THE SENATE COMMITTEE ON
JUDICIARY WILL COME TO ORDER.
GOOD AFTERNOON. WE'RE HOLDING
THIS COMMITTEE HEARING IN ROOM
2100 OF THE Ó STREET BUILDING.
I ASK THAT ALL MEMBERS OF THE
COMMITTEE BE PRESENT IN ROOM
2100 SO WE CAN ESTABLISH OUR
QUORUM AND BEGIN OUR HEARING
BEFORE WE BEGIN PRESENTATIONS ON
TODAY'S BILL. UH WE DON'T WE
STILL NEED ONE MORE MEMBER. ONE
MORE MEMBER. UH, UH, I WANNA
ANNOUNCE THAT FILE ITEM NUMBER
10 S¼ B 1124 BY SENATOR MENJIVAR
HAS BEEN PULLED BY THE AUTHOR. I
ALSO WANT TO NOTE THAT I WILL BE
PRESENTING ITEM NUMBER SEVEN S¼
B 1 1366 BY SENATOR TARO AND
THAT WILL PROBABLY BE THE VERY
LAST BILL. THAT'S UM, PRESENTED
HERE TODAY. FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO
ARE WAITING. LET ME UH, NOW
ANNOUNCE THE BILLS THAT ARE ON
THE CONSENT CALENDAR. THE
FOLLOWING BILLS ARE ON THE
CONSENT CALENDAR TODAY. IS
NUMBER TWO. S¼ B 1161 BY SENATOR
BECKER FILE NUMBER THREE S¼ B
949 BY SENATOR BLAKESPEAR FILE
NUMBER FIVE S¼ B 1384 BY SENATOR
DODD FILING NUMBER NINE S¼ B
1027 BY SENATOR MENJIVAR FILE
NUMBER 11 S¼ B 48 BY SENATOR
ROCK FILING NUMBER 12 S¼ B 1034
BY SENATOR SEHAR WITH AMENDMENTS
F NUMBER 13 S¼ B 1096 BY
SENATORS FILE NUMBER 17 S¼ B
1027 BY SENATOR ALLEN WITH
AMENDMENTS 19 SB 1458 BY SENATOR
ALLEN, UH AND FINALLY, FINALLY,
NUMBER 22 S¼ B 1127 BY SENATOR
YELLO. UH, ALL RIGHT. I SEE THAT
WE HAVE SENATOR I. I SEE. WE
HAVE SENATOR BECKER. SEVERAL
PEOPLE ARE POINTING TO YOU,
SENATOR BECKER. SO, UH, LET US
LET US TAKE UP SENATOR BECKER,
SINCE HE IS THE ONLY AUTHOR HERE
. UM S¼ B 1095. UH, SENATOR
BECKER. WE'RE GOING TO COMMENCE
AS A SUB COMMITTEE HERE. GOOD
AFTERNOON CHAIR UMBERG AND
MEMBERS. I WOULD LIKE TO START
BY SAYING I WILL ACCEPT THE
AMENDMENTS TO BETTER ALIGN
IMPLEMENTATION DATES FOR THIS
BILL AND DUE TO OUR AMENDMENTS
TAKEN IN SENATE HOUSING, UM WE
BELIEVE THERE'S NÓ LONGER ANY
OPPOSITION TO THE MEASURE. S¼ B
1095, THE COZY HOMES CLEAN UP
ACT WILL MAKE IT EASIER FOR
HOMEOWNERS TO CONVERT FROM GAS
TO ELECTRIC APPLIANCES, MAKING
IT EASIER FOR CALIFORNIA TO
ACHIEVE OUR MISSIONS REDUCTION
GOALS RIGHT NOW THEY ARE LEGAL
AMBIGUITIES OR DELAYS IN
APPROVAL OF INSTALLATION FROM A
COMMON INTEREST DEVELOPMENT.
SUCH AS A HOMEOWNER ASSOCIATION
THAT CAN ADD TIME OR COST TO THE
PROCESS OF ALLOWING RESIDENTS TO
MAKE THE SWITCH FROM GAS TO
ELECTRIC APPLIANCES. UH, THIS IS
PARTICULARLY BURDENSOME IN CASES
OF APPLIANCES AT THE END OF
LIFE, WHERE A FAMILY WILL NOT
WAIT AND TAKE COLD SHOWERS FOR
THREE OR SIX MONTHS FOR THEIR
HÌ, A TO PROVE REPLACEMENT WATER
HEATER INSTALLATIONS. UM THERE
ARE CODE AMBIGUITIES IN THE
DEPARTMENT OF HOUSING AND
COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT THAT MAKE
IT CHALLENGING FOR MANUFACTURED
HOME. RESIDENTS ALSO TO CONVERT
FROM GAS TO ELECTRIC. SB 1095
WILL CLEAR UP CODE AMBIGUITIES
AND MAKE IT EASIER TO
TRANSITION. BY NUMBER ONE,
AVOIDING ANY POLICIES WITHIN A
COMMON INTEREST DEVELOPMENT THAT
PREVENT THE PLACEMENT OF FUEL
GAS BURNING APPLIANCES WITH AN
ELECTRIC APPLIANCE AND NUMBER
TWO REQUIRES THE DEPARTMENT OF
HOUSING COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT TO
UPDATE THE GUIDELINES TO
FACILITATE THE TRANSITION FROM
GAS TO ELECTRIC APPLIANCES WITH
ME TODAY, I HAVE A ALAN ES OF
THE BAY AIR AIR QUALITY
MANAGEMENT DISTRICT AND SAM
SAMUELSON ON BEHALF OF THE
BUILDING, DEC. CARB COALITION. A
LOT OF ALLITERATION IN OUR
WITNESSES TODAY. UH, THANK YOU.
THE GROUND RULES. THANK YOU,
ERICA. LET ME ANNOUNCE THE
GROUND RULES HERE THAT WILL
APPLY TO ALL BILLS UNLESS, UM, I
SAY OTHERWISE. UH, SO UH, WE
WILL HAVE TWO PRIMARY WITNESSES
IN SUPPORT AND TWO PRIMARY
WITNESSES IN OPPOSITION ON EACH
BILL. EACH PRIMARY WITNESS WILL
HAVE TWO MINUTES TO SPEAK. AFTER
PRIMARY SUPPORT. I'LL INVITE
OTHER SUPPORTERS TO STATE THEIR
NAME, THEIR AFFILIATION THEIR
POSITION. WE REFER THIS AS ME
TOO. TESTIMONY JUST TO BE CLEAR.
THAT'S ALL WE'LL PERMIT IS YOUR
NAME YOUR AFFILIATION, YOUR
POSITION. UM THE SAME. ALL
APPLIED TO THE OPPOSITION.
THEY'LL HAVE TWO PRIMARY
WITNESSES. EACH WILL HAVE TWO
MINUTES. UM, AFTER WE HEAR FROM
SUPPORTING OPPOSITION, THEN
WE'LL TURN COMMENTS FROM
COMMITTEE MEMBERS IF YOU WISH TO
PROVIDE US FURTHER INFORMATION
ON YOUR POSITION ON ANY BILL,
YOU MAY SUBMIT A LETTER TO THE
COMMITTEE. YOU SHOULD REFER TO
THE COMMITTEE'S WEBSITE FOR THE,
UM UH, INSTRUCTIONS AS TO HOW TO
SUBMIT, UH WE NOW HAVE, UH, I
THINK WE HAVE A QUORUM. SO WHY
DON'T WE STILL SENATOR NIELLO
LEFT? ALL RIGHT, OK, WE WERE
VERY WE WERE VERY CLOSE. WE WERE
VERY, VERY CLOSE. ALL RIGHT?
THANK YOU FOR YOUR PATIENCE,
SENATOR BECKER. UH, WE'LL GO
AHEAD WITH YOUR FIRST WITNESS.
THANK YOU. GOOD AFTERNOON CHAIR
UMBERG AND MEMBERS OF THE
COMMITTEE. MY NAME IS ALLEN ABS
WITH THE BAY AREA AIR QUALITY
MANAGEMENT DISTRICT, WHICH IS
THE LOCAL AIR REGULATORY AGENCY
FOR THE 7.5 MILLION PEOPLE OF
THE NINE COUNTY BAY AREA REGION
AND THE SPONSOR OF SENATE BILL
1095 S¼ B 1095 SEEKS TO
ELIMINATE BARRIERS TO HOMEOWNERS
WANTING TO TRANSITION FROM
NATURAL GAS TO ELECTRIC
APPLIANCES, WHICH WILL ASSIST
CALIFORNIA IN ITS GOAL OF HAVING
6 MILLION HEAT PUMPS DEPLOYED BY
THE YEAR 2030 PROVIDING BENEFITS
TO PUBLIC HEALTH S¼ B 1095 DOES
TWO WAYS THE FIRST BY ENSURING
THAT HOMEOWNERS ASSOCIATIONS AND
COMMON INTEREST DEVELOPMENTS
CAN'T PROHIBIT OR UNDULY DELAY
THE INSTALLATION OF ELECTRIC
HEATING DEVICES IN PLACE OF
NATURAL GAS APPLIANCES, GIVEN
THAT EVEN DELAYING AN APPROVAL
CAN CAUSE A HOMEOWNER TO CANCEL
THE INSTALLATION AND INSTEAD
INSTALL A SIMILAR NATURAL GAS
APPLIANCE, LOCKING IN THE
EMISSIONS IN HEALTH BENEFITS FOR
THE LIFE OF THAT REPLACEMENT.
THE SECOND IS BY DIRECTING THE
STATE HOUSING AND COMMUNITY
DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT TO UPDATE
GUIDELINES FOR APPLIANCE
INSTALLATIONS AND PERMITTING IT
MANUFACTURED HOME. AND MOBILE
HOMES TO GIVE THE SAME
DISCRETION TO ELECTRIC
APPLIANCES IS CURRENTLY EXISTS
FOR NATURAL GAS APPLIANCES,
ENSURING ACCESS NOT JUST TO
SINGLE FAMILY HOUSES IN NON HÌ
Ó A COMMUNITIES BUT TO ALL
HOMES, INCLUDING MANUFACTURED
AND MOBILE HOMES, IS KEY FOR
EQUITABLE DECARBONISATION ACROSS
THE STATE. THE BAY AREA A
STRONGLY SUPPORTS THIS GOAL AND
PLANS TO BE INVOLVED IN THIS
ISSUE FOR YEARS TO COME IN
CLOSING. I'D LIKE TO THANK
SENATOR BECKER FOR HIS
LEADERSHIP ON THIS ISSUE, AND
I'M HERE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS
THAT YOU HAVE, AND I'D ALSO LIKE
TO ADD THAT STAFF HAS DONE A
GREAT JOB CAPTURING THIS ISSUE
AND THEIR ANALYSIS AND WITH THAT
, I RESPECTFULLY ASK FOR YOUR
EYE VOTE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH
BEFORE WE MOVE ON TO OUR NEXT
WITNESS. WHY DON'T WE ESTABLISH
A QUORUM? MADAM SECRETARY IF YOU
WOULD CALL THE ROLE FOR PURPOSE
OF ESTABLISHING A QUORUM HERE,
WILK WILK PRESENT ALLEN ALLEN
HERE, ASHBY. CABALLERO DURAZO
DURAZO HERE, LAIRD LAYERED HERE,
MEN. NELO STERN HERE, WAHHAB,
YOU HAVE A QUORUM. WE HAVE A
QUORUM. ALL RIGHT, GREAT. THANK
YOU. UM, YOUR NEXT WITNESS,
SENATOR BECKER. GOOD AFTERNOON
CHAIR UMBERG AND MEMBERS OF THE
COMMITTEE. MY NAME IS SAMANTHA
SAMUELSON ON BEHALF OF THE
BUILDING DECARBONISATION
COALITION, OTHERWISE KNOWN AS B
Dð èC IN SUPPORT OF SENATE BILL
1095 B Dð èC IS AN ASSOCIATION
OF MANUFACTURERS, UTILITIES,
LOCAL GOVERNMENTS AND
ENVIRONMENTAL NONPROFITS ALL
FOCUSED ON ELIMINATING POLLUTION
FROM BUILDINGS TO IMPROVE
PEOPLE'S HEALTH, PRIORITIZE HIGH
ROAD JOBS AND ENSURE THAT OUR
COMMUNITIES ARE MORE RESILIENT
TO THE IMPACTS OF CLIMATE
CHANGE. WE THANK SENATOR BECKER
FOR HIS LEADERSHIP IN AUTHORING
S¼ B 10. FIVE WHICH WILL CLEAN
UP OUTDATED BUILDING AND SAFETY
CODE LANGUAGE, INHIBITING OR
DELAYING, BUILDING AND HOME
ELECTRIFICATION. BETA 95 BRINGS
CALIFORNIA CLOSER TO MEETING OUR
STATE'S GOAL OF 6 MILLION HEAT
PUMPS DEPLOYED BY 2030 BY
PREVENTING THE PROHIBITION OR
UNDULY DELAY OF ELECTRIC HEATING
DEVICE INSTALLATION AND UPDATING
GUIDELINES FOR APPLIANCE
INSTALLATIONS TO INCLUDE
EQUITABLE DISCRETION FOR BOTH
ELECTRIC AND GAS. EXCUSE ME
APPLIANCES. BDC'S MEMBERS FIND
REAL BENEFIT TO THIS LEGISLATION
. SEAN ARMSTRONG OF REDWOOD
ENERGY REPORTS THAT MOST
MANUFACTURED HOMES BUILT BEFORE
1980. MANY BUILT SINCE THEN HAVE
MULTIPLE BARRIERS TO INSTALLING
HEAT PUMP UNITS INSIDE THE
BUILDING COVENANTS THAT RESTRICT
INSTALLATION CAN LEAVE OCCUPANTS
WITHOUT ACCESS TO THE COOLING
BENEFITS OF HEAT PUMPS.
FREQUENTLY EXISTING WATER HEATER
CLOSETS CAN ONLY ACCOMMODATE 30
TO 40 GALLON UNITS, LIMITING THE
ABILITY OF HOME OCCUPANTS TO
TAKE ADVANTAGE OF DEMAND
RESPONSE PROGRAMS THAT IMPROVE
AFFORDABILITY OF THE UNIT TO THE
OCCUPANT. AND THE GRID B Dð èC
HAS ALSO HEARD FROM AN EXISTING
MOBILE HOME OCCUPANT WHO CITES
AN EXISTING HÌ A LIMITATION
KEEPING THEIR PARK FROM ALLOWING
EXTERNAL INSTALLATION IN MOBILE
HOMES AS BUILDINGS ARE
RESPONSIBLE FOR ROUGHLY TWO
THIRDS AS MUCH KNOX POLLUTION AS
THE STATE'S 16 MILLION PASSENGER
CARS. WE MUST REDUCE BARRIERS TO
ELECTRIFICATION AND ENCOURAGE
EQUITABLE BUILDING
DECARBONIZATION TO ENSURE A
STATE'S MOST VULNERABLE
COMMUNITIES ARE NOT LEFT BEHIND.
THANK YOU, SENATOR BECKER, CHAIR
UMBERG AND COMMITTEE MEMBERS FOR
THE OPPORTUNITY TO TESTIFY IN
SUPPORT OF S¼ B 1095. I
RESPECTFULLY ASK FOR YOUR I VOTE
. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ALL
RIGHT. UH, NOW FOR THOSE OF YOU
WISH TO TESTIFY AS TO YOUR NAME,
AFFILIATION IN YOUR POSITION,
PLEASE APPROACH THE MICROPHONE.
MR CHAIR MEMBERS, BRENDAN TIG ON
BEHALF OF THE CALIFORNIA AIR
POLLUTION CONTROL OFFICERS
ASSOCIATION, REPRESENTING THE
AIR POLLUTION CONTROL OFFICERS
FROM ALL 35 LOCAL AIR DISTRICTS
IN SUPPORT. THANK YOU. GOOD
AFTERNOON, JENNIFER TANNEHILL
WITH AARON REID AND ASSOCIATES
ON BEHALF OF THE SILICON VALLEY.
CLEAN ENERGY, UH, ALSO IN
SUPPORT. THANK YOU. ME SOME WAY
REPRESENTING SACRAMENTO THREE
150 CLIMATE ACTION, CALIFORNIA
IN SUPPORT. THANK YOU. GOOD
AFTERNOON, LILLIAN MEVIS WITH M
èC E, CALIFORNIA'S FIRST
COMMUNITY CHOICE AGGREGATOR HERE
IN SUPPORT. THANK YOU. THIS IS
AN APPROPRIATE TIME. UH, THE
CALIFORNIA JEFF NEAL REPRESENT
THE CALIFORNIA MANUFACTURED
HOUSING INSTITUTE NEUTRAL ON THE
BILL AS SENATOR BECKER OR
OPPOSITION WAS REMOVED THANKS TO
THE AMENDMENTS. ALL RIGHT.
ANYONE ELSE IN SUPPORT? PLEASE
APPROACH. GOOD AFTERNOON, CHRIS
ROSA ON BEHALF OF THE N R Dð
èC ACTION FUND AND SILICON
VALLEY LEADERSHIP GROUP BOTH IN
SUPPORT. THANK YOU ALL RIGHT,
SAYING NÓ ONE ELSE APPROACHED
THE MICROPHONE. LET'S NOW TURN
TO THE OPPOSITION. IF YOU'RE
OPPOSED, PLEASE APPROACH. THANK
YOU, MR CHAIR MEMBERS, CHRIS,
WEAK, W MA, AND WE WANT TO THANK
THE AUTHOR FOR ACCEPTING THE
AMENDMENTS, ESPECIALLY AS THEY
RELATE TO OUTSIDE WATER OUTSIDE
APPLIANCE INSTALLATION AND GRID.
UH, SYSTEM UPGRADE REQUIREMENTS.
WE HAVE REMOVED OUR OPPOSITION.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ANYONE ELSE
ANY OTHER? OPPOSED TWEENERS
SEEING NÓ ONE ELSE APPROACH THE
MICROPHONE. LET'S BRING IT TO
THE COMMITTEE QUESTIONS BY
COMMITTEE MEMBER SENATOR LAIRD.
UH, THANK YOU, MR CHAIR. I JUST
HAVE A COMMENT AND, UH I'M DOING
A VERY SIMILAR BILL THIS YEAR
BECAUSE IT TURNS OUT THAT IN
MOBILE HOME PARKS WHERE PEOPLE
HAVE INDIVIDUAL METERS, SOME
HAVE BEEN DENIED THE RIGHT TO
HAVE SOLAR AND INSTALL SOLAR AND
SO WHERE THEIR INDIVIDUAL METERS
, I THINK THAT IS SOMETHING THAT
SHOULD BE EXTENDED AS A RIGHT
AND YOU ARE DOING THIS WITH THIS
IN ANOTHER VENUE, AND IT MEETS
OUR CLIMATE GOALS. ALLOWS
INDIVIDUAL HOMEOWNERS TO MAKE
THEIR OWN CHOICE. I THINK THIS
IS THE RIGHT THING, AND AT THE
APPROPRIATE TIME, I WILL MOVE
THE BILL. ALL RIGHT. I THINK
IT'S THE APPROPRIATE TIME.
SENATOR LAIRD MOVES THE BILL.
ALL RIGHT. OTHER QUESTIONS.
COMMENTS, SENATOR CABALLERO
THANK YOU, MR CHAIR. I JUST
WANTED TO, UM ASK AND I. I
APOLOGIZE IF I MISSED IT
SOMEWHERE. UM, SENATOR DOES, UH,
THIS BILL THE DATE HAS BEEN
CHANGED. AND SO WITH THE REAL
SHORT DATE I WAS ASSUMING YOU
WERE DOING EMERGENCY HAVING HÌ
èC Dð DO EMERGENCY REGULATIONS.
UM UH, WITH THE DATE CHANGE THAT
MAY NOT BE NECESSARY. AND SO IT
IS IT EXPLICIT IN THE BILL THAT
YOU ARE NOT FOLLOWING THE A P A
OR, UH UH, HAVE YOU ANTICIPATED?
UH, DOING EMERGENCY REGS? MAY
ASK ONE OF MY WITNESSES. UM UH,
TO COMMENT WITH THAT CHANGE. I
BELIEVE THAT MEANS THAT WITH
THAT CHANGE, WE'RE NOT DOING
EMERGENCY REGS, BUT, UH, A
COMMENT. UH, YES, SENATOR. SO,
SO THIS WOULDN'T BE EMERGENCY
REGULATIONS. WE HAD TALKED WITH
HÌ èC Dð STAFF AND ASKED WHAT
THEIR NORMAL TIMELINE WAS FOR
RURAL DEVELOPMENT, AND WE WERE
TOLD ABOUT 18 MONTHS AND SO THIS
REFLECTS THAT. THANK YOU VERY
MUCH. I APPRECIATE THAT. SO I
DON'T HAVE ANY FURTHER QUESTIONS
. THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT. ANY
FURTHER QUESTIONS? NÓ SEEING
NONE. SENATOR LAIRD HAS MOVED
THE BILL, WHICH CLOSE THAT
SENATOR BECKER RESPECTFULLY ASK
FOR MY VOTE. ALL RIGHT. THANK
YOU. UH, MADAM SECRETARY, IF YOU
WOULD CALL THE ROLL THIS IS FILE
ITEM NUMBER ONE S¼ B 1095. THE
MOTION IS TO PASS AS AMENDED TO
SENATE APPROPRIATIONS. UMBERG
UMBERG. I WILKY WILK. I ALLEN
ALLEN. I ASHBY CABALLERO
CABALLERO, I DURAZO DURAZO, I LE
LAYERED I MIN MIN I NELO I STERN
AND I, WAHAB 8 TO 0. YOU HAVE
MEMBERS MISSING? ALL RIGHT, 80.
WE PUT THAT ON CALL. I SEE
SENATOR BRADFORD'S HERE, SENATOR
BRADFORD. S¼ B 924. WE GIVE
CONSENT? OH, YES. GOOD IDEA.
THANK YOU, MR VICE CHAIR. UH,
LET LET'S GO AHEAD. IS THERE A
MOTION ON THE CONSENT? CALENDAR
QUIK MOOSE, SENATOR CABALLERO
MOVES THE CONSENT CALENDAR. UH,
MADAM SECRETARY, IF YOU WOULD
CALL THE ROLL ON THE CONSENT
CALENDAR. UMBERG UMBERG. I WILL
WILK. I, ALAN. A AND I, ASHBY
CABALLERO CABALLERO IO. ALSO I
LEERED LAYERED. AMEN. M. I NELO
STERN. AND IW. YOU HAVE 8 TO 0
MEMBERS MISSING ON CONSENT. ALL
RIGHT, 80. WE WILL PUT THAT ON
CALL CENTER BRADFORD. THANK YOU
FOR YOUR PATIENCE. S¼ B 924.
THANK YOU, MR CHAIRMAN AND
MEMBERS S¼ B 924 SIMPLY REMOVES
THE SUNSET OF JANUARY. 1 I MEAN,
JULY 1 2025 FROM, UH, THE BILL I
AUTHORED S¼ P 1157 IN 2020,
WHICH REQUIRES LANDLORDS OF
ASSISTED HOUSING DEVELOPMENT TO
OFFER TENANTS THE OPTION OF
HAVING THE RENTAL PAYMENTS
REPORTED TO A CONSUMER
REPORTING. AGENCY EFFECTIVELY
MAKING THIS A PERMANENT PROGRAM
AND, ACCORDING TO THE CENSUS,
AMERICAN COMMUNITY SURVEY OVER
44% OF CALIFORNIANS RENT THEIR
HOUSING YET AT THIS PRESENT
TIME, ALTHOUGH FAILURE TO PAY
ONE'S RENT HAS A NEGATIVE IMPACT
. ON ONE'S CREDIT, MOST
CALIFORNIANS WHO MAKE THEIR RENT
ON TIME. UH, HAVE VERY LITTLE TO
SHOW FOR AND NEVER RECEIVE ANY
BENEFITS, UH, TO THEIR CREDIT,
UH, FOR MAKING THOSE PAYMENTS IN
A TIMELY MANNER REPORTING HELPS
INDIVIDUALS WHO LACK CREDIT
SCORES, ESTABLISH THOSE SCORES
AND HELPS INDIVIDUALS WITH NON
PRIME CREDIT, IMPROVE THEIR
CREDIT SCORES, AND WE'VE ALREADY
HEARD DOZENS OF STORIES SINCE
1157 HAS PASSED. THIS BILL
BUILDS ON. OF 157
AND CONTINUES TO PROVIDE A TOOL
FOR LOW INCOME RENTERS.
BY
COMMITTEE MEMBERS. UH, SENATOR
MIN HAS MOVED THE BILL. WOULD
YOU LIKE TO CLOSE? AS FOR YOUR
VOTE, ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU,
SENATOR BRADFORD. ALL RIGHT,
MADAM SECRETARY, PLEASE CALL THE
ROLL. THIS IS FILE ITEM NUMBER
FOUR S¼ B 924. THE MOTION IS TO
PASS THE SENATE APPROPRIATIONS
UMBERG. AMBER. I WILL. WILKE I
ALAN, ALAN, I ASHBY CABALLERO
CABALLERO. I DURAO. RUSSO I
LAIRD LAYERED A MIN MIN A NILO.
STERN STERN, WAHAB. YOU HAVE 8
TO 0 MEMBERS MISSING 80 PUT THAT
ON CALL. THANK YOU. THANK YOU,
MR CHAIR. JUST GO OVER THE
BATTING ORDER HERE. SO NEXT UP
ORDINARILY WOULD BE SENATOR
EDMAN WITH SB 1017 AFTER THAT,
UM AS I MENTIONED S¼ B 1366 BY
SENATOR TOO. I'M GOING TO
PRESENT THAT BUT AT THE VERY END
OF THE HEARING I SEE SENATOR MON
COMING IN NEXT WOULD BE SENATOR
LIMÓN ON ITEM NUMBER EIGHT S¼ B
1061. THEN, UH, AS WE ANNOUNCED
SENATOR MENJIVAR BILL, SB 1124
HAS BEEN PULLED. SO IF YOU'RE
HERE FOR SB 11 AND 24, THAT BILL
HAS BEEN PULLED. ALL RIGHT, SO
S¼ REGAN S¼ B 1017. THANK YOU
VERY MUCH. UM AND I DON'T THINK
THIS BILL WILL BE SURPRISED TO
ANYBODY. WE'VE DONE IT QUITE A
FEW YEARS. NOW I WAS TALKING TO
REPORTER TODAY WHO SAID SHE
NEVER EXPECTS THIS ONE TO NOT
GET THROUGH, BUT, UH, WE'RE
COMING BACK AGAIN. ONE MORE
TIME. UM, THIS WE'RE TALKING
ABOUT AS PEOPLE KNOW, RIGHT WHEN
PEOPLE GO COME INTO A FACILITY
WITH SOME KIND OF MENTAL HEALTH
SUBSTANCE ABUSE DISORDER. OFTEN
TIMES THEIR FIRST POINT OF
CONTACT IS THE EMERGENCY ROOM,
AND THEN THERE'S A DETERMINATION
ABOUT WHERE THAT PERSON SHOULD
BE PLACED. UH AND THEN THAT, UH,
TRANSFER NEEDS TO OCCUR OFTEN
TIMES IT TAKES HOURS DAYS A LONG
TIME TO BE ABLE TO FIND A PLACE
BECAUSE MOST OF THE TIME THE
PLACE OR THE SOCIAL WORKER IS
CALLING DIFFERENT FACILITIES TO
SEE IF THEY HAVE A BED. HOW FAR
THAT BED IS, IF THEY CAN ACCEPT
THIS KLEIN OR THAT CLIENT
ANYWAY, SO WE HAVE BEEN WORKING
FOR QUITE A FEW. NOW AND NOW THE
DEPARTMENT HAS AGREED WITH US ON
OUR END, UM, SUPPORT SO AND
WE'RE NOT CALLING IT A BED
REGISTRY. WE'RE CALLING IT A BED
SOLUTION BECAUSE IT MAY NEED TO
BE MAY NEED TO BE CREATIVE WITH
HOW WE DO IT BECAUSE WE
UNDERSTAND THIS IS DIFFICULT TO
DO, BUT TO BE ABLE TO HAVE A
SOLUTION THAT HAS A DATABASE OF
ALL THE ALL THE PLACES THAT HAVE
BEDS WHAT THE CRITERIA IS FOR
THOSE BEDS. IF THERE'S AN
OPENING OR NOT, SO THAT SOMEBODY
CAN BE MUCH MORE EXPEDIENTLY
SENT TO HIGHER OR A LOWER LEVEL
OF CARE, AS THEIR CONDITION
REQUIRES, UM THAT'S BASICALLY
THE ONUS OF WHAT THIS DOES. UH,
THE ATTEMPT IS TO STREAMLINE TO
MAKE THINGS EASIER TO GET PEOPLE
TO A LEVEL OF CARE. UH, WHEN I
PRESENTED THIS IN HEALTH, PEOPLE
SAID, WELL, WILL PEOPLE HAVE TO
ACCEPT PATIENTS? NÓ A FACILITY
ALWAYS HAS TO AGREE TO ACCEPT A
CLAIM BEFORE A CLIENT IS
TRANSFERRED, AND I JUST DUMPING
PEOPLE, UM, THEY WOULD STILL
HAVE TO HAVE THAT. BUT AT LEAST
THEY WOULD KNOW WHERE THERE'S AN
OPENING AND WHERE THERE'S AN
APPROPRIATE OPENING. I ANOTHER
QUESTION ALWAYS COMES. WHAT WE
HAVE TO ACCEPT PEOPLE FROM OUT
OF OUR AREA. LIKE IF WE'VE DONE
A GOOD JOB OF DEVELOPING OUR
BED. WOULD WE HAVE TO? YOU DON'T
KNOW YOU. YOU NEVER HAVE TO, BUT
WE'D ALSO THIS IS ALSO SERVED
THEN AS A DATA TOOL, SO THEN WE
KNOW OH, THIS THIS COUNTY
DOESN'T SEEM TO HAVE ANY
ADOLESCENT LOCK UNITS AND THEY
HAVE TO GO 200 MILES TO ANOTHER
COUNTY. ALL OF THAT IS
INFORMATION ON DISCHARGE ON
PLACEMENT ALL OF THAT, SO IT
MAKES SENSE TO HAVE A SOLUTION
THAT INCORPORATES ALL OF THIS,
UM, YOU'LL HEAR UH, CONCERN FROM
THE BEHAVIORAL HEALTH DIRECTORS
BECAUSE THERE IS A FINE IF
PEOPLE DON'T UPDATE IT, CAUSE
THAT'S ALWAYS AS WE ALL KNOW,
THERE'S A LOT OF DATABASES THAT
WE TRY TO START. WE'RE TRYING TO
DO THAT WITH OUR HEALTH RECORDS,
AND EVERY SYSTEM DOESN'T COME ON
IN THE SAME AMOUNT OF TIME AND
ARE RESISTANT TO OFTENTIMES
SHARING THAT DATA. SO THERE IS,
OF COURSE WE DON'T WANT TO
ATTACH A FINE BUT IT SOMETIMES,
IF WE KNOW IF THERE'S NÓ FINE,
THEN IT JUST BECOMES A
SUGGESTION VERSUS UH, AN
ENFORCEABLE LAW. SO THERE THERE
WAS. THERE WILL ALWAYS BE A, UM,
A, UH, AN ATTEMPT TO NOT HAVE A
FINE BUT YOU MAY HEAR THAT AT
SOME POINT, SO I WILL ASK FOR
YOUR EYE AT THE APPROPRIATE TIME
AGAIN. THAT'S SOMETHING WE ALL
YOU'VE ALL HEARD ME TALK A LOT
ABOUT A BED REGISTRY, A BED
OPTION A PROCESS. TO HAVE ALL
THE DATA IN ONE PLACE TO BE ABLE
TO UNDERSTAND WHERE THERE IS
OPENINGS WHERE THERE IS NOT. AND
HOW DO WE MOVE CLIENTS MOST
EFFECTIVELY THROUGH THE SYSTEM
WITH ME HERE IN SUPPORT. TODAY,
I HAVE RANDALL HAGAR,
LEGISLATIVE ADVOCATE WITH THE
PSYCHIATRIC PHYSICIANS ALLIANCE,
AS WELL AS DANNY OFFER WITH THE
NATIONAL ALLIANCE ON MENTAL
HEALTH. THANK YOU, SIR. MR
CHAIRMAN, MEMBERS OF THE
COMMITTEE RANDALL HAGER,
REPRESENTING THE PSYCHIATRIC
PHYSICIANS ALLIANCE OF
CALIFORNIA. UM MY GUYS WORK IN
HOSPITALS. THEY WORK IN
EMERGENCY ROOMS. THEY WORK IN A
LOT OF DIFFERENT KINDS OF SPACES
, AND WHEN THEY FIND A PATIENT
AND THAT PATIENT HAS AN ACUTE
NEED, UM, AND THAT FACILITY AT
THAT TIME CANNOT MEET THAT NEED.
THEY NEED TO FIND IT. AND RIGHT
NOW, THE EXPEDIENT THAT WE ARE
CALLED ON TO USE IS A DOWNLOAD A
PAPER P Dð F OF THE Dð HÌ èC S¼
WEBSITE AND GO THROUGH IT. AND
COLD CALL. UM THAT CAN BE A VERY
TEDIOUS AND LONG PROCESS. WE
NEED TO DO BETTER BY PATIENTS.
THIS OFFERS US A SOLUTION.
SENATOR MON DESCRIBED IT VERY,
VERY WELL. AND WE URGE THIS TO
YOUR SUPPORT. THANK YOU.
ALRIGHT. MR CHAIR AND MEMBERS
DANNY OFFER WITH THE NATIONAL
ALLIANCE ON MENTAL ILLNESS, ALSO
KNOWN AS NAMI, CALIFORNIA AT
NAMI, CALIFORNIA IS THE
STATEWIDE AFFILIATE OF THE
LARGEST MENTAL HEALTH ADVOCACY
ORGANIZATION IN THE NATION. WE
HAVE OVER 100 10,000 ACTIVE
ADVOCATES AND 58 AFFILIATES,
INCLUDING MANY PEOPLE WHO ARE
LIVING WITH A SERIOUS MENTAL
ILLNESS AS WELL AS THEIR LOVED
ONES. UM JUST BRIEFLY ON LENGTH
OF STAY, UM PATIENTS WHO ARE
EXPERIENCING A BEHAVIORAL HEALTH
CRISIS CAN EXPECT SOME OF THE
LONGEST LENGTH STAY IN EMERGENCY
ROOMS, A NATIONWIDE SURVEY OF
OVER 6000 HOSPITAL EMERGENCY
ROOMS REPORTED THAT OUT OF THOSE
MORE THAN 70% REPORTED HOLDING
PSYCHIATRIC PATIENTS FOR HOURS
OR DAYS. I THINK WE CAN ALL
AGREE THAT ANY TRIP TO A CHAOTIC
EMERGENCY ROOM IS A VULNERABLE
POSITION TO BE IN, BUT WE WOULD
ARGUE IT'S ESPECIALLY SO FOR
SOMEONE IN A BEHAVIORAL HEALTH
CRISIS. YOU'VE GOT THE GLARING
LIGHTS THE NOISE ABOUT AS MUCH
PRIVACY AS A TRAIN STATION, AND
ALL OF THESE CONDITIONS CAN
EXACERBATE AN ALREADY CRISIS
LEVEL. SET OF SYMPTOMS. YOU KNOW
YOU'RE FRIGHTENED. YOU MAY BE
PARANOID. YOU MAY BE HEARING
VOICES TELLING YOU TO HARM
YOURSELF OR OTHERS, UM, IN CASES
LIKE THESE ARE OUR LOVED ONE.
AND TRULY DON'T HAVE A MINUTE TO
SPARE. UM WE'RE LUCKY AS A STATE
THAT WE DO ACTUALLY HAVE MORE
BEDS COMING ONLINE, THANKS TO
THE BEHAVIORAL HEALTH CONTINUUM
INFRASTRUCTURE PROGRAM AND
PROPOSITION ONE FROM OUR GOOD
SENATOR. OVER HERE, UM, SO WE'LL
BE ADDING CAPACITY AROUND THE
STATE, AND IT'S IT WILL BE EVEN
MORE IMPORTANT TO TRACK THIS
CAPACITY TO MAKE IT EASY AND
EFFECTIVE AND EFFICIENT TO PLACE
PEOPLE WHERE THEY NEED TO BE,
UM, IN ORDER TO PROTECT THEIR
HEALTH. THANK YOU. ALRIGHT THANK
YOU. OTHERS IN SUPPORT, PLEASE
APPROACH THE MICROPHONE. EASTMAN
WITH THE STEINBERG INSTITUTE AND
SUPPORT YOU. GOOD AFTERNOON, MR
CHAIR MEMBERS, USHA MALER ON
BEHALF OF THE CALIFORNIA STATE
SHERIFFS ASSOCIATION IN SUPPORT.
GOOD AFTERNOON, BETSY MONTEL
WITH THE LEAGUE OF CALIFORNIA
CITIES IN SUPPORT. MISTER CHAIR
MEMBERS. POLIO ON BEHALF OF THE
CALIFORNIA STATE ASSOCIATION OF
PSYCHIATRISTS AND OTHER CO
SPONSOR ON THE BILL OR DRIVE,
VOTE. THANK YOU. THANK YOU ALL
RIGHT, SEEING NÓ ONE ELSE
APPROACH THE MICROPHONE. LET'S
TURN NOW TO THE OPPOSITION. IF
YOU'RE OPPOSED TO SB 1017,
PLEASE APPROACH.
GO AHEAD. THE FLOOR IS YOURS.
THANK YOU. CHAIR AND SENATORS
FOR YOUR TIME HERE TODAY. UH, MY
NAME IS AM RASHID AND I'M HERE
ON BEHALF OF THE COUNTY
BEHAVIORAL HEALTH DIRECTORS
ASSOCIATION OF CALIFORNIA, THE
LEADERS OF THE PUBLIC BEHAVIOR,
HEALTH AGENCIES THAT SERVE THE
MENTAL HEALTH AND SUBSTANCE USE
DISORDER NEEDS OF THE MEDICAL,
UNINSURED AND UNDERINSURED
POPULATIONS. WE RESPECTFULLY
HAVE AN OPPOSE UNLESS AMENDED
POSITION ON THIS BILL, WHILE CB
COMMENDS THE AUTHOR FOR SEEKING
TO ADDRESS THE DELAYS THAT THOSE
IN PSYCHIATRIC CRISIS TOO
FREQUENTLY EXPERIENCE TOO
FREQUENTLY EXPERIENCE WHEN
ATTEMPTING TO ACCESS VITAL
SERVICES, PARTICULARLY AS THE
STATE UNDERTAKES IMPORTANT NEW
FACILITY CONSTRUCTION WITH THE
PASSAGE OF THE BEHAVIORAL HEALTH
SERVICES ACT. WE BELIEVE THAT
ANY OF THE APPROACHES TAKEN MUST
BE FEASIBLE, WORKABLE AND GUIDED
BY PARTNERSHIPS RATHER THAN
PUNITIVE APPROACHES. èC B HÌ Dð
APPRECIATES THE APPROACH
OUTLINED IN S¼ B 1017, WHICH
INCLUDES CONFERRING WITH
STAKEHOLDERS TO INFORM THE
DEVELOPMENT OF THIS DATABASE.
RECOGNIZING HOW CRITICAL
STAKEHOLDER BUY IN IS FOR
ENSURING EFFECTIVENESS OF A
REGISTRY AS BED REGISTRY.
SUCCESSES IN OTHER STATES HAVE
SHOWN AS THE LEADERS OF THE
PUBLIC BEHAVIOR HEALTH AGENCIES
IN CALIFORNIA. WE RECOMMEND AN
AMENDMENT, WHICH INCLUDES COUNTY
BEHAVIORAL HEALTH AS A PART OF
THE STAKEHOLDER BUY IN AS WELL
AS WAS INCLUDED IN LAST YEAR'S
VERSION OF THE BILL. HOWEVER THE
BDA IS CONCERNED WITH THE
PUNITIVE PROVISIONS IN SB 1017,
WHICH ULTIMATELY ALLOWED DHCS TO
ASSESS A PLAN OF CORRECTION OR
PENALTIES AGAINST A FACILITY FOR
FAILING TO SUBMIT DATA IN A
TIMELY MANNER WHEN THE SCOPE OF
THIS DATABASE HAS YET TO BE
DEVELOPED, WE UNDERSTAND THAT
DHCS IS ALREADY EXPLORING
OPTIONS TO TRACK THE
AVAILABILITY OF INPATIENT AND
CRISIS STABILIZATION BEDS ON A
STATEWIDE BASIS AS PART OF THE B
HÌ CONNECT DEMONSTRATION PROJECT
AND èC B èC DOES BELIEVE OUR
STATE COULD BENEFIT FROM A MORE
THOROUGH INVENTORY. OF AVAILABLE
INPATIENT BEDS. BUT THE
PARAMETERS OF THAT APPROACH MUST
BE FEASIBLE AND REALISTIC,
ESPECIALLY WHEN IT REQUIRES
FREQUENT MANUAL UPDATING BY
STAFF. AND AS PREVIOUSLY STATED,
WE BELIEVE THAT APPROACH SHOULD
BE GUIDED BY PARTNERSHIPS RATHER
THAN PREMATURE. PUNITIVE
APPROACHES. THANK YOU, AND WE
LOOK FORWARD TO CONTINUING
CONVERSATIONS AS THE STATE
UNDERTAKES IMPORTANT NEW
INVESTMENTS IN BEHAVIORAL HEALTH
FACILITIES ALREADY, THANK YOU
VERY MUCH OTHERS OPPOSED TO S¼ B
1017. PLEASE APPROACH. SEEING NÓ
ONE ELSE APPROACHING THE
MICROPHONE. LET'S TURN TO THE
COMMITTEE. UM, QUESTIONS,
COMMENTS BY COMMITTEE MEMBERS.
SORRY I HEARD SOMEBODY SAY
SOMETHING. SENATOR STERN HAS
MOVED THE BILL. ALL RIGHT? DID
YOU GET HER CLOSE? UH, THANK YOU
VERY MUCH. AND THANK YOU FOR
YOUR TIME TODAY. UM AND WE WILL
CONTINUE TO WORK WITH ALL THE
STAKEHOLDERS. WE DON'T WANT IT
TO BE PUNITIVE. WE JUST WANT
THINGS TO WORK. UH AND THANK YOU
VERY MUCH FOR YOUR I VOTE. ALL
RIGHT. THANK YOU, SENATOR EGMOND
BEFORE WE CALL THE ROLL, UH,
NEXT UP WILL BE SENATOR LEMON.
UH THEN I THEN SENATOR SKINNER.
I KNOW. SENATOR SKINNER IS
CHAIRING ANOTHER COMMITTEE. THEN
SENATOR WEINER, THEN UM SENATOR
ALLEN LOOKS LIKE WE'RE MOVING
TOO FAST. UM WORDS NEVER BEEN
SAID HERE IN SENATE JUDICIARY
COMMITTEE. NEVER BEEN UTTERED.
ALL RIGHT, SO LET'S LET'S UH GO
AHEAD AND CALL THE ROLL. MADAM
SECRETARY OK? THIS IS FILE ITEM
NUMBER SIX S¼ B 117. THE MOTION
IS DUE PASS TO SENATE
APPROPRIATIONS. UMBERG UMBERG. I
WILKY WILK. I ALAN. ALAN, I
ASHBY èC A HERO. CABALLERO. I,
DURAZO DURAZO, I LEERED LAYERED
I NE STERN. I WAHAB. AYE. ALL
RIGHT. WE'RE GONNA PUT THAT BILL
ON. CALL NINE TO 09 TO ZERO.
WE'RE GONNA PUT ON CALL CENTER
ALLEN HAS MOVED WITH GREAT
ALACRITY TO THE PODIUM. THANK
YOU VERY MUCH. SENATOR ALLEN.
UM, GO AHEAD, SENATOR ALLEN. UM
S¼ B 1441 GOOD AFTERNOON WITH
GREAT ALACRITY. I'D LIKE TO
ACCEPT THE COMMITTEE'S
AMENDMENTS AND THANK AMANDA AND
THE CHAIR FOR ALL THEIR WORK.
UH, A AS YOU MAY KNOW WHEN AN
ELECTION PETITION RECEIVES
INSUFFICIENT SIGNATURES TO
QUALIFY FOR THE BALLOT. STATE
LAW PROVIDES PROPONENTS WITH THE
OPPORTUNITY TO EXAMINE THE
PETITION AND REASONS FOR THE
SIGNATURE REJECTIONS. AND IF A
PROPONENT THEN SEEKS TO EXAMINE
AND REVIEW THE PETITION THE
EXAMINATION UH, MUST COMMENCE
WITHIN 21 DAYS OF THE
CERTIFICATION OF INSUFFICIENCY
AS IT'S CALLED. SO WHILE THE LAW
ESTABLISHES A TIMELINE FOR THE
INITIATION OF THE REVIEW PROCESS
. IT'S ABSOLUTELY SILENT AS TO,
UH, THE TIMELINE FOR CONCLUDING
THE EXAMINATION. AND THIS HAS
ENABLED IN A FEW CASES, BUT YOU
ARE RARE, BUT BUT BUT
SIGNIFICANT, UH, SOME PETITION
PROPONENTS TO EXPLOIT THEIR
ACCESS TO PUBLIC RESOURCES BY
EMPLOYING AN INDEFINITE TIME
PERIOD. UH, FOR A REVIEW THAT
POSES SIGNIFICANT IMPACTS ON
COUNTY ELECTIONS, DEPARTMENT
STAFF, TIME RESOURCES AND
ULTIMATELY AND MOST IMPORTANTLY,
TAXPAYER DOLLARS. SO TO BE CLEAR
PETITION REVIEWS TYPICALLY OCCUR
OVER THE COURSE OF ONLY A FEW
DAYS. UH, MOST WILL LAST ONLY,
UH, YOU KNOW ABOUT ONE OR TWO
WEEKS. BUT THERE WAS ONE RECENT
CASE IN L, A COUNTY WHERE
PETITION AND PRO PROPONENTS
INITIATED A PROCESS TO REVIEW
TENS OF THOUSANDS OF SIGNATURES
THAT LITERALLY LASTED 14 MONTHS.
THE REVIEW OVERLAPS WITH THE
2022 GENERAL ELECTION. IT
ATTACKS THE COUNTY STAFF TIME
FOR CONDUCTING THE ELECTION. AND
THIS ONE REVIEW. WHICH
ULTIMATELY, UH YOU KNOW? DIDN'T
FIND ANY. YOU KNOW PROBLEMS THAT
MADE IT MADE A CHANGE IN IN IN
THEIR IN THE RESULT, IT COST THE
COUNTY THIS ONE REVIEW COST THE
COUNTY $1.5 MILLION ALONE TO
PROVIDE PROPONENTS DEDICATED
OFFICE SPACE COMPUTERS,
TEMPORARY STAFF TO ACCOMMODATE
THEIR REQUESTS. UH, YOU KNOW,
THESE WERE ALL COSTS THAT THE
COUNTY WAS ABSOLUTELY UNABLE TO
RECOVER, UH, WHICH MEANT THE
DIRECT IMPACTS ON THE COUNTY'S
GENERAL FUND AND ABILITY TO
PROVIDE CRITICAL SERVICES TO
THEIR CONSTITUENTS WAS, UM, WAS
WAS COMPROMISED. YOU KNOW, WE'VE
, UH WE, OF COURSE ENACTED THE
VOTERS CHOICE ACT IN 2016. IT
WAS FOLLOWED BY A GREATER SHIFT
TO MALE BALLOT ELECTIONS SINCE
THE COVID PANDEMIC AND AS A
RESULT, ELECTIONS HAVE BECOME
SOMEWHAT MORE COMPLEX, AND
OFFICIALS HAVE THE DUTY TO
ENSURE THAT OUR ELECTIONS ARE
FAIR. TRANSPARENT AND LAWFUL.
THIS DUTY EXTENDS TO ALL ASPECTS
OF THE ELECTION PROCESS AND
REQUIRES THAT ELECTION
ACTIVITIES INCLUDING REVIEW OF
FAILED PETITIONS, OR MANAGED
EFFECTIVELY AND EFFICIENTLY AND
THIS IS OFTEN TIMES DIFFICULT
WHEN YOU'VE GOT A COUPLE OF
ACTORS OUT THERE THAT MAY BE
EXPLOITING THE INDEFINITE TIME
TO EXAMINE F PETITIONS AND THEY
HAVE NÓ OBLIGATION AT ALL TO
REIMBURSE THE COUNTY'S COSTS.
AND SO THIS IS UNTENABLE FOR OUR
OUR COUNTIES. AND IT, UH, THIS
BILL ADDRESSES THIS CRITICAL GAP
IN IN STATUTE IN TWO WAYS. FIRST
OF ALL, ESTABLISHES 60 DAY LIMIT
FOR PROPONENTS TO EXAMINE A
FAILED PETITION. THIS MIRRORS
EXISTING TIMELINE THAT COUNTY
REGISTRARS HAVE TO EXAMINE A
STATEWIDE PETITION. IF THE
RANDOM SAMPLING RESULTS REQUIRE
A FULL EXAMINATION AND
VERIFICATION OF ALL PETITION
SIGNATURES. SECONDLY, IT ENABLES
COUNTY ELECTIONS OFFICIALS TO
RECOVER THE COSTS ASSOCIATED
WITH THE ADDITIONAL PERSONNEL
AND RESOURCES USED TO CONDUCT
THESE EXAMINATIONS. THESE ARE
COST IN EXCESS OF THE GENERAL
OPERATING COST OF RUNNING THE
COUNTY ELECTIONS OFFICE. UH,
THIS MIRRORS THE EXISTING COST
RECOVERY MECHANISM EMPLOYED IN
VOTER INITIATED RECOUNT EFFORTS.
WITH THE STATUTORY TIMELINE. UH,
OUR OFFICIALS WILL BE ABLE TO
BETTER DETERMINE THE IMPACT THE
PETITION REVIEWS HAVE ON THEIR
OPERATIONS AND ALLOCATE
RESOURCES ACCORDINGLY. AND A
COST RECOVERY MECHANISM WILL
HELP TO ENCOURAGE ALL PARTIES TO
USE RESOURCES EFFICIENTLY,
EFFICIENTLY AND WITH ME TODAY
TESTIFY IN SUPPORT IS, UH
AUDELIA LOSADA, WHO'S UH,
DIVISION MANAGER AT L, A COUNTY
REGISTER RECORDER'S OFFICE.
MISTER PRESIDENT. GOOD AFTERNOON
CHAIR UMBERG AND MEMBERS OF THE
COMMITTEE. MY NAME IS ADELIA
LOZADA AND I AM A DIVISION
MANAGER FOR THE LOS ANGELES
COUNTY REGISTRAR RECORDER COUNTY
CLERK'S OFFICE. THANK YOU TO
SENATOR ALLEN FOR THIS
OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK TO THE
HONORABLE MEMBERS OF THE
COMMITTEE. LOS ANGELES COUNTY IS
PROUD TO SPONSOR SB 1441. AS
SENATOR ALLEN STATED. THIS BILL
DOES TWO THINGS. FIRST IT
ESTABLISHES A 60 DAY PERIOD FOR
PETITION PROPONENTS TO COMPLETE
THEIR EXAMINATION. OF
DISQUALIFIED SIGNATURES ON
PETITIONS THAT FAIL TO QUALIFY
FOR THE BALLOT. THIS 60 DAY
PERIOD, AS SENATOR ALLEN
MENTIONED IS ALIGNED WITH THE
TIME FRAMES THAT ELECTIONS
OFFICIALS HAVE TO INITIALLY
REVIEW THOSE SAME SIGNATURES.
SECOND THANKS TO THE CLARIFYING
AMENDMENT. THIS BILL ALLOWS
ELECTIONS OFFICIALS TO RECOVER
THE ACTUAL COSTS OF INSPECTING
DISQUALIFIED SIGNATURES WHEN
THOSE COSTS SUCCEED THE OFFICE'S
NORMAL OPERATING BUDGET, THE
COST RECOVERY PROVISIONS OF S¼ B
ONE, AND 41 HELPED TO ENSURE
THAT ADDITIONAL PUBLIC FUNDS ARE
NOT USED WHEN PROPONENTS OF A
FAILED PETITION REQUEST TO
INSPECT HIS QUALIFIED
SIGNATURES. CURRENTLY EXISTING
LAW DOES NOT ADDRESS HOW LONG
PETITION PROPONENTS MAY EXAMINE
DISQUALIFIED SIGNATURES, NOR
DOES IT ADDRESS WHO PAYS FOR
THOSE COSTS TO SECURELY AND
PRESENT PETITION DOCUMENTS FOR
PUBLIC INSPECTION BY ADDRESSING
THIS GAP IN LAW S¼ B 1441
SIGNIFICANTLY IMPROVES ELECTIONS
OFFICIALS ABILITY TO MANAGE THE
EXAMINATION OF FAILED POSITIONS
EFFICIENTLY AND RESPONSIBLY. I
RESPECTFULLY REQUEST THE
COMMITTEE'S I VOTE ON SB 1441.
AND I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER
QUESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE. THANK
YOU. THANK YOU VERY MUCH OTHER
WITNESSES IN SUPPORT OF S¼ B
1441. GOOD AFTERNOON, LARISSA
CAUGHT ON BEHALF OF THE
CALIFORNIA ASSOCIATION OF CLERK,
SELECTION OFFICIALS, PRODUCT CO
SPONSOR AND SUPPORT. THANK YOU.
GOOD AFTERNOON. I'M ERIC LAWYER
SPEAKING ON BEHALF OF THE
CALIFORNIA STATE ASSOCIATION OF
COUNTIES, REPRESENTING ALL 58
COUNTIES IN SUPPORT, THANK YOU.
THANK YOU OTHERS IN SUPPORT,
SEEING NÓ ONE ELSE APPROACH OF
IPHONE. LET'S TURN TO THE
OPPOSITION. IF YOU'RE OPPOSED TO
SB 1441, PLEASE APPROACH THE
MICROPHONE. SEEING NÓ ONE
APPROACHED THE MICROPHONE. UM
ALL RIGHT, LET'S BRING IT BACK
TO COMMITTEE QUESTIONS. COMMENTS
SORT OF SENATOR MIN. I THINK
MOVED THE BILL. YOU WERE
UP. ALL RIGHT, UH, SENATOR MIN
HAS MOVED THE BILL. SIR ALAN,
WOULD YOU LIKE TO CLOSE? 00
SENATOR OSSO. I'M SORRY. SORRY.
YES JUST A SIMPLE QUESTION.
COULD YOU REVIEW AGAIN? WHAT THE
COSTS ARE, UM THAT SOMEBODY
WOULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR
REIMBURSING SO YEAH. SO
BASICALLY THE BILL, UM IT'S A
IT'S REASONABLE COST ASSOCIATED
THAT THEY GO. THEY GO IN EXCESS
OF A TYPICAL YOU CAN PROBABLY
GIVE A BETTER ANSWER HERE. BUT
BUT, UM IT'S YEAH, IT'S
REASONABLE COST OF GOING IN
EXCESS OF THE NORMAL COURSE OF
BUSINESS OF THE REVIEW. IS THAT
RIGHT? SURE SO ONE EXAMPLE OF
THE PARTICULAR COSTS THAT WOULD
HAVE BEEN RECOVERABLE IF SB 1441
WERE TO BE PASSED OR TO SAY, FOR
EXAMPLE, SET UP PUBLIC VIEWING
ACCESS TO SUPPORT MORE REVIEWING
THOSE PETITIONS, AND THE OFFICE
NORMALLY WOULD KEEP SO
TRADITIONALLY, ELECTIONS
OFFICIALS HAVE 1 TO 2 PUBLIC
VIEWING ACCESS TERMINALS IN THE
CASE THAT, UM SENATOR ALLEN
REFERENCED LOS ANGELES COUNTY
SET UP NEARLY 20 OF THOSE, UH,
PUBLIC VIEWING ACCESS TERMINALS,
UM, STAFF TIME TO OPERATE THE
ELECTION MANAGEMENT SYSTEM TO
SHOW THE PROPONENTS THE
INFORMATION THAT THEY'RE ALLOW.
TO INSPECT WHILE ALSO
MAINTAINING VOTER PRIVACY IS AN
EXAMPLE OF THE COSTS THAT COULD
NOW BE RECOVERABLE IF 1441 WAS
PASSED. AND IS THERE A SENSE OF?
IF SOMEBODY SAYS I WANT THIS,
YOU KNOW AND MAKE THE REQUEST
FOR THIS. UH, TO BE DONE. IS
THERE A SENSE IN ADVANCE OF
BILL THAT WAS SIGNED INTO LAW IN
2020 TO REQUIRE DEPARTMENT OF
PUBLIC HEALTH, UH TO DO MORE. UH
UNFORTUNATELY, UM, MORE WAS NOT
DONE FOR THE MOST PART. AND SO,
UH, WE REQUESTED AN AUDIT. UH,
THROUGH THE THROUGH JL èC A FEW
YEARS AGO, UM OF èC Dð P HÌ S¼
IMPLEMENTATION OF REQUIREMENTS
TO COLLECT THIS DATA AND WHAT
THAT AUDIT SHOWED. WAS THAT THE
DEPARTMENT? UH, THEY HAVE BEEN
DOING THE VERY, VERY BARE
MINIMUM, PERHAPS, UM, BUT THAT
ON THE VAST MAJORITY OF HEALTH
FORMS, THE QUESTIONS WERE NOT
BEING ASKED. AND SO THIS BILL
IMPLEMENTS THE AUDITOR'S
RECOMMENDATIONS. IT WILL REQUIRE
THAT èC Dð P COLLECT THIS DATA
FROM THIRD PARTY ENTITIES,
INCLUDING LOCAL HEALTH
JURISDICTIONS, UM ON ANY FORMS
OR ELECTRONIC DATA SYSTEMS ALLOW
VOLUNTARILY PROVIDED DATA
RELATING TO SEXUAL ORIENTATION
AND GENDER IDENTITY TO BE
INCLUDED IN THE STATEWIDE
IMMUNIZATION REGISTRY, AND
LASTLY REQUIRE THE DEPARTMENT TO
PROVIDE AN ANNUAL REPORT ON ITS
TO DO THIS DATA COLLECTION. I
RESPECTFULLY ASK FOR AN I VOTE
AND WITH ME TODAY, TESTIFY IS
GUZMAN, THE MANAGER OF PROGRAMS
WITH THE CALIFORNIA HEALTH AND
HUMAN SERVICES NETWORK, AND EVA
BANNA, THE ADVOCACY AND TRAINING
LEAD WITH THE SACRAMENTO UH L GB
Tð, UH, CENTER. GO AHEAD,
FLOURISH. YOUR UH, GOOD
AFTERNOON. UH Kò, UMBERG AND
MEMBERS OF THE COMMITTEE. MY
NAME IS GUZMAN AND I AM
REPRESENTING THE CALIFORNIA L GB
Tð Q HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES
NETWORK. I'M HERE JUST, UH TODAY
TO SHARE WITH YOU ABOUT THE
IMPORTANCE OF DEMOGRAPHIC DATA
COLLECTION TO UNDERSTANDING AND
ADDRESSING THE UNIQUE HEALTH
NEEDS AMONG THE DIVERSE
COMMUNITIES IN CALIFORNIA.
WITHOUT DEMOGRAPHIC DATA
INFORMATION. WE CANNOT KNOW
WHERE THE DISPARITIES EXIST
AMONG UNDERSERVED POPULATIONS
AND HOW TO CREATE EFFECTIVE
PUBLIC HEALTH INTERVENTIONS. TO
ADDRESS THOSE HEALTH GAPS. THE
NETWORK HAS ACTIVELY SUPPORTED
EFFORTS TO IMPROVE THE UNIFORM
COLLECTION AND REPORTING OF SOJI
DATA OVER THE LAST DECADE. IN
2015 AS MENTIONED EARLIER WE
WORKED ALONGSIDE A COALITION OF
Ó GB Tð U STATEWIDE PARTNERS TO
SUPPORT A B 959 BY ASSEMBLY
MEMBER DAVID CHU, WHICH REQUIRED
CALIFORNIA HEALTH DEPARTMENTS,
INCLUDING èC Dð P HÌ TO COLLECT
VOLUNTARY SURGERY INFORMATION
AND REPORT THOSE FINDINGS TO THE
PUBLIC. IN THE YEARS SINCE ITS
ENACTMENT. WE'VE SEEN VERY
UNEVEN IMPLEMENTATION OF THIS
BILL, AND DESPITE THE EXISTING
LAWS IN PLACE, WE STILL DO NOT
HAVE ACCURATE OR CONSISTENT SOI
DATA IN OUR STATE HOUSE PROGRAMS
. THIS HAS NEGATIVELY IMPACTED
HOW PUBLIC HEALTH PROGRAMS AND
LOCAL COMMUNITY ORGANIZATIONS
RESPONSES TO UNIQUE HEALTH OF L,
GB, Tð Q PLUS COMMUNITIES AND
THIS DIFFERENT SHE WAS MADE
EXTREMELY CLEAR IN 2020 DURING
THE GREATEST PUBLIC HEALTH
CRISIS IN A GENERATION, WHERE WE
LEARNED THAT COVID-19 WAS HAVING
DEVASTATING IMPACTS ON
DISADVANTAGED POPULATIONS,
EXCEPT HOW COVID-19 WAS
AFFECTING L GB Tð Q PLUS
COMMUNITIES DURING THIS TIME,
èC Dð P HÌ CREATED A DASHBOARD
THAT ILLUSTRATED THE DISPARITIES
BY RACE AND ETHNICITY AND MANY
OTHER DEMOGRAPHIC FACTORS, WHICH
ALLOW PUBLIC HEALTH DEPARTMENTS
TO TAILOR INTERVENTIONS TOWARDS
THE MOST IMPACTED POPULATIONS.
HOWEVER, THERE WAS NEVER
COMPLETE DATA ON L GB Tð Q PLUS
THESE AND WE KNOW FROM THE DATA
THAT WE HAVE, AND FROM THE
STORIES OF OUR PARTNERS ACROSS
THE STATE THAT COVID-19
DISPROPORTIONATELY AFFECTED L GB
Tð Q PLUS CALIFORNIANS, BUT
UNFORTUNATELY BECAUSE OF THE
LACK OF EXISTING SOJI DATA
COLLECTION STANDARDS, WE WILL
NEVER KNOW THE TRUE TOLL OF THE
PANDEMIC HAD ON OUR COMMUNITIES.
THIS LACK OF SOJI DATA PREVENTS
STATE AND LOCAL PROGRAMS FROM
BEING ABLE TO ADEQUATELY
ALLOCATE RESOURCES TO RESPOND TO
THE GREATEST NEED BECAUSE WE
DON'T KNOW WHERE THAT NEED IS,
UM, THAT IS WHY S¼ B NINE F S¼ B
+957 WILL MAKE SURE THAT L GB Tð
Q COMMUNITIES ARE VISIBLE AND
CAN RECEIVE EQUITABLE CARE AND
SERVICES AND, UH WHY THE NETWORK
RESPECTFULLY ASKED MEMBERS OF
THIS COMMITTEE FOR AN I VOTE.
THANK YOU. THANK YOU VERY MUCH,
ALL RIGHT, OTHERS IN SUPPORT.
GOOD AFTERNOON, MISTER CHAIR AND
MEMBERS. MY NAME IS EVE BANNA
WITH THE SACRAMENTO L GB Tð
COMMUNITY CENTER, HAPPY TO BE
HERE TODAY TO SPEAK IN SUPPORT
OF SENATE BILL 957. AT THE L GB
Tð CENTER. WE OFTEN HEAR
FIRSTHAND ACCOUNTS ABOUT THE
LACK OF AFFIRMING HEALTH CARE
AND SOCIAL SERVICES AVAILABLE TO
L GB Tð COMMUNITY MEMBERS. L GB
Tð PEOPLE ARE OFTEN LEFT TO RELY
ON EACH OTHER FOR SUPPORT,
INFORMATION AND CARE. TO MAKE UP
FOR THE LACK OF AVAILABLE
RESOURCES. THIS LACK OF SUPPORT
CAN BE ATTRIBUTED TO MANY ISSUES
, INCLUDING PERVASIVE STIGMA,
MISINFORMATION AND AN INCOMPLETE
UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT COMMUNITY
MEMBERS NEED. L GB Tð. PEOPLE
SHOULD NOT HAVE TO FILL IN THESE
GAPS BY THEMSELVES. AND ONE
IMPORTANT WAY TO ADDRESS THESE
ISSUES IS BY PRIORITIZING BETTER
SEXUAL ORIENTATION AND GENDER
IDENTITY DATA. THE L GB Tð
COMMUNITY EXPERIENCES EXTENSIVE
HEALTH DISPARITIES, INCLUDING
HEIGHTENED RATES OF DEPRESSION,
ANXIETY, SUICIDALITY CERTAIN
TYPES OF CANCER. S¼ Tð I
SUBSTANCE USE CARDIOVASCULAR
DISEASE. UM AND DISABILITY
OVERALL, TO REDUCE THESE HEALTH
DISPARITIES. WE NEED TO
UNDERSTAND COMMUNITY MEMBERS
UNIQUE EXPERIENCES AND NEEDS,
PARTICULARLY THOSE WHO HAVE
MULTIPLE MARGINALIZED IDENTITIES
TO DO THIS. WE NEED COMPLETE
SOJI DATA. IF WE DO NOT
PRIORITIZE THIS TYPE OF DATA
COLLECTION, WE RISK PERPETUATING
THE SAME PROBLEMS THAT L GB Tð Q
PLUS COMMUNITY MEMBERS HAVE BEEN
NAVIGATING FOR GENERATIONS.
QUEER AND TRANS FOLKS NEED US TO
DO BETTER. AND WE BELIEVE THAT
SENATE BILL 957 IS A MUCH NEEDED
SOLUTION TO REDUCE EXISTING
HEALTH DISPARITIES GIVEN ALL
THIS, THE SACRAMENTO L GB Tð
COMMUNITY CENTER STRONGLY
RECOMMENDS SENATE BILL 957, AND
WE URGE YOU TO SUPPORT THIS
IMPORTANT LEGISLATION. THANK
YOU. THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT.
OTHERS IN SUPPORT YOUR NAME,
YOUR AFFILIATION AND YOUR
POSITION. CRAIG POST, CRAIG
PULSE FOR QUALITY CALIFORNIA
COSPONSOR AND STRONG SUPPORT.
THEY NEED A STRONG GRIND MEMBER
OF CALIFORNIA AAA RP ON BEHALF
OF THE 3.2 MILLION MEMBERS IN
CALIFORNIA IN STRONG SUPPORT. ON
BEHALF OF ÁP L HEALTH AND THE
SAN FRANCISCO ACE FOUNDATION IN
SUPPORT. GOOD AFTERNOON, LINDA
WE WITH WESTERN CENTER ON LAW
AND POVERTY AND SUPPORT. KATIE
VAN DINES WITH HEALTH ACCESS
CALIFORNIA AND SUPPORT. THANK
YOU. NICO MORALES ON BEHALF OF
CHILDREN NOW IN SUPPORT. THANK
YOU SEEING NÓ ONE ELSE
APPROACHING THE MICROPHONE IN
SUPPORT OF S¼ B 957. LET'S TURN
THE OPPOSITION IF YOU'RE OPPOSED
TO S¼ B 957, PLEASE APPROACH.
GOOD AFTERNOON. AARON FRIDAY
DEMOCRAT OUR DUTY. I VOTED FOR
SAME SEX MARRIAGE. S¼ B 957
REQUIRES SCHOOLS, HEALTH
PROVIDERS AND A MULTITUDE OF
ENTITIES, INCLUDING SCHOOLS TO
OUT CALIFORNIANS TO THE
DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC HEALTH. THE
INTENT OF THIS BILL IS THE SAME
EXHAUSTING TROPE THAT THE L GB
Tð Q PLUS COMMUNITY IS SO
MARGINALIZED THAT THEY NEED AN
ENDLESS STREAM OF GOVERNMENT
SERVICES AND RIGHTS. NAME ONE
RIGHT? A GÂY PERSON IS LACKING
AS COMPARED TO A STRAIGHT PERSON
. BUT THIS IS NOT ABOUT GÂY
RIGHTS TETHERING THE L GB TO THE
Tð Q. PLUS IS ANOTHER WAY TO
TRICK PEOPLE. UH, THAT NÓ ONE IS
OR THAT ONE IS BORN TRANS AS
OPPOSED TO, UH, TRANSITION
MEDICINE BEING USED TO
STERILIZE. A OF GÂY AND AUTISTIC
KIDS BY TELLING THEM THAT THEY
WERE BORN WRONG. THIS IS THE
SAME MARGINALIZED GROUP THAT
FORCES PEOPLE TO CALL A MAN, A
WOMAN, THE GROUP THAT IS USING
THAT IS ERASING THE WORD WOMAN
FROM OUR LAWS. THE GROUP THAT
PERMITS MEN WITH PENISES TO
WATCH LITTLE GIRLS UNDRESS,
SHOWER AND USE OUR BATHROOMS,
THE MARGINALIZED RAPIST,
MURDERERS AND BABY KILLERS WHO
CAN CHOOSE WHICH PRISON TO SERVE
THEIR TIMES AS WELL AS THEIR
CELL MATE, THE SAME GROUP THAT
FORCES INSURANCE TO PAY FOR
BODY. TOURING HAIR REMOVAL,
FACIAL SURGERIES AND A WHOLE
HOST OF OTHER COSMETIC SURGERIES
. THIS GROUP HAS 100 AND 45 DAYS
A YEAR DEDICATED TO THEIR
RECOGNITION. DE TRANSITIONERS
ARE TOLD THAT THE HARMS
PERPETRATED AGAINST THEIR BODIES
WERE JUST PART OF THEIR GENDER
JOURNEYS. SUCK IT UP, BUTTERCUP.
UH, WHERE IS THE DATA THAT IS
TRACKING ALL THE MURDERING TRANS
PEOPLE. RIVERS MOSELEY ALDRIDGE,
MCKINLEY MARCELO HALE. WHERE IS
THE DATA KEEPING FOR ALL OF THE
MALES WHO ARE MASQUERADING AS
FEMALES TAKING FEMALE TROPHIES,
PLACES ON TEAMS AND SCHOLARSHIPS
. THIS BILL IS A MONEY GRAB.
IT'S A WAY TO POUR MORE
UNNECESSARY DOLLARS INTO FUNDING
ALL THINGS TRANS. YOU AND YOUR
CRONIES ARE RAKING IN MILLIONS
ON COMMODITIZING SELF LOATHING.
A Kò, A GENDER DYSPHORIA AND ANY
KIND OF FE, UH, FETISHES. VOTE
NÓ ALL RIGHT, NEXT WITNESS. GOOD
AFTERNOON. MY NAME IS NICOLE
YANG AND IN THE STATE OF
CALIFORNIA WE HAVE BEEN DATA
MINING BASED OFF RACE FOR AS
LONG AS I CAN REMEMBER, WITH THE
EXPLANATION BEING IT WILL BE
USED TO CLOSE THE HEALTH GAP,
EDUCATION AND EMPLOYMENT
DISPARITIES. WHAT IS ACTUALLY
HAPPENED IS WE HAVE NOT SEEN AN
IMPROVEMENT IN HEALTH OUTCOMES
AND WE HAVE DUMBED DOWN
EDUCATION, TAKING AWAY
OPPORTUNITIES FOR THE VERY
PEOPLE. WE WERE TOLD IT WOULD
HELP. IT IS MOST EVIDENT IN
SENATORS WEINER DISTRICTS IN SAN
FRANCISCO, WHERE THEY REMOVED
HIGHER LEVEL MATHEMATICS AND
THEY ARE NOW BRINGING IT BACK.
THESE MEASURES CREATED MORE
DIVISION, MORE SEGREGATION AND
MORE DISCRIMINATION. WE POURED
MONEY INTO PROGRAMS THAT DID NOT
CREATE A FLOURISHING CALIFORNIA
AS OUR STATE FACES AN
UNPRECEDENTED BUDGET. DEFICIT WE
SHOULD NOT BE POURING MORE MONEY
INTO PROGRAMS BASED OFF IDENTITY
POLITICS. WE SHOULD NOT BE DOING
MORE DATA MINING IN THE NAME OF
EQUITY AND CREATING ANOTHER AREA
OF SEGREGATION IN CALIFORNIA.
FOR THESE REASONS, I'M ASKING
FOR A NÓ VOTE ON S¼ B 957. THANK
YOU. ALL RIGHT. OTHER WITNESSES
IN OPPOSITION, PLEASE APPROACH
THE MICROPHONE. GIVE US YOUR
NAME, YOUR AFFILIATION AND YOUR
POSITION. UH, GREG BURT WITH THE
CALIFORNIA FAMILY COUNCIL IN
OPPOSITION. THANK YOU. RIGHT?
YVETTE CORCORAN REGISTERED NURSE
SAN FRANCISCO RESIDENT. I OPPOSE
THIS VOTE OR THIS BILL NEXT
WITNESS. SAYING NÓ ONE ELSE
APPROACHING THE MICROPHONE.
LET'S TURN TO COMMITTEE MEMBERS.
QUESTIONS BY COMMITTEE MEMBERS
COMMENTS SENATOR SENATOR LAIR,
DID YOU FINE. I WAS ALL RIGHT.
SENATOR STERN HAS MOVED THE BILL
. ALL RIGHT, SENATOR WEINER.
WOULD YOU LIKE TO CLOSE? I
RESPECTFULLY ASK FOR AN I VOTE.
ALL RIGHT. UM, MADAM SECRETARY,
PLEASE CALL THE ROLL. THIS IS
FILE ITEM NUMBER 15 S¼ B 957.
THE MOTION IS DUE PASS IT IN AN
APPROPRIATIONS. UMBERG UM I WILK
WILK, NÓ. ALAN. ALAN. I ASHBY
CABALLERO CABALLERO, I DURAZO. I
LAIRD LAYERED EYE. MIN MIN. I
NELO NEITHER NÓ STERN STERN IW.
WAHAB? AYE. 8 TO 2 EVERY WAIT A
MINUTE. NÓ. NOT EVERYONE IS
HERE. 8 TO 21 MEMBER MISSING.
EIGHT TO DO. ALRIGHT. THANK YOU.
WE'LL PUT THAT BILL ON CALL 8 TO
2. ALL RIGHT, UM SENATOR WIENER
S¼ B 1047 BEF BEFORE WE BEGIN ON
S¼ B 1047 JUST A COUPLE OF
COMMENTS. UM AH, FIRST OFF ALL
BILLS ARE IMPORTANT. THIS BILL
IS UM, AMONG THE MOST IMPORTANT
BILLS THAT THAT I THINK WE'RE
GOING TO CONSIDER THIS YEAR AND
I AM FULLY AWARE, AS IS THE
AUTHOR THAT WHATEVER WE DO HERE
IN CALIFORNIA, UM SETS THE
METRICS SETS. THE GUIDELINES
SETS THE LAW, THE REGULATION FOR
THE UNITED STATES AND MAYBE EVEN
BEYOND. I KNOW THAT SOUNDS LIKE
A BIT OF HUBRIS, BUT BUT IT IS
NOT INTENDED TO BE SUCH. I THINK
IT IS THE REALITY. THERE'S A
NUMBER OF FOLKS HERE IN THE
AUDIENCE WHO I KNOW WISH TO
TESTIFY. I I'M SURE THAT THERE'S
A NUMBER OF FOLKS WHO ARE
WATCHING US. UM IN THEIR HOMES
AND OFFICES. WE DON'T NEED TO
KNOW THAT WE KNOW THAT WE KNOW
THE IMPLICATIONS OF WHATEVER WE
DO HERE IN CALIFORNIA. UM WE ARE
GOING TO HAVE BEEN ASKED ABOUT
EXPANDING THE OPPORTUNITY FOR
TESTIMONY. FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO
ARE NOT FAMILIAR WITH THE
PROCESS IS THAT THIS IS THE
ASSUMING THE BILL GETS OUT OF
COMMITTEE. I THINK IT WILL. UM,
THIS IS A, UH, FIRST STEP IN A
IN A VERY LONG JOURNEY THROUGH
LEGISLATURE, SO THERE ARE MANY
OPPORTUNITIES AND WE WELCOME
WRITTEN MATERIALS. I'VE
ENCOURAGED FOLKS TO PROVIDE US
WRITTEN MATERIALS. UH, BECAUSE
THIS IS, UM I THINK, AS SENATOR
WEINER WILL ATTEST. THIS IS A
WORK IN PROGRESS AND WE DO WANT
TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT WE GET
THIS IS RIGHT AS WE POSSIBLY CAN
. UH, THERE'S A TENSION BETWEEN
MAKING SURE THAT WE ENCOURAGE
ENTREPRENEURIAL DEVELOPMENT OF
ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE. BUT WE
ALSO WE PROTECT, UM, AGAINST
THOSE HARMS THAT THAT ARE ARE
ATTENDANT TO ARTIFICIAL
INTELLIGENCE. SO HAVING SAID
THAT WE'RE GOING TO MAINTAIN
THAT THE USUAL PROTOCOL HERE IN
SENATE JUDICIARY WITH TWO
WITNESSES IN SUPPORT, TWO
WITNESSES IN OPPOSITION AND AS
MANY AS ARE PHYSICALLY PRESENT
IN THE ROOM MAY TESTIFY IN ME,
TOO. TESTIMONY. HAVING SAID
THAT? THANK YOU, SENATOR WEINER
FOR YOUR WORK ON THIS. THE FLOOR
IS YOURS. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
UH, MR CHAIRMAN AND I WILL START
BY SAYING THAT I STRONGLY
BELIEVE THAT GOOD SAFETY, UM
ABSOLUTELY ENHANCES INNOVATION.
AND SO WE VERY APPRECIATIVE OF
YOU. UH UH. AGENDAS THE BILL
TODAY AND I WANT TO THANK
PERSONALLY THANK YOU AND YOUR
STAFF FOR SPENDING A LOT OF TIME
WORKING WITH US EVEN I THINK
BEFORE WE INTRODUCED THE BILL,
AND AS YOU AND I HAVE DISCUSSED,
WE'LL CONTINUE THAT ENGAGEMENT.
UH, MOVING FORWARD. UM, AND I
APPRECIATE THAT, UM HAPPY TO
ACCEPT THE AMENDMENTS THAT THE
COMMITTEE IS REQUESTING, WHICH
ARE CHANGING A DRAFTING ERROR IN
THE DEFINITION OF COVERED MODELS
, ADJUSTING DEFINITION OF A I TO
MAKE IT CONSISTENT WITH OTHER
BILLS, ADDING SOME CO AUTHORS
AND AGAIN WE WILL CONTINUE TO
ENGAGE THROUGHOUT THE
LEGISLATIVE PROCESS. UM UH SO
I'M CALLING BECAUSE I'M HERE TO
PRESENT UH S¼ P 1047. THE
LEGISLATION HAS TWO MAIN GOALS
FIRST IS PROMOTING THE
RESPONSIBLE DEVELOPMENT OF SO
CALLED FRONTIER. ARTIFICIAL
INTELLIGENCE, UH, MODELS AND BY
FRONTIER. WE MEAN VERY, VERY
LARGE, POWERFUL MODELS POWERFUL
BEYOND WHAT WE EVEN PROBABLY
COULD HAVE IMAGINED. UH, NOT
THAT LONG AGO. SO THESE ARE THE
FRONTIER OF SIZE AND POWER. UH
AND SECOND, UM, SUPPORTING
COMPETITION? UH, AND PROMOTING.
A IN THE ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE
FIELD. UH, WE KNOW THAT
CALIFORNIA HAS BECOME A VIBRANT
HUB, UM, FOR ARTIFICIAL
INTELLIGENCE, AND I DON'T WANT
TO BRAG TOO MUCH ON MY CITY, BUT
, UH, SAN FRANCISCO? UH I'M VERY
PROUD OF THE A. I INNOVATION
THAT IS HAPPENING IN OUR CITY.
UM A I HAS ENORMOUS POTENTIAL TO
BENEFIT OUR STATE, OUR NATION
AND THE WORLD EVERY WEEK. WE ARE
HEARING ABOUT NEW, INCREDIBLE.
THINGS THAT ARE BEING CREATED
VIA A I, UM WHETHER A MODEL THAT
IS A MODEL THAT'S DISCOVERING A
NEW ANTIBIOTIC THAT HAPPENS
RECENTLY, OR DECODING ANCIENT
MANUSCRIPTS THAT PHYSICALLY
CAN'T BE OPENED BECAUSE THEY'RE
SO OLD AND THEY WOULD FALL
APART, BUT A I WAS ABLE TO
ACTUALLY DECODE THEM. OR
STRENGTHENING OUR CLEAN ENERGY
SUPPLY CHAINS. UH, CALIFORNIA
MUST BE IN THE LEAD AND SUPPORT
AND INVEST IN THE DEVELOPMENT OF
THIS TECHNOLOGY AND GOVERNMENT
AND BUSINESS AND CIVIL SOCIETY
TO ENSURE THAT OUR STATE REMAINS
ON THE CUTTING EDGE AND THAT IS
SOMETHING THAT I AM DEEPLY
DEEPLY COMMITTED TO AT THE SAME
TIME THAT WE ARE INNOVATING AND
HELPING THIS TECHNOLOGY MAKE THE
WORLD A BETTER PLACE. UH, WE
KNOW THAT SCIENTISTS, ENGINEERS
BUSINESS LEADERS, INCLUDING
SCIENTISTS WHO HELPED CREATE
ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE, UM,
INCLUDING TWO OF THE MOST CITED
MACHINE LEARNING RESEARCHERS ON
THE PLANET RESEARCHERS WHO BY
THE WAY HAVE OFFICIALLY ENDORSED
THIS LEGISLATION, THEY HAVE
REPEATEDLY WARNED POLICYMAKERS
THAT FAILURE TO TAKE APPROPRIATE
PRECAUTIONS COULD HAVE SEVERE
SAFETY CONSEQUENCES FOR OUR
STATE AND FOR THE PLANET. UM IN
THE FUTURE, THE MOST POWERFUL A
I MODELS COULD POSE SERIOUS
DANGERS TO PUBLIC SAFETY AND
NATIONAL SECURITY IF THEY ARE
DEVELOPED RECKLESSLY. THESE
DANGERS INCLUDE RISKS TO
CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE. AND THE
THREAT OF NOVEL BIOLOGICAL
WEAPONS AND CYBER ATTACKS. FOR
ANY NEW TECHNOLOGY TO SUCCEED IN
BEING ADOPTED AND ACCEPTED
WIDELY. AS I BELIEVE THIS
TECHNOLOGY SHOULD BE POTENTIAL
USERS HAVE TO TRUST THAT IT IS
BOTH SAFE AND COMPATIBLE WITH
THEIR NEEDS AND VALUES. A I
DEVELOPERS IN CALIFORNIA HAVE
ALREADY TAKEN IMPORTANT FIRST
STEPS IN PIONEERING THE SAFE
DEVELOPMENT OF THIS TECHNOLOGY.
UH, BUT WE CANNOT AFFORD TO BE
COMPLACENT. WITH CONGRESS
PARALYZED. AND THE FUTURE OF THE
BIDEN ADMINISTRATION'S EXECUTIVE
ORDER IN DOUBT LEGALLY
CALIFORNIA HAS AN INDISPENSABLE
ROLE TO PLAY IN ENSURING THAT WE
DEVELOP THIS TECHNOLOGY
RESPONSIBLY. UM I WILL KNOW. I'M
SURE YOU WILL HEAR TODAY. THIS
IS SOMETHING THAT SHOULD BE
HANDLED BY CONGRESS. WELL, THAT
WOULD BE GREAT. UM BUT I WOULD
ASK, UH, THE FOLKS WHO ARE, UH,
MAKING THOSE STATEMENTS HOW MANY
LAWS HAS CONGRESS PASSED AROUND
SOCIAL MEDIA AND DATA PRIVACY,
AND THAT ANSWERS THE QUESTION.
WHATEVER WE THINK SHOULD HAPPEN
AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL. IT'S NOT
HAPPENING. UM S¼ B 147 BUILDS ON
THE FOUNDATION OF IMPORTANT
MEASURES ALREADY TAKEN BY
GOVERNOR NEWSOM AND HIS
EXECUTIVE ORDER RELATING TO
GOVERNMENT AGENCIES. 1047
COMPLEMENTS THESE EFFORTS. IT
SETS OUT CLEAR STANDARDS FOR
DEVELOPERS OF THESE EXTREMELY
POWERFUL A. I MODELS, UH,
SYSTEMS THAT MEET THE BILL'S
THREAT THRESHOLD OF 10 TO THE 26
FLOP, WHICH IS A TECHNICAL TERM
THAT YOU WILL HEAR ABOUT. IT
MEANS REALLY, REALLY BIG AND
POWERFUL. UM, AND THAT WOULD
TYPICALLY COST MORE THAN 100
MILLION. HOURS TO TRAIN AND
WOULD BE SUBSTANTIALLY MORE
POWERFUL THAN ANY SYSTEM THAT
EXISTS TODAY. SO THIS BILL ONLY
REGULATES SYSTEMS THAT DON'T
EVEN EXIST YET TODAY THEY WILL
SOON AND THEY ARE EXTREMELY
POWERFUL. S¼ 3 1047 CLARIFIES
THAT DEVELOPERS OF THESE MODELS
MUST TAKE BASIC SAFETY
PRECAUTIONS SUCH AS PRE
DEPLOYMENT, SAFETY TESTING AND
CYBER SECURITY PROTECTIONS.
THESE RESPONSIBILITIES AGAIN
ONLY APPLY TO THE LARGEST
MODELS. UM, WE KNOW THAT, UH
THAT IF WE KNOW THAT, UH SORRY.
MY APOLOGIES. UM AND AGAIN, THIS
IS GOING TO HELP US REMAIN IN
THE LEAD ON INNOVATION, AND THE
BILL ALSO CREATES A NEW ADVISORY
COUNCIL TO ADVOCATE FOR AND
SUPPORT SAFE OPEN SOURCE. A I
DEVELOPMENT OPEN SOURCE IS
INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT IN
FOSTERING INNOVATION. UH WE ALSO
NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT IT IS
DONE IN A SAFE AND RESPONSIBLE
WAY. S¼ P 1047 CREATES
WHISTLEBLOWER PROTECTIONS FOR
EMPLOYEES. FRONTIER
LABORATORIES, UH, AND REQUIRES
PROVIDE CLOUD COMPUTE FOR THESE
VERY LARGE MODELS TO INSTITUTE A
KNOW YOUR CUSTOMER POLICY TO
PREVENT THE DANGEROUS MISUSE OF
A I SYSTEMS. UM SO, UH, I JUST
WANT TO STRESS. AS WE SAID AT
THE BEGINNING THIS BILL, THIS IS
THE FIRST STOP ON A WHAT IS A
LONG JOURNEY FOR THIS BILL. I
KNOW THAT THERE'S WE'VE DONE
ENORMOUS WORK OVER THE LAST YEAR
ON THIS BILL WITH A WIDE ARRAY
OF STAKEHOLDERS, INCLUDING
PEOPLE WHO LOVE THE BILL, AND
PEOPLE WHO DON'T LOVE THE BILL,
AND WE HAVE HAD AN OPEN DOOR AND
WE'LL CONTINUE TO HAVE AN OPEN
DOOR AND IT IS A GROWING
COALITION WITH A LOT OF START
UPS THAT ARE SUPPORTING IT.
PEOPLE WHO FOUNDED COMPANIES AND
UNDERSTAND WHAT THE RISKS ARE,
AND I AM REALLY OPTIMISTIC THAT
WE'LL BE ABLE TO PRODUCE A VERY,
VERY STRONG LAW FOR CALIFORNIA.
UM SO, UH, I RESPECTFULLY ASK
FOR YOUR I VOTE. UH AND WITH ME
TODAY TO TESTIFY ARE NATHAN
CALVIN, WHO'S A SENIOR POLICY
COUNSEL AT THE CENTER FOR A I
SAFETY ACTION FUND. ONE OF OUR
SPONSORS, UM AND SNEHA, UM RAVEN
OR THE PRESIDENT OF ENCODE
JUSTICE, ALSO ONE OF OUR SPON.
AND I ALSO WANT TO KNOW THAT
CHRIS PAINTER, THE POLICY
DIRECTOR AT THE MODEL EVALUATION
THREAT RESEARCH, METER IS HERE
FOR TECHNICAL QUESTIONS METER,
UM, IS HEAVILY RELIED ON BY
LARGE LABS. UM TO FOR SAFETY
EVALUATION PURPOSES. THANK YOU.
THANK YOU. FIRST WITNESS,
PLEASE. CHAIR UMBER AND MEMBERS.
I'M HONORED TO TESTIFY HERE
TODAY IN SUPPORT OF S¼ B 147. MY
NAME IS SNEHA RAVEN OR AND I'M
THE 19, YEAR OLD LEADER OF
ENCODE JUSTICE, A GLOBAL YOUTH
MOVEMENT FOR SAFE EQUITABLE A I.
WE'RE ONE OF THREE COS SPONSORS
OF THIS CRITICAL LEGISLATION. I
CREATED UNCODE JUSTICE IN 2020
AS A TEEN GROWING UP IN SAN
JOSE. SINCE THEN, THIS MOVEMENT
HAS EXPANDED FAR BEYOND
CALIFORNIA. BUT OUR STATE HOME
TO THE TOP TECH GIANTS, IT'S
STILL FRONT AND CENTER IN THE
GLOBAL FIGHT FOR A I GUARD RAILS
PUT SIMPLY ALL OF HUMANITY WILL
BENEFIT FROM URGENT ACTION
WITHIN THIS CHAMBER, STARTING
WITH YOUNG CALIFORNIANS LIKE ME.
OUR SOCIETY HAS ALREADY FAILED
TO REIN IN EXPLOITATIVE SOCIAL
MEDIA PLATFORMS. IN TURN, I'VE
SEEN MY PEERS GROW ADDICTED TO
SCREENS AND BE NUDGED TO
SUICIDE. NOW WE FACE AN EVEN
MORE TRANSFORMATIVE TECHNOLOGY.
A I EARLIER THIS YEAR OPEN A. I
UNVEILED SO A MODEL THAT CAN
GENERATE HYPER REALISTIC VIDEO
BASED ON JUST A SHORT TEXT
PROMPT. JUST DAYS AGO OPEN A I
UNVEILED MO VOICE ENGINE, A
MODEL THAT CAN MIMIC ANYONE'S
VOICE REALISTICALLY, BASED ON
JUST A SHORT CLIP. I WANT TO
LIVE IN A WORLD WHERE A I
BENEFITS ALL OF US. BUT AS
FRONTIER A I GROWS EXPONENTIALLY
MORE CAPABLE. I'M SCARED THAT
THE RISKS OF SEVERE HARM COULD
BE COMPOUNDING TOO, WITHOUT OUR
KNOWLEDGE OR CONSENT. A HANDFUL
OF A I COMPANIES ARE SLOWLY AND
QUIETLY RESHAPING OUR FUTURE.
THE FUTURE THAT MY GENERATION
WILL SOON INHERIT AS CONGRESS
STALLS, THE MORAL RESPONSIBILITY
OF A I OVERSIGHT FALLS ON
CALIFORNIA WE MUST URGENTLY
PASS. B ONE AND 47, WHICH WOULD
SET COMMON SENSE A I SAFETY
STANDARDS AND ESTABLISHED èC
COMPUTE SO WE CAN PROTECT OUR
YOUNG PEOPLE AND ELEVATE OUR
YOUNG INNOVATORS TO GIVE THEM A
CHANCE TO COMPETE. ALL EYES ARE
ON IN CALIFORNIA. FOR OUR SAKE.
I HOPE LEADERS LIKE YOU WILL
TAKE NOTICE AND TAKE ACTION. MY
GENERATION WILL THANK YOU FOR
IT. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. THANK
YOU VERY MUCH. ALL RIGHT. NEXT
WITNESS, PLEASE. CBG AND MEMBERS
OF THE COMMITTEE. THANK YOU FOR
THE OPPORTUNITY TO PROVIDE
TESTIMONY IN SUPPORT OF SB 1047.
I AM NATHAN CALVIN, SENIOR
POLICY COUNSEL AT THE CENTER FOR
A I SAFETY ACTION FUND, ONE OF
THREE COS SPONSORS OF THIS
LEGISLATION. THE CENTER FOR A I
SAFETY ACTION FUND IS A POLICY
ADVOCACY ORGANIZATION AFFILIATED
WITH THE CENTER FOR A I SAFETY,
A TECHNICAL RESEARCH
ORGANIZATION BASED IN SAN
FRANCISCO THAT WORKS TO SHAPE
THE SAFE AND SECURE DEVELOPMENT
OF A I SYSTEMS. THE PACE OF AIR
PROGRESS IS ASTOUNDING. FOUR
YEARS AGO, GENERATIVE A. I
SYSTEMS LIKE OPEN A GP Tð SERIES
STRUGGLE TO COUNT TO 10. TODAY
THEY CAN WRITE SOFTWARE, COMPOSE
MUSIC AND STEER ROBOTS. A. I IS
ALREADY BEING USED TO ACCELERATE
DRUG DISCOVERY, OPTIMIZE
WILDFIRE RESPONSE AND UNCOVER
RARE EARTH ELEMENTS FOR CLEAN
ENERGY. HOWEVER, THERE ARE ALSO
REAL RISKS. JUST THIS PAST MONTH
. WE'VE SEEN URGENT WARNINGS
FROM THE SEC CHAIR ABOUT A I'S
POTENTIAL TO TRIGGER FINANCIAL
MELTDOWNS. NEW CALLS FROM
EMINENT SCIENTISTS FOR RED LINES
AROUND RISKY A DEVELOPMENT AND
DEMONSTRATIONS OF INCREASINGLY
POWERFUL A I AGENTS,
AUTONOMOUSLY WRITING CODE AND
TAKING INDEPENDENT ACTIONS AT
SCALE. IN A 2023 EXECUTIVE ORDER
. THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION
OUTLINED CONCERN THAT THE NEXT
GENERATION OF LARGE A MODELS
COULD BE CAPABLE OF ENABLING
NOVEL CYBER ATTACKS ON CRITICAL
INFRASTRUCTURE OR FACILITATE THE
DEVELOPMENT OF NOVEL BIOLOGICAL,
CHEMICAL OR NUCLEAR WEAPONS. AS
SENATOR WEINER MENTIONED TWO OF
THE SCIENTISTS WHO HAVE WARNED
ABOUT THE POTENTIAL FOR
INCREASINGLY CAPABLE SYSTEMS TO
CAUSE POTENTIALLY CATASTROPHIC
HARM INCLUDE DOCTOR JEFFREY
HINTON AND DOCTOR YASHUA BENJO,
WINNERS OF THE COMPUTER SCIENCE
EQUIVALENT OF THE NOBEL PRIZE,
AND SO CALLED GODFATHERS OF A I
WHO PIONEERED THE DEVELOPMENT OF
DEEP NEURAL NETWORK DECADES AGO
TECHNIQUES WHICH UNDERPIN RECENT
ADVANCES IN A I LIKE CHA èC P
Tð. BOTH OF THOSE SCIENTISTS
HAVE PUBLICLY ENDORSED SB 1040
SEVEN'S APPROACH AS AN IMPORTANT
AND SENSIBLE STEP FORWARD IN
ADDRESSING EMERGING RISKS, THE
LARGEST A I SYSTEMS AS A GLOBAL
TECHNOLOGY LEADER, CALIFORNIA
CAN ENSURE THE BIGGEST A. I
SYSTEMS CAN FORM WITH BASIC
SAFEGUARDS. CALIFORNIA HAS A
CRITICAL WINDOW TO ESTABLISH A
GOVERNANCE FRAMEWORK THAT
PROMOTES RESPONSIBLE DEVELOPMENT
REQUIRES COMMON SENSE.
GUARDRAILS THANK YOU. WRAP IT
UP. THANK YOU. SORRY JUST MY
LAST. UM THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR
ALL OF YOUR TIME ON THIS, AND,
UH, WE URGE YOUR SUPPORT ON S¼ B
1047. THANK YOU SO MUCH. ALL
RIGHT, UM OTHERS IN SUPPORT.
PLEASE APPROACH THE MICROPHONE.
THANK YOU, MR CHAIR. MEMBERS OF
THE COMMITTEE TERRY OLEY WITH
ECONOMIC SECURITY CALIFORNIA
ACTION, ONE OF THE CO SPONSORS
OF THE BILL IN STRONG SUPPORT.
GOOD AFTERNOON, LANNON KLEIN
FROM THE FUTURE OF LIFE
INSTITUTE AND SUPPORT. THANK
YOU. ANYONE ELSE IN SUPPORT?
THAT'S IT. OK, UH, LET'S TURN TO
OPPOSITION. THANK YOU. CHAIR
MEMBERS. WE DE ALAMI WITH CAL
CHAMBER RESPECTFULLY IN
OPPOSITION TO SB 1047 EXCUSE MY
VOICE. TODAY WE THANK THE AUTHOR
AND HIS STAFF FOR ALL THE WORK
THAT HAS CLEARLY GONE INTO THIS
BILL. UM AND TO BE CLEAR WE VERY
MUCH SHARE THE GOAL OF ENSURING
THE SAFE AND RESPONSIBLE
DEVELOPMENT OF A I. HOWEVER WE
DO HAVE SOME CONCERNS OVER
ISSUES THAT WOULD PRECLUDE US
FROM GETTING THERE IN A MANNER
THAT STILL FOSTERS INNOVATION.
FUNDAMENTALLY OUR PRIMARY
CONCERNS BOIL DOWN TO
WORKABILITY ISSUES AND
CONSEQUENCES THEREOF. WE'RE
CONCERNED THAT THE BILL DICTATES
COMPLIANCE WITH THE NUMBER OF
VAGUE AND IMPRACTICAL IF NOT
TECHNICALLY, UH, INFEASIBLE
REQUIREMENTS AS DRAFTED, AS
DESCRIBED IN FURTHER DETAIL IN
OUR LETTER. THESE INCLUDE, FOR
EXAMPLE, TERMS AND STANDARDS
AROUND POSITIVE SAFETY
DETERMINATIONS AND HAZARDOUS.
UH, CAPABILITY, ALL OF WHICH LED
TO INCREDIBLE UNCERTAINTY FOR
BUSINESSES AND LIE AT THE CORE
OF THIS FRAMEWORK AND S¼ B 1047.
WE'RE ALSO CONCERNED THAT THE
BILL IS ALMOST EXCLUSIVE FOCUS
ON DEVELOPER LIABILITY FOR
FAILING TO BLOCK ANY AND ALL
CONCEIVABLE, CONCEIVABLY
HARMFUL. IS OF A MODEL EVEN IN
SCENARIOS WHERE A THIRD PARTY
EFFECTIVELY JAILBREAKS, THE
MODEL IS PROBLEMATIC. WITH SUCH
UNCERTAINTY, THE HIGH COST OF
COMPLIANCE, INSIGNIFICANT
LIABILITY EXPOSURE AS WELL AS
OTHER ISSUES IN OUR LETTER
AROUND OPEN SOURCE DEVELOPMENT
AND COMPUTER CLUSTER, UH,
REQUIREMENTS WE ARE CONCERNED
THAT THIS INEVITABLY DISCOURAGES
TECHNOLOGICAL INNOVATION AND OUR
ECONOMY. UH, BY HAMSTRINGING
BUSINESSES FROM DEVELOPING THE
VERY A, I TECHNOLOGIES THAT
COULD PROTECT CALIFORNIANS FROM
DANGEROUS MODELS DEVELOPED IN
TERRITORIES BEYOND OUR CONTROL.
SB 1047 RISK ONLY MAKING THEM
MORE VULNERABLE. MAKE MAKING
CALIFORNIANS MORE VULNERABLE.
EXCUSE ME, UM, ULTIMATELY AGAIN
TO SUCCEED. I THINK WE HAVE TO
MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE
CONSISTENCY NATIONALLY, UM, AND
REFRAIN FROM ADDING MORE
CONFUSION TO AN ALREADY
FRAGMENTING A I REGULATORY
LANDSCAPE. UM, WITH THAT, WE
JUST RESPECTFULLY, UH, OPPOSE
AND LOOK FORWARD TO WORKING WITH
THE AUTHOR. THANK YOU. THANK
YOU. THANK YOU. OTHERS IN
OPPOSITION. GOOD AFTERNOON CHAIR
UMBERG AND MEMBERS OF THE
COMMITTEE. I'M JESS MYERS. I'M A
COMPUTER SCIENTIST AND ADJUNCT
LAW PROFESSOR. UM AND I'M HERE
TODAY AS SENIOR COUNSEL ON
BEHALF OF CHAMBER OF PROGRESS,
WHERE WE ADVOCATE FOR
TECHNOLOGICAL INNOVATIONS TO
BENEFIT AMERICANS. TODAY WE
ADDRESS OUR SIGNIFICANT CONCERNS
WITH SENATE BILL 1047. THIS
LEGISLATION THREATENS TO STIFLE
COMPETITION AND SLOW INNOVATION
IN A STATE KNOWN FOR ITS
TECHNOLOGICAL LEADERSHIP, RATHER
THAN FOSTERING CALIFORNIA'S TECH
ECOSYSTEM. S¼ B 147 REPRESENTS A
REGRESSIVE MOVE. FOR THE STATE'S
ECONOMY. THE BILL WHILE RAISING
LEGITIMATE CONCERNS ABOUT A I
DEVELOPMENT, PARTICULARLY WITH
RECENT ADVANCEMENTS IN
GENERATIVE A. I MISGUIDEDLY
FOCUSES ON REGULATING MODEL
DEVELOPERS INSTEAD OF TACKLING
THE PROBLEMATIC USE OF SPECIFIC
APPLICATIONS OF A I S¼ B 1047
INTRODUCES CERTIFICATION
REQUIREMENTS THAT ARE OVERLY
BROAD AND UNREALISTIC FOR
PRACTICAL APPLICATION BEFORE ANY
DEVELOPMENT AND EVEN MODEL
TRAINING COMMENCES. THE BILL
DEMANDS THAT A I DEVELOPERS
PREEMPTIVELY TACKLE A VAST ARRAY
OF POTENTIAL HAZARDS, INCLUDING
THOSE INDIRECTLY RELATED TO
THEIR MODELS THROUGH
HYPOTHETICAL THIRD PARTY MISUSE.
THIS MEANS DEVELOPERS ARE
EXPECTED TO ANTICIPATE RISKS AT
A POINT WHEN THE SCOPE OF A
MODEL'S CAPABILITIES AND
VULNERABILITIES IS YET TO BE
DETERMINED. A COMMON ADAGE IN
CYBER SECURITY IS IF YOU BUILD
IT, THEY WILL HACK IT APTLY, AND
IT APTLY APPLIES TO A I GIVEN
THE COMPLEXITY AND EVOLVING
NATURE OF A I SYSTEMS. IT'S
IMPOSSIBLE TO CREATE A SYSTEM
DEVOID OF POTENTIAL HAZARDS, BUT
ESPECIALLY UNIQUE TO A I IS THE
FACT THAT SOME TECHNICAL ASPECTS
OF THE DECISION MAKING PROCESS
REMAIN UNKNOWN EVEN TO THE
DEVELOPERS THAT CREATED IT. THIS
INHERENT TRANSPARENCY BARRIER
MAKES IT NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE TO
ADEQUATELY ENSURE A MODEL
REMAINS UNDER THE HAZARD
THRESHOLD PRESCRIBED. SB 1047
STIFLES INNOVATION BY UNFAIRLY
FAVORING ESTABLISH ESTABLISHED
TECH GIANTS OVER EMERGING START
UPS. THE BILL ALSO CREATES AN
UNJUSTIFIABLE DIVIDE BETWEEN SO
CALLED DERIVATIVE AND NON
DERIVATIVE A I MODELS WITHOUT
CONSIDERING THE INHERENT RISKS
OF A I TECHNOLOGIES. GENERALLY
THIS DISTINCTION ACTS AS A
REGULATORY MOAT AROUND INCUMBENT
FIRMS, CONTRADICTING PERSISTENT
EFFORTS BY THIS LEGISLATURE TO
REDUCE BIG TAX INFLUENCE. AND,
IRONICALLY, BOLSTERING, THANK
YOU. THANK YOU. ALRIGHT. OTHERS
IN OPPOSITION, PLEASE APPROACH
THE MICROPHONE. HARMAN ON BEHALF
OF TECHNET, RESPECTFULLY POST.
THANKS, ALL RIGHT, OTHERS NICOLE
YANG OPPOSE MISTER PRESIDENT.
NAO. WE PUT YOUR ON ON BEHALF OF
THE COMPUTER AND COMMUNICATIONS
INDUSTRY ASSOCIATION AND
OPPOSITION. THANK YOU. ALL
RIGHT, OTHERS IN OPPOSITION.
SAYING NÓ ONE ELSE IN
OPPOSITION. AH, LET'S BRING IT
BACK TO COMMITTEE. YES, SENATOR.
MIN. I WANT TO THANK THE SENATOR
FOR BRINGING IT IS CLEARLY AN
IMPORTANT BILL AN IMPORTANT
TOPIC TO ADDRESS AND UH, WE HAVE
SEEN, UM, A I UP IN TRADITIONAL
MODELS, WHETHER IT'S ACADEMIA,
WHETHER IT'S UH, THE INTERNET
BANKING, CYBER SECURITY, ETC. UM
AND IT'S CLEAR WE NEED A
REGULATORY FRAMEWORK MOVING
FORWARD. I'LL JUST KNOW SOME
THOUGHTS HERE, I. I THINK THIS
IS AN INCREDIBLY COMPLICATED
AREA FOR THE LAW TO ADDRESS SOME
OF THE CHALLENGES THAT A I
RAISES, I THINK ARE PROBABLY
BEST COVERED BY ADAPTATIONS TO
EXISTING LAW. SOME OF THEM
CLEARLY REQUIRE NEW LAWS AND NEW
STRUCTURES AND NEW AGENCIES. UM
YOU KNOW, I GUESS MY CONCERN
HERE AND I'M GOING TO ASK A
QUESTION WITH THE LONG RUN UP,
UH, IS AROUND REGULATORY
COMPETENCY? UM BECAUSE THIS IS
SUCH A COMPLICATED AREA TO
ADDRESS AND I DON'T PRETEND TO
UNDERSTAND. I WATCH TERMINATOR
TWO BACK IN THE DAY. SO I HAVE
SOME FAMILIARITY WITH THE A. I,
BUT, UM, SORRY. BAD JOKE. UM I
GOT KIDS WATCH THE MOVIE. IT'S
TERRIBLE. UH èC G. I BUT, UH,
PRETTY GOOD PLOT. UM BUT I CAME
FROM A BANKING BACKGROUND AND
SOME OF THE CHALLENGES IN
REGULATING BANKING IN THE
FEDERAL AND STATE LEVEL. SIMILAR
TO THE CHALLENGES THAT I COULD
SEE ARISING IN A I, UH WITH
BANKING, PARTICULARLY THESE DAYS
WITH, UM VERY COMPLICATED
CONGLOMERATES, UH, DOING LOTS OF
DIFFERENT ACTIVITIES. YOU HAVE A
LOT OF DIFFERENT TYPES OF VERY
COMPLEX RISKS. UH, REGULATORS
ARE ASKED TO BOTH GAUGE UH,
MUTABLE RISKS THAT ARE
CONSTANTLY CHANGING AND EVOLVING
. UH AND TRYING TO ENFORCE THOSE
COMPLIANCE WITH THOSE, UH, RISK
AND ENFORCEMENT OR RISK, UH,
MEASURES THAT THEY'RE DEALING
WITH A AND STATES. ARE OFTEN
SEEN AS A PROBLEMATIC IN THIS
EFFORT BECAUSE STATE REGULATORS
AND STATE AGENCIES ARE NOT SEEN
AS AS AS COMPETENT AS THE
FEDERAL REGULATORS. AND, UH,
WITHOUT EDITORIALIZING TOO MUCH.
I THINK WE EVEN SEE THAT IN OUR
STATE. UH I. I DON'T THINK
ANYONE WAS PLEASED WITH HOW
CALIFORNIA STATE BANKING
REGULATORS HANDLED THE SILICON
VALLEY BANK COLLAPSE, AND THAT'S
IN PART BECAUSE WE DON'T PAY OUR
REGULATORS AS MUCH. THEY'RE NOT
AT THE TOP OF THE HEAP. AND WHEN
WE LOOK AT THE FEDERAL RESERVE
AND THE BANKING REGULATORS AT
THE FEDERAL LEVEL WE PAY A LOT
OF MONEY. WE TRY TO RECRUIT THE
BEST AND BRIGHTEST AND IT
STRIKES ME THAT THAT WE'RE GONNA
NEED TO DO THE SAME IN A I IF WE
REALLY WANT TO GRAB WRAP OUR
HANDS AROUND THIS. WE'RE GOING
TO NEED PEOPLE THAT ARE SMART,
THAT REALLY UNDERSTAND THIS IN
WAYS THAT I DON'T PRETEND TO A
AND I WORRY THAT IF WE TRY TO
HANDLE THIS WITH LIMITED
RESOURCES AT THE STATE LEVEL, WE
ARE SETTING OURSELVES UP TO JUST
BE LIKE A CHECK MARK FOR THAT
THAT DIFFERENT FIRMS, UH, GET TO
CHECK OFF AND SAY, HEY, WE
COMPLIED WITH CALIFORNIA'S
FRAMEWORK HERE. AND THAT WILL
OBVIATE PERHAPS, UM, MAKE IT
MORE DIFFICULT FOR, UH OTHER
STATES OR THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT
TO TRY TO REGULATE THIS IN A WAY
THAT WOULD MAKE SENSE. AND SO I
GUESS I'M SAYING III. I SEE A
LOT OF SENSE IN WHAT YOU'RE
DOING, BUT I DO WANT JUST WANNA
RAISE THE CHALLENGES THAT THE
STATE'S GOING TO HAVE,
PARTICULARLY WITH ENFORCEMENT,
PARTICULARLY WITH GAUGING RISKS.
UH, AND UNDERSTANDING THOSE
RISKS. WELL UM, WITH LIMITED
RESOURCES, UH, IN A IN A
CONSTRAINED BUDGET ENVIRONMENT,
SO I GUESS I JUST ASK YOU TO
RESPOND TO THAT. AND THEN I HAVE
A FOLLOW UP. UH, SURE. AND THANK
YOU FOR THAT, UM, YOU KNOW,
FIRST OF ALL, UM AS WITH ALL THE
THERE ARE CERTAINLY, UM, IF YOU
LOOK AT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT
REGULATORS THERE ARE ALSO HITS
AND MISSES NÓ GOVERNMENT
ANYWHERE ON THE PLANET THAT
PERFECTLY DOES REGULATION ALL
THE TIME, AND WE COULD FIND
INTENSE CRITICS OF EVERY SINGLE
FEDERAL OR STATE REGULATORY
AGENCY. UM, I WILL SAY THAT
THERE ARE, UM PLENTY OF TIMES
WHEN I THINK CALIFORNIA DOES, UH
, GET IT RIGHT. I THINK WE'RE
ALL VERY PROUD OF THE U èC.
IT'S NOT A REGULATOR, BUT YOU
KNOW, PUBLIC BODY THAT I THINK
IS ON THE CUTTING EDGE. UH, AND
SO I THINK WE ARE CAPABLE OF
DOING IT. WHEN WE PUT OUR MIND
TO IT AND II. I DO AGREE THAT
YOU HAVE TO HAVE THAT FOCUS AND
YOU HAVE TO HAVE THE RESOURCES.
ONE THING I DO WANT TO SAY ABOUT
THIS BILL, THOUGH THIS IS NOT A
BILL WHERE WE'RE ASKING A
REGULATOR TO GET IN AND
MICROMANAGE A I. THIS IS NOT
THIS BILL. THERE ARE SOME WHO
THINK WE SHOULD INCLUDE A
LICENSURE REQUIREMENT IN THIS
BILL. WE HAVE NOT. THERE ARE
SOME WHO THINK THAT WE SHOULD BE
REQUIRING GOVERNMENT
PRECLEARANCE BEFORE YOU EITHER
TRAIN OR PUBLISH A MODEL. WE ARE
NOT DOING THAT. OUR GOAL HERE IS
NOT TO HAVE THE STATE
MANAGING THAT, BUT RATHER TO
HAVE RULES IN PLACE FOR WHAT YOU
HAVE TO DO TO RESPONSIBLY TEST
FOR SAFETY SO THAT YOU'RE NOT
PUTTING SOMETHING OUT IN THE
WORLD THAT'S GOING TO SHUT DOWN
THE GRID FOR SIX MONTHS, FOR
EXAMPLE, OR DO SOME OTHER
PROBLEMATIC, HARMFUL THING. UH,
AND IF YOU DON'T DO IT, THEN THE
ATTORNEY GENERAL CAN SUE YOU AND
SO, I. I THINK THE APPROACH
WE'VE TAKEN. I'M NOT SAYING IT'S
NOT GONNA WE, OF COURSE, WANT
THE DEPARTMENT OF TECHNOLOGY,
ETCETERA TO BE ABLE TO DO A
REALLY GOOD JOB ON THIS. UM BUT
IT IS NOT THE SAME. AS, FOR
EXAMPLE, BANK REGULATION. WHICH
IS MUCH MORE INTRUSIVE AND
INTENSIVE. IF WE PASS THIS INTO
LAW, CONGRESS AT ANY MOMENT IN
TIME, CAN OCCUPY THE FIELD AND
PASS A REGULATION AND PRE EMPT
STATE LAWS. THEY CAN DO THAT
THEY'VE NOT DONE IT WITH SOCIAL
MEDIA. DESPITE PROFESSING
BIPARTISAN SUPPORT, THEY HAVE
NOT DONE IT WITH DATA PRIVACY
DESPITE PROFESSING BIPARTISAN
SUPPORT, AND I'M NOT BLAMING ONE
PARTY OR THE OTHER. I'M BLAMING
BOTH PARTIES FOR FAILING ON
THOSE ISSUES. AND SO WE HAVE HAD
TO STEP IN, AND WE'VE DONE OUR
OWN CLIMATE AND ON VARIOUS OTHER
ISSUES, AND I THINK WE SHOULD DO
IT HERE. AND TO JUST APPRECIATE
THAT RESPONSE. I HEAR YOU THERE.
THERE'S A CHICKEN AND EGG
QUESTION HERE, OBVIOUSLY, WITH
THE DYSFUNCTIONAL CONGRESS ON,
YOU KNOW, WHEN WILL CONGRESS ACT
AND MAYBE IT'S NEVER RIGHT AND
SO THAT'S A VERY SALIENT POINT.
YOU RAISE. AND UH THE ONLY POINT
I WOULD RESPOND WITH IS THERE IS
A REAL CONCERN THAT THAT MANY OF
THE LOBBYISTS THAT ARE IN THE
ROOM TODAY THAT, UH, OPPOSE YOUR
BILL, UM OR MAY END UP IF THEY
LIKE IT, AND THEY FEEL LIKE IT'S
THE WEAKER BUILD, UH THAN THAN
WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED AT THE
FEDERAL LEVEL. UH OR COMPLIANCE
IS NOT SEEN. SOMETHING THAT IS
PARTICULARLY DIFFICULT TO COMPLY
WITH A LOT OF WORKAROUNDS, FOR
EXAMPLE, THAT THEY MAY END UP
MAKING THAT ARGUMENT TO THE
FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. THAT WE,
CALIFORNIA ALREADY HAS A STRONG
LAW. THIS SHOULD BE A STATE
MATTER, AND WE'VE SEEN THAT
ARGUMENT MADE THAT ALL BEING
SAID, UM I ALSO RECOGNIZE THE
FAST MOVING PACE WITH WHICH A I
IS MOVING, AND BY THIS TIME NEXT
YEAR IF WE DON'T THIS YEAR. UH A
I WILL HAVE TAKEN MASSIVE LEAPS
AND BOUNDS AND I THINK WE ARE
RACING AGAINST THE CLOCK. SO I
AM GOING TO VOTE I, BUT I JUST
WOULD ENCOURAGE YOU. TO REALLY
THINK ABOUT WHAT THE STATE'S
CORE COMPETENCIES ARE AND WHAT
WE CAN DO WELL, AND I SUSPECT
THAT A LOT OF THIS IS GOING TO
HAVE TO GET PA DOWN ANYWAYS,
BECAUSE YOU'RE THE BUDGET CHAIR
AND YOU KNOW HOW BAD THE BUDGET
SITUATION IS BETTER THAN ANYONE.
SO I GUESS I JUST, UH YOU KNOW,
ENCOURAGE YOU TO THINK ABOUT A
STRIPPED DOWN VERSION OF LIKE,
WHAT CAN THE STATE ACTUALLY DO
WELL AS AS REALLY POSITIVE FIRST
STEPS HERE, AND I KNOW THAT'S
HOW A LOT OF THE THINKING BEHIND
THIS BILL WENT, BUT I JUST I
JUST REALLY WANNA, UH, WE'RE
GETTING AHEAD OF OUR SKIS. IF WE
THINK WE CAN DO THIS REALLY
WELL, I THINK AND THAT'S MY MAIN
CONCERN WITH THIS BILL, BUT I
WILL BE VOTING. TODAY. SENATOR
M. I THINK THE FEDERAL
GOVERNMENT IS WAITING FOR
SENATOR THEN CONGRESSMAN MIN TO
GET THERE AND THEN WE'LL SEE.
I'M JUST GONNA COPY. WE'LL WE'LL
SEE. I WILL REAL ACTION. IF I
MAY. 1 THING I WILL NOTE IN 2018
FOR THOSE WHO WE'RE HERE. WHO
WAS HERE? MR. WILK HERE, MR
ALLEN. YOU GUYS WERE HERE. UM
UH, WHEN I AUTHORED OUR NET
NEUTRALITY LAW S¼ B 822, WHICH
IS A HUGE MELTDOWN FIGHT IN THE
LEGISLATURE AND WE WERE ALSO
TOLD BY SOME LOBBYISTS LET
CONGRESS DO IT. AND I ALWAYS SAY
HEY, IF CONGRESS PREEMPTS US
WITH A GOOD NET NEUTRALITY LAW,
I WILL BE HAPPY TO PACK UP
SHOPPING. GO HOME. WE'RE NOW SIX
YEARS LATER, AND CONGRESS HAS
NEVER ACTED. ALL RIGHT, UH,
FIRST SENATOR, THEN SENATOR HAB.
THEN, SENATOR RIGHT THEN SENATOR
GROSSO. THANK YOU, MR CHAIR. UH,
SENATOR WEINER. YOU HAVE TACKLED
A BIG ISSUE HERE AND A
COMPLICATED ISSUE, AND I
ACTUALLY COMPLIMENT YOU FOR
THAT. IT IS NONETHELESS, AS THE
CHAIR INDICATED AT THE OUTSET.
IT IS A WORK IN PROCESS. UM I
CAN'T SUPPORT IT AS IT IS, BUT I
DON'T OPPOSE IT BECAUSE I
RESPECT THE EFFORT. UM COUPLE OF
POINTS WITH REGARD TO THE
DANGERS OF A I THIS IS
FUNDAMENTALLY DIFFERENT THAN
REGULATIONS IN OTHER AREAS WHERE
PEOPLE MIGHT HAVE SAID WAIT FOR
CONGRESS, AND YOU DIDN'T WAIT
FOR CONGRESS, BUT, UH IT THE
CONTROLS ARE RELEVANT AND CAN
WORK WITHIN OUR STATE. BUT THE
FUNDAMENTAL REASON FOR HAVING A
GUARD RAILS WITH REGARD TO A I
IS TO TRY TO WORK AGAINST THOSE
NEGATIVE EFFECTS. WE COULD PASS
WHATEVER REGULATION WE WANT HERE
, AND WE WOULDN'T STOP THOSE
NEGATIVE EFFECTS AS LONG AS
NOBODY ELSE IS GOING TO ACT. AND
BY THE WAY, ANOTHER MOVIE WAS
WAS MENTIONED BY SENATOR MAN I,
UM, WHAT I WOULD URGE IS FOR
PEOPLE TO WATCH A SPACE ODDITY,
2001 AND IN PARTICULAR PAY
ATTENTION TO THE SCENE WHERE HAL
SAYS, UH, I'M SORRY, DAVE. I
CAN'T DO THAT. WATCH THE MOVIE
AND YOU'LL SEE WHAT I MEAN BY
THE BY THE MEANING OF THAT
STATEMENT ENCAPSULATES WHAT A
DANGER OF A I AND IT SEEMED
FANCIFUL THEN, BUT, UH, IT'S
REAL, AND BASICALLY HE WAS
KILLING THE ASTRONAUTS. UM BUT,
UH UH, THE WITH REGARD TO THOSE
DANGEROUS EFFECTS, AS I SAID, WE
CAN PASS WHAT WE WANT HERE. BUT
IF NOBODY ELSE DOES ANYTHING
AROUND THE OTHER 49 STATES
AROUND THE WORLD, WE'RE GOING TO
HAVE A TOUGH TIME. UM PREVENTING
THOSE NEGATIVE REMARKS. HOWEVER,
ONE OF YOUR WITNESSES DID SAY AN
IMPORTANT THING, SHE SAID. ALL
EYES ARE ON CALIFORNIA, AND THAT
MAY BE TRUE. SO PERHAPS WE COULD
PASS SOMETHING THAT WOULD GUIDE
OTHERS. UM AND THAT'S WHY I'M
NOT GONNA VOTE NÓ. BUT AGAIN, IT
IS SO MUCH OF A WORK IN PROCESS
WITH SO MANY THINGS THAT I
QUESTION THAT. I CAN'T. I'M NOT
QUITE AT. I HAVEN'T GOTTEN TO
YES, YET, AND I IN AN IDEAL
WORLD WE'D HAVE CONGRESS AND
THEN CHINA AND ALL THE BIG
COUNTRIES IN PARTICULAR, HAVE A
TREATY. THAT WOULD BE GREAT.
WE'LL SEE IF THAT EVER HAPPENS.
BUT I DO THINK THAT CALIFORNIA
IS WELL SITUATED, UH TO, UH,
ADDRESS THIS BECAUSE OF THE
CRITICAL MASS OF A I INNOVATION.
HERE AND OUR ROLE IN TECHNOLOGY
IN THE COUNTRY AND ON THE PLANET
. UM AND WE ARE SEEING, YOU
KNOW, THERE ARE THINGS HAPPENING
AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL. I COMMEND
PRESIDENT BIDEN, THE U S¼ AND
THE U Kò SIGNED AN M Ó U. UH,
JUST, UH, YESTERDAY I BELIEVE
ABOUT WORKING ON DIFFERENT
SAFETY ISSUES. SO THERE'S A LOT
OF MOMENTUM HERE, BUT AT SOME
POINT IT HAS TO GO INTO LAW AND
I THINK WE SHOULD START HERE IN
CALIFORNIA. ALRIGHTY THANK YOU.
UH, SENATOR. THANK YOU, UM IS
BECAUSE MY TWO COLLEAGUES
MENTIONED A I AND FILMS. I WILL
MENTION THAT THERE'S AN A I
NAMED AISHA. SO I JUST WANNA,
UM, HIGHLIGHT THAT AND, UM, BUT
SPECIFICALLY, I WANTED TO
HIGHLIGHT THAT. YOU KNOW, A LOT
OF THE ARGUMENTS HERE HAVE BEEN
KIND OF, UM, CAUTIONARY TALES.
UH, THIS IS TOO BIG. WE DON'T
KNOW THINGS LIKE THAT. UH THE
REALITY IS AND AS A PERSON WITH
A TECH BACKGROUND THAT HAS
WORKED IN TECHNOLOGY FOR A
NUMBER OF YEARS. UM I OFTEN SEE
THAT POLICY DOESN'T CATCH UP TO
WE ARE ACTUALLY FAR BEHIND ON A
LOT OF DIFFERENT FRONTS, WHETHER
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SOCIAL MEDIA
AND SAFETY AND CYBER SECURITY
AND MUCH MORE AND TO BE QUITE
FRANK WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT,
UM RANSOMWARE AND HACKING AND
DATA LEAKS AND, UH, SECURITY AND
PRIVACY AND MUCH MORE. UM EVERY
SINGLE GOVERNMENT IS BEHIND THE
TIMES AND IN IN CALIFORNIA, AS
WELL AS ACROSS THE NATION. UM WE
CANNOT COMPETE WITH THE PRIVATE
SECTOR AT ALL. RIGHT THAT'S THE
HONEST TRUTH. WE CANNOT. UM
LOCAL GOVERNMENTS CANNOT FIND
THE MOST TALENTED STAFF BECAUSE
OF BUDGET RESTRAINTS AND MUCH
MORE, UM MANY CITIES AND
JURISDICTIONS ACROSS THE BOARD,
INCLUDING IN THE BAY AREA HAVE
BEEN RANSOMED AND MUCH MORE. AND
THERE ARE DATA LEAKS AND THINGS
LIKE THAT. SO I SAY ALL OF THIS
BECAUSE WE HAVE TO MAKE AN
INVESTMENT IN EMERGING
TECHNOLOGIES. WE HAVE TO START
FROM SOMEWHERE. THIS ISN'T AND I
KNOW, SENATOR YOU'VE STATED, YOU
KNOW, THIS ISN'T THE END ALL BE
ALL RIGHT. THIS IS A STARTING
POINT. UM AND IT DOES NOT COVER
ALL OF THE CONCERNS THAT
EVERYBODY HAS. UH BUT WHAT BILL
DOES RIGHT? UM AND I
SPECIFICALLY WANNA HIGHLIGHT THE
FACT THAT WHEN WE TALK ABOUT
ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE, UM AND
WE ARE COMPETING WITH OTHER
NATIONS, WE ARE COMPETING WITH
TECHNOLOGY THAT IS VERY MUCH
OPEN TO THE PUBLIC WHERE YOU
KNOW PEOPLE CAN TINKER AND YOU
KNOW, WE HAVE LITTLE SCIENTISTS
AND ENGINEERS THAT CAN GO ABOVE
AND BEYOND, UM, IN THEIR OWN
BACKYARD AND, UH, GARAGE. AND SO
FORTH. SO I THINK THAT FOR ME, I
THINK THAT THIS IS INCREDIBLY
IMPORTANT TO AT LEAST SAY THIS
IS A FRAMEWORK WE CAN START WITH
. THIS IS A FRAMEWORK THAT WE
CAN, UM SEE WHAT WE ARE TRYING
TO PRIORITIZE SPECIFICALLY, EVEN
THE DAMAGES YOU KNOW, HALF A
BILLION DOLLARS IS A VERY HIGH
THRESHOLD. UM, WE HAVE SEEN I
WILL SAY SIGNIFICANT CONCERNS IN
REGARDS TO OUR INFRASTRUCTURE.
UM OUR INFRASTRUCTURE IS NOT
JUST BUILDINGS, BUT IT'S ALSO
THE TECHNOLOGY WE UTILIZE. UM
FOR EXAMPLE, IF ONE CLOUD
COMPUTING, UM, SERVER OR
LOCATION FROM ONE OF THE TOP
TECH COMPANIES IS DOWN. AH, THAT
IS A CONCERN. FOR NOT JUST ONE.
COMPANY BUT LITERALLY, EVERYBODY
THAT DEPENDS ON IT. UM AND I
DON'T THINK THAT WE DO ENOUGH IN
REGARDS TO TECHNOLOGY AS A
POLICY RIGHT? AND YOU KNOW, IT'S
FUNNY BECAUSE I THINK THAT SOME
OF THE COMMENTS THAT WE'VE HEARD
IS THAT, UM, IT'S WE'RE GOING TO
IDENTIFY A POSITIVE SAFETY,
DETERMINATION. AND UM THINGS
LIKE THAT ABOUT THIS BILL, AND
SOME DON'T THINK THAT WE HAVE
THE CAPACITY TO, UH, AT A LOCAL
LEVEL WHEN WE TALK ABOUT POLICY.
WE TALK ABOUT EQUITY IMPACTS. WE
TALK ABOUT ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT
REPORTS WE TALK ABOUT, UM, A LOT
OF OTHER IMPACT REPORTS THAT
WERE STILL BUILDING ON. EVEN AT
A LOCAL LEVEL ON THINGS LIKE
PURE DEVELOPMENT, RIGHT HOUSING.
UM THINGS LIKE THAT. SO I REALLY
WANNA HIGHLIGHT THAT TO ME. THIS
BILL IS A STARTING POINT. UM IT
VERY MUCH IS SOMETHING THAT IS
NEEDED THE FACT THAT WE SEE
TECHNOLOGY MOVE AT THE SPEED OF
LIGHT BECAUSE OF ARTIFICIAL
INTELLIGENCE. OTHER THINGS ARE
IMPACTED. UM SO, I. I JUST WANNA
HIGHLIGHT ALL OF THOSE CONCERNS.
I REALLY APPRECIATE THE, UH YOU
KNOW, PROPONENTS OF THIS BILL AS
WELL AS THE OPPOSITION OF THIS
BILL, BECAUSE THIS IS JUST THE
FIRST OF MANY CONVERSATIONS THAT
NEED TO BE DONE AND HAD TO
CONTINUE TO IMPROVE AND INVEST.
UM, I WILL, SAY Ó E S¼. UH IS
THERE BUT WE ALSO KNOW THAT WE
NEED TO GO ABOVE AND BEYOND SOME
OF THESE THINGS. UM SO, I, I
WILL SAY THAT I FULLY SUPPORT
THIS. THIS EFFORT. UM AND I WILL
MOVE THE BILL WHEN APPROPRIATE.
UM, AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME
ON THIS. SENATOR RUSSELL THANK
YOU. THANK YOU, UM, FOR RAISING
THIS ISSUE FOR HAVING THE
COURAGE TO PUT SOMETHING
TOGETHER THAT EVERYBODY COULD
THEN JUMP OUT AND SAY, WHY
DIDN'T YOU COVER THIS? WHY
DIDN'T YOU COVER THAT? UM AS IF
WE KNEW WHAT WE WERE TALKING
ABOUT. UM BUT I, I DO WANT, UH,
YOUR FIRST, UH, WITNESS SPEAKER,
UM, TALKED A LOT ABOUT AND WAS
VERY ARTICULATE ABOUT WE'RE
GOING TO MAKE SURE WE ALL DO
THIS TOGETHER THAT IT COVERS
EVERY SOMETHING ABOUT EQUITY. UH
AND, UH, I WAS IMPRESSED BY THAT
, BECAUSE TO THIS DAY WE STILL
HAVE MILLIONS OF CALIFORNIANS
WHO HAVE NÓ SIMPLE INTERNET
CONNECTIVITY. AND THAT'S ABOUT
AS BEHIND AS ANY PART OF THE
WORLD COULD GET. UM AND SO I
WOULD LIKE YOU. TO LOOK INTO THE
ISSUE OF EQUITY. IN A MUCH MORE
SPECIFIC WAY, IF WE'RE GONNA
HAVE GUIDING PRINCIPLES IN
GENERAL ABOUT A I WHAT ABOUT
EQUITY? TO PEOPLE. LIKE
CALIFORNIANS WHO WERE SUPPOSED
TO BE WAY AHEAD OF, UH, OTHER
PARTS OF THE WORLD. NOT
PROVIDING CONNECTIVITY. THERE'S
SOMETHING PRETTY SHAMEFUL ABOUT
THAT. AND SO TO THINK THAT NOW
WE'RE IN THIS NEW ERA OF A I AND
NOT THE BEGINNING OF IT, BUT
CERTAINLY A WE'RE ALL NOW MORE
AWARE OF IT THAN EVER BEFORE. WE
IF WE DON'T HAVE A DELIBERATE
INCLUSION. NOT JUST FOR ALL
CALIFORNIANS IN THIS CASE, BUT
YOU KNOW, PEOPLE ALL OVER THE
WORLD. WILL BE LEFT OUT. AND THE
POWER OF THE A. I WILL CONTINUE
TO REST IN THE HANDS OF A FEW
PEOPLE. JUST LIKE THE INTERNET.
UM YOU KNOW, BROADBAND
CONNECTIVITY. AND WHAT DOES THAT
MEAN? A CONTINUATION OF NOT
HAVING ACCESS TO INFORMATION NOT
HAVING ACCESS TO EDUCATION, NOT
HAVING ACCESS TO THE HEALTH CARE
. THERE'S SO MANY THINGS THAT WE
WILL CONTINUE TO HAVE THOSE BIG
GAPS. IF WE ARE NOT EXPLICITLY
DELIBERATE. ABOUT NOT MOVING. IN
THAT IN THE IN THE MOST FAIR AND
JUST WAY, SO, UM, I WISH I HAD A
SPECIFIC SUGGESTION OTHER THAN
ASK ALL THE EXPERTS AROUND YOU.
MUCH MORE DELIBERATE AND
INTENTIONAL. ABOUT WHAT? AND HOW
ARE WE GONNA HANDLE THAT?
EVERYBODY DOES MOVE FORWARD
TOGETHER ON THIS. GO AHEAD,
SENATOR. WE? YEAH, NÓ. THAT'S A
REALLY IMPORTANT IMPORTANT POINT
SENATOR ERAS AND I REALLY
APPRECIATE IT A COUPLE OF THINGS
I. I WANNA NOTE. UM OF COURSE
THIS IS WHY I'M VERY FLATTERED
OF THE CHAIRS. UH,
CHARACTERIZATION OF THIS BILL AT
THE BEGINNING, AND I THINK IT IS
AN IMPORTANT BILL. BUT THERE ARE
THERE ARE OTHER IMPORTANT A I
BILLS MOVING IN THE LEGISLATURE,
FOR EXAMPLE, AS ASSEMBLY MEMBER,
BAUER Kò HAS A BILL, WHICH SHE
LOST LAST YEAR IS TRYING AGAIN
ON ALGORITHMIC DISCRIMINATION,
MAKING SURE THAT IS NOT MAKING
SOME OF THE HUGE INEQUITIES IN
OUR SOCIETY EVEN WORSE, UH,
THAT'S A VERY IMPORTANT BILL.
THERE ARE OTHER IMPORTANT BILLS,
TOO. WE DO HAVE I THINK SOME, UM
UH, IN IN UH, EQUITY OR FIELD
LEVELING ASPECTS OF THE BILL. UM
CAL COMPUTE, WHICH WE TOUCH ON
BRIEFLY IS ANOTHER PIECE OF THIS
BILL. IT SETS UP A PUBLIC CLOUD
SYSTEM SO THAT WE HAVE MORE
ACCESS TO THE ABILITY OF PEOPLE
TO CREATE THESE LARGER MODELS,
NOT JUST THE BIG TECH COMPANIES.
WE HAVE A PRICING TRANSPARENCY.
UH, PROVISION IN THE BILL SO
THAT SOME OF THE BIG TECH
COMPANIES CAN'T MONOPOLIZE THAT
AND PLAY, UH, FAVORITES WITH
WHISTLEBLOWER PROTECTION SO THAT
OUR FRONT TECHNOLOGISTS WHO ARE
NOT IN THE èC SUITE, UH, ARE
ABLE TO COME FORWARD TO SAY
THERE'S A SAFETY ISSUE HERE AND
I HAVE RAMIFICATIONS. AND ONE
THING I WILL SAY, AND I KNOW
THIS DOESN'T ISN'T EXACTLY WHAT
YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT. BUT IN
TERMS OF EQUITY. UM UH, YOU KNOW
, IT WAS I. I DO WANT TO JUST
ADDRESS THE CHAMBER OF PROGRESS
GOT UP THERE, UH, IN CHAMBER OF
PROGRESS. SOME OF THEIR MEMBERS
INCLUDE GOOGLE AND META AND ON
AN UBER AND SOME OF THE BIGGEST
TECH COMPANIES ON THE PLANET.
AND YET THEY GOT UP THERE AND
SAID THIS IS GONNA FAVOR THIS IS
GONNA LOCK IN THE BIG TECH
COMPANIES. WELL, THEY REPRESENT
THE BIG TECH COMPANIES. AND THE
REALITY IS IF YOU LOOK AT WHO IS
SUPPORTING THIS BILL, IT'S AN
AWFUL LOT OF START UPS. IT IS A
SMALL COMPANIES THAT ARE START
UPS THAT THEY KNOW THAT THIS IS
IMPORTANT. SO I. I APPRECIATE
THE POINT AND WE'LL KEEP WORKING
ON THAT. THANK YOU. UM I'M GONNA
HAVE TO LEAVE, UNFORTUNATELY,
BUT II I WANNA RAISE A FEW
POINTS WITH YOU, SENATOR WEINER
BEFORE I LEAVE. UM, THANK YOU,
SENATOR. RAO. UH, SO, UH, THERE
ARE A NUMBER OF VARIOUS CONCERNS
THAT YOU AND I TALKED ABOUT AND
I. I JUST WANNA GO OVER SOME OF
THEM SO THAT THAT WE ARE CLEAR
ON THE RECORD, AND ONE IS THIS
IS THIS IS A HEAVY LIFT. UM AND
IN TERMS OF THE PHASE IN WHETHER
OR NOT JANUARY 1 OF 2025,
EVERYTHING BECOMES OPERATIONAL.
II. I HAVE A CONCERN ABOUT
EVERYTHING BECOMING OPERATIONAL
THAT WE CAN IN THIS CURRENT
BUDGET SITUATION IN THE CURRENT
SITUATION, EVEN WITH OUR OWN
INTERNAL TECHNOLOGY THAT WE CAN
BECOME FUNCTIONAL BY WON 2025 I
WANTED YOU TO RESPOND TO, UH,
POTENTIAL PHASE IN? YEAH. SO UM,
IN TERMS OF A PHASE, AND WE'RE
OPEN TO THAT, AS LONG AS WE ARE
DISTINGUISHING BETWEEN DIFFERENT
PARTS OF THE BILL, UM AND IN
PARTICULAR, I DO THINK IT'S
REALLY IMPORTANT FOR THE ACTUAL
SAFETY REQUIREMENTS IN TERMS OF
THE SAFETY EVALUATIONS THAT
COMPANIES NEED TO DO, UM, THAT
NEEDS TO ME GO INTO EFFECT VERY
QUICKLY. UM BUT THERE ARE SOME
ASPECTS OF THE BILL THAT I THINK
CAN BE PHASED IN AND WE'RE HAPPY
TO WORK WITH YOU. ON THAT
DISTINGUISHMENT IF THAT'S THAT'S
NOT A WORD, BUT I'LL MAKE IT A
WORD. I THINK IT IT. THIS IS
DISTINCTION, DISTINCTION,
DISTINCTION. ALL RIGHT. THIS IS
CRITICAL. AND I AND I YOU'VE
ALWAYS DEALT WITH GOOD FAITH AND
I AND I BELIEVE THAT WE WILL BE
ABLE TO WORK SOMETHING OUT. BUT
IT IS CRITICAL. I THINK THAT WE
DO WORK SOMETHING OUT IN TERMS
OF PHASING. I JUST I SIMPLY
DON'T BELIEVE THAT WE CAN. ON
JANUARY 1 OPERATIONALIZED ALL
ALL THE COMPONENTS AND THAT ALSO
GIVEN SOME OF THE BUDGET
CONSTRAINTS THAT COULD BE
HELPFUL IN THAT RESPECT, TOO.
THE OTHER ISSUE AMONG OTHERS IS
THE DIFFERENCE. UH, THE BILL
TALKS ABOUT COVERED MODELS. YOU
KNOW WHO'S COVERED AND COVERED
GUIDANCE. WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE?
UM GIVEN THAT HOW FAST THIS
TECHNOLOGY IS MOVING, UH, THE
BILL IS A BIT VAGUE AND MAYBE
INTENTIONALLY SO TO BE ABLE TO
BE FLEXIBLE AS AS THE OUT YEARS
ARE UPON US. UM WHAT? WHAT WHAT
ARE YOUR THOUGHTS ON HOW WE
CRAFT SUFFICIENT FLEXIBILITY?
SAME THING WITH METRICS WITH THE
FLOPS. I AM TOLD THAT THAT'S AN
OUT THAT WILL SOON BE AN
OUTDATED METRIC. SO, YEAH, SO A
COUPLE THINGS IN TERMS. OF THE
SIZE 10 TO 26 FLOP IT. IT'S ALSO
UM FOR MODELS THAT ARE CREATED
THAT EFFECTIVELY THAT MIGHT NOT
MEET THAT THRESHOLD IN THE
FUTURE, BUT HAVE THE SAME POWER
THEY WILL BE COVERED AND IN
TERMS OF HARMS IT IS, UH YOU
KNOW, WE'VE DELINEATED. UM UH,
CYBERCRIME, CAUSING 500 MILLION
OR MORE, UH, IN DAMAGE, HARM TO
CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE OF 500
MILLION OR MORE IN DAMAGE, AND I
KNOW WE CAN HAVE A DEBATE SHOULD
THAT BE A HIGHER NUMBER OR A
LOWER NUMBER? THAT'S TOP FAIR
TOPIC OF DISCUSSION. UM
BIOLOGICAL, CHEMICAL ETCETERA
WEAPONS AND THEN WE HAVE A
CATEGORY FOUR OR EQUIVALENT
HARMS AND SO WE DO BUILD
FLEXIBILITY, AND SOME ARE GOING
TO CRITICIZE THAT BY SAYING IT'S
NOT PRECISE ENOUGH. BUT IF WE'RE
TOO PRECISE, THEN WE LOCK
OURSELVES IN. WHAT ABOUT
DELEGATING TO THE FRONTIER MODEL
DIVISION? THE ABILITY TO UM
CHANGE THE METRICS, I GUESS IN
TERMS OF BEING FLEXIBLE AS AS WE
I I'M I AM HAPPY TO HAVE THAT.
CONVERSATION WE NOT REALLY
CONTEMPLATED THAT, BUT I THINK
THAT THAT, UM I, I CERTAINLY
WORTHY OF A OF A DISCUSSION
HERE. HERE'S MY CONCERN.
EVERYTHING I'VE EXPRESSED IT IS
THAT IF WE IF WE LOCK IN TODAY
IN 2024 YOU KNOW, JUST AS WE
WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN ABLE TO
ENVISION THE POWER AND THE
BREADTH OF A I 10 YEARS AGO, WE
MAY NOT BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND
THAT THE ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE AND
WHAT METRICS ARE APPROPRIATE SO
I'D I'D I'D ASK YOU AND WE WILL
CONTINUE TO COME HAVE A
CONVERSATION ABOUT THAT. UM
SINCE WE'RE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE,
I HAVE SOME JUDICIARY. QUESTIONS
FOR YOU. LAWYER TO LAWYER. WHAT
IS WHAT IS REASONABLE CAUSE TO
BELIEVE THAT A PERSON IS
VIOLATING THE LAW. WHAT WHAT?
WHAT WHAT'S REASONABLE CAUSE IS
THAT PROBABLE CAUSE IS THAT
SUSPICION? I MEAN, THESE ARE
THEY'RE DEFINED DEFINED TERMS IN
THE LAW AND YOU AND YOU AND I
HAVE TALKED ABOUT THIS AND I. I
APPRECIATE YOU RAISING AND I
THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE ARE
GOING. NEED TO CLARIFY SO
TYPICALLY WHEN THE ATTORNEY
GENERAL WOULD DECIDE YOU
VIOLATED THE LAW. I'M SUING YOU.
THEY DON'T HAVE TO MEET A
PARTICULAR LEGAL THRESHOLD. THEY
JUST DECIDE AND AS LONG AS
THEY'RE DOING IT IN GOOD FAITH
AND NOT FRIVOLOUSLY, THEY CAN
FILE THE LAWSUIT. AND THEN
ULTIMATELY, THE COURT DECIDES
WHETHER THERE WAS A VIOLATION OR
NOT, AND WE COULD DO THAT. HERE
WE PUT REASONABLE CAUSE AND JUST
TO PUT SOME SORT OF THRESHOLD,
YOU POINTED OUT, AND YOU ARE
CORRECT THAT THAT IS NOT A
DEFINED TERM, SO I THINK THAT WE
WOULD EITHER NEED TO DEFINE IT
OR TAKE IT OUT AND HAVE THE
ATTORNEY GENERAL ENFORCE IN THE
WAY THAT HE NORMALLY OR
SUBSTITUTE OR SUBSTITUTE A
DEFINED TERM, WHETHER IT'S
REASONABLE, SUFFICIENT, PROBABLE
CAUSE WHAT WHATEVER IT MAY BE,
IS A THRESHOLD. WHERE EVEN I
THINK THAT THAT THAT'S ANOTHER
ISSUE THAT MUST BE RESOLVED HERE
BECAUSE WE DON'T WANT THE COURT.
YOU KNOW, OUR MISSION IS TO
CREATE CLARITY. WE DON'T WANT
THE COURTS HAVING TO STRUGGLE
WITH THIS FOR YEARS. UM THE
OTHER PROVISIONS THAT PROVIDE
FOR JOINT AND SEVERAL LIABILITY
AND THAT IS ALSO OF CONCERN, UH,
THAT THAT CLEARLY THAT THE
COVERED MODELS IF THEY ARE NOT
COMPLYING WITH THE LAW IF THEY
FAIL TO PROVIDE THE ADEQUATE
SAFETY MEASURES, THEY SHOULD BE
LIABLE. AND THEN IN TERMS OF
JOINING SEVERAL LIABILITY, UM
YOU KNOW HOW FAR DOWN THE CHAIN
SHOULD THAT GO? SHOULD THE YOU
KNOW THE $10 MILLION COMPANY BE
RESPONSIBLE FOR THE $100 BILLION
COMPANIES. FAILURE IF THAT $100
BILLION COMPANY DOESN'T EXIST,
THAT THAT'S ANOTHER CONCERN THAT
THAT YOU AND I HAVE TALKED ABOUT
. AND HOW DO WE RESOLVE THAT
CONCERN? YEAH AND, UH, WE'RE
HAPPY TO WORK WITH YOU ON THAT.
OUR GOAL HERE IS TO MAKE SURE
THAT PEOPLE ARE NOT IN
INFLICTING GREAT HARM. AND THEN,
UH, BECAUSE THERE WAS SOMEONE
ELSE WHO WAS DETERMINED BY A
JURY TO HAVE BEEN RESPONSIBLE
FOR 80% BUT THERE ARE SAY
OVERSEAS, UM AND YOU'RE ABLE TO
BASICALLY BE OFF THE HOOK. UH,
SO STRUCTURE THAT WE THINK IN A
REASONABLE WAY. BUT THERE MIGHT
BE THERE MAY VERY WELL BE OTHER
REASONABLE WAYS. AND WE'RE HAPPY
TO WORK WITH YOU ON THAT. I'M
WORRIED ABOUT THE CONVERSE WHERE
SOMEONE IS 1. LIABLE IN THE
UNITED STATES AND SOMEONE'S 99%
LIABLE OVERSEAS IN THAT 1%
LIABILITY, THEN THAT THAT ENTITY
IS RESPONSIBLE FOR 100% OF THE
DAMAGES. WE'RE HAPPY TO WORK
WITH YOU ON GUARD RAILS TO MAKE
SURE THAT EXTREME SITUATIONS
DON'T OCCUR. ALL RIGHT, UM GOOD.
THE BILL PROVIDES FOR A SAFE
HARBOR FOR GOOD FAITH HEIRS. BUT
THEN LATER ON, SAYS THAT THAT
RELIANCE ON UNREASONABLE
POSITIVE SAFETY DETERMINATIONS
DOES NOT RELIEVE A DEVELOPER. I
THINK WE NEED TO FIGURE THAT OUT
ALSO, BECAUSE THAT THERE THERE
SEEMS TO BE A TENSION BETWEEN
THOSE TWO TERMS. WHAT WHAT'S A
GOOD FAITH THERE VERSUS IF YOU
RELY ON THE POSITIVE SAFETY
DETERMINATION, AND YOU'RE WRONG?
IT SEEMS THAT THAT MIGHT BE A
GOOD FAITH. YEAH WE, UH, WE
AGREE THAT SOME MASSAGING AND
HARMONIZATION WOULD BE HELPFUL,
AND WE'RE HAPPY TO WORK WITH YOU
ON THAT. ALL RIGHT? WE ALSO TALK
ABOUT JURY INSTRUCTIONS. I THINK
YOU SAID THAT WE'RE GONNA FIGURE
OUT WHO SHOULD BE DEVELOPED.
TYPICALLY THE JU THE JUDICIAL
COUNCIL DEVELOPS JURY
INSTRUCTIONS, NOT AN AGENCY, AND
WE'LL FIGURE THAT OUT. I WOULD
NEVER WANT TO STEP ON THEIR
TOES, SO NEITHER WOULD I. EVEN
THOUGH WE OFTEN DO IN
LEGISLATION HERE, I'M NOT GOING
TO STEP ON THEIR TOES. DON'T SAY
THAT, SENATOR WEINER. THEY DON'T
KNOW THAT WE'RE WE'RE TRYING TO
SLIDE THAT BY ALL RIGHT? UM
PUNITIVE DAMAGES. THERE IS NÓ
PROVISION FOR PUNITIVE DAMAGES.
UH YOUR THOUGHTS ON THAT, UH,
THERE, I. I THINK THAT THERE ARE
I THINK THAT ANY APPROPRIATE
REMEDY SHOULD BE ALLOWED. AND IF
SOMEONE GOES IN AND
INTENTIONALLY BUILDS A MODEL
WITH THE INTENT THAT IT'S GOING
TO SHUT OFF THE WATER SYSTEMS
FOR THE ENTIRE UNITED STATES OF
AMERICA. I'VE GOT GOTTEN. DO WE
EVER GET AT SOMETHING CAPABLE OF
THAT? UM AND THAT'S THEIR INTENT
IN DOING IT. UM THEN WE KNOW
THAT IN OUR CIVIL LAW SYSTEM
THAT THAT'S AN OPTION, BUT BUT
IT IT'S NOT AN OPTION IN
STATUTORY, IN ESSENCE IN IN IN
STATUTORY HARMS UNLESS WE PUT IT
IN THERE, SO YEAH, I. I EXPECT
SUSPECTED THAT'S SOMETHING YOU'D
WANT TO ADD. YEAH WE'LL WORK
WITH YOU. WE'RE HAPPY TO WORK
WITH YOU ON THAT, RIGHT? THE
OTHER THE OTHER COMMENT IN IN
TERMS OF THE OPPONENT. WE'VE
ONLY GOTTEN TWO LETTERS IN
OPPOSITION. I'VE GOTTEN A
BAZILLION PHONE CALLS IN
OPPOSITION. UM BUT BUT I WOULD
ENCOURAGE THOSE WHO, YOU KNOW,
AS AS YOU POINT OUT, UM THE, UM
OPPOSITION SAYS THIS FAVORS THE
BIG ENTITIES VERSUS THE SMALL
ENTITIES AND I'D BE INTERESTED
AS TO HOW THAT HOW YOU COME TO
THAT CONCLUSION. MAYBE I COULD
ASK ONE OF THE OPPONENTS TO GIVE
US SOME INSIGHT AS TO HOW THAT
THIS FAVORS THE BIG ENTITIES
OVER THE SMALL ENTITIES BECAUSE
IT ONLY IS I I'LL ASK THE AUTHOR
, I THINK IT ONLY COVERS SOME OF
THE VERY BIGGEST ENTITIES THAT
EXIST AND IT TENDS TO BE THE BIG
ENTITIES WHO ARE SAYING THIS IS
GOING TO FAVOR THE BIG ENTITIES
AQUARIUM. I'M SORRY. SAY AGAIN,
IT TENDS TO BE THE BIG COMPANIES
THAT ARE MAKING THAT ARGUMENT.
IT'S THE BIG TECH COMPANIES IS
UNFAIR BECAUSE IT FAVORS US SO
JUST QUERY, YOU KNOW. THANK YOU,
SENATOR. ALL RIGHT? YES. SO WE
DON'T HAVE TO MAKE ANY
ASSUMPTIONS ABOUT THIS. IT'S IN
THE BILL ITSELF, SO THE BILL
REGULATES NON DERIVATIVE MODELS,
AND THE WAY THAT THE BILL
DEFINES DERIVATIVE MODELS IS AN
EXISTING MODEL A MODEL THAT'S
PRETTY MUCH ALREADY IN THE
MARKETPLACE. NON DERIVATIVE
MODELS IS GOING TO BE A NEW
MODEL, A NEW MARKET ENTRANT THAT
COMES IN INDEPENDENTLY TRAINS
INDEPENDENTLY BUILT. UM AND
THAT'S WHERE WE'RE KIND OF
GETTING THIS REGULATORY MODE. SO
ANYBODY KNEW WHO COMES IN. AND
YES, YOU YOU MENTIONED THAT THE
10 TO THE SIX. IT'S FOR VERY
POWERFUL MODELS, POWERFUL MODELS
. WELL, FOR NOW, ACCORDING TO
MOORE'S LAW, WE WILL SEE
ADVANCEMENTS IN EVERY TWO YEARS
WHEN IT COMES TO OUR TECHNOLOGY
WHEN IT COMES TO ADVANCEMENTS IN
TECHNOLOGY, ESPECIALLY IN A I.
SO FOR NOW IT YOU KNOW THAT
MIGHT BE A VERY LARGE COMPUTING
POWER JUST FOR THE BIG TECH
COMPANIES, BUT THE NEXT TWO
YEARS THAT COULD HIT ANY NEW
MARKET ENTRANCE, FOLKS WHO ARE,
YOU KNOW, JUST NOW BUILDING NEW
MODELS. THAT'S A LEGITIMATE
CONCERN. AND I WELCOME I WELCOME
LANGUAGE, THE ACTUAL LANGUAGE
THAT WILL HELP US TO MAKE SURE
THAT WE ACCOMPLISH THE INTENT OF
SENATOR WEINER AND MY INTENT IS
THAT IS THAT WE NOT STYMIE, UM,
INNOVATION AND SO TO THE EXTENT
THAT YOU HAVE LANGUAGE NÓ NOT A
CONCEPT, BUT LANGUAGE THAT WILL
MAKE SURE THAT THAT WE DON'T
STYMIE THAT KIND OF INNOVATION
FROM, YOU KNOW, START UPS AND
THOSE WHO ARE FARTHER DOWN THE
FOOD CHAIN I. I ABSOLUTELY
WELCOME THAT LANGUAGE AS AS
WE'VE DISCUSSED AT NAUSEAM. THIS
IS A WORK IN PROGRESS. AND WHILE
I EXPECT IT'S GONNA PASS OUT OF
THIS COMMITTEE, THERE'S SENATOR
WEINER HAS COMMITTED TO ME THAT
WE WILL RESOLVE SOME OF THESE
THINGS. WE RESOLVE ALL THESE
THINGS, ACTUALLY, BUT I WANT AND
I HAVE, BUT I WANNA ALSO WE
FUNDAMENTALLY DISAGREE WITH THAT
ASSERTION. AND SO I DISAGREE
WITH THE PREMISE THAT THIS IN
ANY WAY ADVANTAGES BIG COMPANIES
OVER SMALL AND IN FACT, AS THE
GUY WHO REPRESENTS, UH, PERHAPS
THE LARGEST CONCENTRATION OF
START UP A I COMPANIES ON THE
PLANET. THAT IS NOT SOMETHING I
WOULD EVER DO. UM I WOULD BE
HAPPY TO HAVE MR CALVIN COME UP
TO RESPOND TO THAT BECAUSE WE
REALLY DON'T AGREE. I THINK I
DON'T THINK WE NEED TO RESPOND
RIGHT NOW. I THINK THAT WHEN WE
GET THEIR LANGUAGE, WE'LL TAKE A
LOOK AT THEIR LANGUAGE. AND
FIGURE OUT WHETHER OR NOT IT
ACCOMPLISHES THE OUR OUR GOALS.
I THINK I THINK THAT'S I JUST
WANT TO MAKE CLEAR THAT WE
FUNDAMENTALLY I UNDERSTAND THAT
PREMISE, SO WE'RE NOT. WE'RE NOT
AGREEING THAT WE'RE GONNA MAKE
AMENDMENTS BASED ON THAT BECAUSE
I DON'T THINK IT'S TRUE. AND I
AND I, I THINK THE, UM I THINK
THE MEMBERS OF THE COMMITTEE FOR
THEIR INDULGENCE I HAVE TO
LEAVE. I'M GOING TO TURN IT OVER
TO SENATOR ALLEN. NÓ SENATOR
CABALLERO SITTING NEXT CLOSER TO
ME, SENATOR WILK IS HERE. OK,
HERE COMES SENATOR WILK. I'M
GONNA TURN IT OVER TO SENATOR
WILK HERE. FOR THE REMAINING
COMMENTS AND QUESTIONS. I'LL BE
BACK. THANK YOU. MOVE THE BILL.
I MOVED THE BILL ALREADY, BUT
LIKE LET'S WRAP IT UP WITH A YOU
WANT. ALL RIGHT. SENATOR WAHAB
MOVES THE BILL IS VOTING, CAN
YOU. THERE'S A MOTION. GO AHEAD.
YEAH, WELL, WHEN YOU CLOSING, I
RESPECT FOR ASK FOR AN I OK WITH
THAT. LET'S CALL THE VOTE. THIS
IS FAIR. HE'S GONNA HAVE TO COME
BACK ANYWAY. YEAH, TRUE. THIS IS
FILE ITEM NUMBER 16 S¼ B 1047 BY
SENATOR WIENER. THE MOTION IS TO
PASS AS AMENDED TO SENATE
GOVERNMENTAL ORGANIZATION
UMBERG. WILK. ALAN AYE. AND I
ASHBY. CABALLERO CABALLERO. I
TOO, DURAZO. I LAYERED LAYERED
IMM. I NELO STERN. I WAHAB
WAHAB? AYE. 8 TO 0 WITH MEMBERS
IN THE THAT BILL HAS ENOUGH
VOTES TO BE OUT. WE'LL LEAVE THE
ROLE OPEN FOR THE CHAIR, YOU
VERY MUCH AND OTHERS. THANK YOU,
SENATOR WEINER. I KNOW. OK UP.
NEXT IS FILE ITEM EIGHT. S¼ B
FOUR, SENATOR LEMON. NOTHING YOU
HAVE TO WAIT BECAUSE NÓ ONE HAS
GIVEN ME A SCRIPT. WELL, NÓ
WORRIES. THERE IS NÓ SCRIPT.
WHAT? WHAT'S THE RECOMMENDATION
ON THIS BILL? WE HAVE PROTOCOLS
HERE. I KNOW THAT'S OK, I DON'T
KNOW WHAT THE RECOMMENDATION IS
BECAUSE I DON'T SEE IT ON HERE.
BUT SO SENATOR LEMON WILL GO
AHEAD AND LET YOU PRESENT
THANKS, MEMBERS. UM THINK I HE
HE WELL, I KNOW I KNOW THAT
THERE'S OPPOSITION HERE, SO I
FEEL LIKE SHE SHOULD TO THE BEST
OF YOUR ABILITY. I MEAN, I'LL
DEFER TO YOU. YOU CAN DO
WHATEVER YOU LIKE. SO LET ME
JUST ASK MY WITNESSES TO, UH,
COME UP. I'M SORRY. UM YES, I'LL
ASK THE WITNESSES, BUT I DO WANT
TO JUST TALK ABOUT IT. THIS IS
MEDICAL DEBT, AND I CAN ANSWER
QUESTIONS. SO I'M GONNA ASK, UH,
ELEANOR BLOOM FROM THE OFFICE OF
ATTORNEY GENERAL ROB BONTA AND
SONYA HAYDEN TO PLEASE COME UP.
SORRY. THIS IS NOT IN THE
SCRIPT. IF YOU I DIDN'T Y. IT'S
GONNA READ WHAT I WAS GONNA SAY.
OK ON BEHALF OF SENATOR LEONE
SHE PRESENTS S¼ B 1061, WHICH
WOULD REMOVE MEDICAL DEBT FROM
CONSUMER CREDIT REPORTS AND
IMPROVE OUR UNDERSTANDING OF
MEDICAL DEBT COLLECTION
LITIGATION. OUR NEED FOR HEALTH
CARE IS USUALLY OUT OF OUR
CONTROL AND OUR HEALTH INSURANCE
SYSTEM DOES NOT COVER ALL OF OUR
NEEDS TOO OFTEN MEDICAL DEBT
THAT IS REPORTED TO CREDIT
AGENCIES AS INACCURATE. WHEN A
CONSUMER DISCOVERS MEDICAL DEBT
ON THEIR CREDIT REPORT, THEY MAY
NOT KNOW WHY IT IS THERE OR WHO
TO CONTACT TO VERIFY ITS
ACCURACY. ON TOP OF THESE
CHALLENGES. MEDICAL DEBT IS NOT
A GREAT PREDICTOR OF CREDIT
RISK, WHICH HAS LED SOME LENDERS
AND CREDIT SCORING MODELS TO
REMOVE MEDICAL DEBT FROM THEIR
CALCULATIONS. FOR THESE REASONS,
THIS BILL WOULD REMOVE MEDICAL
DEBTS FROM CREDIT REPORTS. IT
WOULD ALSO REQUIRE HOSPITALS TO
KEEP TO KEEP TRACK OF DEBT
COLLECTION LITIGATION THAT DEBT
COLLECTORS AND DEBT BUYERS
PURSUE AGAINST THEIR PATIENTS.
THIS BILL DOES NOT SOLVE ALL THE
PROBLEMS WITH MEDICAL DEBT AS WE
ARE NOT SAYING THAT THE DEBT IS
UNCOLLECTIBLE, BUT IT DOES GIVE
CONSUMERS A CHANCE TO REBUILD
THEIR FINANCIAL HEALTH WHILE
THEY ARE TAKING CARE OF THEIR
PHYSICAL HEALTH. SENATOR LAMONE
IS FORTUNATE TO WORK WITH A
GREAT GROUP OF CO SPONSORS ON
THIS BILL. TESTIFYING IN SUPPORT
TODAY IS ELEANOR BLOOM FROM THE
OFFICE OF ATTORNEY GENERAL ROB
BONTA, AS WELL AS SONIA HAYDEN,
A CONSUMER WHO WILL SHARE HER
EXPERIENCE WITH MEDICAL DEBT
SHOWING UP ON HER CREDIT REPORT.
THANK YOU, SENATOR MIN, AND
BEFORE WE START COMMITTEE RULES,
TWO SPEAKERS TWO MINUTES EACH.
SO WHENEVER YOU'RE READY, GO
AHEAD. UH, HELLO, CHAIR AND
MEMBERS. THANK YOU FOR LETTING
ME TELL YOU ABOUT MY EXPERIENCE
WITH MEDICAL DEBT. IN OCTOBER.
2021 I WAS INVOLVED IN A MAJOR
CAR ACCIDENT WHILE DRIVING ON I
80 FROM SACRAMENTO TO OAKLAND.
THE ACCIDENT HAPPENED AROUND 10
P.M. IN THE EVENING AND I WAS
TAKEN BY AMBULANCE TO THE ER
AIRFIELD. EXCUSE ME, FOR
WHATEVER REASON, THAT'S NOT LOUD
ENOUGH. OH, SHOULD I GO AHEAD
AND WHY DON'T YOU GO AHEAD AND
START OVER AND WE'LL WE'LL
RESTART THE CLOCK AS WELL. CAN
YOU HEAR ME BETTER NOW? OK THANK
YOU. IN OCTOBER 2021. I WAS
INVOLVED IN A MAJOR CAR ACCIDENT
WHILE DRIVING ON I 80 FROM
SACRAMENTO TO OAKLAND. THE
ACCIDENT HAPPENED AROUND 10 P.M.
IN THE EVENING AND I WAS TAKEN
BY AMBULANCE TO THE ER IN
FAIRFIELD. LUCKILY I WAS OK, BUT
THEY KEPT ME THERE QUITE A WHILE
TO RUN SOME TESTS TO MAKE SURE
EVERYTHING WAS FINE. AS A STATE
WORKER. I HAVE FULL INSURANCE
COVERAGE THROUGH WORK, SO THAT
WAS AT LEAST ONE LAST THING THAT
I HAD TO WORRY ABOUT. FAST
FORWARD A FEW YEARS LATER TO THE
SUMMER OF 2023, MY PARTNER AND I
MADE THE DECISION TO TRY AND BUY
OUR FIRST HOME WHILE APPLYING
FOR A LOAN. I WAS SURPRISED TO
DISCOVER MY CREDIT SCORE HAD
GONE DOWN SIGNIFICANTLY DUE TO
AN UNPAID MYSTERY BILL. I CALLED
THE COLLECTIONS COMPANY LISTED
AND DISCOVERED THAT THE, UH,
HOSPITAL THAT I WAS TAKEN TO
AFTER THE ACCIDENT HAD CORRECTLY
BILLED MY INSURANCE FOR
EVERYTHING, EXCEPT FOR ONE VERY
EXPENSIVE TEST THAT THEY HAD
DONE. I THINK IT WAS A SIMPLE
MISTAKE. THEY HAD SIMPLY
FORGOTTEN TO ADD MY INSURANCE
INFORMATION TO IT AND BUILD ME
INSTEAD. BUT I HAD SOMEHOW NEVER
RECEIVED THE BILL. THIS WAS
INCREDIBLY STRESSFUL AT THE TIME
BECAUSE MY CREDIT SCORE
NEGATIVELY AFFECTED OUR MORTGAGE
RATE AT A TIME WHEN RATES WERE
ALREADY AT AN ALL TIME HIGH. I
HAVE SPENT HOURS ON THE PHONE
TRYING TO GET THIS FIXED TO NÓ
AVAIL. UH, REPRESENTATIVES AT
THE INSURANCE COMPANY HAVE TRIED
TO HELP AND AS HAS THE
COLLECTIONS COMPANY AS OF NOW,
THIS IS STILL SHOWING ON MY
CREDIT SCORE, AND THERE APPEARS
TO BE NOT MUCH I CAN DO ABOUT
IT. AGAIN. THANK YOU FOR LETTING
ME SPEAK IN FRONT OF YOU TODAY.
THANK YOU. WHENEVER YOU'RE
READY. GO AHEAD. THANK YOU. GOOD
AFTERNOON, MR CHAIR AND
COMMITTEE MEMBERS. MY NAME IS
ELEANOR BLOOM, AND I'M THE
SPECIAL ASSISTANT ATTORNEY
GENERAL FOR ECONOMIC JUSTICE IN
THE CALIFORNIA ATTORNEY
GENERAL'S OFFICE. ATTORNEY
GENERAL BONTA IS PLEASED TO
COSPONSOR SENATE BILL 1061 TO
BRING AN END TO PUTTING MEDICAL
DEBT ON CONSUMER CREDIT REPORTS.
ON BEHALF OF THE ATTORNEY
GENERAL. I WANT TO THANK SENATOR
LEMON AND OUR COALITION OF
CONSUMER AND HEALTH ADVOCACY
ORGANIZATIONS FOR LEADING ON
THIS IMPORTANT LEGISLATION TO
PROTECT CALIFORNIANS FROM THE
HARMFUL IMPACTS OF MEDICAL DEBT
AND BURDENING CONSUMER CREDIT
REPORTS, ESPECIALLY THE LOW
INCOME AND MARGINALIZED
COMMUNITIES THAT ARE MOST
IMPACTED BY THIS PERVASIVE
PROBLEM. MEDICAL DEBT APPEARING
ON CONSUMER CREDIT REPORTS CAN
DESTROY CREDITWORTHINESS BURDEN
CONSUMERS THROUGHOUT THEIR
FINANCIAL LIVES. THE CONSUMER
FINANCIAL PROTECTION BUREAU
FOUND THAT MEDICAL DEBT IS NOT A
GOOD PREDICTOR OF A CONSUMER'S
LIKELIHOOD OF PAYING A DEBT, AS
WAS PREVIOUSLY BELIEVED. AND
NONETHELESS, CONSUMER REPORTING
COMPANIES ARE PROVIDING CREDIT
REPORTS WITH THIS INFORMATION
NEEDLESSLY DIMINISHING THE
ABILITY OF PEOPLE WITH MEDICAL
DEBT TO CARRY OUT THE REST OF
THEIR FINANCIAL LIVES. MEDICAL
DEBT OFTEN COMES FROM UNEXPECTED
, UNPLANNED AND UNAVOIDABLE
CIRCUMSTANCES UNRELATED TO
GENERAL FINANCIAL WELL BEING.
CAN HAPPEN UNEXPECTEDLY TO
ANYONE, AS ILLUSTRATED BY THE
TESTIMONY OF THE PREVIOUS
WITNESS WHEN MEDICAL DEBT IS
REPORTED TO A CREDIT REPORTING
COMPANY, IT CAN UNFAIRLY PREVENT
A CONSUMER FROM GETTING APPROVED
FOR A LOAN, RENTING AN APARTMENT
OR BEING SELECTED FOR A JOB.
MEDICAL DEBT CAN ALSO CREATE
BARRIERS TO FINDING EMPLOYMENT
AS EMPLOYERS OFTEN USE CREDIT
REPORTS AS A BASIS FOR HIRING
DECISIONS. FINALLY WE KNOW FROM
DATA THAT INCREASING NUMBERS OF
PEOPLE ARE DELAYING OR SKIPPING
ESSENTIAL MEDICAL TREATMENT OUT
OF FEAR OF ACCUMULATING MEDICAL
DEBT, NOT AN UNREASONABLE FEAR,
GIVEN THE HIGH COST OF HEALTH
CARE. SKIPPING HEALTH CARE, OF
COURSE, ONLY LEADS TO WORSE
HEALTH OUTCOMES AND CAN
EXACERBATE HEALTH INEQUALITIES
THAT ALREADY EXIST. CALIFORNIA
FAMILIES SHOULD NOT BE FORCED TO
SUFFER FROM THE HARMFUL AND
UNNECESSARY IMPACTS RESULTING
FROM MEDICAL DEBT, DAMAGING
THEIR CREDIT. S¼ B 1061 ENACTS A
VERY STRAIGHTFORWARD SOLUTION TO
THIS PROBLEM BY PROHIBITING
MEDICAL DEBT FROM BEING REPORTED
TO CONSUMER CREDIT REPORTING
COMPANIES IF 1061 IS ENACTED,
CALIFORNIA WOULD JOIN COLORADO
AND NEW YORK STATES THAT HAVE
ALREADY PASSED LAWS TO PROHIBIT
MEDICAL DEBT FROM APPEARING ON
CREDIT REPORTS AND TOGETHER
HELPED TO LEAD THE COUNTRY. MORE
RATIONAL AND JUST APPROACH TO
ADDRESSING MEDICAL DEBT.
ATTORNEY GENERAL PONTA IS
PLEASED TO STAND WITH THE BROAD
COALITION OF CONSUMER AND HEALTH
ADVOCACY GROUPS THAT ARE CO
SPONSORING S¼ P 161 AND URGES
YOU TO APPROVE THIS MUCH NEEDED
LEGISLATION. I AM HERE, ALONG
WITH MY COLLEAGUE ANTHONY LO TO
ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MAY
HAVE. GREAT THANK YOU. WE HAVE
ANY OTHER PEOPLE WANT TO TESTIFY
? THIS IS NOW ME, TOO, TERRITORY
, SO NAME ORGANIZATION AND THAT
YOU SUPPORT THE BILL. UM KATIE
VAN DYNES WITH HEALTH ACCESS
CALIFORNIA ONE OF THE CO
SPONSORS OF THE BILL. THANK YOU.
THANK YOU. GOOD AFTERNOON, MR
VICE CHAIR AND MEMBERS. ROBERT
HORRELL, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF
THE CONSUMER FEDERATION OF
CALIFORNIA. OTHER COSPONSOR OF
THIS MEASURE YOUR I VOTE. THANK
YOU. DID HE NEED A STRONG GRIN?
UH, MEMBER OF VOLUNTEER AT
CALIFORNIA, A ARP, REPRESENTING
THREE 0.2 MILLION MEMBERS IN
SUPPORT. THANK YOU. MAXINE
MANTEL ON BEHALF OF THE NATIONAL
MULTIPLE SCLEROSIS SOCIETY IN
SUPPORT. GOOD AFTERNOON, LINDA
WE WITH WESTERN CENTER ON LAW
AND POVERTY AND SUPPORT. DANNY
KANO KER ON BEHALF OF TWO OF THE
CO SPONSORS OF THE BILL,
NATIONAL CONSUMER LAW CENTER IN
THE CALIFORNIA LOW INCOME
CONSUMER COALITION, URGING HER I
VOTE. REBECCA MARQUEZ, ON BEHALF
OF ONE OF THE CO SPONSORS, CP
AND SUPPORT AS WELL AS THE
CONSUMER PROTECTION POLICY
CENTER AT THE UNIVERSITY OF SAN
DIEGO LAW SCHOOL. THANK YOU.
GOOD AFTERNOON. JOHN SCAN
CALIFORNIA NURSES ASSOCIATION.
PROUD TO SPONSOR OR DO I VOTE?
THANK YOU. THANK YOU. ALBERT
LAZAR ON BEHALF OF THE
CALIFORNIA LABOR FEDERATION IN
SPORT. GOOD AFTERNOON. VICE
CHAIR MEMBERS, UH, BRIAN MARRA
MONTEZ WITH ASK ME CALIFORNIA
AND SUPPORT. THANK YOU. SAVANNAH
JORGENSEN WITH THE LUTHERAN
OFFICE OF PUBLIC POLICY,
CALIFORNIA IN SUPPORT. SARAH
BRENNAN WITH WEIDEMAN GROUP ON
BEHALF OF N IN CALIFORNIA IN
SUPPORT MARIN PINEA ON BEHALF OF
THE LEUKEMIA AND LYMPHOMA
SOCIETY IN SUPPORT. MISTER
PRESIDENT. OK WITH THAT, UM, DO
WE HAVE OPPOSITION SPEAKERS? I
BELIEVE WE HAVE A COUPLE. OH,
THANK YOU, MR CHAIRMAN. CLIFF
BEG HERE ON BEHALF OF THE
CALIFORNIA ASSOCIATION OF
COLLECTORS. UM WE DID, UH,
SUBMIT A LETTER OF OPPOSITION
UNLESS AMENDED TO THE COMMITTEE
WHEN WE FIRST SAW THE BILL, UM
OUR CONCERNS ARE IN THE DETAILS
OF THE LANGUAGE OF THE BILL, FOR
EXAMPLE, THE DEFINITION OF
MEDICAL DEBT. WE ARE CONCERNED
IT INCLUDES NOT THE KINDS OF
MEDICAL DEBT THAT WE HEAR TALKED
ABOUT HERE TODAY, BUT THINGS
LIKE ELECTIVE AND COSMETIC
SURGERY. UM, WE ARE CONCERNED.
WE'RE CONCERNED ABOUT THE
PROVISION. THAT BASICALLY SAYS
IF YOU VIOLATE THIS LAW ALL THE
UNDERLYING DEBT, EVEN IF IT'S
UNDISPUTED AND LEGITIMATE IS
VOIDED, UM AS A PENALTY FOR
VIOLATING THE BILL. THERE ARE
OTHER AMBIGUOUS PROVISIONS
WITHIN THE BILL. HOWEVER I AM
PLEASED TO TELL THE COMMITTEE
THAT WE MUCH APPRECIATE THE
CHAIR AND THE AUTHOR, UM, ADDING
LANGUAGE WE UNDERSTAND THE
AUTHOR IS TAKING KNOWINGLY TO
THE BILL, WHICH I THINK IS AN
IMPORTANT CLARIFICATION ON THE
VOIDING ISSUE, AND WE ARE
WORKING WITH THE AUTHOR AND HER
STAFF ON THE OTHER ISSUES. I
THINK THIS CONVERSATIONS ARE
GOING WELL. SO WHILE WE ARE
STILL OPPOSING AT THIS POINT, UM
WE WOULD LIKE TO GET TO A PLACE
WHERE WE THINK THE BILL IS
OPERATIONALLY WORKABLE AND
THEREFORE LOOK FORWARD TO
CONTINUING WORKING WITH THE
AUTHOR. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, MR
BERG. DO YOU ALL AGREE THAT THIS
IS THE OTHER PRIMARY? BECAUSE
YOU GUYS WERE ALL KIND OF
RUNNING UP THERE AT THE SAME
TIME? YOU'RE YOU'RE FINE WITH
HIM. OK? WHENEVER YOU'RE READY.
THANK YOU, UH, CHAIR WELCOME
MEMBERS OF THE JUDICIARY
COMMITTEE. MY NAME IS DAVID REED
AND I SERVE AS GENERAL COUNSEL
TO THE RECEIVABLES MANAGEMENT
ASSOCIATION. INTERNATIONAL ARMY.
I IS A NATIONAL NONPROFIT TRADE
ASSOCIATION, WHICH REPRESENTS
BANKS, CREDIT UNIONS, COLLECTION
AGENCIES, STAFF, BUYING
COMPANIES AND COLLECTION LAW
FIRMS, WHILE ARMY I APPRECIATES
THE BILL'S INTENT ARM IS HERE
TODAY IN OPPOSITION TO S¼ B 1061
IS CURRENTLY DRAFTED ARMY EYES,
PRIMARY CONCERN IS RELATED TO
THE OVERLY BROAD DEFINITION.
MEDICAL DEBT AND HOW IT
INTERRELATES WITH THE BILL'S
PROHIBITION ON REPORTING MEDICAL
DEBT TO CREDIT BUREAUS AND THE
POTENTIAL EXPUNGEMENT OF THE
DEBT. WHILE THE BILL EXEMPTS
GENERAL PURPOSE CREDIT CARDS
FROM THE DEFINITION OF MEDICAL
DEBT DUE TO THE IMPOSSIBILITY OF
KNOWING WHAT GOODS AND SERVICES
BEING PURCHASED, ARE MEDICALLY
RELATED. A NUMBER OF OTHER
LENDING PRODUCTS WILL WILL BE
UNINTENTIONALLY PULLED INTO THE
DEFINITION AS DRAFTED HOME
EQUITY LOANS AND BANKING LINES
OF CREDIT COULD BE DEFINED AS
MEDICAL DEBT BASED ON CONSUMER
ACTION, FOR EXAMPLE, IF A
CONSUMER WERE TO TAKE OUT
$100,000 HOME EQUITY LOAN AND
USE 70,000 ON HOME IMPROVEMENTS
20,000 TO VAC IN SPAIN AND USE
THE FINAL 10,000 FOR LIPOSUCTION
THAT HOME EC EQUITY LOAN WOULD
NOW BE CLASSIFIED AS MEDICAL
DEBT AND SUBJECT TO THE CREDIT
REPORTING BANAN. FURTHERMORE IT
PULLS INTO THE DEFINITION OF
MEDICAL DEBT, SPECIALLY HEALTH
BASED CREDIT CARDS THAT ARE
ISSUED TO CONSUMERS WITH PRIME
CREDIT RATINGS OF 660 ABOVE THAT
CAN BE USED TO PURCHASE HAIR
IMPLANTS. TUMMY TUCKS FACE LIFTS
NOT TO MENTION SPA TREATMENTS,
JEWELRY, FLOWERS, PET INSURANCE.
UH, AND BOWFLEX ATHLETIC
EQUIPMENT ARMY. I UNDERSTANDS
THAT MEDICAL DEBT IS A UNIQUE
TYPE OF DEBT AND SHOULD BE
TREATED AS SUCH BECAUSE PATIENTS
DO NOT CHOOSE TO GET SICK OR TO
BE IN AN ACCIDENT, BUT WE NEED
TO BE CAREFUL NOT TO CONFLATE
HAIR IMPLANTS, SPA TREATMENTS
AND ATHLETIC EQUIPMENT WITH
BEING EMITTED INTO AN EMERGENCY
ROOM OR HAVING AN APPOINTMENT
WITH YOUR PRIMARY CARE PHYSICIAN
. WE HAVE HAD SEVERAL POSITIVE
CONVERSATIONS WITH STAFF AND
HOPE, UH, THESE ISSUES WILL BE
ADDRESSED. FORTHCOMING
AMENDMENTS. THANK YOU. THANK
YOU. GOOD TO KNOW THAT THE
LIPOSUCTION IS ONLY $10,000 ON.
I'M GONNA PUT THAT BACK ON MY TO
DO LIST. UH ANY ANYBODY ELSE WHO
CAN MR CHAIR? ME TOO? THIS
MEMBERS OF THE COMMITTEE RANDY
PACK ON BEHALF OF THE CONSUMER
DATA INDUSTRY ASSOCIATION. UH WE
ARE HERE IN OPPOSITION, BUT
LATER THIS WEEK, WE WILL BE
MEETING WITH THE CENTER STAFF.
THANK YOU. THANK YOU. GOOD
AFTERNOON CHAIR AND MEMBERS OF
THE COMMITTEE WERE ACTUALLY IN A
CONCERNED POSITION. I WAS HOPING
IF I HAD JUST A BRIEF MOMENT TO
DESCRIBE THAT THAT NUANCE SHE'S
NOT HERE, SO WE'RE GONNA GO OUT.
I APPRECIATE THAT, UH, RON B¢O
HERE ON BEHALF UH, FOR WHEN THEY
HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH US TO
DISCUSS OUR ONGOING CONCERNS
WITH THE BILL, UH, I THINK WE
CAN FIND COMMON GROUND ON THE
COMMON CRUX OR OR ON THE MAIN
CRUX OF THE BILL, WHICH WOULD BE
TO NOT HAVE THESE DEBTS REPORTED
TO THE MAIN THREE MAIN CREDIT
REPORTING AGENCIES ARE CONCERNS
CENTER MAINLY AROUND THE
REQUIREMENT IN THE BILL FOR
HOSPITALS TO MAINTAIN A DATABASE
FOR LITIGATION, WHICH WOULD BE
AT A MINIMUM ADMINISTRATIVELY.
BURDENSOME UH, WE THINK IS
INCONSISTENT WITH OUR CORE
MISSION OF PROVIDING HEALTH CARE
WOULD PULL LIMITED RESOURCES
AWAY FROM, UH FROM PATIENT CARE,
AND WE SEE LITTLE TO NÓ BENEFIT,
UH TO ACTUAL PATIENTS, AND SO,
UH, WE WOULD REALLY LIKE TO SEE
THAT LANGUAGE, UH, EVENTUALLY
REMOVED FROM THE BILL OR WOULD
LIKE TO WORK WITH THE AUTHOR AND
THE SPONSORS TO ADDRESS THAT
THAT CHIEF CONCERN TO SEE IF
THERE'S ANOTHER WAY OF WORKING
ON THAT. UM AND SO ANYWAY WITH
THAT, UH, WE APPRECIATE THE
AMENDMENTS TAKEN SO FAR, AND WE
LOOK FORWARD TO CONTINUING THAT
WORK, UH, WITH THE AUTHOR AND
THE SPONSOR. SO THANK YOU FOR
ALLOWING ME THAT THAT WAS MORE
THAN A LITTLE BIT. BUT YOU'RE
WELCOME. APPRECIATE IT. ALL
RIGHT. I SEE MELANIE THERE. GOOD
AFTERNOON. MELANIE CUEVAS WITH
THE CALIFORNIA BANKERS
ASSOCIATION, ALSO, IN A POSITION
OF CONCERN, APPRECIATE THE
WILLINGNESS TO LOOK AT THE
ISSUE, AVOIDING A DEBT AND LOOK
FORWARD TO WORKING WITH THE
AUTHOR AND HER STAFF ON THE REST
OF OUR CONCERNS. THANK YOU FOR
THOSE OF YOU WATCHING AT HOME.
THAT'S HOW YOU DO IT. ALL RIGHT,
SO WE'RE GONNA PULL BACK TO THE
COMMITTEE AND I'M GOING TO
RETURN THE GAVEL TO OUR CHAIR.
THANK YOU, SENATOR WILK. I WAS
FULLY ANTICIPATING THAT YOU
WOULD BE FINISHED. BUT
APPARENTLY YOU'VE MOVED MORE
SLOWLY. ONCE I LEFT, SO, UM ALL
RIGHT. UH SO QUESTIONS BY
COMMITTEE? YES OH, LET ME LET ME
ASK QUESTIONS. SENATOR LEMON,
THERE WAS A SUGGESTED AMENDMENT
CONCERNING KNOWING VIOLATIONS.
YOU DON'T NEED TO SAY I JUST
HOLD YOUR THUMB UP. IT ALSO JUST
WANNA CLARIFY THAT WE WERE NOT
ABLE, UH, TO GET THE DEFINITION
OF MEDICAL DEBT CLEARED UP, BUT
WE ARE GONNA WORK ON IT. IT'S
INTENDED TO BE MEDICALLY
NECESSARY. SO THE EXAMPLES THAT
WERE GIVEN WITH TIME SHOULD
ACTUALLY NOT APPLY TO THIS BILL.
UM, BECAUSE WE DO BELIEVE THAT
IT NEEDS TO BE CLARIFIED. SO
WE'RE WORKING WITH THE
OPPOSITION ON THAT. SO I FIGURED
SOMEONE IS GOING TO ASK THAT I
MIGHT AS WELL ADDRESS IT RIGHT
AWAY THAT THE INTENTION IS
MEDICALLY NECESSARY AND
COSMETIC. WOULD NOT FALL INTO
THAT. SO WE WANT TO WORK WITH
THEM TO CLARIFY IT AND NARROW
IT. COULD YOU EXPOUND UPON THAT?
GIVE US A DIFFERENT, OK, ALL
RIGHT, ALL RIGHT, ALL RIGHT,
RIGHT. RIGHT RIGHT. RIGHT OK,
SENATOR ASHBY, RIGHT, SENATOR
LIMÓN. I UM THIS QUESTION IS FOR
SENATOR CABALLERO BECAUSE SHE
HAD TO STEP OUT TO ANOTHER
COMMITTEE HEARING AND WANTED ME
TO, UH, ASK THIS ON HER BEHALF,
BUT ALSO TO LET YOU KNOW THAT
SHE PLANS ON SUPPORTING IT WHEN
SHE COMES BACK, BUT WOULD LIKE
TO ASK YOU TO ADDRESS THIS
ISSUE. UM WITH THE BILL AS YOU
MOVE THROUGH THE PROCESS, AND
THAT IS THE ISSUE OF THE
HOSPITALS HAVING TO POST THAT
YOU HEARD DISCUSSED HERE BY ONE
OF THE OPPOSITION. SHE'S
CONCERNED ABOUT THAT ISSUE, AND
I WANT ALSO WOULD LIKE TO SEE
THAT MAYBE COME OUT OF THE BILL
AT A FUTURE POINT. AS YOU'RE
WORKING ON YOUR NEGOTIATIONS AS
THIS GOES THROUGH THE PROCESS.
WELL I HAVE THAT DISCUSSION. UM
THIS YOU KNOW, THE DATABASE IS
INTENDED TO BE JUST A SIMPLE
EXCEL SHEET. IT'S NOT INTENDED
TO BE ANYTHING MORE, BUT JUST AN
AWARENESS OF WHAT THE LAWSUITS
HAVE BEEN. SO WE'RE HAPPY TO
HAVE THAT CONVERSATION, OK?
OTHER QUESTIONS. OTHER COMMENTS
IS THERE YES AND YO THANK YOU,
MR CHAIR. UM I SEE TWO. SORT OF
FUNDAMENTAL. LAWS THAT CONCERN
ME. ONE IS WELL. THE EXISTENCE
OF MEDICAL DEBT MAY NOT BE AN
INDICATION OF THE PERSON'S
CREDITWORTHINESS. THE EXISTENCE
OF MEDICAL DEBT IS POTENTIALLY
DEPENDING ON THE SIZE. A
SUBSTANTIAL DRAW ON THE DEBTOR'S
RESOURCES, AND THEREFORE MOST
DEFINITELY HAS, UH, THE, UH, HAS
AN EFFECT ON THE ABILITY TO PAY
THAT'S THE FIRST ONE. THE SECOND
ONE IS. ONCE WE START, UM
ELIMINATING CERTAIN CLASSES OF
DEBT FROM CONSUMER REPORTS. WE
BEGIN TO DEPRECIATE THE UH,
UTILIZE THE USE UTILITY OF, UH,
CONSUMER REPORTS. CONSUMER
CREDIT REPORTS. AND IF WE PASS
THIS BILL, THEN THE CREDIT
COMMUNITY KNOWS THAT ANY
POTENTIAL DEBTOR MIGHT HAVE.
MEDICAL DEBT, SUBSTANTIAL
MEDICAL DEBT, AND THEY HAVE NÓ
WAY FROM THE CREDIT REPORTING
AGENCY TO KNOW WHAT THAT MIGHT
BE. AND SO THEY WILL SEEK OTHER
WAYS TO POTENTIALLY FIND THAT
OUT, BECAUSE, WELL, AS, UH, YOUR
REPORT SAYS. PERHAPS IT'S NOT AN
INDICATOR OF A BILL OF THE
CREDITWORTHINESS. IT IS
POTENTIALLY A SUBSTANTIAL DRAW
ON POTENTIAL RESOURCES, AND ANY
CREDITOR WOULD BE VERY CONCERNED
ABOUT THAT. AND THEY HAVE NÓ WAY
TO TELL. AND IF THIS BECOMES A
STRATEGY TO ELIMINATE THAT WE AS
POLICYMAKERS MIGHT THINK IS NOT
FAIR TO GO ON A CREDIT REPORT.
IF THAT'S A ROAD, WE'RE GOING TO
GO DOWN, IT WOULD COMPLETELY
ELIMINATE THE UTILITY OF CREDIT
REPORTS ALTOGETHER. WELL I JUST
WANT TO SPEAK TO THE FACT THAT
MEDICAL DEBT IS NOT THE SAME.
THERE ARE MORE INCONSISTENCIES
AND MORE ERRORS AND MORE TIME IS
NEEDED IN MEDICAL DEBT THAN ANY
OTHER KIND OF DEBT. SO THIS
ISN'T LIKE A, YOU KNOW,
INACCURATE CREDIT CARD PURCHASE,
RIGHT? THIS IS YOU HAVE TO GO
BACK AND FORTH WITH YOUR
INSURANCE AND, YOU KNOW, BLESS
YOU IF YOU'VE NEVER HAD TO DO
THAT, BUT, UM, FOR THOSE THAT
HAVE THAT TAKES TIME AND SO THIS
IS WHY WE FEEL IT'S NECESSARY
BECAUSE, AS YOU HEARD IN THE
EXAMPLE GIVEN BY THE WI DIDN'T
EVEN KNOW IT NEVER GOT TO HER
ATTENTION UNTIL IT WAS TOO LATE,
AND HER ABILITY TO PAY AND TO
FINANCE A MORTGAGE ACTUALLY
WOULD HAVE BEEN DIFFERENT. HAD
THAT ERROR BEEN CAUGHT AND HAD
THERE BEEN TIME TO DO THIS, SO I
THINK THAT THIS IS NOT YOUR
AVERAGE TYPE OF DEBT. THIS IS A
TYPE OF DEBT THAT CREATES MORE
THAT NEEDS MORE TIME TO SETTLE,
AND ALSO TIME TO ACTUALLY CREATE
THE INACCURACIES AND YOUR MANY,
MANY CONSTITUENTS THAT HAVE, UM,
THE ABILITY TO HAVE YOU
INSURANCE AND KNOW THE COVERAGE
AND KNOW THE CODING MATTERS. AND
IF THE ER CAUGHT THE CODING
WRONG, THEY HAVE TO GO BACK AND
FORTH. WE WILL TELL YOU THAT IF
THIS GOES, YOU KNOW, AFTER A FEW
WEEKS OR MONTHS, IT'S NOT ENOUGH
TIME TO ACTUALLY GET IT SORTED
OUT. SO I THINK THAT THIS IS WHY
WE'RE MOVING THIS FORWARD. THANK
YOU. OTHER QUESTIONS COMMENTS?
IS THERE A MOTION SENATOR STERN
HAS MOVED THE BILL, ALL RIGHT?
I'M SORRY, SENATOR WILK. DID YOU
HAVE A QUESTION, WOULD YOU? OH,
ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. SENATOR
RAMON, WOULD YOU LIKE TO CLOSE
AHEAD THAT WOULD WORK. YOU WOULD
LIKE TO CLOSE. OK THAT'S YOUR
CLOSE. OK TWO THUMBS UP AS A
CLOSE GOOD. ALL RIGHT, MADAM
SECRETARY, IF YOU WOULD CALL THE
ROLL UH, IT WAS MADE BY SENATOR
STERN. THIS IS FILE ITEM NUMBER
EIGHT S¼ B 1061. THE MOTION IS
TO PASS AS AMENDED TO SENATE
RULES. UMBERG UM I WILK, WILK,
NÓ ALAN. ASHBY, ASHBY. I
CABALLERO. DURAO DURAZO, I LE
LAYERED A MIN. M I, MILO. KNOW
NÓ STERN STERN. I WAHAB AYE. 7
TO 2 WITH MEMBERS MISSING 7 TO 2
. WE'LL PUT THAT ON CALL. THANK
YOU GET WELL. ALL RIGHT. NEXT,
SENATOR SKINNER. SENATOR SKINNER
. ITEM NUMBER 14 SB 1144.
SENATOR SKINNER MEANS BUSINESS.
SHE'S TAKEN OFF HER COAT. WELL.
UH, THE COMMITTEE ROOM I WAS
CHEERING IN WAS 65 DEGREES. WELL
WELCOME TO IT'S PRETTY WARM IN
HERE. SO THANK YOU, SENATOR
SKINNER. I APPRECIATE YOUR
PATIENCE AS I MENTIONED JUST A
MOMENT AGO. I YOUR PATIENTS CUBE
FOR BOTH FOR SENATE JUDICIARY,
AS WELL AS THE COMMITTEE. YOU
CHAIR SENATE HOUSING. UM ALL
RIGHT. UH, THE FLOOR IS YOURS.
S¼ B 1144. THIS THING IS FUNNY.
RIGHT THANK YOU. UH, PLEASE
PRESENT S¼ B 1144, WHICH DEALS
WITH THE PROBLEM OF ORGANIZED
RETAIL THEFT AND HOW THE FACT
THAT MUCH OF THESE, UM GOODS
THAT ARE STOLEN ARE BEING SOLD
ONLINE AND BEFORE I GO FURTHER
INTO EXPLAINING THE BILL, I WANT
TO INDICATE THAT I AM ACCEPTING
THE COMMITTEE AMENDMENTS TO
CLARIFY THE NOTICE TO CONSUMERS
AND I'M ALSO TAKING AUTHOR
AMENDMENTS. THAT ADD CIVIL
ENFORCEMENT AUTHORITY TO
DISTRICT ATTORNEYS, CITY
ATTORNEYS AND CITY COUNCIL TO
FURTHER TARGET THESE FENCING
OPERATIONS. AND THAT, UH, ADDING
THAT ONLINE MARKETPLACES MUST
VERIFY TO CONSUMERS THAT HIGH
VOLUME THIRD PARTY SELLERS HAVE
COMPLIED WITH OUR EXISTING
REQUIREMENTS. THIS IS A
PROTECTION MEASURE, SO THAT AS A
CONSUMER YOU ARE NOT, UH,
INADVERTENTLY PURCHASING STOLEN
ITEMS. UM, SO THOSE ARE THE
AMENDMENTS. UM NÓ THIS BILL, SO
IN 2022 YOU ALL PASSED A BILL
THAT I AUTHORED THAT WAS SIGNED
INTO LAW THAT CREATED
REGULATIONS FOR THESE ONLINE
MARKETPLACES BECAUSE WE HAD
FOUND THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, IF YOU
JUST PRETTY MAKES SENSE. MOST OF
US BUY GOODS ONLINE. WE'RE NOT
USING. NOT THAT WE DO NOT USE
BRICK AND MORTAR ANYMORE. BUT
THE MOST SALES ARE DONE ONLINE.
AND SO IT MADE SENSE. THEN THAT,
UH, IF SOMEBODY'S FENCING GOODS
ESPECIALLY, UH, ENTITIES THAT
ARE DOING THESE HIGH VOLUME THAT
ARE HAVE A SET UP A WHOLE RING
YOU MAY HAVE SAW IN THE PAPER
JUST LAST WEEK THAT A IME WAS
TWO WEEKS AGO THAT A COUPLE IN
SAN DIEGO WAS BUSTED. THEY WERE
BASICALLY PAYING, UH, GIVES
PAYING, UM, NOT MUCH, BUT TWO
PEOPLE TO, UH, RAID SEPHORA
STORES TARGETS OTHER STORES.
DOING MAKEUP AND THEN THIS
COUPLE WAS BASICALLY SELLING IT
THROUGH VARIOUS ONLINE
MARKETPLACES. UM SO WE HAVE
AMPLE EVIDENCE. THE A G S¼
OFFICE, FOR EXAMPLE, HAS A TASK
FORCE ON THIS. THEY HAVE ALREADY
BUSTED A NUMBER OF LARGE
ORGANIZED RETAIL THEFT RINGS WHO
ARE UNFORTUNATELY STILL
PRIMARILY USING ONLINE
MARKETPLACES. THAT BILL CREATED
REGULATIONS FOR HIGH VOLUME
THIRD PARTY SELLERS AND A
REQUIRED ONLINE. AT PLACES TO
GET I Dð AND BANK INFO FROM
THESE SELLERS THAT WOULD VERIFY
THAT THEY'RE LEGITIMATE BUSINESS
ENTITIES MAKING THESE SALES NOW
HOW SOME OF THESE ORGANIZED
RETAIL THEFT ENTITIES HAVE
GOTTEN AROUND THIS IS THEY ARE
INCREASINGLY USING THOSE
MARKETPLACES WHERE THE ACTUAL
PAY TRANSACTION DOESN'T OCCUR ON
THE SITE, AND THERE'S A NUMBER
OF THOSE IN THAT, AND SO THEY
AVOID. MAKING THE PAY
TRANSACTION AND SO THUS THEY
DON'T HAVE TO TURN IN ANY OF
THAT INFO. SO IT'S THE A G S¼
OFFICE IS INCREASINGLY SEEING
THAT STOLEN GOODS ARE BEING SOLD
THIS WAY. SO WHAT THIS BILL DOES
IS ENSURE THAT ALL HIGH VOLUME
THIRD PARTY SELLERS AND WHEN I
SAY HIGH VOLUME, AND I REALLY
WANT TO MAKE AN EMPHASIS ON THIS
, THIS IS THEIR SELLING MORE
THAN 200 TRANSACTIONS IN A GIVEN
YEAR, SO IT'S NOT JUST SOMEONE
WHO'S SELLING, SAY 10 TIMES ON A
SITE. IT'S OVER 200 TRANSACTIONS
ON A GIVEN YEAR AND THE ON IT'S
THEN REQUIRING THOSE THIRD PARTY
SELLERS TO HAVE, UM COMPLYING
WITH THE LAW AND REQUIRING THE,
UH, MARKETPLACE TO BE ABLE TO
ATTRACT THEM AND GET THAT
VERIFIED INFORMATION FROM THEM
AND TO TAKE ACTION TO ONLINE
MARKETPLACE TO TAKE ACTION
AGAINST SELLERS WHO SELL STOLEN
GOODS AND INFORMING THE
CONSUMERS THAT THE SELLERS THESE
HIGH VOLUME SELLERS HAVE
COMPLIED WITH THE LAW AGAIN WITH
THE THAT PROTECTION TO CONSUMERS
, SO LET ME HAVE MY WITNESSES IN
SUPPORT. CHRISTINE SOTO DE FROM
THE PROSECUTORS ALLIANCE OF
CALIFORNIA AND KI¾M STONE FROM
THE DISTRICT ATTORNEYS
ASSOCIATION. GOOD MORNING CHAIR
OR GOOD AFTERNOON. I'VE BEEN
HERE A LONG TIME. GOOD AFTERNOON
. CHAIR AND COMMITTEE MEMBERS.
PLEASURE TO BE HERE WITH YOU
TODAY. CHRISTINE SOTO DE BERI.
I'M THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF
THE PROSECUTORS ALLIANCE. WE
REPRESENT OVER 4000 MEMBERS IN
THE STATE OF BOTH LINE.
PROSECUTORS VICTIM ADVOCATES AND
COMMUNITY MEMBERS COMMITTED TO
SAFE COMMUNITIES THROUGH SMART
STRATEGIES. WE'RE HERE IN STRONG
SUPPORT OF SENATOR SKINNER'S
BILL. AS YOU JUST HEARD HER
EXPLAIN. THIS OFFERS HIM AN
IMPORTANT IMPROVEMENTS TO S¼ B
THREE AND ONE WHICH WE ALSO
SUPPORTED IN 2022. WE HAVE
LEARNED FROM THAT LEGISLATION
COMING INTO EFFECT THAT WE CAN
DO MORE TO IMPROVE ON THE
INFORMATION COLLECTED AND SHARED
TO SHUT DOWN THE KINDS OF RETAIL
THEFT RINGS THAT WE ARE SEEING
AROUND OUR STATE, AND
UNFORTUNATELY AROUND THIS
COUNTRY IN THE CURRENT MOMENT.
THERE. AS THE SENATOR MENTIONED,
THERE ARE SOME IMPORTANT
IMPROVEMENTS TO PROVIDE MORE
INFORMATION TO CONSUMERS.
CURRENTLY WHEN YOU OR I GO ON TO
AMAZON OR ANY OTHER PLATFORM, WE
DO NOT HAVE MUCH INFORMATION
ABOUT WHO WE'RE BUYING GOODS
FROM, AND WE'RE MAKING DECISIONS
BASED, MAYBE ON PRICE POINT OR
DELIVERY DATE, BUT MANY OF US
WOULD PRIORITIZE WORKING WITH
THE SELLER THAT WE KNEW WAS
LEGITIMATE. WE HAVE BEEN
SPEAKING BEFORE ALL OF THE
RETAIL, UH, TASK FORCES THAT
HAVE BEEN FORMED BY THIS BODY
AND OTHERS URGING THAT WE HAVE
THE EQUIVALENT OF A BLUE CHECK
MARK AS YOU HAVE ON SOCIAL MEDIA
SO THAT CONSUMERS CAN BE
INFORMED AND MAKE SMART
DECISIONS WITH THEIR DOLLARS.
THIS BILL WILL HELP IMPROVE THAT
OPPORTUNITY FOR CONSUMERS.
LIKEWISE IT WILL IMPROVE
INFORMATION SHARING TO LAW
ENFORCEMENT SO THAT THEY CAN
TAKE ACTION. THE SENATOR
MENTIONED SEVERAL BIG RETAIL
THEFT RINGS THAT HAVE BEEN
BUSTED RECENTLY. THAT IS BECAUSE
WE HAVE INFORMATION ON WHO THOSE
SELLERS ARE AND WHERE THEIR
GOODS ARE GOING. WITHOUT THAT
INFORMATION, WE'RE UNABLE TO
ACT. LAW ENFORCEMENT IS IN A
MUCH HARDER SITUATION, TRYING TO
IDENTIFY WHERE THOSE GOODS CAME
FROM, AND PURSUE THOSE CASES. SO
WHY ARE WE SUPPORTING THIS AS
PROSECUTORS BECAUSE WE KNOW
RETAIL THEFT IS AN ISSUE AND
THIS LEGISLATURE IN MANY VARIOUS
COMMITTEES IS GRAPPLING WITH HOW
WE GET AHEAD OF THE CURRENT
SITUATION. THIS IS A SMART
APPROACH. THIS WILL GET US A
LEAPFROG APPROACH OVER MANY OF
THE OTHER STRATEGIES THAT HAVE
BEEN PUT BEFORE YOU BECAUSE WE
ARE EVOLVING IN OUR ECONOMY WE
NÓ LONGER ARE LOOKING AT SWAP
MEETS. AND UH THANK YOU. IF YOU
COULD WRAP IT UP. ABSOLUTELY FOR
THESE KINDS OF, UM, WHERE THESE
GOODS ARE GOING, AND WE WILL NOT
SOLVE IT ENTIRELY THROUGH POLICE
AND PROSECUTION. SO WE HOPE THAT
YOU ALL WILL HELP US IN URGING
BUSINESSES IN THIS IN THIS STATE
AND IN THIS COUNTRY TO JOIN US
AS LAW ENFORCEMENT AND
PROSECUTORS IN URGING YOU ALL TO
GIVE YOUR STRONG SUPPORT. ALL
RIGHT. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THE STONE.
GOOD AFTERNOON KI¾M STONE STONE
ADVOCACY ON BEHALF OF THE
CALIFORNIA DISTRICT ATTORNEYS
ASSOCIATION, ALSO THE SAN DIEGO
DISTRICT ATTORNEY SUPPORTS BUT
I'M MAKING COMMENTS ON BEHALF OF
THE ASSOCIATION. THIS BILL
REQUIRES ONLINE MARKETPLACES TO
TELL CONSUMERS THAT THEY ARE
TRYING TO FOLLOW THE RULES AND
NOT SELL STOLEN GOODS TO LAW
ENFORCEMENT IF THEY REASONABLY
BELIEVE THAT THEIR PLATFORM IS
BEING USED TO SELL STOLEN GOODS
AND PROHIBIT A SELLER FROM
SELLING ON THE PLATFORM IF THEY
BELIEVE THAT THEY ARE SELLING
STOLEN GOODS WE ALL KNOW RETAIL
THEFT IS A PART OF THAT PROBLEM
IS THE EASE HOW EASY IT IS TO
SELL STOLEN GOODS ONLINE. UH,
THE DISTRICT ATTORNEYS
ASSOCIATION BELIEVE THAT ONLINE
MARKETPLACES THAT DON'T WANT TO
ACT AS FENCES FOR STOLEN GOODS
SHOULD BE SUPPORTIVE OF THIS
LEGISLATION. NOW MY CLIENT DOES
NOT BELIEVE THAT THIS BILL IS
THE BE ALL AND END ALL FOR AFTER
THIS IS THE ONLY SOLUTION BY ANY
MEANS, BUT WE DO BELIEVE THAT
THIS IS PART OF A COMPREHENSIVE
AND COM COMMON SENSE SOLUTION
AND URGE YOUR I VOTE. THANK YOU.
OTHERS IN SUPPORT, PLEASE
APPROACH THE MICROPHONE. GOOD
AFTERNOON, GLENN BACKUS FOR THE
YELLOW BAKER CENTER FOR HUMAN
RIGHTS AND SUPPORT. GOOD
AFTERNOON, DEVO ANDERSON ON
BEHALF OF THE HOME DEPOT AND
SUPPORT BRANDED UP ON BEHALF OF
L, A COUNTY SHERIFF ROBERT LUNAN
SUPPORT GOOD AFTERNOON LARISSA
SASS ON BEHALF OF THE TOY
ASSOCIATION AND SUPPORT. WE'VE
ALSO HAD CONVERSATIONS WITH THE
AUTHORS STAFF THE POSSIBLE
EXPANSION OF THIS BILL TO
COUNTERFEIT GOODS, BUT WE
APPRECIATE THIS BILL AND THE
LEADERSHIP SHE'S SHOWN. THANK
YOU. THANK YOU. MARGARET
GLADSTEIN ON BEHALF OF THE
CALIFORNIA RETAILERS ASSOCIATION
AND SUPPORT THANK YOU. AH
NATALIA WITH CRUISE STRATEGIES
ON BEHALF OF CALIFORNIA BUSINESS
PROPERTIES ASSOCIATION AND
SUPPORT, ALL RIGHT, GREAT. THANK
YOU. OPPOSITION. ANYONE IN
OPPOSITION. PLEASE APPROACH THE
MICROPHONE. THANK YOU, MR CHAIR
AND MEMBERS DYLAN HOFFMAN ON
BEHALF OF TECHNET. I'M THE
EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR FOR
CALIFORNIA. OPPOSED TO SB 1144.
AND WHILE WE APPRECIATE THE
PREVIOUS AMENDMENTS AND OUR
REVIEWING THE COMMITTEE
SUGGESTED, AND AUTHORS
AMENDMENTS, THEY DON'T IMPACT
OUR MAIN CONCERN WITH THIS BILL,
WHICH IS THAT IT CREATES A
SEPARATE AND BURDENSOME
REQUIREMENTS FOR BUSINESSES
HOPING TO SELL IN CALIFORNIA. UM
AND TAKES THE CALIFORNIA INFORM
ACT OUT OF ALIGNMENT WITH THE
REST OF THE COUNTRY. UM TECHNA
AND OUR ONLINE MARKETPLACE
MEMBERS TAKE THE ISSUE OF
ORGANIZED RETAIL CRIME
INCREDIBLY SERIOUSLY. WE'VE
PARTICIPATED THROUGH A ROBUST
STAKEHOLDER PROCESS THROUGH THE
ATTORNEY GENERAL'S OFFICE, UM,
AND HAVE TESTIFIED AT
INFORMATIONAL HEARINGS IN THE
PAST YEAR TO PROVIDE ADDITIONAL
INFORMATION ON THE WORK THAT OUR
COMPANIES ARE DOING. WE ARE ALSO
PART OF THE NATIONAL
NEGOTIATIONS IN 2022 ON THE
FEDERAL INFORM ACT. WE
PARTICIPATED HERE IN CALIFORNIA
AND THE CALIFORNIA INFORM ACT.
UH, WE DID NOT OPPOSE THAT BILL.
WE AGREE WITH A LOT OF THE
REGULATIONS AND REQUIREMENTS IN
THAT BILL, AND BOTH LAWS WENT
INTO EFFECT DURING THE SUMMER OF
JUST LAST YEAR. HOWEVER, SINCE
THAT TIME WE ARE NOT AWARE OF
ANY DATA OR EVIDENCE TO JUSTIFY
THE CHANGES IN THIS BILL TO THE
DEFINITION OF A HIGH VOLUME
SELLER. THAT DEFINITION WAS THE
SUBJECT OF VERY CAREFUL
NEGOTIATIONS HERE AND IN
CONGRESS, AND IT WAS A
DELIBERATE POLICY CHOICE, NOT A
LOOPHOLE OFF PLATFORM
SALES. THIS IS BECAUSE IT IS
IMPOSSIBLE FOR ONLINE
MARKETPLACES TO KNOW WHICH SALES
ARE COMPLETED OFF PLATFORM OR IN
PERSON. UM AND WITHOUT THIS
EXCLUSION MARKETPLACES WILL HAVE
TO CONSIDER ALL HIGH VALUE ALL
SELLERS AS VOLUME SELLERS IN
ORDER TO COMPLY WITH THIS LAW.
FURTHERMORE THIS BALANCE WAS
STRUCK TO PROTECT SMALL SELLERS
AND THEIR PRIVATE INFORMATION.
INFORM REQUIRES HIGH VOLUME
SELLERS TO PROVIDE THEIR NAME
CONTACT INFORMATION SUCH AS
TELEPHONE NUMBER OR EMAIL
ADDRESS TAXPAYER IDENTIFICATION
NUMBER, WHICH FOR AN INDIVIDUAL
IS THEIR SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER
AND THEIR PHYSICAL ADDRESS TO AN
ONLINE MARKETPLACE. UM, AND
THERE'S VERY LITTLE REASON FOR
SOMEONE SELLING A GOOD ONLINE
SHOULD HAVE TO PROVIDE THE
SENSITIVE PERSONAL INFORMATION
JUST TO DO SO. THE CURRENT
THRESHOLD AND DEFINITION
CAPTURES WHEN SELLERS REACH A
LOW CAPITAL. THANK YOU AND
WARRANTS THAT PRIVACY TRADE OFF
FOR THESE REASONS WE RESPECT
OPPOSE SP 1144 THANK YOU, OTHERS
IN OPPOSITION. GOOD AFTERNOON.
I'M BRENDA BASS WITH THE
CALIFORNIA CHAMBER OF COMMERCE
AND WE ARE CURRENTLY IN
OPPOSITION TO S¼ VÆ 144. YOU
KNOW, WE TAKE THE ISSUE OF EARTH
THE TASK OF COMBATING RETAIL
THEFT REALLY SERIOUSLY, BUT WE
DON'T WANT UNINTENTIONALLY HARM
LAWFUL BUSINESSES. SO AFTER THE
MARCH 19TH AMENDMENTS AND THE
COMMITTEE AMENDMENTS, WE KIND OF
SEE THREE OUTSTANDING ISSUES
THAT WE'D LIKE TO WORK THROUGH
ON THIS BILL. UM, THE FIRST ONE
AS MY COLLEAGUE DYLAN. THAT WE
HAVE REAL CONCERNS ABOUT THE
VIABILITY OF TRACKING OFF
PLATFORM TRANSACTIONS. WE WANNA
MAKE SURE THAT THIS IS WORKABLE
AND ACHIEVABLE, AND WE DON'T
REALLY WANT TO SET PLATFORMS AND
THE SMALL BUSINESSES THAT USE
PLATFORMS TO REACH THEIR
CUSTOMERS. UH, UP FOR FAILURE.
UH, RELATEDLY, UM, AS WAS
MENTIONED WE HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT
THE DEFINITION OF HIGH VOLUME
THIRD PARTY SELLER. WE
APPRECIATE THE COMMITTEE'S WORK
DONE HERE TRYING TO ADDRESS A
POTENTIAL READING THAT THIS
WOULD REQUIRE AGGREGATION ACROSS
OTHER PLAN. NOT JUST THE
PLATFORM THAT A PARTICULAR
COMPANY OPERATES. UM AND SO
THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE'RE
HOPING WE CAN CONTINUE WORKING
ON REFINING THE LANGUAGE TO KIND
OF REDUCE SOME OF THIS CONCERN
THAT YOU WOULD HAVE TO LOOK AT
SALES ACROSS PLATFORMS AND
THAT'S WHAT WOULD END UP LEADING
YOU INTO TREATING EVERY SELLER
AS POTENTIALLY HIGH VOLUME
RIGHT? UM AND THEN. THIRDLY WE
THINK THE VERIFICATION SECTION
HAS IMPROVED. UM BUT, YOU KNOW,
WE WERE REALLY CONCERNED THAT
THIS WOULD BE CONFUSING TO
CONSUMERS. IF SMALL BUSINESSES
DON'T HAVE A VERIFICATION. UM
YOU KNOW, MAYBE IT MAKES A
CONSUMER THINK THAT A SMALL
BUSINESS ISN'T LEGITIMATE ON A
PLATFORM. HAVE
SOMETHING LIKE A BLUE CHECK
MARK, SO THAT'S SOMETHING WE
WOULD BE INTERESTED. ROBERT
SINGLETON. ALSO A CHAMBER OF
PROGRESS, UM, RESPECTFULLY
OPPOSED. THANK YOU. GOOD
AFTERNOON, NAOMI PEDR ON BEHALF
OF THE COMPUTER AND
COMMUNICATIONS INDUSTRY
ASSOCIATION IN OPPOSITION. THANK
YOU. THANK YOU. CHAIR MEMBERS.
JONATHAN ARNEL ON BEHALF OF
OFFER UP IN OPPOSITION. THANK
YOU. ALL RIGHT. QUESTIONS BY
COMMITTEE MEMBERS. SO BILL'S
BEEN MOVED OTHER QUESTIONS NÓ I
I'M GONNA SUPPORT THE BILL. AND
THE REASON I SUPPORT THE BILL IS
BECAUSE SENATOR SKINNER ALWAYS,
UM, OPERATES IN GOOD FAITH, BUT
I STILL HAVE, AS I'VE EXPRESSED
TO SENATOR SKINNER GRAVE GRAVE
GRAVE CONCERNS, AND I AND I
WANNA ASK THE PROPONENTS. I WANT
TO ASK THE DISTRICT ATTORNEYS
THOSE REPRESENTING DISTRICT
ATTORNEYS IS THAT WE MAKE POLICY
CHOICES HERE. AND AS I SEE THE
BILL AS CRAFTED RIGHT NOW, UM
IT. IT BASICALLY PUTS A PLATFORM
LIKE CRAIGSLIST, EITHER OUT OF
BUSINESS OR SUCH THAT THEY'VE
GOT TO MODIFY THEIR BUSINESS
MODEL SO DRAMATICALLY THAT IT'S
A COMPLETE REVISION. SO THE
QUESTION FOR ME IS, YOU KNOW HAS
RETAIL THEFT IN REACHED A LEVEL
OF CONCERN WHERE WE NEED IS A
POLICY TO BASICALLY PUT
CRAIGSLIST OUT OF BUSINESS IS
THAT IS THAT WHERE WE ARE NOW?
SO MY LEGISLATIVE COMMITTEE
MAKES THE DECISIONS THAT I GET
TO SPEAK ON, AND I PERSONALLY
OUTFITTED LIKE MY NEW HOUSE OFF
OF FACEBOOK MARKETPLACE AND I
DECORATED MY PREVIOUS HOUSE OFF
OF CRAIGSLIST. SO I HOPE, UH,
AND DON'T BELIEVE THAT OUR THAT
THAT MY CLIENT BELIEVES THAT
THEY SHOULD GO OUT OF BUSINESS.
I DO THINK THAT THEY ARTICULATED
IN THEIR LETTER, AND WHEN THE UM
DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEYS LOOKED
AT IT, THEY DO BELIEVE THAT IT
IS FAR TOO EASY TO SELL STOLEN
GOODS ONLINE. THAT THERE ARE
INSUFFICIENT MOTIVATIONS FOR THE
ONLINE SELLERS TO WORK IN
CONJUNCTION WITH LAW ENFORCEMENT
TO STOP THAT, AND THAT'S WHY
THEY DECIDED TO TAKE US SUPPORT
POSITION ON THE BILL AFTER THE
MOST RECENT AMENDMENTS. THERE
WAS KIND OF A LOT OF THINKING
THAT WENT INTO IT. WE WERE LATE.
WE DIDN'T GET OUR LETTER UNTIL
YESTERDAY, AND THEY DID. LOOK AT
IT PRETTY CAREFULLY AND YOU
KNOW, I'M SURE WOULD BE, YOU
KNOW, HAPPY TO CONTINUE TO WORK
WITH YOU IN THE COMMITTEE AND
THE AUTHOR, IT'S SO
FUNDAMENTALLY ALTERS THEIR
BUSINESS MODEL. AND JUST THE
QUESTION THAT THE PREDICATED THE
QUESTION IS RETAIL THEFT REACHED
A LEVEL THAT THAT WE NEED AS A
POLICY BASICALLY TO SAY, LOOK AT
I MEAN, WE COULD PUT ALL OF THEM
OUT OF BUSINESS IF WE WANTED TO,
SO THERE WOULD BE NÓ ONLINE
SALES AND THAT WOULD ELIMINATE
THE ABILITY TO HAVE THOSE WHO
STEAL SELL ONLINE. I DON'T THINK
WE'VE REACHED THAT POINT YET.
BUT BUT THERE THERE CERTAIN
MODELS THAT WE WOULD PROBABLY IF
NOT PUT OUT. A BUSINESS
DRAMATICALLY HINDER IS THAT IS
THAT WHERE WE ARE ON RETAIL
THEFT? NÓ I DON'T THINK ANYBODY
IS ADVOCATING FOR THAT.
EVERYBODY IN THIS ROOM. I'M SURE
SHOPS ONLINE WHAT WERE TARGETING
AND WHAT THE CENTER HAS CRAFTED
AS LEGISLATION THAT'S SMART
REGULATIONS ON THE LARGEST
INDUSTRY. AMAZON IS THE THIRD
LARGEST COMPANY ON THE GLOBE.
AMAZON SITE. HOW DOES THE LIST
IS NOT A SMALL COMPANY EITHER?
AND THE OTHER PLATFORMS THAT
OPERATE SIMILARLY TO CRAIGSLIST?
YES, I'D LOVE TOWNS SENATOR SO
SIMILARLY, WE REGULATE BRICK AND
MORTAR PAWN SHOPS, MUCH SMALLER
INDUSTRY. MANY SMALL OPERATORS
WITH MUCH MORE ONEROUS, REG.
THAN WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING HERE
FOR ONLINE BROKERS. SO I'M
CONFIDENT THAT THE SENATOR
WORKING WITH INDUSTRY AS SHE HAS
BEEN, AND WE ALL HAVE BEEN,
WE'LL FIND A REGULATION THAT
BALANCES AS YOU ARE URGING THE
NEED FOR COMMERCE AND THE NEED
FOR THE COMMUNITY SAFETY, BUT IT
IS AN IMPORTANT IT IS A PRESSING
ISSUE. I'M SURE YOUR DISTRICT IS
TALKING TO YOU ABOUT IT. WE ARE
ALL HEARING ABOUT IT, AND IT IS
INCUMBENT UPON US TO BE
RESPONSIVE TO THAT. WITH 2021
SOLUTIONS. WE NEED TO PROVIDE
SOLUTIONS THAT ARE NOT HOW DO WE
WORK THIS? THAT'S WHAT I'M
REALLY I'M REALLY FOCUSED UPON.
SO, FOR EXAMPLE, ON EBAY IF
SOMEONE HOW? HOW DOES EBAY TRACK
THOSE WHO CONTACT THE SELLER OR
THE BUYER INDEPENDENT OF EBAY?
HOW DO THEY? HOW DO THEY CONTACT
THEM? I MEAN NOT CONTACT. HOW DO
THEY KEEP TRACK OF THAT? WOULD
YOU LIKE ME DOWN THERE, SO THERE
ARE EVERY PLATFORM IS SLIGHTLY
DIFFERENT. BUT THERE ARE TWO
PRIMARY MECHANISMS. EITHER YOUR
IN CONTRACT AS A SELLER ON THE
PLATFORM, OR ARE YOU USING THE
PLATFORM'S PAYMENT PROCESSOR?
THOSE ARE THE TWO MAIN WAYS THAT
THEY CAN IDENTIFY, EASILY
IDENTIFY WHO IS USING THEIR
PLATFORM AND THEIR TOOLS TO COM
TO CONDUCT COMMERCE. AND SO I
THINK THAT THE EFFORTS AROUND
AMENDMENTS AND THE CONVERSATIONS
ARE AROUND FOCUSING ON THE
EFFORT HERE IS TO SHUT DOWN THE
ONLINE RESALE, NOT INDIVIDUALS
THAT ARE ON CRAIG'S LIST AND SAY
, I'D LIKE TO SELL YOU A CAR
SEAT OR A BABY STROLLER THAT
NOBODY IS SEEKING TO REGULATE
THAT BEHAVIOR. WHAT WE'RE
TALKING ABOUT IS PEOPLE RUNNING
INTO STORES TAKING THREE 100
PAIRS OF JEANS AND TOMORROW
THEY'RE ON AMAZON OR CRAIG'S
LIST OR OFFER UP. THAT IS A VERY
REAL PROBLEM. WE ARE HAVING THE
èC P WILL TELL YOU, THE
ATTORNEY GENERAL'S OFFICE WILL
TELL YOU THESE TWO PROSECUTOR
GROUPS ARE TELLING YOU IT IS A
REAL PROBLEM THAT WE CANNOT
SOLVE. WITH LAW ENFORCEMENT
RESOURCES ALONE. WE WILL NEVER
CATCH IT. WE ARE CHASING A
DRAGON, AND WE NEED BUSINESS TO
STEP IN AND WORK WITH US.
FORTUNATELY MANY HAVE AND I
THINK MORE WILL, AS THEY
CONTINUE TO UNDERSTAND THAT
WE'RE BEING REASONABLE ABOUT
THIS, BUT THAT WE NEED THEIR
PARTNERSHIP. WE CANNOT SOLVE
THIS. WITH THE CRIMINAL JUSTICE
SYSTEM ALONE. COMMERCE HAS TO
LEAN IN. THEY HAVE TO BE A GOOD
PARTNER WITH US ON THIS, AND I
BELIEVE MOST OF THEM WANT THAT.
THEY WANT TO BE THE KINDS OF
PLATFORMS THAT CONSUMERS CAN
TRUST. SO HOW DO WE DO THAT? I
MEAN BACK TO MY ORIGINAL POINT
THE WAY WE CAN ELIMINATE ANY ANY
, UH, SALES OF PILFERED GOODS
ONLINE IS TO ELIMINATE ALL
ONLINE SALES. BUT I, I TAKE YOUR
POINT. WE DON'T WANT TO DO THAT.
BUT BUT THERE ARE CERTAIN
PLATFORMS WHERE WE DON'T THEY
DON'T TRACK IN, AND THEY THEY
LINK THE SELLER AND THE BUYER
INDEPENDENT OF THE PLATFORM. AND
IF THEY HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE
PLATFORM FOR PAYMENT THAT THAT'S
SO FUNDAMENTALLY ALTERS THEIR
BUSINESS MODEL THAT IT ESSENCE.
IT EITHER IMPEDES THEM OR PUTS
THEM OUT OF BUSINESS. SO JUST
HOW DO WE DO THAT? SO I'M
CONFIDENT THAT THEY HAVE ENOUGH
INFORMATION AND IF THEY DON'T,
THEY CAN REQUIRE ADDITIONAL
INFORMATION FROM THOSE SELLERS
TO CONFIRM WHEN THEY HIT A HIGH
VOLUME THRESHOLD AGAIN. REMEMBER
SENATOR WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT
ONE OFF SALES. WE'RE NOT TALKING
ABOUT ME GETTING A NEW SOFA AND
WANTING TO GET RID OF THE OLD
ONE, RIGHT? WE'RE TALKING ABOUT
SOMEBODY THAT'S MAKING 200
TRANSACTIONS IN A YEAR. THAT'S A
JOB IF YOU'VE EVER SOLD
SOMETHING AND HAD THE PERSON
COME TO YOUR HOUSE TO PICK IT UP
OR TRY TO DROP SOMETHING OFF.
IT'S AN ENDEAVOR THAT REQUIRES
YOUR ATTENTION. AND SO WE'RE
TALKING ABOUT THOSE INDIVIDUAL.
AND YES, WE ARE ASKING THE
PLATFORMS THEY MAY HAVE TO MAKE
SOME MODIFICATIONS TO THEIR
BUSINESS TO ACCOMMODATE THAT. WE
WILL BE REASONABLE. I'M SURE THE
SENATOR WILL BE VERY REASONABLE
WHAT THOSE ACCOMMODATIONS ARE,
BUT THEY ARE NECESSARY
ACCOMMODATIONS TO PROTECT THE
SAFETIES OF OUR COMMUNITIES. MR
CHAIR. IF I CAN ADD, SO IT WON'T
NECESSARILY HAVE TO REQUIRE THAT
THE PAYMENT TRANSACTION OCCURS.
SO I THINK THAT'S ONE OF THE
CONCERNS OF SOME OF THE, UM
ONLINE. PLACES THAT HAVE
INDICATED, BUT IT BUT ALL OF
THESE ENTITIES DO HAVE TRACKING
SYSTEMS AND AGAIN. I THINK THE
POINT THAT MR BARRY MADE THAT IS
IN WHICH I MADE IN MY OPENING IS
THAT WE ARE ONLY TALKING ABOUT
HIGH VOLUME. THIRD PARTY
SELLERS. THEY ARE ONLY NEEDING
TO A VERIFICATION INFORMATION ON
THOSE ENTITIES THAT ARE HAVING
200 OR MORE ABOVE 200
TRANSACTIONS ON THEIR SITE. NOT
1020 199, BUT MORE THAN 200. NÓ
I UNDERSTAND THAT TRACKING
ITSELF, THOUGH, IS SO FOR
EXAMPLE, YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENS
IF THERE'S SELLERS AND BUYERS
THAT BASICALLY MEET ONLINE IN
ESSENCE, AND THEN SUBVERT THE
SYSTEM TO AVOID THE FEE OR TO
AVOID THE COMMISSION BY BY
TALKING TO ONE ANOTHER. I'M NOT
SURE HOW THEY KEPT IT, BUT BUT
THE FUNDAMENTAL QUESTION IS THIS
IS RETAIL THEFT. IT SOUNDS LIKE
RETAIL IS RETAIL THEFT INCREASED
DRAMATICALLY IN THE LAST YEAR,
SO WE'VE CERTAINLY HAD INCREASES
AROUND THE UNITED STATES,
PARTICULARLY BIG CITIES. UH, IT
IS ON THE DECLINE AND HOPEFULLY
WE WILL CONTINUE TO DECLINE.
NONETHELESS WE ARE IN A NEW
UNIVERSE WITH E COMMERCE. THAT
IS THAT, YOU KNOW, CRIME MOVES
WHERE THERE'S OPPORTUNITY. THIS
IS A PLACE OF BIG OPPORTUNITY
THAT WE WOULD LIKE TO REGULATE
SO THAT WE CAN SHUT DOWN THAT
OPPORTUNITY. MR AGREE THAT
RETAIL THEFT IS DOWN NÓ. OH, OK,
SO IF I YOU KNOW WHAT I BELIEVE
YOU DON'T MIND. UH, LET ME MAKE
A COUPLE OF ADDITIONAL POINTS
THAT I THINK ARE VERY RELEVANT
TO THE DISCUSSION. SO THOSE
ENTITIES THAT ARE AND AGAIN MY
INTENTION IS NOT NECESSARILY TO
REQUIRE AN ALL SITUATIONS THE
PAYMENT DONE THROUGH THE SITE,
AND THAT IS SOMETHING WE'LL
CONTINUE TO WALK. EXCUSE ME TALK
TO STAKEHOLDERS, BUT THOSE
ENTITIES THAT DO NOT WE ARE
LOSING THAT SALES TAX. IF YOU
RECALL WHEN ONLINE SALES BEGAN
AND INCREASED AND INCREASED AND
WERE COMPETING WITH ALL BRICK
AND MORTAR STORES, WHO WERE
COLLECTING SALES TAX, IT TOOK US
A FEW YEARS, BUT WE WERE AND IT
WAS MY BILL. WE WERE FINALLY
ABLE TO AND IT WAS PRIMARILY
ORIENTED AT AMAZON, BUT IT
AFFECTED ALL OF THESE SELLERS
THAT THEY COLLECT THE SALES TAX
AND THEN IMPART IT TO THE STATE
OF CALIFORNIA VERSUS LEAVING IT
TO EACH OF US TO REPORT ON OUR
USE TAX CIRCUMSTANCE, RIGHT?
WELL, NOW, ANY OF THESE ONLINE
SELLERS THAT ARE NOT DOING THAT
WE ARE LOSING THAT SALES TAX AND
GIVEN THE AMOUNT OF SHIFT FROM
BRICK AND MORTAR SALES TO ONLINE
SALES, THAT IS AND GIVEN OUR
REVENUE SITUATION. WE SHOULD NOT
BE HèA. SO THAT'S ANOTHER
BENEFIT OF THE BILL. BUT
ADDITIONALLY WE, UH I THINK THE
POINT THAT WAS MADE ABOUT YOU
KNOW THE TYPE OF WHEN PAWN SHOPS
, FOR EXAMPLE, WERE ONE OF THE
MAIN ENTITIES THAT SOMEBODY USED
TO SELL STOLEN GOODS. WE PUT A
GREAT DEAL OF REGULATIONS ON
PAWN SHOPS AND THAT YOU KNOW,
I'M SURE UPON SHOPS WOULD IF
THEY WERE STANDING HERE WOULD
SAY, YEAH, THAT WAS WE ONEROUS
ON US, RIGHT? AND WHEN, FOR
EXAMPLE, DURING THE GREAT
RECESSION WE SAW AND IT'S
INTERESTING THAT WE'RE NOT DOING
THIS AGAIN. BUT IT MAY BE THAT
IT'S ALREADY IN PLACE BECAUSE WE
NOW SEE A LOT OF HEAVY METAL
THEFT. THAT'S WHAT'S DRIVING.
CATALYTIC CONVERTER THEFT IS IN
ORDER TO REDUCE TO REMOVE THOSE
RARE METALS, BUT WE BASICALLY
PUT ALL KINDS OF, UH,
RESTRICTIONS OR REGULATIONS ON
THE ENTITIES THAT WOULD BUY
DIFFERENT METALS AND BASICALLY
WOULDN'T LET THEM PAY YOU. IF
YOU CAME AND SOLD, WE WOULDN'T
LET THEM PAY OUT IN CASH. WE
WOULDN'T LET CERTAIN VOLUMES
MANY, MANY THINGS IN ORDER TO
REDUCE THE THESE FORMS OF
ABILITY TO SELL STOLEN GOODS. SO
THAT IS WHAT THE PURPOSE OF THE
BILL IS. AND I YOU HAVE MY
COMMITMENT TO CONTINUE TO WORK
WITH THESE STAKEHOLDERS TO MAKE
THIS AS FAIR AS POSSIBLE AND
STILL ACHIEVE THE OBJECTIVES
AND, UM UNLESS OTHER PEOPLE HAVE
QUESTIONS. I COULD USE THAT AS
MY CLOSE. THANK YOU. THANK YOU
FOR YOUR CLOTHES, AND YOU CAN
TELL FROM MY TONE IN QUESTIONS
THAT I HAVE SOME RESERVATIONS,
BUT BUT I SUPPORT THE CONCEPT OF
THE BILL AND I SUPPORT THE FACT
THAT THAT YOU WORK IN GOOD
FAITH. SO UH, WE WILL CONTINUE
TO HASH THIS OUT THAT RETAIL
THEFT IS AN ISSUE AND WE WANT TO
DISCOURAGE FOLKS FROM HAVING A
MECHANISM TO BE ABLE TO DO IT
WITH IMPUNITY. SO UM, I BELIEVE
THERE WAS A MOTION BY SENATOR W.
UH, ALL RIGHT. MADAM CHIEF
COUNSEL IF YOU CALL THE ROLL THE
SENATE BILL 144 BY SENATOR
SKINNER. UH THE MOTION IS TO
PASS AS AMENDED TO SENATE PUBLIC
SAFETY UMBERG UMBERG I WILK,
WILK NÓ. ALAN. ALAN. I ASHBY.
CABALLERO CABALLERO, I DURAZO
DURAZO. I LAD LAYERED I MIN MEN.
I NELO NELO I STERN STERN I
WAHAB WAHAB, I YOU HAVE ONE
MISSING, BUT IT'S 9 TO 1 SO FAR,
9 TO 1. WE'LL PUT THAT ON CALL.
THANK YOU, SENATOR SKINNER.
THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT. SO WE HAVE
UM SENATOR DE RUSSO. THEN
RUSSELL, YOU'RE UP. THEN SENATOR
LAIRD. THEN I'LL TAKE UP SENATOR
TAO'S BILL.
MOVE. WITH A BILL THANK YOU, MR
CHAIR. S¼ 1201 REQUIRES
CORPORATIONS AND LIMITED
LIABILITY COMPANIES TO REPORT
INFORMATION ABOUT THEIR
BENEFICIAL OWNERS. WHEN THOSE
BUSINESS ENTITIES FILE WITH THE
SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE.
CURRENTLY THERE IS NÓ REQUIRED
PUBLIC DISCLOSURE OF WHO THE
REAL OWNERS OF AN LL èC OR
CORPORATION ARE MANY LL èC S¼
ARE OWNED IN THE NAME OF ANOTHER
LL èC, WHICH CREATES ADDITIONAL
LAYERS OF ANONYMITY. ALLOWS
OWNERS TO ABUSE A LCS NOT ONLY
TO SHIELD THEIR ASSETS BUT ALSO
THEIR IDENTITIES. NONE OF THIS
IS NECESSARY TO ACHIEVE THE
LEGAL AND THE FINANCIAL
PROTECTIONS AFFORDED BY FORMING
AN LL èC IN THE FIRST PLACE.
THE ABILITY OF LL èC S¼ TO
ABUSE THE STRUCTURE TO REMAIN
ANONYMOUS ENDS UP PRESENTING
NUMEROUS ISSUES AND EVEN ENABLES
DISHONEST AND IN SOME CASES,
ILLEGAL PRACTICES. TAKE, FOR
INSTANCE, HOW ANONYMOUS SEES OUR
PERVASIVE AMONG EMPLOYERS THAT
SKIRT THE LAWS MEANT TO PROTECT
WORKERS. DECEITFUL EMPLOYERS CAN
USE LL èC S¼ TO AVOID
RESPONSIBILITY FOR UNDERPAYING
WORKERS, VIOLATING MEAL AND REST
, BREAK RULES AND IGNORING
OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH AND SAFETY
REGULATIONS. BY THE TIME A
BUSINESS IS FOUND RESPONSIBLE
FOR VIOLATIONS, THE OWNERS OFTEN
HAVE DISSOLVED THE LL èC AND
CREATED A NEW ONE. LEAVING
NOBODY TO PAY THE BACK WAGES OR
ADDRESS SAFETY ISSUES. IN FACT,
FEW WORKERS WHO WIN WAGE JUD
JUDGMENTS ARE ABLE TO COLLECT
THEIR MONEY. AN ANALYSIS OF THE
LABOR COMMISSIONER'S DATA BY
CALMATTERS REVEAL THAT
CALIFORNIA ISSUED $32.7 MILLION
WORTH OF WAGE JUDGMENTS TO MORE
THAN 1800 EMPLOYERS IN 2017, AND
FIVE YEARS LATER, ONLY 9% OF
THOSE COURT JUDGMENTS WERE
RECORDED AS SATISFIED OR PAID IN
FULL THREE QUARTER. OF THE
WORKERS WERE RECORDED AS
RECEIVING NÓ PAYMENT. IT CAN
TAKE YEARS FOR JUSTICE
DEPARTMENTS AND LABOUR
REPRESENTATIVES TO CONNECT THE
DOTS TO SHOW THAT A SINGLE
PERSON IS RESPONSIBLE FOR
REPEATED VIOLATIONS. THIS ALLOW
ABUSE. THIS ALLOWS ABUSES TO
CONTINUE LARGELY UNIMPEDED,
WHICH OFTEN HAPPEN AMONG THE
LOWEST WAGE INDUSTRIES. THE LACK
OF OWNER TRANSPARENCY ALSO
PROVIDES AN AVENUE TO SKIRT
RESPONSIBILITY FOR SUBSTANDARD
HOUSING. ONE PROPERTY OWNERS CAN
HIDE BEHIND THE WEB OF LL èC
S¼. TENANTS AND LOCAL
ENFORCEMENT OFFICIALS ARE OFTEN
FRUSTRATED IN THEIR ATTEMPTS TO
OBTAIN REPAIRS BECAUSE THEY
CANNOT FIND THE TRUE OWNER
RESPONSIBLE FOR THE PROPERTY.
AND WHEN THE LOCAL, UH
ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES FINALLY
CLOSE IN THESE BAD ACTORS SIMPLY
SWITCH LL èC S¼, CREATING
SUBSTANTIAL DELAYS IN THE
ABILITY OF REGULATORS TO COMPEL
REPAIRS. S¼ B 1201 IS A GOOD
GOVERNANCE BILL. I'M GOING TO
ASK YOU TO PAUSE FOR JUST A
MOMENT. WE HAVE TO LIFT CALLS.
I'M SORRY. UM SO MADAM CHIEF
COUNSEL, IF YOU WOULD LIFT CALLS
YES. ON THE CONSENT CALENDAR.
ASHBY. AS NELO. NEAL I WAHAB
WAHHAB. AYE THAT'S 11 TO 0 11 TO
0 CONSENT COUNTER IS CONFIRMED.
SURE S¼ B. SORRY THIS IS FILE
ITEM NUMBER ONE S¼ B 1095 BY
SENATOR BECKER PASS AS AMENDED
TO SENATE APPROPRIATIONS. ASHBY
ASHBY, I NELO NELO I. WAHAB
WAHHAB. AYE. THAT'S 11 TO 0 11 0
BILLS OUT. FILE ITEM NUMBER
FOUR. S¼ 924 BY SENATOR
BRADFORD. VOTING I ASHBY ASHBY
NILO NÓ WAHHAB WAHAB. I. THAT'S
9 TO 292 BILLS OUT. WHILE ITEM
NUMBER SIX S¼ B 1017 BY SENATOR
EDMAN. WITH THE CHAIR VOTING. I
ASHBY ASHBY. I NEO NEO. I THAT'S
11 TO 0 11 0 BILLS OUT. FILE
ITEM NUMBER SEVEN S¼ B 1000
THREE 166. WE HAVEN'T DONE THAT
ONE YET. SORRY. FILE ITEM NUMBER
EIGHT S¼ B 1061 BY SENATOR LIMÓN
CHAIRING A ALLEN. ALAN I CERRO
CABRIO I THAT'S 9292 BILLS OUT.
ITEM 10 WAS PULLED FILE ITEM 14.
THIS IS S¼ B ONE AND 44 BY
SENATOR SKINNER, CHAIR OF VOTING
I, ASHBY ASHBY. I THAT IS. 10 TO
110 TO 1 BILLS OUT. FILE ITEM 15
BY SENATOR WEINER S¼ B 957.
SHARE VOTING. I ASHBY ASHBY. 9
TO 292 BILLS OUT. FILE ITEM
NUMBER 16 SB 1047 BY SENATOR
WEINER. THERE HASN'T VOTED YET.
UMBERG UMBERG I WILK NELO THAT'S
NINE TO 090 BILLS OUT. FILE ITEM
18 BY SENATOR ALLEN CHAIR
VOTING. I THIS IS SB. 1441 ASHBY
. ASHBY I NELO NELO NÓ. THAT'S 9
TO 292 BILLS OUT. F ITEM NUMBER
20. WE'RE ON. I THINK THAT'S ALL
RIGHT. THANK YOU FOR YOUR
CONSIDERATION. SENATOR DE RASO.
THANK YOU, SENATOR RUSSO. YOU
MAY PROCEED. THANK YOU. S¼ B
1201 IS A GOOD GOVERNANCE BILL.
IT DOES NOT CHANGE ANY OF THE
LEGAL PROTECTIONS AFFORDED TO
THESE BUSINESS ENTITIES IS
SIMPLY REQUIRES THE DISCLOSURE
OF THEIR BENEFICIAL OWNER. WE
ARE JUST ASKING FOR ONE
ADDITIONAL POINT OF INFORMATION
ON A FORM THAT ENTITIES
CURRENTLY FILL OUT WITHOUT OWNER
TRANSPARENCY AS POLICYMAKERS AND
ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES. UH AND THE
PUBLIC LACK CRITICAL INFORMATION
TO MAKE INFORMED POLICY
DECISIONS, ONE WILL MAKE IT
EASIER TO ENFORCE EXISTING LAWS
TO PROTECT THE PEOPLE WHO LIVE
AND WORK IN OUR COMMUNITIES
ACROSS THE STATE. IT WILL
INCREASE GOVERNMENT EFFICIENCY
ULTIMATELY SAVE TAXPAYER DOLLARS
. TODAY I HAVE WITH ME TWO
WITNESSES IN SUPPORT OF THE
BILL. UH KI¾M WILLETT. THE LEGAL
AID AT WORK AND YOU AS SURU BAWA
FROM RISE ECONOMY, ONE OF THE
SPONSORS OF THE BILL. GOOD
AFTERNOON TO AMBER AND MEMBERS
OF THE COMMITTEE. AMD THAU WITH
RISE ECONOMY THANK YOU FOR THE
OPPORTUNITY TO TESTIFY TODAY.
THE LACK OF OWNER TRANSPARENCY
IS A DRAIN ON TAXPAYER DOLLARS,
IMPEDES EFFORTS TO ENFORCE
EXISTING LAWS AND FRUSTRATES
EFFORTS TO DESIGN POLICIES THAT
ARE RESPONSIVE TO REAL WORLD
TRENDS AND CONDITIONS IN OUR
COMMUNITIES, FOR EXAMPLE,
WITHOUT OWNER INFORMATION, WE
CANNOT ASSESS THE EXTENT TO
WHICH OUR COMMUNITIES ASSETS ARE
ACTUALLY OWNED BY A SMALL NUMBER
OF CORPORATE ENTITIES. THIS IS
PARTICULARLY IMPORTANT IN THE
HOUSING CONTEXT, GIVEN HOW
CRUCIAL HOMEOWNERSHIP IS TO
FINANCIAL STABILITY AND BUILDING
INTERGENERATIONAL WEALTH, WHILE
THERE IS SIGNIFICANT EVIDENCE
THAT WE ARE SEEING INCREASING
CONSOLIDATION OF HOUSING
OWNERSHIP IN CORPORATE HANDS, IT
IS IMPOSSIBLE TO KNOW THE TRUE
EXTENT TO THIS OF THE ISSUE AND
WHERE IN THE STATE IT IS MOST
PREVALENT WITHOUT TRANSPARENCY,
FRUSTRATING EFFORTS TO DEVELOP
POLICY RESPONSES. CALIFORNIA
ALREADY HAS ONE OF THE LOWEST
HOMEOWNERSHIP RATES IN THE
COUNTRY, CORPORATE PURCHASES OF
SINGLE HOMES EXACERBATE THIS
BECAUSE THE AVERAGE HOME BUYER
CANNOT COMPETE WITH THE ALL CASH
OFFERS THAT CORPORATIONS ARE
ABLE TO MAKE. WHAT'S WORSE AS
LANDLORDS, CORPORATIONS CHARGE
HIGHER RENTS ON AVERAGE, MAKING
IT MORE DIFFICULT FOR PEOPLE TO
SAVE FOR A DOWN PAYMENT. ALSO
LARGE CORPORATE LANDLORDS ARE
MOTIVATED FIRST AND FOREMOST BY
THEIR NEED TO SHOW QUARTERLY
GAINS SO THEY INVEST AS LITTLE
AS POSSIBLE IN THEIR BUILDINGS.
RESEARCH SHOWS THAT LIVING
CONDITIONS ARE WORSE IN
BUILDINGS OWNED BY LARGE
CORPORATIONS THAN SMALL
INVESTORS. AS A LEGISLATOR, GRAD
WITH HOW TO INCREASE HOUSING
OPPORTUNITIES THROUGHOUT THE
STATE. WE ALSO NEED TO ENSURE
THAT OUR CURRENT HOUSING STOCK
DOES NOT FALL INTO DECAY.
CURRENTLY EFFORTS TO ENFORCE
HABIT HABITABILITY STANDARDS IN
RENTAL HOUSING ARE FRUSTRATED BY
A LACK OF INFORMATION ABOUT WHO
THE ACTUAL PEOPLE ARE BEHIND THE
LL èC S¼ THAT OWN PROPERTIES.
IT CAN TAKE YEARS AND
SIGNIFICANT PUBLIC RESOURCES FOR
LOCAL CODE ENFORCEMENT
DEPARTMENTS TO DETERMINE WHO TO
HOLD ACCOUNTABLE FOR
NON-COMPLIANCE WITH EXISTING
HABITABILITY. LAWS AND TO
UNCOVER PATTERNS OF ABUSE AND
NEGLECT OVER MULTIPLE PROPERTIES
. LL èC SHOULD NOT BE A SHIELD
TO AVOID RESPONSIBILITY FOR
SUBSTANDARD BUILDINGS, FINALLY,
HAVING BENEFICIAL OWNER
INFORMATION READILY AVAILABLE
WOULD SAVE SIGNIFICANT PUBLIC
RESOURCES AND BE A NET POSITIVE
IN TERMS OF PROVIDING SAFE,
STABLE HOUSING OPPORTUNITIES
ACROSS THE STATE. YOU WRAP IT
UP. THANK YOU FOR YOUR
THOUGHTFUL CONSIDERATION. I
RESPECTFULLY ASK FOR AN EYEBALL.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH, ALL RIGHT.
NEXT WITNESS. GOOD AFTERNOON. MY
NAME IS KI¾M. WILLETT AND I'M AN
ATTORNEY AT LEGAL AID.ORG. WE'RE
A NONPROFIT BASED IN SAN
FRANCISCO. THE ADVOCATES ON
BEHALF OF WORKERS ACROSS
CALIFORNIA. UM WE PROVIDE
REPRESENTATION TO HUNDREDS OF
WORKERS EVERY YEAR WHO HAVE BEEN
DENIED ACCESS TO BASIC RIGHTS
LIKE MINIMUM WAGE OVERTIME PAID
SICK LEAVE. ONE MAJOR CHALLENGE
THAT WORKERS FACE IN HOLDING
EMPLOYERS ACCOUNTABLE FOR
VIOLATIONS OF THEIR RIGHTS IS
ACCURATELY IDENTIFYING THE
INDIVIDUALS AND BUSINESSES THAT
ARE LIABLE FOR THE VIOLATIONS.
S¼ B 12 Ó ONE WOULD HELP
ADDRESS THIS BY REQUIRING PUBLIC
DISCLOSURE OF THE BENEFICIAL
OWNERS OF LL, èC, S¼ AND OTHER
ENTITIES THAT OWN AND OPERATE
BUSINESSES. I RECENTLY
REPRESENTED FOUR INDIVIDUALS WHO
WORKED IN A SUSHI RESTAURANT IN
HAYWARD AS COOKS IN THIS
RESTAURANT. THEY REGULARLY
WORKED OVER 10 HOURS A DAY, SIX
DAYS A WEEK. THEY WERE NOT
PROVIDED WITH MEAL BREAKS. THEY
DID NOT RECEIVE OVERTIME
COMPENSATION, AND THEY WERE NOT
PAID THE MINIMUM WAGE. THE
VIOLATIONS WERE CLEAR. BUT
DETERMINING WHO TO HOLD
ACCOUNTABLE WAS NOT. DURING THE
THREE YEARS MY CLIENTS WORKED AT
THIS RESTAURANT. THEY WERE
EMPLOYED BY THREE DIFFERENT
CORPORATE ENTITIES. THE WORKERS
DID NOT KNOW WHO ACTUALLY OWNED
THE BUSINESS OR SET POLICIES FOR
THE BUSINESS. BY THE TIME WE GOT
A HEARING, IN THIS CASE, ALL
THREE OF THE CORPORATE ENTITIES
HAD BEEN DISSOLVED. THROUGH TIME
. CONS TIME CONSUMING EXTENSIVE
INVESTIGATION, INCLUDING
DETAILED SEARCHES OF YELP
REVIEWS AND EVEN CALLING A
NUMBER OF SUSHI RESTAURANTS IN
HAYWARD. WE WERE ABLE TO
IDENTIFY TWO INDIVIDUALS WHO WE
THOUGHT RAN THESE BUSINESSES,
BUT DURING THE HEARING, NEITHER
INDIVIDUAL WOULD ADMIT TO OWNING
OR SETTING POLICIES FOR THE
BUSINESS, EVEN THOUGH WE WANT
OUR CASE AND THE HEARING OFFICER
DETERMINED THAT MY CLIENTS WERE
OWED OVER $200,000 FOR THE
VIOLATIONS COMMITTED AGAINST
THEM, WE ULTIMATELY WERE ABLE TO
ONLY A FRACTION OF THAT AMOUNT
IN PART DUE TO A LACK OF PROOF
ABOUT WHO ACTUALLY OWNED AND RAN
THE RESTAURANT. UNFORTUNATELY
THIS STORY IS JUST ONE OF SO
MANY WE DESPITE SPEAKING UP AND
SPENDING YEARS FIGHTING FOR
STOLEN WAGES, WORKERS STRUGGLE
TO HOLD WORK EMPLOYERS
ACCOUNTABLE FOR VIOLATIONS. SB
1201 WILL TAKE A VERY, VERY
IMPORTANT STEP TO PREVENT
CORPORATIONS FROM EVADING
RESPONSIBILITY. AND FOR THIS
REASON WE URGE YOUR SUPPORT.
THANK YOU, OTHERS IN SUPPORT.
APPROACH MICROPHONE. CHRISTOPHER
SANCHEZ WITH THE MESA GROUP ON
BEHALF OF THE WESTERN CENTER ON
POVERTY, INCLUSIVE ACTION FOR
THE CITY AND THE CONSUMER
FEDERATION OF CALIFORNIA AND
STRONG SUPPORT. BRIAN AUGUSTA,
ON BEHALF OF THE CALIFORNIA
RURAL LEGAL ASSISTANCE
FOUNDATION, THE PUBLIC INTEREST
LAW PROJECT, THE NATIONAL
HOUSING LAW PROJECT, AND HOUSING
AND ECONOMIC RIGHTS ADVOCATES
AND SUPPORT CATHERINE CHARLES ON
BEHALF OF HOUSING IN CALIFORNIA
AND SUPPORT HERE AND MEMBERS,
BETH MOWS OF THE S¼ U,
CALIFORNIA AND SUPPORT CHAIR
UMBERG AND MEMBERS BRYANT MERA
MONTES WITH ASK ME, CALIFORNIA
AND SUPPORT SUSANNE DERSHOWITZ
WITH PUBLIC ADVOCATES CO SPONSOR
OF THE BILL AND STRONG SUPPORT.
MARK STIVERS OF THE CALIFORNIA
HOUSING PARTNERSHIP AND SUPPORT
THANK YOU. ER LAZZARO WITH THE
CALIFORNIA LABOR FEDERATION IN
SUPPORT. SHANTI SINGH ON BEHALF
OF TENANTS TOGETHER IN OUR 60
MEMBER ORGANIZATIONS ACROSS THE
STATE. STRONG SUPPORT. THANK
YOU. ALL RIGHT. OPPOSITION.
YOU'RE OPPOSED TO, UM S¼ B 1201,
PLEASE APPROACH. GOOD AFTERNOON
CHAIR AND MEMBERS. THANK YOU FOR
THE OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK IN
OPPOSITION OF THIS BILL. UM MY
NAME IS AMBER MADISON ON BEHALF
OF THE CALIFORNIA APARTMENT
ASSOCIATION. WE HAVE OPPOSED
BILLS OF THIS NATURE. PREVIOUSLY
IN OUR OPPOSITION TO THIS
REINCARNATION OF LAST YEAR'S S¼
B 594 REMAINS THE SAME.
REQUIRING BUSINESS OWNERS TO
DISCLOSE THEIR IDENTITY IS
UNNECESSARY AND A COSTLY
REQUIREMENT WITH NÓ TANGIBLE
PUBLIC BENEFIT. THE BILL IS
ATTEMPTING, ACCORDING TO THE
AUTHOR, TO PROTECT CONSUMERS
FROM PEOPLE WHO WILLFULLY BREAK
THE LAW. BUT THE PROBLEM IS THAT
THE BILL DOES NOT BY ITS OWN
BLACK AND WHITE STOP THESE BAD
ACTORS FROM PERFORMING THESE BAD
ACTS. DUE TO THIS. THE BILL IS
ABSORBANT COST THE ENACTMENT OF
THE FEDERAL èC Tð A AND
POSSIBLE CONFLICT WITH THE BILLS
, REQUIREMENTS AND THE
DISCLOSURE LAWS OF OTHER STATES
AS HIGHLIGHTED IN THE STAFF
ANALYSIS. WE RESPECTFULLY
REQUEST A NÓ VOTE AT THE
APPROPRIATE TIME. THANK YOU. UH,
GOOD AFTERNOON. UH, MISTER CHAIR
AND MEMBERS CREAM DREY ON BEHALF
OF THE CALIFORNIA ASSOCIATION OF
REALTORS AND OPPOSITION.
RESPECTFULLY REQUEST A NÓ VOTE.
THANK YOU. GOOD AFTERNOON, MR
CHAIR AND MEMBERS AND I APPLAUD
YOUR STAMINA AT THIS POINT. UH,
ROBERT MUCCI, CALIFORNIA CHAMBER
OF COMMERCE, OPPOSITION,
PARTICULARLY CONCERNED ABOUT THE
PERSONAL RESIDENCE. DISCLOSURE.
THANK YOU. THANK YOU. YOU THINK
THIS IS STAMINA? NEXT WEEK.
THANK YOU. YEAH ALL RIGHT. UH,
LET'S BRING IT BACK TO
COMMITTEE. YES, SENATOR. THANK
YOU. UM I'M ACTUALLY GONNA MOVE
THIS BILL. UM SPECIFICALLY I. I
ALSO WANT TO HIGHLIGHT THAT SOME
OF THE WITNESSES MENTIONED FOLKS
IN HAYWARD. I OBVIOUSLY
REPRESENTED HAYWARD. WE SEE THIS
ACROSS THE BOARD. WE SEE
VIOLATIONS TO SPECIFICALLY THE
FOLKS OF LOWER INCOME STATUS.
PEOPLE WHO HAVE DIFFERENT
BACKGROUNDS IN THEIR, UM,
IMMIGRANT STATUS AND MUCH MORE.
I THINK THAT AT A CERTAIN POINT
IN TIME WE NEED TO KNOW WHO OWNS
WHAT RIGHT? AND LAST YEAR WE, ME
SPECIFICALLY, I WAS TRYING TO
PUT PUSH A RENT REGISTRY TO
ACTUALLY UNDERSTAND AGAIN. WHO
OWNS WHAT? YOU KNOW. WHERE CAN
THIS BE? YOU CANNOT HIDE BEHIND
THE SHADOWS. I UNDERSTAND THE
PURPOSE OF AN LL èC. I FULLY
SUPPORT, YOU KNOW, PROTECTING
ASSETS AND, YOU KNOW, LIMITED
LIABILITIES AND SO FORTH. I
COMPLETELY FULLY SUPPORT THAT,
HOWEVER, AT A CERTAIN POINT IN
TIME WHEN, AS WAS MENTIONED,
VIOLATIONS ARE MADE THAT ARE
COMPLETELY AGAINST THE LAW. UH,
IT SHOULD BE. EASY TO FIGURE OUT
, YOU KNOW EXACTLY WHO'S LIABLE.
NUMBER ONE NUMBER TWO IS THE
FACT THAT UM SOME OF THE
COMMENTARY OF THE OPPOSITION
STATED THAT, UM, THAT THIS IS
PROBLEMATIC IN SOME WAYS MORE
SPECIFICALLY, I. I DO WANNA
HIGHLIGHT THAT. IF THIS DOESN'T
SOLVE THE PROBLEM, I ALSO JUST
WANT TO GIVE AN ANECDOTAL
INFORMATION THAT IN THE CITY OF
HAYWARD, WE TRY TO IDENTIFY UM,
YOU KNOW AND REDUCE OUR EVICTION
RATE. OUR EVICTION RATE. THE
MOMENT WE HAD AN EXCEL DATABASE
OF WHO OWNS THE PROPERTY AND
STATING VERY CLEARLY THAT YOU
CANNOT EVICT BASED ON, YOU KNOW,
AGE AND DISCRIMINATION AND SO
FORTH, UM, OR EVICTION RATE WENT
DOWN BY DOUBLE DIGITS WITHIN 12
MONTHS. PURELY BECAUSE WE COULD
TELL WHO WAS DOING IT. WE COULD
IDENTIFY BAD ACTORS AND REPEAT
OFFENDERS. WE COULD ALSO HOLD
THEM ACCOUNTABLE. IN 12 MONTHS.
WE SAW DOUBLE DIGIT DECLINE IN
EVICTIONS. AND THE PEOPLE THAT
WERE BEING EVICTED. WERE THE
MOST MARGINALIZED. MOST
VICTIMIZED MOST, UM VULNERABLE
COMMUNITY MEMBERS. IN ALREADY.
YOU KNOW, LOWER INCOME CITY. AND
SO WE HAVE THIS CONVERSATION
HERE IN IN JUDICIARY AND I. I
SPECIFICALLY ASKED TO JOIN THIS
COMMITTEE, UM, TO HIGHLIGHT SOME
OF THESE CONCERNS, AND I
UNDERSTAND I'M NOT A LAWYER. I
GET THAT, BUT IT'S INCREDIBLY
IMPORTANT TO EXPLAIN. HOW
HOUSING AND THE LAWS AROUND
RENTS AND CORPORATIONS AND SO
FORTH HAVE A NEGATIVE IMPACT,
NOT NECESSARILY JUST THE
FINANCIAL POSITIVE IMPACT IN
REGARDS TO BUSINESS, WHICH I
AGAIN SUPPORT. WE HAVE TO CREATE
SAFEGUARDS TO PROTECT AS MANY
PEOPLE AS POSSIBLE, ESPECIALLY
WHEN PEOPLE ARE ABUSING THEIR
POWER. SO I REALLY APPRECIATE
THE SENATOR FOR YOUR WORK AND
YOUR CONSISTENT COMMITMENT TO
MARGINALIZED COMMUNITIES. I
RESPECT BOTH OPPOSITION AND
PROPONENTS OF THIS BILL, AND I
RESPECTFULLY RESPECTFULLY MOVE
THIS, UH, BILL WHEN APPROPRIATE.
THANK YOU. ALRIGHTY. THANK YOU.
YES, SENATOR. MIN. I WANT TO
THANK MY COLLEAGUE FROM HAYWARD
FOR BRINGING THAT, UM, FOR THOSE
COMMENTS AND TO YOU, SENATOR OZO
FOR BRINGING THIS BILL FORWARD.
UM YOU KNOW, LOUIS BRANDEIS, THE
FORMER S¼. THE OLD SUPREME COURT
JUSTICE ONCE SAID SUNLIGHT'S THE
BEST DISINFECTANT, AND THAT'S
REALLY WHAT THIS BILL IS ABOUT,
UH, IT MAY OR MAY NOT SOLVE
PROBLEMS, BUT BY PROVIDING
TRANSPARENCY IN THE WAYS THAT MY
COLLEAGUE FROM HAYWARD MENTIONED
I. I THINK IT CAN, UH, REALLY
ILLUMINATE, UH, WHO IS
PROBLEMATIC? WHO'S UM, WHO MIGHT
BE REPEAT OFFENDERS AND, UH, WE
ALSO KNOW JUST FROM A LOT OF
STUDIES AND WHAT WE SEE ON
INTERNET THAT ANONYMITY OFTEN
ENTITLES PEOPLE TO ACT IN BAD
WAYS. SO UM HAVING SOMEONE TO
HOLD ACCOUNTABLE, I THINK IS
IMPORTANT, PARTICULARLY GIVEN
THE DOMINANCE OF REEDS AND
PRIVATE EQUITY FIRMS THAT HAVE
REALLY BEGUN TO DOMINATE
CALIFORNIA'S, UH, RENTAL MARKET.
SO I HAVE BEEN SYMPATHETIC TO A
LOT OF THE SMALL LANDLORDS, UH,
IN A LOT OF THESE BILLS THAT
HAVE GONE THROUGH THIS
COMMITTEE, BUT THIS ONE'S AN
EASY ONE. SO, I, I WILL BE
VOTING. I AND I WANNA THANK YOU
FOR BRINGING FORWARD THANK YOU.
THANK YOU, UM ARE QUESTIONS
COMMENTS, SENATOR WHA HAS MOVED
THE BILL. SENATOR RAO WOULD LIKE
TO CLOSE. THANK YOU ALL AND I
APPRECIATE THE COMMENTS AND
SUPPORT AND ASK FOR YOUR VOTE.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ALL RIGHT,
SENATOR. MIN. ADDED. OR MADAM
SECRETARY. PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
THIS IS FILE ITEM NUMBER 20 S¼ B
1201 MOTION IS DUE PASS THE
SENATE BANKING AND FINANCIAL
FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS. UMBERG
UMBERG, I WILK, WILK ALLEN. A
AND I, ASHBY CABALLERO
CABALLERO. I DURAZO RUSSO. I
LEERED LAYERED I MIN MIN I NELO
NELO NÓ STERN STERN IW. WHAT
HAVE I. 9 TO 191. THE BILL IS
OUT. THANK YOU MEMBERS. ALL
RIGHT. UM. SENATOR LAIRD. FILE
ITEM, 21. MR CHAIR. SENATE BILL
1150 WILL UPDATE THE TITLE OF
CHAPTER SEVEN OF VISION SIX OF
THE FAMILY CODE TO ENSURE PEOPLE
, REGARDLESS OF GENDER IDENTITY
CAN RESTORE THEIR FORMER SURNAME
FOLLOWING A DIVORCE. THE
CHAPTERS LANGUAGE WAS UPDATED
NEARLY THREE YEARS AGO TO
CONTAIN GENDER NEUTRAL LANGUAGE,
BUT THE CHAPTER'S TITLE
RESTORATION OF WIFE'S FORMER
NAME WAS LEFT UNCHANGED. THIS
BILL IS SIMPLY A CORRECTION TO
IT OF THE BILL, SUPPORTED BY THE
CHILD SUPPORT. ASSOCIATION OF
CALIFORNIA IT HAS NÓ REGISTERED
OPPOSITION, AND I REQUEST AN
IVOE. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU VERY
MUCH, UH, WITNESSES IN SUPPORT,
SEEING NÓ ONE APPROACH THE MIC
WOULDN'T OH, I'M SORRY, I. I WAS
TOO FAST. YOU GOTTA BE FAST IN
THE COMMITTEE. ONCE AFTER FOUR.
YOU GOT TO BE FAST. HE'S A ME
TOO AFTER THERE'S NÓ ME. OH, OK.
ME TOO. GO AHEAD. UH CRAIG POST
FOR QUALITY CALIFORNIA IN
SUPPORT. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU.
OTHERS IN SUPPORT OPPOSITION. NÓ
ONE APPROACHES THE MICROPHONE IN
OPPOSITION, UH, BACK TO THE
COMMITTEE. UH, I SEE QUESTIONS.
UH SENATOR MIN HAS MOVED THE
BILL THERE. WOULD YOU LIKE TO
ASK FOR AN IPHONE? ASK FOR AN I
VOTE. ALL RIGHT. YOU'RE ASKING
FOR MY QUOTE. MADAM SECRETARY,
PLEASE CALL THE ROLL. THIS IS
FILE ITEM NUMBER 21 S¼ B 150.
THE MOTION IS TO PASS UMBERG
UMBERG. I WILL LOOK, I ALLEN. A
AND I, ASHBY CABALLERO
CABALLERO. I DURAZO TOO. I LAIRD
LAYERED EYE MEN. I NELO NELO I
STERN STERN. I WAHAB WAHAB. AYE.
10 TO 0. 10 TO 0. THE BILL IS
OUT. THANK YOU. AND NOW WE'RE
MOVING ON TO THE FINAL ITEM OF
THE DAY. FINAL ITEM SEVEN. S¼ B
1366 BY SENATOR HURTADO AND
PRESENTING ON HER BEHALF IS OUR
CHAIR. WITH THE RECOMMENDATION
OF DUE PASSES AMENDED TO
DIRECTLY TO THE FLOOR. ALL RIGHT
WITH THAT WHENEVER YOU'RE READY.
THANK YOU, MR CHAIR MEMBERS.
IT'S MY PRIVILEGE TO PRESENT
SENATE BILL 1366 FOR OUR
COLLEAGUE, SENATOR TAO. SENATOR
TAO ACCEPTS THE VERY EXCELLENT
AMENDMENTS SUGGESTED BY THE
COMMITTEE IN ITS ANALYSIS AND
EXTENDS ITS HER GRATITUDE
COMMITTEE STAFF FOR ALL THEIR
ASSISTANCE. REALLY, TO THE BILL,
UH, ACCESS TO SAFE, CLEAN AND
AFFORDABLE DRINKING WATER IN
RURAL AREAS OF CALIFORNIA HAS
BEEN COME INCREASINGLY DIFFICULT
. DOMESTIC WATER WELLS ARE ONE
MAJOR SOURCE OF WATER THAT
RESIDENTS OF R COMMUNITIES
CONTINUE TO RELY UPON. HOWEVER
DUE TO THE DWINDLING GROUNDWATER
BASINS AND INSUFFICIENCY OF
WATER STORAGE AND DELAYED
INFRASTRUCTURE PROJECTS. THIS
OPTION FOR WATER PROCUREMENT IS
BECOMING LESS RELIABLE AS
GROUNDWATER SUPPLIES CONTINUE TO
FACE VARIOUS THREATS AND WATER.
WELLS FAIL. RESIDENTS
COMMUNITIES MAY TURN TO WATER
TANK ASSISTANCE PROGRAMS TO
OBTAIN THE RESOURCES THEY NEED.
S¼ B 1366 WOULD REQUIRE THAT A
SELLER WHEN LISTING A PROPERTY
THAT HAS EXPERIENCED WATER WELL
ISSUES RECEIVE WATER TANK
ASSISTANCE. DISCLOSE THOSE
ISSUES TO PROSPECTIVE. BUYERS UM
PRESENTLY, CERTAIN DISCLOSURES
MUST BE COMPLETED WHEN SELLING
REAL ESTATE IN CALIFORNIA. THERE
ARE A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT
DISCLOSURES HAZARDOUS WASTE LEAD
BASED PRODUCTS. UM THERE'S NÓ
DISCLOSURE REQUIRED FOR WATER
WELL FAILURES, AND THIS WOULD
REQUIRE SUCH NOTICE. UM JUST AH,
ON MY OWN. SENATOR TAO HAS BEEN
A CHAMPION FOR CLEAN DRINKING
WATER FOR RURAL COMMUNITIES. AND
THIS IS ALONG THE SAME LINES AS
SHE HAS ADVOCATED AND CHAMPIONED
IN THE PAST. UM TODAY, EMILY, UH
MCKAY IS HERE, UH, AS A PRIMARY
WITNESS IN SUPPORT. GOOD
AFTERNOON. MY NAME IS EMILY
MCKAY WITH SELF HELP ENTERPRISES
. WE'RE A NONPROFIT HOUSING AND
COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT
ORGANIZATION, AND WE PROVIDE
INTERIM WATER TANKS AND HAULED
WATER TO SAN JOAQUIN VALLEY
RESIDENTS WHOSE PRIVATE DOMESTIC
WATER WELLS HAVE GONE DRY. THERE
ARE THREE POINTS THAT I'D LIKE
TO MAKE AS TO WHY I THINK THIS
CHANGE IS IMPORTANT FIRST, THAT
ACCESS TO WATER IS A BASIC
NECESSITY AND A HUMAN RIGHT.
LOSING ACCESS TO RUNNING WATER
IS TRAUMATIC IN AND OF ITSELF
AND STATEWIDE OVER 5800 DRY
WELLS HAVE BEEN VOLUNTARILY
REPORTED SINCE 2014 AND THE REAL
NUMBER IS LIKELY HIGHER.
FURTHERMORE PRIVATE WELLS WILL
CONTINUE TO GO DRY OR SUSTAIN
DAMAGE DUE TO THE SLOW RATE OF
GROUNDWATER RECHARGE AND THE
INEVITABILITY OF FUTURE
DROUGHTS, FLOODS AND OTHER
CLIMATE RELATED IMPACTS.
SECONDLY THE PURPOSE OF THE
WATER TANK ASSISTANCE PROGRAM IS
TO PROVIDE RELIEF TO RESIDENTS
DIRECTLY AFFECTED BY THE WATER
OUTAGE EMERGENCY. THE TANK
SYSTEM ITSELF IS LEASED TO THE
HOMEOWNER AND NEITHER THE SYSTEM
NOR THE HAULED WATER SERVICE
CONVEYS WITH THE PROPERTY IF
OWNERSHIP IS TRANSFERRED.
FINALLY A DRY WELL OR LACK OF
ACCESS TO WATER DEVALUES A
PROPERTY WHICH AFFECTS THE
ABILITY TO SELL OR EVEN TO
OBTAIN FINANCING AGAINST THE
PROPERTY'S EQUITY IN ORDER TO
DRILL A NEW WELL WHICH IN THE
SAN JOAQUIN VALLEY COSTS AROUND
$55,000 A COST THAT IS
INFEASIBLE FOR MANY, ESPECIALLY
LOW INCOME FAMILIES. FOR THESE
REASONS, I BELIEVE THAT IT IS
CRUCIAL DURING THE TRANSACTION
OF RESIDENTIAL REAL PROPERTY TO
DISCLOSE THE STATUS OF A
DOMESTIC WELL AND THE FACT THAT
TANK ASSISTANCE MAY NOT CONVEY
WITH THE PROPERTY AS WELL AS
ADVISING THE PROSPECTIVE BUYER
TO HAVE A PROFESSIONAL
INSPECTION OF THE WATER. WELL I
BELIEVE THAT THIS BILL WILL AID
PROSPECTIVE BUYERS AND MAKING A
SOUND INFORMED DECISION AND WILL
PREVENT UNDUE HARM FROM LACK OF
ACCESS TO WATER. THANK YOU.
THANK YOU. ANY OTHER MEMBERS OF
THE AUDIENCE WISH TO SPEAK IN
SUPPORT. ANYBODY HERE IN
OPPOSITION? RIGHT. YOU HAVE TWO
MINUTES. OH, I DON'T NEED A FULL
TWO MINUTES. THANK YOU, SENATOR.
SENATOR UH, JENNIFER SPEAK ON
BEHALF OF THE CALIFORNIA
ASSOCIATION OF REALTORS WERE
ACTUALLY PLEASED TO LET THE
COMMITTEE KNOW AND TO THANK
THANK THE AUTHOR AND HER STAFF
ALONG WITH THE COMMITTEE FOR
HELPING US TO RESOLVE OUR
CONCERNS WITHIN THE BILL THE WAY
THE BILL WAS ORIGINALLY DRAFTED,
WE HAD SOME SIGNIFICANT CONCERNS
WITH THE WAY THE DISCLOSURE WAS
REQUIRED THROUGHOUT THE STATE OF
CALIFORNIA AS IT ONLY APPLIED TO
HOLD WATER, WHICH DOES NOT
NECESSARILY APPLY TO OTHER AREAS
OF THE STATE. BUT AT THIS POINT,
WE ARE ELATED WITH THE CHANGES
WITHIN THE BILL THAT ONCE
THEY'RE IN PRINT, WE'LL REMOVE
OUR I WOULD JUST LIKE TO THANK
THE COMMITTEE FOR ALL THEIR GOOD
WORK ON THIS AND FOR THE
CONSULTANTS FOR THEIR WORK AS
WELL. THANK YOU. ANYONE ELSE?
SEEING NÓ ONE ELSE WILL PULL IT
BACK TO THE COMMITTEE. SENATOR
STERN YOU HAVE QUESTIONS,
COMMENTS. BILL'S ALREADY BEEN
MOVED BY SENATOR HURTADO. BUT I
APPRECIATE THAT. OH WHA IF YOU
HOLD IT. SO YOU'RE MAKING A
MOTION BECAUSE NORMALLY YOU'RE
LIKE PULLING BILLS OFF. SO YEAH.
YOU'RE YOU'RE GROWING. YOU'RE
GROWING AS A LEGISLATOR. IS
THERE ANY OK? WE HAVE A MOTION
OF ANY ANY QUESTIONS SING NAN
CENTER, YOU MAY CLO I I'M GOOD
WITH ELATED URGENT. I VOTE SO
WITH THAT WE CAN CALL THE ROLL.
THIS THIS FILE ITEM NUMBER SEVEN
S¼ B 1366. THE MOTION IS TO PASS
AS AMENDED. UM, UM I WK WK I
ALAN, ALAN, I ASHBY CABALLERO
CABALLERO. I THO I LAIRD LAYERED
A MIN. M I NELO NELO I STERN
STERN. I WAHAB WAHAB. I 10 TO 0.
UH, 10 0 THAT BILL IS OUT. ALL
RIGHT. I THINK WE ARE WE DONE SO
I'M I'M TEMPTED TO ASK US ALL TO
POSE BENEATH THE CLOCK BECAUSE
IT'S NOT YET FIVE. BUT I'LL
FOREGO THAT. SO THANK YOU VERY
MUCH MEMBERS, RIGHT PRELUDES
WERE OH, WE'RE ADJOURNED.