:21.919 --> 02:24:24.722 FOUNDED AFTER THE 1047 FIGHT, 02:24:24.789 --> 02:24:26.491 BUT OUR FOUNDERS OF THE 02:24:26.557 --> 02:24:27.625 ORGANIZATION WERE INVOLVED WITH 02:24:27.692 --> 02:24:29.460 THAT AND, YOU KNOW, HAD A DUTY 02:24:29.527 --> 02:24:32.263 OF CARE THAT THEY WOULD SUPPORT. 02:24:32.330 --> 02:24:34.098 AS YOU KNOW, THAT'S A THORNY, 02:24:34.165 --> 02:24:35.400 CONTENTIOUS ISSUE POLITICALLY. 02:24:35.466 --> 02:24:37.101 AND THANKFULLY, I THINK THAT 02:24:37.168 --> 02:24:39.137 THERE ARE A LOT OF WAYS TO HOLD 02:24:39.203 --> 02:24:40.204 THESE COMPANIES ACCOUNTABLE. 02:24:40.271 --> 02:24:41.672 UNDER EXISTING LAW, THERE HAVE 02:24:41.739 --> 02:24:43.441 BEEN SUCCESSFUL LAWSUITS FOR 02:24:43.508 --> 02:24:45.977 HARMS THAT THEY HAVE ENACTED. 02:24:46.044 --> 02:24:47.512 AND I THINK THE FRAMEWORK THAT 02:24:47.578 --> 02:24:49.580 WE LAID OUT WITH MINIMUM SAFETY 02:24:49.647 --> 02:24:50.448 STANDARDS THEY HAVE TO FOLLOW, 02:24:50.515 --> 02:24:51.749 AND THOSE WHO ARE ASSESSING 02:24:51.816 --> 02:24:53.518 RISK LEVELS CAN INFORM THE 02:24:53.584 --> 02:24:54.952 ASSESSMENT OF LIABILITY UNDER 02:24:55.019 --> 02:24:57.121 COMMON LAW IN WAYS THAT DON'T 02:24:57.188 --> 02:24:59.290 REQUIRE EXPLICIT CHANGES TO 02:24:59.357 --> 02:25:01.426 LIABILITY RULES, AND ALSO DON'T 02:25:01.492 --> 02:25:02.527 SHIELD THE COMPANIES FROM 02:25:02.593 --> 02:25:03.628 LIABILITY JUST BECAUSE THEY 02:25:03.694 --> 02:25:05.129 FOLLOW THE LAW. IT'S JUST ONE 02:25:05.196 --> 02:25:06.164 THING THAT COULD BE AN 02:25:06.230 --> 02:25:07.899 INDICATOR THAT THERE ARE, YOU 02:25:07.965 --> 02:25:09.200 KNOW, ESPECIALLY NEGLIGENT IF 02:25:09.267 --> 02:25:11.869 THEY DID NOT. THE REASON WE'VE 02:25:11.936 --> 02:25:14.439 CHOSEN TO FOCUS ON ON A 02:25:14.505 --> 02:25:16.541 DIFFERENT APPROACH, APART FROM 02:25:16.607 --> 02:25:19.811 THE THE THORNY POLITICAL, 02:25:19.877 --> 02:25:21.979 CONTENTIOUS PART OF IT IS THAT 02:25:22.046 --> 02:25:23.414 FIRST, THESE COMPANIES HAVE 02:25:23.481 --> 02:25:24.582 PROVEN THEMSELVES TO BE VERY 02:25:24.649 --> 02:25:27.351 RISK TOLERANT. RIGHT? THEY'RE 02:25:27.418 --> 02:25:28.820 THEY'VE THEY'RE TALKING OPENLY 02:25:28.886 --> 02:25:30.688 ABOUT PERCENT CHANCE OF, OF 02:25:30.755 --> 02:25:32.423 HUMAN EXTINCTION. RIGHT. AND IF 02:25:32.490 --> 02:25:33.224 THEY'RE WILLING TO BARGE 02:25:33.291 --> 02:25:34.859 THROUGH THAT, I'M NOT SURE THAT 02:25:34.926 --> 02:25:36.761 A LAWSUIT IS GOING TO BE THE 02:25:36.828 --> 02:25:38.162 THING THAT THAT RESTRAINS THEM. 02:25:38.229 --> 02:25:39.931 AND I ULTIMATELY DON'T WANT THE 02:25:39.997 --> 02:25:42.133 DAMAGES THAT THESE SYSTEMS 02:25:42.200 --> 02:25:43.935 COULD POTENTIALLY INFLICT TO BE 02:25:44.001 --> 02:25:45.036 BOUNDED BY THE COMPANY'S 02:25:45.103 --> 02:25:47.171 ABILITY TO PAY THE DAMAGES THEY 02:25:47.238 --> 02:25:48.239 HAVE. THEY'RE VERY WELL 02:25:48.306 --> 02:25:49.607 RESOURCED COMPANIES. I THINK IT 02:25:49.674 --> 02:25:51.142 SHOULD INSTEAD BE A PUBLIC 02:25:51.209 --> 02:25:53.277 DECISION ABOUT HOW MUCH RISK 02:25:53.344 --> 02:25:56.214 WE'RE WILLING TO ACCEPT. AND I 02:25:56.280 --> 02:25:58.649 THINK THAT THAT IS WHAT OUR 02:25:58.716 --> 02:26:01.252 MODEL IS DESIGNED TO TO ACHIEVE. 02:26:01.319 --> 02:26:04.088 SO, SORRY. LET ME JUST QUICKLY 02:26:04.155 --> 02:26:06.324 FOLLOW UP ON THIS POINT. SO BUT 02:26:06.390 --> 02:26:08.793 WHAT ABOUT EVERYBODY THAT IS 02:26:08.860 --> 02:26:10.928 UNDER YOUR MODEL UNDER FLOP 25. 02:26:10.995 --> 02:26:12.363 YEAH. LIKE WHAT ABOUT ALL THE 02:26:12.430 --> 02:26:14.165 REST OF AI? IF WE IF WE LEAVE 02:26:14.232 --> 02:26:15.600 THE EXISTING LIABILITY 02:26:15.666 --> 02:26:17.401 MECHANISM IN PLACE AND ITS 02:26:17.468 --> 02:26:19.570 AMBIGUITIES WITHOUT, WITHOUT, 02:26:19.637 --> 02:26:21.339 WITHOUT, WITHOUT INDEPENDENT 02:26:21.405 --> 02:26:23.107 TESTING, LIKE HOW DO, HOW DO WE 02:26:23.174 --> 02:26:24.208 GRAPPLE WITH THAT SIDE OF THE 02:26:24.275 --> 02:26:25.943 EQUATION? YEAH, ABSOLUTELY. DO 02:26:26.010 --> 02:26:27.845 NOT INTEND OUR APPROACH TO 02:26:27.912 --> 02:26:29.313 SOLVE THE LIABILITY ISSUE FOR, 02:26:29.380 --> 02:26:31.849 FOR ALL FOR ALL ISSUES. I THINK 02:26:31.916 --> 02:26:33.951 THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE, ARE 02:26:34.018 --> 02:26:35.186 AI HARMS THAT ARE BEYOND THE 02:26:35.253 --> 02:26:36.387 SCOPE OF WHAT OUR ORGANIZATION 02:26:36.454 --> 02:26:38.322 FOCUSES ON THAT I'M NOT GOING 02:26:38.389 --> 02:26:40.458 TO GOING TO WEIGH IN WITH A 02:26:40.525 --> 02:26:41.726 TAKE ON HOW WE SHOULD APPROACH 02:26:41.792 --> 02:26:43.594 IT. WE ALSO OFTEN GET QUESTIONS 02:26:43.661 --> 02:26:45.163 ON THE LIABILITY PIECE, EVEN 02:26:45.229 --> 02:26:47.465 WITHIN OUR OUR TYPES OF RISKS. 02:26:47.532 --> 02:26:48.766 AND I JUST WANTED TO SHARE OUR 02:26:48.833 --> 02:26:51.769 APPROACH ON THAT. OKAY. I HAVE 02:26:51.836 --> 02:26:52.670 TO SAY, I'VE BEEN THINKING 02:26:52.737 --> 02:26:54.372 ABOUT THIS MOMENT ALMOST LIKE A 02:26:54.438 --> 02:26:55.940 NINE OVER 11 MOMENT, BUT FOR 02:26:56.007 --> 02:26:56.774 CYBERSECURITY, THE SAME WAY 02:26:56.841 --> 02:26:58.409 THAT AFTER NINE OVER 11, WE 02:26:58.476 --> 02:26:59.577 LOOKED AT ALL THOSE PHYSICAL 02:26:59.644 --> 02:27:00.545 SPACES AND THOUGHT ABOUT 02:27:00.611 --> 02:27:01.546 HARDENING THEM AND CHANGING 02:27:01.612 --> 02:27:03.481 THEM IN WAYS TO, YOU KNOW, BE 02:27:03.548 --> 02:27:04.982 RESILIENT AGAINST POTENTIAL 02:27:05.049 --> 02:27:06.150 TERRORIST ATTACKS. I FEEL LIKE 02:27:06.217 --> 02:27:07.818 WE ARE LOOKING AT THE WEB RIGHT 02:27:07.885 --> 02:27:08.953 NOW WITH THE SAME TYPE OF 02:27:09.020 --> 02:27:10.721 VISION AND TRYING TO THINK 02:27:10.788 --> 02:27:12.723 ABOUT WHAT CAN WE DO. AND SO IN 02:27:12.790 --> 02:27:15.359 TERMS OF WHAT THE STATE CAN DO, 02:27:15.426 --> 02:27:18.262 I'M NOT SUPER. WELL READ ON HOW 02:27:18.329 --> 02:27:21.132 PRIVACY, CYBERSECURITY RISK 02:27:21.199 --> 02:27:23.634 ASSESSMENT PIECE, BUT I SUSPECT 02:27:23.701 --> 02:27:25.436 THAT IT PROBABLY REALLY DEALS 02:27:25.503 --> 02:27:29.073 WITH CONSUMER FACING ISSUES AND 02:27:29.140 --> 02:27:30.508 THINGS LIKE DATA BREACHES, FOR 02:27:30.575 --> 02:27:32.376 EXAMPLE. AND I SUSPECT THAT AS 02:27:32.443 --> 02:27:34.011 WE LOOK AT WHAT'S BEEN 02:27:34.078 --> 02:27:35.479 HAPPENING BEHIND THE SCENES AT 02:27:35.546 --> 02:27:37.782 THESE COMPANIES, YOU KNOW, 02:27:37.848 --> 02:27:38.683 WE'RE NOT DEALING WITH CONSUMER 02:27:38.749 --> 02:27:39.717 FACING TOOLS. WE'RE DEALING 02:27:39.784 --> 02:27:41.886 WITH R&D. AND SO, YOU KNOW, 02:27:41.953 --> 02:27:44.021 TRYING TO THINK ABOUT HOW TO 02:27:44.088 --> 02:27:47.692 BROADEN COMPANIES CYBERSECURITY 02:27:47.758 --> 02:27:48.292 RESPONSIBILITIES WITH RESPECT 02:27:48.359 --> 02:27:50.161 TO R&D SPECIFICALLY, AND NOT 02:27:50.228 --> 02:27:51.996 JUST ABOUT CONSUMER FACING 02:27:52.063 --> 02:27:52.830 PRODUCTS, IS PROBABLY A PIECE 02:27:52.897 --> 02:27:54.498 OF THE PUZZLE THAT WE NEED TO 02:27:54.565 --> 02:27:58.069 CONSIDER. I THINK THAT WOULD BE 02:27:58.135 --> 02:27:59.870 POTENTIALLY CONSEQUENTIAL. 02:27:59.937 --> 02:28:00.972 AGAIN, I MENTIONED EARLIER, I 02:28:01.038 --> 02:28:02.807 HAVE A POLICY BRIEF LOOKING AT 02:28:02.873 --> 02:28:04.909 THE CONSUMER CONTEXT FOR AI 02:28:04.976 --> 02:28:06.410 AGENTS. AND SO OBVIOUSLY 02:28:06.477 --> 02:28:07.845 THERE'S SO MANY ISSUES HERE. SO 02:28:07.912 --> 02:28:09.547 IF WE NARROW IT ALL AND THINK 02:28:09.614 --> 02:28:11.382 ABOUT JUST THE CONSUMER 02:28:11.449 --> 02:28:14.619 EXPERIENCE, FOR EXAMPLE, AGAIN, 02:28:14.685 --> 02:28:15.686 SOME OF THE THINGS YOU 02:28:15.753 --> 02:28:16.787 MENTIONED IN PASSING, YOU KNOW, 02:28:16.854 --> 02:28:19.423 DO WE HOW DO WE IDENTIFY AGENTS, 02:28:19.490 --> 02:28:20.791 YOU KNOW, WHAT KIND OF 02:28:20.858 --> 02:28:22.560 LICENSING REGIME MIGHT WE WANT? 02:28:22.627 --> 02:28:24.362 WHAT FIDUCIARY DUTIES IN 02:28:24.428 --> 02:28:26.163 PARTICULAR, WHAT CONTEXTS? 02:28:26.230 --> 02:28:27.598 MEDICAL BANKING, FOR EXAMPLE. 02:28:27.665 --> 02:28:29.734 THOSE ALL SEEM LIKE AREAS WHERE 02:28:29.800 --> 02:28:31.269 THE STAKES ARE REALLY HIGH. AND 02:28:31.335 --> 02:28:32.603 SO COMPANIES SHOULD NOT BE 02:28:32.670 --> 02:28:34.472 INTRODUCING AI AGENTS WITHOUT 02:28:34.538 --> 02:28:36.207 SOME CLEAR LEGAL RESPONSIBILITY. 02:28:36.274 --> 02:28:38.075 IF IF THE AGENTS GET THINGS 02:28:38.142 --> 02:28:39.510 WRONG OR, YOU KNOW, 02:28:39.577 --> 02:28:41.279 ACCIDENTALLY MAKE A TRADE OR 02:28:41.345 --> 02:28:43.447 EMPTY YOUR BANK ACCOUNT, YOU 02:28:43.514 --> 02:28:44.882 KNOW, YOU WANT YOU WANT THOSE 02:28:44.949 --> 02:28:46.317 THOSE STAKES TO BE EXTREMELY 02:28:46.384 --> 02:28:47.785 CLEAR. SO I THINK THOSE ARE 02:28:47.852 --> 02:28:49.420 AREAS THAT WE, I MEAN, 02:28:49.487 --> 02:28:50.421 OBVIOUSLY, IT DOESN'T SOLVE 02:28:50.488 --> 02:28:51.522 THIS LARGER SAFETY ISSUE THAT 02:28:51.589 --> 02:28:52.556 WE'RE CONCERNED ABOUT TODAY. 02:28:52.623 --> 02:28:53.691 BUT I DO THINK THERE ARE 02:28:53.758 --> 02:28:55.559 THERE'S A LOT OF LOW HANGING 02:28:55.626 --> 02:28:56.694 FRUIT WE CAN THINK ABOUT IN 02:28:56.761 --> 02:28:58.562 TERMS OF HOW TO REALLY NARROW 02:28:58.629 --> 02:29:00.431 IN ON SOME OF THESE MORE KIND 02:29:00.498 --> 02:29:03.934 OF URGENT DAILY ISSUES. THANKS. 02:29:04.001 --> 02:29:05.770 ANY MORE QUESTIONS, SENATOR 02:29:05.836 --> 02:29:14.745 BECKER? SIR JOSHUA, HOW DO YOU. 02:29:14.812 --> 02:29:17.248 UNDERSTAND THAT THE THE RATE OF 02:29:17.315 --> 02:29:18.749 PROGRESS IN ADVANCING THESE 02:29:18.816 --> 02:29:21.252 MODEL CAPABILITIES COMPARED TO 02:29:21.319 --> 02:29:23.054 OUR PROGRESS IN UNDERSTANDING 02:29:23.120 --> 02:29:28.092 THEM? I THINK THE PROGRESS IN 02:29:28.159 --> 02:29:30.227 CAPABILITIES IS DEFINITELY 02:29:30.294 --> 02:29:32.396 OUTSTRIPPING OUR ABILITY TO 02:29:32.463 --> 02:29:33.397 CONFIDENTLY PREDICT HOW THESE 02:29:33.464 --> 02:29:35.266 MODELS WILL BEHAVE OR WHAT 02:29:35.333 --> 02:29:36.734 TYPES OF ADVANCES THEY'LL 02:29:36.801 --> 02:29:38.569 GENERATE IN OTHER FIELDS. SO I 02:29:38.636 --> 02:29:40.471 THINK AT THE MOMENT WE HAVE 02:29:40.538 --> 02:29:41.405 LESS UNDERSTANDING THAN WE 02:29:41.472 --> 02:29:43.908 OUGHT TO. I THINK A NEW FOCUS 02:29:43.974 --> 02:29:45.009 ON THAT LEVEL OF UNDERSTANDING 02:29:45.076 --> 02:29:47.511 WOULD BE EXTREMELY HELPFUL. 02:29:47.578 --> 02:29:49.313 COMING BACK AGAIN TO WHAT CAN 02:29:49.380 --> 02:29:52.550 CALIFORNIA DO? I THINK IF WE 02:29:52.616 --> 02:29:54.485 CAN FIND A SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT 02:29:54.552 --> 02:29:56.153 OF COMPUTE TO EMPOWER OUR 02:29:56.220 --> 02:29:57.355 UNIVERSITIES WITH SO THAT THEY 02:29:57.421 --> 02:29:59.056 CAN BE ACTIVELY RESEARCHING AI 02:29:59.123 --> 02:30:01.092 SAFETY TOPICS AND FORECASTING 02:30:01.158 --> 02:30:02.760 FOR AI IMPACTS, BEYOND JUST 02:30:02.827 --> 02:30:04.128 WORKING DIRECTLY ON QUESTIONS 02:30:04.195 --> 02:30:05.529 LIKE INTERPRETABILITY OR 02:30:05.596 --> 02:30:06.464 ALIGNMENT, WHICH ARE CRITICAL 02:30:06.530 --> 02:30:07.998 AND HAVE TO BE A PART OF ANY 02:30:08.065 --> 02:30:09.467 SOUND RESEARCH AGENDA HERE, BUT 02:30:09.533 --> 02:30:11.268 ALSO FORECASTING WHAT WILL BE 02:30:11.335 --> 02:30:12.269 THE TECHNICAL DEVELOPMENTS IN 02:30:12.336 --> 02:30:13.371 OTHER FIELDS THAT WILL BE 02:30:13.437 --> 02:30:14.905 HIGHLY IMPACTFUL AND 02:30:14.972 --> 02:30:15.940 CONSEQUENTIAL. WE CAN USE 02:30:16.006 --> 02:30:17.041 COMPUTE TO BE STUDYING THESE 02:30:17.108 --> 02:30:18.242 ISSUES, AND I WOULD REALLY WANT 02:30:18.309 --> 02:30:19.377 TO EMPOWER OUR UNIVERSITIES 02:30:19.443 --> 02:30:24.215 WITH COMPUTE TO DO THAT. YEAH. 02:30:24.281 --> 02:30:25.983 AND REQUIRING THAT SAFETY 02:30:26.050 --> 02:30:28.052 RESEARCH AND HELPING ACADEMICS 02:30:28.119 --> 02:30:32.523 ALSO DO THAT. YES. WHEN THIS 02:30:32.590 --> 02:30:34.959 QUESTION MAYBE, MAYBE I DON'T 02:30:35.025 --> 02:30:36.861 KNOW IF YOU'D HAVE AN OPINION 02:30:36.927 --> 02:30:38.229 ON THIS TO THE. MY 02:30:38.295 --> 02:30:40.431 UNDERSTANDING IS THAT THAT OPUS 02:30:40.498 --> 02:30:43.300 5.5 ACTUALLY REQUESTS FROM OPUS 02:30:43.367 --> 02:30:44.769 FIVE IN KIND OF REFUSAL 02:30:44.835 --> 02:30:45.836 BEHAVIOR FOR SURVEILLANCE 02:30:45.903 --> 02:30:47.972 RELATED REQUESTS. LIKE THIS WAS 02:30:48.038 --> 02:30:49.206 A DOCUMENT HERE ABOUT THAT I 02:30:49.273 --> 02:30:55.246 WAS READING THROUGH. AND THEN 02:30:55.312 --> 02:30:56.981 THE SAFE DIFFERENCE CAME FROM 02:30:57.047 --> 02:30:58.849 KIND OF THINGS ANCILLARY TO THE 02:30:58.916 --> 02:31:01.986 MODEL ITSELF. SO, SO I GUESS, 02:31:02.052 --> 02:31:03.120 YOU KNOW, DO YOU BELIEVE 02:31:03.187 --> 02:31:04.188 THERE'S SOME RISK INHERENT IN 02:31:04.255 --> 02:31:06.490 THESE SYSTEMS? IS THAT WHAT 02:31:06.557 --> 02:31:08.225 YOU'RE ONE OF THE THINGS YOU'RE 02:31:08.292 --> 02:31:09.560 PROBING? I'M SORRY, COULD YOU 02:31:09.627 --> 02:31:12.830 CLARIFY THE QUESTION? WELL, ARE 02:31:12.897 --> 02:31:14.732 YOU AWARE OF THIS THIS PAPER 02:31:14.799 --> 02:31:16.801 SAYING THAT IN OPUS 5.5 02:31:16.867 --> 02:31:17.668 ACTUALLY REQUESTS FROM OPUS 02:31:17.735 --> 02:31:19.336 FIVE IN TERMS OF REFUSING 02:31:19.403 --> 02:31:21.105 BEHAVIOR FOR SURVEILLANCE 02:31:21.172 --> 02:31:21.972 RELATED REQUESTS? SO PEOPLE 02:31:22.039 --> 02:31:24.708 MADE REQUESTS TO SURVEIL OTHER 02:31:24.775 --> 02:31:25.910 PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, REQUESTS FOR 02:31:25.976 --> 02:31:27.611 BAD BEHAVIOR. AND ACTUALLY THE 02:31:27.678 --> 02:31:29.079 MODEL ACTUALLY REGRESSED IN 02:31:29.146 --> 02:31:31.549 TERMS OF FROM A PREVIOUS 02:31:31.615 --> 02:31:35.152 VERSION IN TERMS OF. OF 02:31:35.219 --> 02:31:38.956 REFUSING THOSE, THE KIND OF THE 02:31:39.023 --> 02:31:40.858 SYSTEM CARD. SO I DON'T KNOW, 02:31:40.925 --> 02:31:42.726 I'M JUST TRYING TO, AS A POINT, 02:31:42.793 --> 02:31:43.894 YOU KNOW, JUST, I GUESS I'M 02:31:43.961 --> 02:31:45.729 TRYING TO UNDERSTAND HOW OR GET 02:31:45.796 --> 02:31:46.897 A PERSPECTIVE ON HOW MUCH THE 02:31:46.964 --> 02:31:49.600 RISK IS, WE BELIEVE IS INHERENT 02:31:49.667 --> 02:31:52.036 IN THESE MODELS THEMSELVES. AND, 02:31:52.102 --> 02:31:54.605 YOU KNOW, HOW DO WE THINK ABOUT 02:31:54.672 --> 02:31:56.807 SAFETY IN REGARDS TO IS IT 02:31:56.874 --> 02:31:58.075 STUFF WE LAYER ON TOP? YOU KNOW, 02:31:58.142 --> 02:31:59.977 IS IT THE IS IT, IS IT THE 02:32:00.044 --> 02:32:01.879 AUDITING? IS THE OTHER PIECE OR 02:32:01.946 --> 02:32:03.814 IS IT IS THERE'S THINGS WE CAN 02:32:03.881 --> 02:32:08.319 THINGS THAT WE CAN. YOU KNOW, 02:32:08.385 --> 02:32:09.053 INCLUDE OR MANDATE OR 02:32:09.119 --> 02:32:10.120 UNDERSTAND ABOUT THE MODELS 02:32:10.187 --> 02:32:10.855 THEMSELVES. DOES THAT MAKE 02:32:10.921 --> 02:32:12.690 SENSE? YES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH, 02:32:12.756 --> 02:32:14.058 SENATOR. REALLY GOOD QUESTION. 02:32:14.124 --> 02:32:16.227 THE FIRST THING TO SAY IS THAT 02:32:16.293 --> 02:32:17.661 THERE'S NO CLEAR RECIPE. 02:32:17.728 --> 02:32:19.463 THERE'S NO IF YOU DO X, THEN 02:32:19.530 --> 02:32:20.664 THE MODEL WILL ALWAYS REFUSE TO 02:32:20.731 --> 02:32:22.366 SURVEIL PEOPLE OR WILL ALWAYS 02:32:22.433 --> 02:32:23.434 REJECT THESE KINDS OF BAD 02:32:23.501 --> 02:32:24.869 ACTIONS. WE DON'T HAVE ANY 02:32:24.935 --> 02:32:27.071 KINDS OF RECIPES LIKE THAT AT 02:32:27.137 --> 02:32:28.472 THE PRESENT. WHAT WE HAVE 02:32:28.539 --> 02:32:30.007 INSTEAD IS THE ABILITY TO VARY 02:32:30.074 --> 02:32:32.076 THE TRAINING DATA, TO VARY THE 02:32:32.142 --> 02:32:32.910 REINFORCEMENT LEARNING THAT'S 02:32:32.977 --> 02:32:34.912 DONE TO VARY THOSE PROCEDURES 02:32:34.979 --> 02:32:36.380 AND TO OBSERVE THE EFFECTS OF 02:32:36.447 --> 02:32:38.916 THAT. AND, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT 02:32:38.983 --> 02:32:39.783 FAMILIAR WITH THE SPECIFIC 02:32:39.850 --> 02:32:41.418 DETAIL YOU MENTIONED ABOUT 5.5, 02:32:41.485 --> 02:32:43.921 BUT IT'S NOT SURPRISING TO ME 02:32:43.988 --> 02:32:45.756 AS YOU BUILD A NEW MODEL, SOME 02:32:45.823 --> 02:32:46.924 THINGS GET BETTER. SOME THINGS 02:32:46.991 --> 02:32:48.058 WILL SOMETIMES GET A LITTLE 02:32:48.125 --> 02:32:50.794 WORSE. AND THAT'S KIND OF 02:32:50.861 --> 02:32:52.596 WHAT'S EXPECTED RIGHT NOW. I 02:32:52.663 --> 02:32:54.565 THINK IT WOULD BE GREAT IF WE 02:32:54.632 --> 02:32:55.599 HAD A DEEPER UNDERSTANDING, A 02:32:55.666 --> 02:32:56.567 MORE FUNDAMENTAL UNDERSTANDING 02:32:56.634 --> 02:32:58.269 OF WHAT CAUSED THESE BEHAVIORS. 02:32:58.335 --> 02:32:59.570 AT THE PRESENT TIME, WE DON'T, 02:32:59.637 --> 02:33:01.205 AND IT DOESN'T FEEL TO ME LIKE 02:33:01.272 --> 02:33:04.842 WE'RE VERY CLOSE TO IT EITHER. 02:33:04.909 --> 02:33:06.243 OKAY. THANK YOU. I CAN ADD ON 02:33:06.310 --> 02:33:07.745 THAT SURVEILLANCE QUESTION. I 02:33:07.811 --> 02:33:09.513 HAVE TWO LINES OF RESEARCH IN 02:33:09.580 --> 02:33:11.649 THIS AREA RIGHT NOW. ONE IS 02:33:11.715 --> 02:33:13.817 ACTUALLY TRYING TO USE THESE 02:33:13.884 --> 02:33:15.953 PRODUCTION MODELS TO BUILD 02:33:16.020 --> 02:33:17.154 INDIVIDUAL SURVEILLANCE TOOLS 02:33:17.221 --> 02:33:18.689 TO SEE HOW SUCCESSFUL WE CAN BE 02:33:18.756 --> 02:33:22.026 IN DOING IT. AND, YOU KNOW, I 02:33:22.092 --> 02:33:23.494 HAVE AN UNDERGRADUATE RESEARCH 02:33:23.561 --> 02:33:24.628 ASSISTANT WORKING WITH ME WHO 02:33:24.695 --> 02:33:26.030 IS VERY SUCCESSFULLY ABLE 02:33:26.096 --> 02:33:27.431 ALREADY TO GET ONE OF THE 02:33:27.498 --> 02:33:28.599 MODELS TO BASICALLY SAY, WELL, 02:33:28.666 --> 02:33:30.367 I SHOULDN'T DO THAT, BUT HERE'S 02:33:30.434 --> 02:33:31.535 EXACTLY HOW TO DO THAT. AND 02:33:31.602 --> 02:33:33.370 SHE'S ALREADY KIND OF BUILT A 02:33:33.437 --> 02:33:34.838 PROOF OF CONCEPT FOR ME JUST IN 02:33:34.905 --> 02:33:36.840 THE LAST FEW WEEKS. SO JUST TO 02:33:36.907 --> 02:33:39.376 SAY, YEAH, IT'S A REAL ONGOING 02:33:39.443 --> 02:33:40.444 CONCERN. OF COURSE, AGAIN, I 02:33:40.511 --> 02:33:42.279 HAVE NO TRANSPARENCY INTO WHY 02:33:42.346 --> 02:33:44.381 THIS IS POSSIBLE, BUT IT'S 02:33:44.448 --> 02:33:46.250 TRIVIAL. THE SECOND PIECE AGAIN, 02:33:46.317 --> 02:33:47.685 LIKE HOW DO WE KNOW INHERENTLY 02:33:47.751 --> 02:33:49.119 WHY THESE MODELS MAKE THE 02:33:49.186 --> 02:33:49.853 DECISIONS THEY DO. I HAVE 02:33:49.920 --> 02:33:51.455 ANOTHER LINE OF RESEARCH AGAIN 02:33:51.522 --> 02:33:53.057 LOOKING AT, YOU KNOW, WHAT WE 02:33:53.123 --> 02:33:54.224 CALL DARK PATTERNS, THIS KIND 02:33:54.291 --> 02:33:55.659 OF ONLINE MANIPULATION SPACE 02:33:55.726 --> 02:33:57.394 AND THE CONSUMER CONTEXT WHERE, 02:33:57.461 --> 02:33:58.829 AGAIN, I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND 02:33:58.896 --> 02:34:00.598 KIND OF AT AN ESSENTIAL LEVEL 02:34:00.664 --> 02:34:03.133 HOW THESE MODELS BASICALLY MAY 02:34:03.200 --> 02:34:04.635 MANIPULATE USERS DEPENDING ON 02:34:04.702 --> 02:34:06.704 WHAT TYPE OF PROMPTING I GIVE 02:34:06.770 --> 02:34:08.072 THEM. AND THAT RESEARCH RIGHT 02:34:08.138 --> 02:34:09.807 NOW IS ONGOING. BUT AGAIN, IT 02:34:09.873 --> 02:34:12.509 APPEARS THAT I CAN VERY EASILY 02:34:12.576 --> 02:34:13.544 MANIPULATE THE TYPE OF 02:34:13.611 --> 02:34:15.346 RESPONSES THEY THEY GIVE US 02:34:15.412 --> 02:34:17.381 BASED ON KIND OF INTRODUCING 02:34:17.448 --> 02:34:18.649 THESE KIND OF CLASSIC DARK 02:34:18.716 --> 02:34:19.717 PATTERNS THAT WE ALREADY ARE 02:34:19.783 --> 02:34:21.518 AWARE FROM THE KIND OF EXISTING 02:34:21.585 --> 02:34:25.823 CONSUMER CONTEXT. YEAH. OKAY. 02:34:25.889 --> 02:34:29.660 WELL THANK YOU. YOU KNOW, ADS, 02:34:29.727 --> 02:34:32.229 ADS TO, TO, TO THE CONCERN. BUT, 02:34:32.296 --> 02:34:33.998 YOU KNOW, THAT'S AT A VERY 02:34:34.064 --> 02:34:35.499 BASIC LEVEL. WE NEED TO BE ABLE 02:34:35.566 --> 02:34:38.636 TO HOLD THESE MODELS 02:34:38.702 --> 02:34:42.973 ACCOUNTABLE FOR ISSUES LIKE YOU 02:34:43.040 --> 02:34:47.344 RAISE MAY HAVE 1 OR 2 MORE 02:34:47.411 --> 02:34:48.412 ABOUT. SENATOR, TURN IT BACK TO 02:34:48.479 --> 02:34:54.551 YOU. NO FURTHER QUESTIONS. ALL 02:34:54.618 --> 02:34:58.122 RIGHT. WELL, I VERY MUCH 02:34:58.188 --> 02:35:00.290 APPRECIATE ALL OF OUR WITNESSES 02:35:00.357 --> 02:35:02.726 TODAY ELUCIDATING MANY OF THESE 02:35:02.793 --> 02:35:04.294 ISSUES. ONE OF THE POINTS OF 02:35:04.361 --> 02:35:05.996 THE OF TODAY'S HEARING IS TO 02:35:06.063 --> 02:35:10.000 BOTH SPOTLIGHT THE THE, THE 02:35:10.067 --> 02:35:12.503 MIND BOGGLING UNCERTAINTIES, 02:35:12.569 --> 02:35:13.937 PACE OF CHANGE. ALL THE ALL, 02:35:14.004 --> 02:35:15.406 ALL, ALL OF WHICH HAS BECOME, 02:35:15.472 --> 02:35:16.440 YOU KNOW, REINFORCED IN THIS 02:35:16.507 --> 02:35:19.043 HEARING AND AT THE SAME TIME TO 02:35:19.109 --> 02:35:21.879 REMIND OURSELVES AND THAT AND 02:35:21.945 --> 02:35:24.782 TO, TO GIVE THE GOVERNMENT THE 02:35:24.848 --> 02:35:28.018 CONFIDENCE TO ACT. THESE ARE 02:35:28.085 --> 02:35:29.653 VERY FINE BALANCE FOR US ALWAYS 02:35:29.720 --> 02:35:31.622 TO ACHIEVE IS TO HAVE THE 02:35:31.689 --> 02:35:32.423 HUMILITY TO UNDERSTAND WE DO 02:35:32.489 --> 02:35:34.825 NOT HAVE EVERY ANSWER. AND WE 02:35:34.892 --> 02:35:36.694 DEFINITELY DON'T HAVE 10,000 02:35:36.760 --> 02:35:38.095 ANSWERS TO TO LEGISLATE INTO 02:35:38.162 --> 02:35:39.963 LAW, WHILE ALSO NOT FEELING AS 02:35:40.030 --> 02:35:41.165 THOUGH WE DON'T KNOW ENOUGH TO 02:35:41.231 --> 02:35:43.000 DO ANYTHING. AND IF WE JUST 02:35:43.067 --> 02:35:44.134 WAIT TILL SOME RESEARCHER OR 02:35:44.201 --> 02:35:45.869 SOMEBODY ELSE TELLS US, OR A 02:35:45.936 --> 02:35:47.538 COURT DECIDES THAT AND WE DON'T 02:35:47.604 --> 02:35:49.273 GET TO LIVE IN EITHER OF THOSE 02:35:49.339 --> 02:35:51.775 MORE COMFORTABLE WORLDS. AND, 02:35:51.842 --> 02:35:52.976 AND I, AND I, AND I THINK 02:35:53.043 --> 02:35:54.778 YOU'VE HELPED US TO ACCOMPLISH 02:35:54.845 --> 02:35:56.513 THAT TODAY. I THINK WE ARE WE 02:35:56.580 --> 02:35:57.915 ARE MORE KNOWLEDGEABLE. WE ARE 02:35:57.981 --> 02:35:58.982 SMARTER ABOUT SOME OF THE 02:35:59.049 --> 02:36:01.852 ISSUES AND THE TRADE OFFS. WE 02:36:01.919 --> 02:36:03.320 WILL NOT ACHIEVE PERFECT 02:36:03.387 --> 02:36:04.755 KNOWLEDGE. BUT, YOU KNOW, I 02:36:04.822 --> 02:36:06.490 VOTE ON LEGISLATION HERE. I'LL 02:36:06.557 --> 02:36:08.692 GIVE A LITTLE SECRET ABOUT 02:36:08.759 --> 02:36:10.160 BARBERING AND COSMETOLOGY. I 02:36:10.227 --> 02:36:11.795 BARELY HAVE ANY HAIR. I CAN'T 02:36:11.862 --> 02:36:12.896 BRAID ANYONE'S HAIR, I DON'T 02:36:12.963 --> 02:36:14.031 KNOW. IT'S TO ME THAT'S AS 02:36:14.098 --> 02:36:16.633 MYSTERIOUS AS LARGE LANGUAGE 02:36:16.700 --> 02:36:19.103 MODEL WITH NEUROSYMBOLIC 02:36:19.169 --> 02:36:20.537 CHARACTERISTICS. THAT'S JUST AS 02:36:20.604 --> 02:36:22.339 MYSTERIOUS. WE STILL DO IT. I 02:36:22.406 --> 02:36:24.541 STILL VOTE ON IT. AND THAT IS 02:36:24.608 --> 02:36:25.976 BOTH OUR OBLIGATION, OUR 02:36:26.043 --> 02:36:26.643 RESPONSIBILITY, AND OUR 02:36:26.710 --> 02:36:28.579 PRIVILEGE TO, TO, TO, TO ACT IN 02:36:28.645 --> 02:36:31.115 THAT SPACE. AND SO THE THAT'S 02:36:31.181 --> 02:36:32.750 THE POINT OF THIS SERIES IS NOT 02:36:32.816 --> 02:36:34.551 TO RESOLVE EVERY ISSUE. IT IS 02:36:34.618 --> 02:36:36.086 TO TO REMIND US WHAT WE DON'T 02:36:36.153 --> 02:36:37.921 KNOW, AND THEN TO PROCEED WITH 02:36:37.988 --> 02:36:39.256 CONFIDENCE THAT WE MUST TAKE 02:36:39.323 --> 02:36:40.224 ACTION FOR ALL THE REASONS THAT 02:36:40.290 --> 02:36:42.126 HAVE BEEN HAVE BEEN DESCRIBED. 02:36:42.192 --> 02:36:44.261 AND I HOPE IN. AND I'M 02:36:44.328 --> 02:36:46.797 COMMITTED TO DOING SO IN A 02:36:46.864 --> 02:36:48.966 THOUGHTFUL BUT URGENT, 02:36:49.032 --> 02:36:51.502 COMPREHENSIVE BUT BUT FLEXIBLE 02:36:51.568 --> 02:36:52.903 AND ADAPTIVE APPROACH TO 02:36:52.970 --> 02:36:54.371 ACCOMPLISH THAT. I'LL JUST 02:36:54.438 --> 02:36:55.305 REINFORCE. I DON'T THINK WE 02:36:55.372 --> 02:36:56.874 NEED 10,000 PIECES OF 02:36:56.940 --> 02:36:57.641 LEGISLATION. I'M JUST I'M 02:36:57.708 --> 02:37:01.211 BEGGING MY COLLEAGUES AND AND 02:37:01.278 --> 02:37:04.148 TO UNDERSTAND HOW, WHERE THE 02:37:04.214 --> 02:37:05.549 THE CHALLENGES AND THE 02:37:05.616 --> 02:37:08.418 OPPORTUNITIES REALLY ARE HERE. 02:37:08.485 --> 02:37:10.587 I THINK IT'S, IT'S QUITE COMMON 02:37:10.654 --> 02:37:12.723 IN OUR SOCIETY FOR FOLKS TO 02:37:12.790 --> 02:37:14.224 THINK ABOUT THIS ISSUE AS A, AS 02:37:14.291 --> 02:37:15.993 AN ENGINEERING OR SOFTWARE 02:37:16.059 --> 02:37:18.929 PROGRAMING. ONE. AND I. AND SO 02:37:18.996 --> 02:37:21.398 I HOPE WE DON'T, WE, WE DON'T 02:37:21.465 --> 02:37:22.633 LEAD OURSELVES INTO THINKING 02:37:22.699 --> 02:37:25.002 THAT OUR JOB HERE IS BY STATUTE, 02:37:25.068 --> 02:37:27.871 TO PROGRAM ARTIFICIAL 02:37:27.938 --> 02:37:28.972 INTELLIGENCE IN A PARTICULAR 02:37:29.039 --> 02:37:30.340 WAY. BECAUSE AS YOU'VE 02:37:30.407 --> 02:37:31.475 REINFORCED FOR US, ALL OF YOU 02:37:31.542 --> 02:37:33.343 TODAY, THAT THAT'S NOT HOW IT 02:37:33.410 --> 02:37:36.213 WORKS. WE CANNOT RELIABLY, 100% 02:37:36.280 --> 02:37:37.314 OF THE TIME, WE'RE NOT GIVING 02:37:37.381 --> 02:37:38.949 IT. WE'RE NOT GIVING IT ALL OF 02:37:39.016 --> 02:37:41.185 ITS PROGRAMING INSTRUCTIONS. 02:37:41.251 --> 02:37:43.353 AND THEREFORE, IT'S MORE 02:37:43.420 --> 02:37:44.421 CHALLENGING FOR US TO THINK 02:37:44.488 --> 02:37:46.390 ABOUT HOW TO, HOW TO ACHIEVE 02:37:46.456 --> 02:37:47.925 THE PUBLIC POLICY GOALS THAT WE 02:37:47.991 --> 02:37:49.059 THAT WE'RE TRYING TO ACHIEVE. 02:37:49.126 --> 02:37:50.861 DOESN'T MEAN THAT WE CAN'T. BUT 02:37:50.928 --> 02:37:52.095 IT DOES MEAN THAT A SIMPLE ONE 02:37:52.162 --> 02:37:53.964 SENTENCE BILL THAT SAYS AI WILL 02:37:54.031 --> 02:37:55.566 DO THIS EXACT THING ALL THE 02:37:55.632 --> 02:37:58.135 TIME IN THIS VERY. BUT ONLY IN 02:37:58.202 --> 02:37:59.803 ELEMENTARY SCHOOLS AND ONLY IN 02:37:59.870 --> 02:38:01.471 RURAL COMMUNITIES, IS NOT GOING 02:38:01.538 --> 02:38:03.507 TO BE A SUFFICIENT ANSWER THAT 02:38:03.574 --> 02:38:05.242 WE NEED. WE DO NEED TO REMAIN 02:38:05.309 --> 02:38:06.710 FOCUSED ON SOME OF THESE LARGER 02:38:06.777 --> 02:38:08.178 QUESTIONS AROUND PRIVACY, 02:38:08.245 --> 02:38:09.613 AROUND CATASTROPHIC RISK, 02:38:09.680 --> 02:38:11.081 AROUND MANY OF THE TOPICS THAT 02:38:11.148 --> 02:38:12.149 WE'VE WE'VE, WE'VE ADDRESSED 02:38:12.216 --> 02:38:14.585 TODAY WHILE ALSO DEALING WITH 02:38:14.651 --> 02:38:15.819 THE, WITH THE IMPLICATIONS THAT 02:38:15.886 --> 02:38:17.554 WE'RE FEELING, WE'RE FEELING IN 02:38:17.621 --> 02:38:19.356 SOCIETY AT THE MOMENT AND THE 02:38:19.423 --> 02:38:20.424 ANXIETY AND THE WORRIES THAT 02:38:20.490 --> 02:38:22.659 THAT CALIFORNIANS FAIL ON A, ON 02:38:22.726 --> 02:38:24.394 A, ON A WIDESPREAD BASIS. SO 02:38:24.461 --> 02:38:26.196 IT'S BEEN VERY HELPFUL. THE 02:38:26.263 --> 02:38:27.297 TESTIMONY TODAY, I WANT TO 02:38:27.364 --> 02:38:28.365 EXCUSE THE PANEL BECAUSE WE'RE 02:38:28.432 --> 02:38:30.801 NOW GOING TO INVITE PUBLIC 02:38:30.868 --> 02:38:34.204 COMMENT. AND I KNOW WE HAVE 02:38:34.271 --> 02:38:35.205 SOME FOR FOR TODAY'S HEARING. 02:38:35.272 --> 02:38:36.974 THANK YOU. THANK YOU. AND SO AS 02:38:37.040 --> 02:38:38.175 THE PANEL, THANK YOU AGAIN VERY 02:38:38.242 --> 02:38:39.910 MUCH. APPRECIATE YOUR EXPERTISE 02:38:39.977 --> 02:38:41.078 AND YOU SPENDING THE TIME WITH 02:38:41.144 --> 02:38:42.980 US TODAY. WE ASK MEMBERS OF THE 02:38:43.046 --> 02:38:44.114 PUBLIC WHO WISH TO PROVIDE 02:38:44.181 --> 02:38:45.916 COMMENTS TO PLEASE COME TO THE 02:38:45.983 --> 02:38:47.017 MICROPHONE THAT'S NEAR THE 02:38:47.084 --> 02:38:54.725 SERGEANT'S DESK TO DO SO. THANK 02:38:54.791 --> 02:38:56.393 YOU, CHAIR MEMBERS, FOR HOSTING 02:38:56.460 --> 02:38:58.295 THIS HEARING. SAVVY CHRISTIAN. 02:38:58.362 --> 02:38:59.363 DIRECTOR OF CALIFORNIA POLICY 02:38:59.429 --> 02:39:01.832 FOR ENCODE. PROUD CO-SPONSOR 02:39:01.899 --> 02:39:03.367 ALONG WITH SECURE AI PROJECT OF 02:39:03.433 --> 02:39:06.904 SB 53 LAST YEAR. I WON'T 02:39:06.970 --> 02:39:08.071 BELABOR THE POINT, BUT I'D JUST 02:39:08.138 --> 02:39:10.474 LIKE TO ECHO THE COMMENTS OF MY 02:39:10.540 --> 02:39:11.909 COLLEAGUE ANDREW DORIS FROM THE 02:39:11.975 --> 02:39:13.477 SECURITY PROJECT. THE PROBLEM 02:39:13.543 --> 02:39:16.280 IS INCREDIBLY URGENT. WE'VE 02:39:16.346 --> 02:39:18.048 BEEN GIVEN, EFFECTIVELY A 02:39:18.115 --> 02:39:20.217 WARNING SHOT THE PAST, YOU KNOW, 02:39:20.284 --> 02:39:21.084 YEAR WITH SOME OF THE INCIDENTS 02:39:21.151 --> 02:39:23.387 THAT WE'VE SEEN. BUT OUR 02:39:23.453 --> 02:39:25.188 ORGANIZATION, MANY CALIFORNIANS, 02:39:25.255 --> 02:39:27.124 MANY HUMANS, FRANKLY, ARE 02:39:27.190 --> 02:39:28.292 WORRIED THAT WE'RE NOT GOING TO 02:39:28.358 --> 02:39:30.060 GET ANOTHER WARNING SHOT. SO 02:39:30.127 --> 02:39:31.128 WE'RE VERY HEARTENED TO SEE 02:39:31.194 --> 02:39:32.462 THAT THE LEGISLATURE IS GIVING 02:39:32.529 --> 02:39:33.530 THIS ISSUE THE ATTENTION THAT 02:39:33.597 --> 02:39:35.699 IT NEEDS. AND WE LOOK FORWARD 02:39:35.766 --> 02:39:37.467 TO ENGAGING WITH YOU ALL IN THE 02:39:37.534 --> 02:39:38.969 COMING MONTHS, HOPEFULLY. THANK 02:39:39.036 --> 02:39:42.072 YOU. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. AND 02:39:42.139 --> 02:39:45.776 LET ME JUST SAY. I MENTIONED 02:39:45.842 --> 02:39:48.178 EARLIER HOW HOW GRATEFUL I KNOW 02:39:48.245 --> 02:39:49.713 I AM, BUT THAT THE YOU KNOW, 02:39:49.780 --> 02:39:51.548 THAT ALL OF US ARE TO SENATOR 02:39:51.615 --> 02:39:53.283 WIENER FOR HIS LEADERSHIP ON ON 02:39:53.350 --> 02:39:56.119 THIS ISSUE. AND WHEN MOST OF US 02:39:56.186 --> 02:39:57.220 DIDN'T REALLY HAVE OUR HANDS 02:39:57.287 --> 02:39:58.755 AROUND IT, AND MAYBE HE DIDN'T 02:39:58.822 --> 02:40:00.190 EITHER, BUT AT LEAST HE WAS 02:40:00.257 --> 02:40:02.059 TRYING. AND HIS INCREDIBLE WORK 02:40:02.125 --> 02:40:04.494 ON BOTH. 1047 AND 53 AND AND 02:40:04.561 --> 02:40:06.296 ELSEWHERE. BUT OF COURSE I. HE 02:40:06.363 --> 02:40:07.698 WOULD BE THE FIRST ONE TO 02:40:07.764 --> 02:40:09.132 EMPHASIZE THE BOTH OF YOU 02:40:09.199 --> 02:40:10.801 HAVING BEEN HAVING WORKED FOR 02:40:10.867 --> 02:40:12.102 HIM. BUT BUT IN CODE AND OTHERS, 02:40:12.169 --> 02:40:13.470 SECURITY PROJECT AND OTHERS, 02:40:13.537 --> 02:40:14.538 OTHER FOLKS WHO'VE BEEN 02:40:14.604 --> 02:40:17.040 ESSENTIAL ACTORS IN HELPING TO 02:40:17.107 --> 02:40:18.342 CRYSTALIZE OUR CALIFORNIA'S 02:40:18.408 --> 02:40:19.209 FOCUS AND THEREFORE THE 02:40:19.276 --> 02:40:20.644 COUNTRY'S FOCUS ON, ON 02:40:20.711 --> 02:40:23.013 CATASTROPHIC RISK. SO THANK YOU. 02:40:23.080 --> 02:40:27.784 THANK YOU. THANK YOU, CHAIR AND 02:40:27.851 --> 02:40:28.952 MEMBERS, ON BEHALF OF THE 02:40:29.019 --> 02:40:30.420 CALIFORNIA NURSES ASSOCIATION. 02:40:30.487 --> 02:40:32.089 I FIRST WANT TO SAY THANK YOU 02:40:32.155 --> 02:40:33.256 FOR HOLDING SUCH AN IMPORTANT 02:40:33.323 --> 02:40:34.358 HEARING ON AI AND POTENTIAL 02:40:34.424 --> 02:40:36.093 THREATS THAT WE ARE SEEING IN 02:40:36.159 --> 02:40:37.227 ITS RAPID EXPANSION FOR NURSES. 02:40:37.294 --> 02:40:39.096 THE RISK OF AI ARE ALREADY HERE. 02:40:39.162 --> 02:40:40.430 THEY ARE SEEING AI RAPIDLY 02:40:40.497 --> 02:40:41.565 INTRODUCED INTO THEIR HOSPITALS 02:40:41.631 --> 02:40:43.000 WITHOUT ADEQUATE OVERSIGHT OR 02:40:43.066 --> 02:40:44.101 SAFEGUARDS TO PROTECT PATIENTS 02:40:44.167 --> 02:40:45.369 AND THE NURSES WHO CARE FOR 02:40:45.435 --> 02:40:46.670 THEM. AS THIS COMMITTEE LOOKS 02:40:46.737 --> 02:40:48.005 INTO HOW CALIFORNIA CAN BEST 02:40:48.071 --> 02:40:49.139 ADDRESS THE EXISTENTIAL THREATS 02:40:49.206 --> 02:40:50.874 FROM AI TECHNOLOGY, WE URGE 02:40:50.941 --> 02:40:52.542 THIS BODY TO ALSO CONSIDER HOW 02:40:52.609 --> 02:40:53.744 WORKERS ARE BEING IMPACTED 02:40:53.810 --> 02:40:55.012 TODAY AND WHAT WE CAN DO ABOUT 02:40:55.078 --> 02:40:57.280 IT. NOW, NURSES ARE WITNESSING 02:40:57.347 --> 02:40:58.148 THE RAPID DEPLOYMENT OF 02:40:58.215 --> 02:40:59.282 SOFTWARE IN THEIR WORKPLACES 02:40:59.349 --> 02:41:00.283 BEING FALSELY PRESENTED AS 02:41:00.350 --> 02:41:01.518 TOOLS TO IMPROVE EFFICIENCY, 02:41:01.585 --> 02:41:03.186 BUT IN REALITY, AN INSTRUMENT 02:41:03.253 --> 02:41:04.254 OF SURVEILLANCE THAT TIGHTENS 02:41:04.321 --> 02:41:06.023 CONTROL, INTENSIFIES WORK, AND 02:41:06.089 --> 02:41:07.324 EXTRACTS VALUE FROM WORKERS AT 02:41:07.391 --> 02:41:08.658 THE EXPENSE OF QUALITY, SAFETY 02:41:08.725 --> 02:41:11.061 AND DIGNITY IN HEALTH CARE. 02:41:11.128 --> 02:41:11.828 UNSAFE WORKING CONDITIONS ARE 02:41:11.895 --> 02:41:14.297 HOW PATIENTS GET HURT. ANY AI 02:41:14.364 --> 02:41:15.399 TOOL THAT INTERFERES WITH 02:41:15.465 --> 02:41:16.333 NURSE'S CLINICAL JUDGMENT, AND 02:41:16.400 --> 02:41:17.768 HER ABILITY TO ADVOCATE AND 02:41:17.834 --> 02:41:18.902 CARE FOR HER PATIENT HAS NO 02:41:18.969 --> 02:41:20.771 PLACE IN OUR HOSPITALS THIS 02:41:20.837 --> 02:41:22.939 YEAR. CALIFORNIA PASSED AB 1979, 02:41:23.006 --> 02:41:24.007 SO AI CANNOT REPLACE THE 02:41:24.074 --> 02:41:25.842 NURSE'S CLINICAL JUDGMENT. BUT 02:41:25.909 --> 02:41:27.177 TODAY, A NURSE WHO EXERCISES 02:41:27.244 --> 02:41:28.678 THAT JUDGMENT AND OVERRIDES AN 02:41:28.745 --> 02:41:30.547 UNSAFE AI OUTPUT CAN STILL BE 02:41:30.614 --> 02:41:32.282 PUNISHED FOR IT. THAT GAP IS 02:41:32.349 --> 02:41:33.717 SOMETHING THE LEGISLATURE MUST 02:41:33.784 --> 02:41:35.285 CLOSE. THE LEGISLATURE SHOULD 02:41:35.352 --> 02:41:36.620 ALSO PAY CLOSE ATTENTION TO 02:41:36.686 --> 02:41:38.722 THOSE AI COMPANIES AND HOW THEY 02:41:38.789 --> 02:41:40.257 ARE CHOOSING TO UTILIZE THESE 02:41:40.323 --> 02:41:41.124 TECHNOLOGIES THAT POSE NOT ONLY 02:41:41.191 --> 02:41:42.592 A POTENTIAL DANGER TO PATIENTS, 02:41:42.659 --> 02:41:44.928 BUT TO OUR COMMUNITIES. FOR 02:41:44.995 --> 02:41:46.663 EXAMPLE, PALANTIR, A COMPANY 02:41:46.730 --> 02:41:47.998 THAT CONDUCTS MASS SURVEILLANCE 02:41:48.065 --> 02:41:49.599 IN THE SERVICE OF STATE 02:41:49.666 --> 02:41:51.401 VIOLENCE FROM ISIS DEPORTATION 02:41:51.468 --> 02:41:53.136 MACHINE TO THE GENOCIDE IN GAZA, 02:41:53.203 --> 02:41:54.638 NOW RUNS NURSE STAFFING 02:41:54.704 --> 02:41:55.705 SOFTWARE IN HOSPITALS ACROSS 02:41:55.772 --> 02:41:57.841 THE COUNTRY THAT DRIVES UNSAFE 02:41:57.908 --> 02:41:58.942 STAFFING LEVELS AND UNDERMINES 02:41:59.009 --> 02:42:01.044 NURSES AT THE BEDSIDE. OUR 02:42:01.111 --> 02:42:02.913 PATIENTS DATA AND OUR TAXPAYER 02:42:02.979 --> 02:42:04.347 DOLLARS MUST NEVER RUN THROUGH 02:42:04.414 --> 02:42:05.515 A COMPANY THAT PROFITS FROM 02:42:05.582 --> 02:42:07.951 MASS SURVEILLANCE, DEPORTATION, 02:42:08.018 --> 02:42:10.120 GENOCIDE AND WAR. CNA URGES 02:42:10.187 --> 02:42:11.221 THIS COMMITTEE TO TAKE THESE 02:42:11.288 --> 02:42:12.756 ATTACKS ON WORKERS AND PATIENTS 02:42:12.823 --> 02:42:13.890 SERIOUSLY, AND WE STAND READY 02:42:13.957 --> 02:42:15.826 TO PARTNER WITH YOU TO PASS AND 02:42:15.892 --> 02:42:17.227 DEFEND STRONG AI REGULATIONS TO 02:42:17.294 --> 02:42:18.361 PROTECT NURSES, PATIENTS AND 02:42:18.428 --> 02:42:20.163 OUR COMMUNITIES. THANK YOU VERY 02:42:20.230 --> 02:42:26.503 MUCH. THANK YOU. GOOD MORNING, 02:42:26.570 --> 02:42:27.404 CHAIR AND MEMBERS OF THE 02:42:27.471 --> 02:42:29.172 COMMITTEE. I APPRECIATE THE 02:42:29.239 --> 02:42:30.240 THOUGHTFULNESS AND CARE YOU 02:42:30.307 --> 02:42:31.374 BRING TO EXAMINING THESE 02:42:31.441 --> 02:42:32.843 COMPLEX ISSUES. MY NAME IS 02:42:32.909 --> 02:42:34.945 PETER MUNOZ FOR THE BAY AREA 02:42:35.011 --> 02:42:37.447 COUNCIL. THE COUNCIL REPRESENTS 02:42:37.514 --> 02:42:38.548 RESEARCHERS, STARTUPS AND 02:42:38.615 --> 02:42:40.117 GLOBAL LEADING COMPANIES WITHIN 02:42:40.183 --> 02:42:43.220 THE AI ECOSYSTEM. ARTIFICIAL 02:42:43.286 --> 02:42:43.954 INTELLIGENCE OFFERS 02:42:44.020 --> 02:42:45.355 EXTRAORDINARY POTENTIAL FOR 02:42:45.422 --> 02:42:46.857 CALIFORNIA. WE SEE 02:42:46.923 --> 02:42:48.258 GROUNDBREAKING BENEFITS ACROSS 02:42:48.325 --> 02:42:50.093 CRITICAL FIELDS, ACCELERATING 02:42:50.160 --> 02:42:51.862 MEDICAL ADVANCEMENTS, DRIVING 02:42:51.928 --> 02:42:53.630 ACADEMIC INNOVATION, AND 02:42:53.697 --> 02:42:54.698 STRENGTHENING CLIMATE 02:42:54.764 --> 02:42:56.967 RESILIENCE, AMONG OTHERS. AT 02:42:57.033 --> 02:42:58.535 THE SAME TIME, WE ACKNOWLEDGE 02:42:58.602 --> 02:43:00.470 THE SERIOUS AND WELL-FOUNDED 02:43:00.537 --> 02:43:02.672 CHALLENGES AHEAD AS MODEL 02:43:02.739 --> 02:43:04.808 CAPABILITIES EXPAND RAPIDLY AND 02:43:04.875 --> 02:43:06.643 AGENTIC SYSTEMS GAIN AUTONOMY, 02:43:06.710 --> 02:43:09.079 WE FACE REAL CONCERNS REGARDING 02:43:09.146 --> 02:43:10.881 CYBERSECURITY, ALGORITHMIC 02:43:10.947 --> 02:43:12.349 DISCRIMINATION, AND MAINTAINING 02:43:12.415 --> 02:43:14.551 MEANINGFUL HUMAN CONTROL. 02:43:14.618 --> 02:43:16.353 ADDRESSING THESE RISKS 02:43:16.419 --> 02:43:18.121 RESPONSIBLY IS ESSENTIAL TO 02:43:18.188 --> 02:43:20.323 PRESERVING PUBLIC TRUST TO 02:43:20.390 --> 02:43:22.425 ENSURE SAFE, CONTINUED PROGRESS. 02:43:22.492 --> 02:43:24.294 ANY FUTURE REGULATION SHOULD BE 02:43:24.361 --> 02:43:26.062 ANCHORED IN SEVERAL HIGH LEVEL 02:43:26.129 --> 02:43:27.864 PRINCIPLES. RULES MUST BE 02:43:27.931 --> 02:43:30.333 GROUNDED IN REAL WORLD EVIDENCE. 02:43:30.400 --> 02:43:31.835 EMPIRICAL TRAJECTORY ANALYSIS 02:43:31.902 --> 02:43:33.970 OF AI SYSTEMS AND CAPABILITIES, 02:43:34.037 --> 02:43:36.106 AND SOUND SCIENCE, RATHER THAN 02:43:36.173 --> 02:43:37.908 STATIC COMPUTE THRESHOLDS, 02:43:37.974 --> 02:43:39.776 WHICH RAPIDLY BECOME OUTDATED. 02:43:39.843 --> 02:43:42.279 AS EFFICIENCY IMPROVES, 02:43:42.345 --> 02:43:43.413 OVERSIGHT MUST KEEP PACE WITH 02:43:43.480 --> 02:43:45.849 THE TECHNOLOGY ITSELF THROUGH 02:43:45.916 --> 02:43:47.651 ADAPTABLE SAFETY PROTOCOLS THAT 02:43:47.717 --> 02:43:49.052 SCALE DYNAMICALLY WITH ACTUAL 02:43:49.119 --> 02:43:51.221 SYSTEM CAPABILITIES AND 02:43:51.288 --> 02:43:53.790 DEPLOYMENT CONTEXT. REGULATION 02:43:53.857 --> 02:43:55.559 SHOULD TARGET BAD ACTORS AND 02:43:55.625 --> 02:43:57.761 CLEAR, ENFORCEABLE CONSEQUENCES 02:43:57.827 --> 02:43:59.896 FOR HIGH RISK MISUSE OR 02:43:59.963 --> 02:44:02.032 CATASTROPHIC HARMS. ENSURING 02:44:02.098 --> 02:44:03.833 SAFETY WITHOUT STALLING 02:44:03.900 --> 02:44:06.369 BENEFICIAL INNOVATION 02:44:06.436 --> 02:44:07.470 SAFEGUARDS MUST PROTECT 02:44:07.537 --> 02:44:09.272 PERSONAL DATA AND MAINTAIN USER 02:44:09.339 --> 02:44:11.041 PRIVACY WITHOUT FORCING 02:44:11.107 --> 02:44:12.809 DEVELOPERS INTO IMPOSSIBLE 02:44:12.876 --> 02:44:14.644 CHOICES BETWEEN MODEL UTILITY 02:44:14.711 --> 02:44:17.180 AND DATA RIGHTS. FINALLY, 02:44:17.247 --> 02:44:18.281 POLICY FRAMEWORKS SHOULD 02:44:18.348 --> 02:44:20.183 PROMOTE OPEN RESEARCH, SUPPORT 02:44:20.250 --> 02:44:22.219 A DIVERSE AI DEVELOPMENT 02:44:22.285 --> 02:44:24.421 ECOSYSTEM, AND ENABLE BROAD, 02:44:24.487 --> 02:44:26.156 EQUITABLE ACCESS TO AI'S 02:44:26.223 --> 02:44:27.624 BENEFITS WHILE APPLYING 02:44:27.691 --> 02:44:29.092 SAFEGUARDS PROPORTIONATE TO THE 02:44:29.159 --> 02:44:31.194 RISKS OF PARTICULAR MODELS AND 02:44:31.261 --> 02:44:32.629 CAPABILITIES. THANK YOU FOR 02:44:32.696 --> 02:44:34.431 YOUR LEADERSHIP AS WE WORK 02:44:34.497 --> 02:44:36.233 TOGETHER ON EVIDENCE BASED 02:44:36.299 --> 02:44:45.976 GUARDRAILS. HI. GOOD MORNING. 02:44:46.042 --> 02:44:47.744 I'M DYLAN MACLEOD, MEMBER OF 02:44:47.811 --> 02:44:49.913 THE PUBLIC DEGREE IN COMPUTER 02:44:49.980 --> 02:44:52.449 SCIENCE FROM UC BERKELEY. AND I 02:44:52.515 --> 02:44:55.719 JUST WANTED TO SAY THAT WHILE 02:44:55.785 --> 02:44:58.221 THE TOPIC OF LIKE WHAT 02:44:58.288 --> 02:44:59.456 REGULATIONS TO PASS, YOU KNOW, 02:44:59.522 --> 02:45:01.925 HOW TO ENFORCE LEGISLATION IS 02:45:01.992 --> 02:45:03.727 STILL EXTREMELY UNCLEAR RIGHT 02:45:03.793 --> 02:45:05.395 NOW, I THINK THERE'S A MASSIVE 02:45:05.462 --> 02:45:06.563 INFORMATION BOTTLENECK, AND 02:45:06.630 --> 02:45:10.867 IT'S ONLY GROWING BECAUSE WE 02:45:10.934 --> 02:45:13.370 DON'T ACTUALLY KNOW THE EXACT 02:45:13.436 --> 02:45:14.771 SPECIFICS OF THE MODEL WHICH 02:45:14.838 --> 02:45:16.573 SOLVE, WHICH RESOLVED THE 02:45:16.640 --> 02:45:18.742 NAVIER-STOKES CONJECTURE. A LOT 02:45:18.808 --> 02:45:21.578 OF THE INFORMATION ABOUT WHAT'S 02:45:21.645 --> 02:45:24.114 ACTUALLY GOING INSIDE OF AI 02:45:24.180 --> 02:45:26.316 COMPANIES IS SPREAD THROUGH 02:45:26.383 --> 02:45:29.519 RUMORS IN THE VALLEY, AND I 02:45:29.586 --> 02:45:33.123 THINK THAT WHILE THE EXACT 02:45:33.189 --> 02:45:34.924 MECHANISMS OF HOW TO ENFORCE 02:45:34.991 --> 02:45:37.060 LEGISLATION ON AI COMPANIES ARE 02:45:37.127 --> 02:45:39.562 STILL UNCLEAR, RIGHT NOW, WE 02:45:39.629 --> 02:45:42.098 HAVE TO SORT OF MAKE A PRIORITY 02:45:42.165 --> 02:45:45.735 OF KEEPING OUR EYES OPEN, OF 02:45:45.802 --> 02:45:47.037 GATHERING AS MUCH INFORMATION 02:45:47.103 --> 02:45:50.040 AS POSSIBLE, AND GETTING EITHER 02:45:50.106 --> 02:45:51.541 GOVERNMENT ACTORS OR 02:45:51.608 --> 02:45:52.709 INDEPENDENT EVALUATORS INSIDE 02:45:52.776 --> 02:45:54.744 OF AI COMPANIES TO BE ABLE TO 02:45:54.811 --> 02:45:56.146 TELL WHAT THEY'RE DOING, EVEN 02:45:56.212 --> 02:45:57.947 IF FROM A STATE LEVEL, WE CAN'T 02:45:58.014 --> 02:46:00.517 PASS LEGISLATION, YOU KNOW, TO 02:46:00.583 --> 02:46:02.652 ENFORCE ON ALL THE AI INDUSTRY. 02:46:02.719 --> 02:46:05.522 HAVING THAT INFORMATION PUBLIC 02:46:05.588 --> 02:46:09.492 COULD BE VERY USEFUL. AND 02:46:09.559 --> 02:46:10.960 THAT'S ALL. THANK YOU. THANK 02:46:11.027 --> 02:46:14.898 YOU FOR JOINING US. ALL RIGHT. 02:46:14.964 --> 02:46:15.965 THAT CONCLUDES OUR PUBLIC 02:46:16.032 --> 02:46:18.501 COMMENT. ANY CLOSING COMMENTS 02:46:18.568 --> 02:46:20.637 FROM SENATOR BECKER? NO, I TRY 02:46:20.704 --> 02:46:21.871 TO THANK ALL THE PANELISTS. I 02:46:21.938 --> 02:46:23.573 THANK YOU FOR CONVENING THIS. 02:46:23.640 --> 02:46:25.308 SAID THE OUTSET CAN'T BE MORE 02:46:25.375 --> 02:46:26.409 IMPORTANT CONVERSATION THIS 02:46:26.476 --> 02:46:28.211 RIGHT NOW. AND THIS WAS VERY, 02:46:28.278 --> 02:46:29.979 VERY, VERY ILLUMINATING. VERY 02:46:30.046 --> 02:46:32.549 HELPFUL. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, 02:46:32.615 --> 02:46:35.085 MR. CHAIR. WHAT HE SAID. THANKS. 02:46:35.151 --> 02:46:36.186 ALL RIGHT. WELL, THANK YOU. 02:46:36.252 --> 02:46:37.287 THANK YOU BOTH FOR FOR FOR 02:46:37.354 --> 02:46:39.222 MAKING THE TRIP TO THE CAPITOL 02:46:39.289 --> 02:46:40.590 DURING THE DURING THE RECESS 02:46:40.657 --> 02:46:42.258 AND FOR BOTH OF YOUR LONG 02:46:42.325 --> 02:46:43.393 STANDING LEADERSHIP IN THIS IN 02:46:43.460 --> 02:46:45.862 THIS SPACE, BOTH HERE IN 02:46:45.929 --> 02:46:47.297 CALIFORNIA AND NATIONALLY. AND 02:46:47.364 --> 02:46:48.732 THANKS TO THE TO THE COMMITTEE 02:46:48.798 --> 02:46:50.300 STAFF FOR ALL OF THEIR WORK, 02:46:50.367 --> 02:46:51.468 BOTH SETTING UP THE HEARING, 02:46:51.534 --> 02:46:52.569 BUT ALSO, AS SENATOR UMBERG 02:46:52.635 --> 02:46:54.104 NOTED, THE THE REALLY EXCELLENT 02:46:54.170 --> 02:46:57.073 BACKGROUND PAPER. I, I CAN SAY 02:46:57.140 --> 02:46:59.509 WITH CERTAINTY THERE WILL BE A 02:46:59.576 --> 02:47:00.610 COMPREHENSIVE SET OF 02:47:00.677 --> 02:47:01.678 LEGISLATION INTRODUCED IN THE 02:47:01.745 --> 02:47:04.547 SENATE AT THE BEGINNING OF THE 02:47:04.614 --> 02:47:07.450 UPCOMING SESSION. THE THE THE 02:47:07.517 --> 02:47:10.687 THE URGENCY AND THE URGENT CALL 02:47:10.754 --> 02:47:11.788 FOR THOUGHTFULNESS TO GO WITH 02:47:11.855 --> 02:47:13.189 THAT URGENCY IS HAS BEEN WELL 02:47:13.256 --> 02:47:16.059 HEARD. AND WE'RE SEEING IT, OR 02:47:16.126 --> 02:47:17.560 WHETHER IT'S AT THE ROTARY CLUB 02:47:17.627 --> 02:47:19.662 OR PTA MEETINGS. CALIFORNIANS 02:47:19.729 --> 02:47:22.198 ARE TALKING ABOUT THIS AND THEY 02:47:22.265 --> 02:47:25.101 ARE ANXIOUS AND THEY DO EXPECT 02:47:25.168 --> 02:47:26.236 ACTION, AND THEY DO EXPECT 02:47:26.302 --> 02:47:27.337 THEIR STATE TO HELP LEAD THE 02:47:27.404 --> 02:47:30.106 WAY. SO WE WILL WE WE WILL 02:47:30.173 --> 02:47:31.908 CONTINUE TO INVESTIGATE AND TO 02:47:31.975 --> 02:47:33.743 LEARN IN PREPARATION FOR THAT, 02:47:33.810 --> 02:47:34.811 FOR THE BEGINNING OF THE 02:47:34.878 --> 02:47:36.579 UPCOMING LEGISLATIVE SESSION. 02:47:36.646 --> 02:47:38.415 BUT WE DO ANTICIPATE, AND I 02:47:38.481 --> 02:47:40.717 KNOW SENATOR BECKER IS WORKING 02:47:40.784 --> 02:47:42.719 HARD ON THIS AS WELL. WE DO 02:47:42.786 --> 02:47:44.220 ANTICIPATE A SUBSTANTIAL A 02:47:44.287 --> 02:47:45.288 SUBSTANTIAL PACKAGE OF 02:47:45.355 --> 02:47:46.656 LEGISLATION IN THE IN THE IN 02:47:46.723 --> 02:47:48.191 THE COMING LEGISLATION 02:47:48.258 --> 02:47:50.260 LEGISLATIVE SESSION FOR FOR FOR 02:47:50.326 --> 02:47:53.329 ACTION. SO WITH THAT, THANKS TO 02:47:53.396 --> 02:47:54.597 EVERYONE. AND THIS HEARING IS 02:47:54.664 --> 02:48:10.814 ADJOURNED.