Good morning everyone and
welcome and and thank you for
your attendance here today
really appreciated this is the.
Median at a hearing of the
Senate subcommittee on gas
electric and transportation
safety under the standing Senate
committee of energy utilities
and communications. I'm Jerry
hill I'm the chair of the
subcommittee. And I like to
start first by thanking the the
great city of Santa Rosa for
their hospitality and for
hosting us today we really
appreciate. Your combinations
and the other great warm feeling
that we've received here. But
also like to thank you the
members of this community so
greatly impacted. By the
wildfires this past fall. Thank
you for welcoming us here.
You're the reason we are here
today. Last week marks the one
hundred day anniversary of the
tragedy and devastation that hit
this community.
And we will not forget this in
Sacramento. As we work on
reforms in the coming months
ahead and years ahead. And we
will work to help identify and
hold accountable.
Any entity found responsible for
these devastating fires.
I want to thank your elected
representatives. For co hosting
this hearing today. You have
outstanding legislators in
Sacramento working on your
behalf everyday. Jenner's Mike
McGuire.
Center bill died will be here
shortly.
Certainly assembly members Jim
would mark Levin and Cecilia
Aguilar curry. In the local
representatives from the city of
Santa Rosa and cinema county who
may be here and I know senator
require will be introducing
them.
In his opening comments when we
heard reports.
The electrical equipment might
be involved where the fires in
your community had started.
We knew there needed to be a
thorough examination of why this
occurred. What cal fire in the
CQC investigations into the
cause of the fires are on going?
These reports do begs the
question. Are utilities and
regulators doing enough. To
ensure the risks associated with
our electrical equipment are
properly managed. Over two years
ago this subcommittee held a
similar here in examining the
two thousand and seven San Diego
fires and the two thousand
fifteen Butte county fire. In
Amador county. In at that time
the answer was no.
Not enough was being done.
So today we turn our attention
once again to the recurring
issue of utility wildfire
prevention.
Electrical power equipment
causes hundreds of fires each
year in California. These fires
can be exacerbated by drought
drive education in California
strong winds. In two thousand
and seven a series of power line
ignited.
Fight wildfires aided by the
Santa Ana winds scorched
southern California in San Diego
county. In twenty fifteen and
you'd county one of California's
most destructive fires was
caused by contact. Between a
tree and a power line. In last
year. The fire siege brought
some of the deadliest most
destructive and largest fires in
California history. Some of
which may have been caused by
power lines. While the root
cause of these fires is still
under investigation. What I hope
to get out of this hearing? Is
information on whether or not
utilities and state regulators
are doing the best they can to
prevent future fires. With
extreme weather events becoming
the new normal or vegetation
standards and line inspections
enough. Should utilities begin
de energizing. Power lines
during high winds.
What's the right balance between
public safety and service
interruption. This hearing will
bring to bear if we're going
we're doing enough to mitigate
the risks of power lines and
will provide us with the
opportunity. To hear from you.
About your questions and
concerns surrounding our
electric infrastructure.
I like it like to open this up
to our committee members.
For their comments.
We'll start with the senator
require welcome.
Since this beautiful district
center require nothing he so
much that I know I can speak for
all of us on the panel here
today about how grateful we are.
For center his work. Center hill
is just showing up here today.
He was active engaged out during
the peak of the fire storm in a
sort of say thank you so much
senator for your work. For
sharing your expertise which you
saw different situation but what
you saw in San Bruno and how
that is helped all of us. To
recover and rebuild we're
grateful for your work. And I
also want to acknowledge that
both. Similar reliving. Some
member would. Soon I get curry
and of course senator Dodd for
their unified front.
Sure you.
A unified front. Focus on making
sure that the North Bay receives
the resources to be able to
rebuild stronger than we were
before. In fact to day we are
all convenient our monthly
working group. With the county
of lake in the casino along with
cinema in napa. To ensure that
each county is bringing forward
the infrastructure projects in
the funding needs so that we can
work this.
Issue within the state budget.
And again I can't say enough
good things about the
individuals were up here today.
In for the team work that has
gone into this thank you so much
in honor to be to work with all
of you. Would like to be
introduced to individuals from
the county cinema and we have a
supervisor Hopkins who is here
today thank you so much
supervisor represents the west
county as well as rose an area
here in Santa Rosa and in the
end we have representatives.
From supervisors Zane's offices
well I think you so much
Michelle women who is here as
anyone Aguilar curry represent
will introduce here some
representation the county napa
in just a bit.
Mr hill just very quickly in
regards to some opening comments
of course absolutely.
Are.
I don't think there is a day
that goes by.
That all of us. Come close to
tears.
And this is been.
The worst disaster that his hit
our region.
And in our history.
But I have to say I've never
been filled with more hope and
pride. From green from.
The North Bay.
Because we are all working
together to ensure that this
community and communities around
this rebuild stronger than ever.
The size and scope of wild
environments in this state. Are
only getting worse.
The Golden State is truly facing
a new normal when it comes to
wildland fire and it's. I do
wanna knowledge of the gentleman
right over here today.
Fire. Because they have done a
phenomenal job not just during
the fire storm here during the
valley fire in two thousand
fifteen the clean fire two
thousand sixteen and also
knowledge. Offer local
firefighters as well.
Two thousand seventeen was an
unprecedented year for wildland
fire events in California. The
North Bay fire storm is now
ranked as the most destructive
and deadly in American history.
With forty four lives lost. In
some residents still missing.
We also saw the largest wildfire
states history the Thomas fire
in southern California. In the
mud sites that followed
tragically killing twenty one
residents.
As we look to this new normal.
Here in California. We need to
ensure. We need to make a
promise to residents. That
wildfire prevention is in on top
of everyone's list.
And what that means is the
legislature. The governor in all
utilities must be focus on
preventive actions to ensure.
That while in fires at what we
have seen here in cinema county
and throughout our region ever
happen.
The city California must develop
modern wildfire prevention
strategies. And this isn't just
focus on issues utilities that
is important area.
We need to ensure that we are
developing modern standards for
emergency alerts is well. But
now what we know is that. The
bottom line.
Is that.
What we've always done will no
longer work in the twenty first
century? Thousands in North Bay
residents have lost their homes
and businesses in many scape
these devastating fires with
nothing but the clothes on their
backs. And their families
safety.
And while there is an active
fire investigation taking place
there is absolutely no way. No
way that residents who are
suffering from this massive
tragedy should ever pay for a
corporations potential
negligence.
As we saw and we just heard from
senator hill. In November the
CPUC unanimously declared that
San Diego gas electric cannot
pass along the rate payers three
hundred seventy nine million
dollars of uninsured cost. The
two thousand seven San Diego
wildfires.
It simply unconscionable.
That if there is negligence
confirmed.
Right there should have to pay.
For hundreds of millions of
dollars.
In damage costs.
Ever suffered because of
negligence. And I want to point
out there is an investigation.
Currently taking place right now
I and I think we need to let
that investigation to the north
a firestorm play out.
Find it here just really
grateful to senator hill. Do we
work with you on your important
piece of legislation to prevent
casa negligence being passive
consumers look for to working
with all of you. In appreciate
all the work in all of you. For
your work here in the months to
come thank you. Thank you very
much senator.
What would as some member of
your career thank you thank you
center kill for of putting this
together patient here? Including
me today I'm obviously this is a
very. Tough time for all of us
were working really hard one is
sure you that at the.
Capital we are working on this
day and night and who would know
we were trying to. Figure out
the entire process that we're
going to be going through. I'm I
just wanted a knowledge I'm some
of those very instrumental
during this period of time for
now but was.
To people that are here today.
For someone acknowledge
supervisor Billy Ramos she was
the chair during that period of
time she worked relentlessly
making sure the information got
out targets Latino community so
thank you very much for
attending today it means a lot
to us. As well as my family read
again the deputy county
executive officer and thank you
again for attending I'm looking
forward to the discussion and
I'd like to get this going so.
You very much and now would like
to move to the great assembly
member who represents this
wonderful community.
Some remember what thank you
very much senator for convening
this today and about what we
were talking about the
temperature in little chilly you
will never find a warmer
community than this than this
community so. So welcome to our
community.
Cooperation we talked about you
heard a little bit about us here
on the dice working together.
Do provide mitigation
activities
such as vegetation management to
reduce the risk but giving the
exploding increase in
destructive wildfires is even
more critical.
Than ever that we know that
utilisateur everything possible
to prevent them.
The wild fires that occurred
just months ago throughout
northern California southern
California devastated people's
lives.
Whether it's losing a loved one
the home they raise their
families and the businesses that
were the hearts of our
communities our economy. We look
at the role the utilities paid
played in these horrific
wildfires we need to be sure
they're following the very best
practices I'm procedures and if
not.
We need to ensure that they do
in the future to protect
families businesses arm.
And make sure everyone is
protected so look forty hearing
their presentations are today
and continue to work on this
issue I will note.
The.
That wasn't very curse you hear
the governor speak yesterday
about I. a forest management
task force to look into how we
can prevent.
These fires in the future and.
That was I think that's a
really critical step for us and
I look forward to hopefully
opportunities for this group to
work closely with the governor.
Thank you similar would some
remember living.
Thank you Mister chair and Dodd.
Do want to acknowledge your long
standing leadership. You didn't
just come when we look at.
The subject matter today as as
been noted we've had we have an
investigation about the cause
and that is on going. And so
there's no one that's on trial.
At this time.
We have people that are going to
be providing testimony that have
definitely experience trials for
example the changing climate.
That we're living in and the
circumstances that can bring
these disasters closer to our
our families to our
neighborhoods that. The
firefighters that we depend on
our dealing with this change as
well as.
Difficulty in getting the
resources that they need and so
we're thinking about ways to
approach that differently which
I'm very grateful for we also
have. A regulatory agency that
has struggled to regulate. The
investor owned utilities that
their charge to regulate and so
I'm grateful to have a president
picker here to talk about the
reforms that they've been making
and how that approach will
assist them. To be able to look
at these issues. And. Next we
have on the agenda.
Those investor owned utilities
these I'll use. And.
They have inherited.
Eight a system that has been in
place for a very long time that
was designed when we were trying
to bring electricity to people
throughout California.
Many years ago. And to develop
transmission and delivery system
that is without was unlike what
we have today and with a
population much bigger. Living
across a much larger territory
then when these I'll use for
granted.
The monopolies that they have.
And.
What's not being talked about
today it's not on the agenda but
something that we need to think
about as we go forward. As we
deal with combat in. A climate
change and all of the impacts
that has for us and the changes
in our state.
I need to look at this model
differently. Are I'll use or
even municipal utilities that
are not. On the agenda today
that are here in this room. In a
position to actually manage and
stored bees service lines in a
way that they've been asked to
do over the decades. Or is there
a different model that we need
to look at to make sure that we
can make sure. That our
communities are safe so long
term policy makers and
regulators need to look at this.
And decide.
Some decisions about how we can
protect our communities in a way
that we haven't been able to. If
it's possible.
So again Mister chair thank you
very much for convening this and
I look forward to the
presentations thank you very
much and remember living timing
is everything senator Dodd
welcome. Thank you very much Sir
chair. I want to start today by
thanking us center hill for
calling this hearing today. And
holding it right here in Norfolk
County.
I'd also like to thank senator
Mike weir and are simply team.
For working on behalf of the
wildfire victims. Since day one.
Supporting victims and
communities rebuild and recover
is paramount.
It's a long road that working
together we will get there.
At the same time we need to take
bold concrete steps to prevent
future fires.
And avoid harm.
That's what we're talking about
here today.
Yeah this hearing isn't point
fingers were here to identify
best practices. In needed
reforms.
So we can prevent wildfires
before they claim more victims.
This year's fire season cost
Californians tens of billions of
dollars. Destroyed thousands of
homes and tragically took dozens
of lives.
While I was forced to evacuate
my home on the first night of
the fires. I count myself very
very lucky.
My home and family came through
safely but so many of my friends
neighbors and love ones. Were
not so lucky.
You can't see the fear and pain
that these fires of cost.
And sit by idly. And do nothing.
We have a moral obligation to
learn from the past.
He had to act.
Unfortunately. There is no
silver bullet.
But we can do better.
We must do better.
And we will do better.
As part of that effort I
introduced a bill earlier this
month. Requiring the electric
utilities to adopt comprehensive
policies.
And procedures for determining
how. When and where to de
energized power lines during
extreme weather events.
SB nine oh one would ensure
public utilities have a thorough
plan that is reviewed by the
public utilities commission.
As the saying goes an ounce of
prevention. Is worth a pound of
cure.
We know if we take a holistic
look look at fuel reduction. At
sources of ignition at building
standards in emergency alerts.
We will save lives.
I hope that today we can see an
earnest effort by utilities to
generate and support real
solutions. And we can have real
reforms that are adopted the out
here in our state. Before I
conclude Mister chair. I would
like to thank the men in with
what we have this opportunity I
don't know that we've done it
that much. The men and women
regardless of what is found out
about the fires ignition sources
in. It and everything the men
and the women.
Were present in cinema county in
napa county.
From PGD that were there day in
and day out.
Helping get our power.
Back on in our communities
throughout these.
Wildfire areas was. Yeoman's
work I had the opportunity to.
Visit one of those sites and
flew over the other one it was
absolutely impressive in the men
and the women that work at for
PGD every single day need to be
commended. Thank you thank you
very much senator Dodd and.
I do want to thank a. Center
require for the time he spent
with me and and that when I came
up in the. The days we spent in
that just.
Surveying the the the landscape
and.
Because you can't. You can't
get a sense of the devastation
and if you're standing in it.
Thank you senator required
before we begin with the opening
public comments we wanted to
kind of change the agenda a
little bit and then if you saw
from the agenda we're going to
allow the public to mix. Of some
comments initially to get a feel
for their thoughts and issues
that they may like to see
discussed before we do that. At
like two of a give a California
Jeez can him with that an
opportunity to. To give his
presentation on the twenty
seventeen fire season since he
has to get back as to its first
responder duties as chief
welcome and thank you again I
know we chatted earlier but. I
can't tell you how grateful we
all are for the great work
hellfire did and that continues
to do in protecting all of us.
Life and property throughout
California that you've got a big
job in you. The test was there
and you passed it.
Thank you and senator Helen that
thank you to all the committee
members and I I have to tell you
first and foremost that that. It
was you and all of your peers
that were directly engaged.
In this fire fight and now
they're continuing ongoing
recovery.
We have never felt more support
with. The legislature Congress
rolling up their sleeves and
working with us to get work done
that to help the people in
California and quite frankly.
Never meant more proud to be
part. Of California then I was
in the most challenging times
last year's so thank you.
Obvious thank you for the
opportunity to to be moved up
and rearranging the agenda.
Literally I it when I'm done
here will be going back to
Sacramento to meet with our lead
investigators on these fires we
had a meeting scheduled for
quite some time. To get update
on the status of the cause in
origin and that was critical for
me to not have to postpone that.
Obviously as we've heard to date
you know just how important that
process is to everything we're
gonna be doing going forward so
thank you.
We heard the governor talked
about it yesterday in in his
state of the state you've talked
about it. You know at length in
all your opening statement this
morning of two thousand
seventeen. Was the most
challenging destructive costly
fire season you know in
California's history really.
Eight of the state's largest and
most damaging fires occurred you
know just. You know within those
last few years. Up faster than
the the the Thomas fire inventor
in Santa Barbara as center
requires it was the largest
fire.
In the state's history.
.
We were facing a challenging
fire season even prior to this
October fire siege.
About mid year about July we
were already experiencing a
record number of fires in acres
burned we were well ahead of the
five year average. Just getting
into the summer.
Despite the the rain
precipitation that we had in two
thousand sixteen.
Conditions were still
critically drive from five years
of drought really what the
precipitation did for us was
great the significant. Growth of
grass as annual grasses that
fine flashy fuel all over
California from the desert of
southern California. To the
north coast in the Central
Valley in the foothills. That
was the killing and once the the
precipitation left in the the
vegetation dry down we were off
to the races with fires
throughout California. And that
never never stopped and. Again
when we reached you know what.
Were folks and are often lower
lured into is thinking that by
the time we reach the fall
months that were passed. The
critical part of fire season and
you know we're home.
We're home free and that's what
we not the case in California
are most destructive fires in
this state have historically
occurred. In October and the
fall months. So. Win this
October fires each kicked off
there in a red flag warnings of
fire weather conditions have
been protected. No we
collectively as a state and our
federal partners are local
government partners had prepared
for this we moved resources
which staffed up additional
resources.
We have deployed we were
prepared. But I don't think
anybody could be prepared for
the conditions that surfaced in
California on that night. That
Sunday night to you know October
eighth and I've got a handout
that I know are prepared in it I
think it provides a great
background information I won't
go into it in detail but I want
I want to get some of the
highlights that really paints
the picture. What occurred? No
for folks and that really
started in that Sunday. Night is
in the evening about nine forty
five when the winds were
surfacing across. Northern
California from reading to the
bay area from the Mendocino
cinema coast to this year as in
Butte Nevada and Utah counties.
We were I had weather stations
it reporting winds in excess of
eighty miles an hour. In many
locations and an often gusts or
skinny sustained winds to at
least fifty miles an hour in
many locations. So ultimately at
numerous fire starts occurred
out and literally over a forty
eight hour. Window starting that
Sunday night into. The next day.
We had over thirty six. Hundred
nine one phone calls to our
emergency command center in St
Lina one of twelve in our
northern region we had one
hundred and seventy two fires.
Are reported a wildland fires
reported again within the
region.
That the areas north of
Sacramento to the Oregon border.
Yoke of command center local
government command centers
everyone was overwhelmed with
nine one calls calls coming in.
Too you know for reporting this
emergency the hospitals on it
was
obviously a fire fight. And a
rescue operation for for many
many hours.
.
Ultimately there were initially
or their basic eighteen large
fires that resulted from these
one hundred and seventy two.
Starts and it was centered in
this area. From end to see no
napa cinema.
And a lake and then across into
tribute to an of Atta and you
but.
But as the next several days and
folded it really was centering
on a number of key areas and
certainly. Not right here.
In cinema county.
And and napa county just a. Out
to our east were ground zero
and.
For example that the tubs fire
the fire that burned here into
the city of Santa Rosa. On it
was literally four hours from
that point to at the time the
fire started. Until it had
reached highway eight one a wind
had burned into. The urban areas
in the city of Santa Rosa and
that's literally moving at the
pace of one football field every
minute and. While that may not
sound like a lot but when you
put that in terms of how do
firefighters out one people get
out from in front of that. To
how do firefighters have a
fighting chance to get around
that and contain it and protects
ruptures. But that was the case
of what was going on across this
fire siege across the the north
half of the state. So that the
machine is the system that
California call for me as well
practiced in. Your quickly
ramped up again we had pre
deployed many many resources but
when you have multiple fire
starts all occurring at the same
time under fifty mile an hour
wind conditions.
That quickly. Over taxes all
the immediate resources there
and so we quickly organized
resources. Are and move them
into figure using the state's
mutual aid system. Are and and
and brought resources in.
But again the challenges that
we see within four hours this
this the tubs fire was really
aligns with that mark west
springs that drainage coming
down mark was springs. And
ultimately. With the committee
of coffee park sitting right
there at the mouse of urban
conservation and fires.
Whirls and fire storm as it is
the dynamics of wind and air and
fire brands you know hitting
buildings in changing direction.
It is a very dynamic unique
situation that were. One of the
lessons learned we how do we
evaluate and look at what
occurred in the fire dynamics
there that we hope will help us
in the future understand. Better
fire behavior in those kinds of
conditions. Are but this was
clearly a situation that. We
quickly organized cal fire
deployed for about six incident
management teams. Are and broke
up all of these.
Eighteen which also became
twenty one fires under those
four incident management teams
that we can manage control and
get resources where they needed
to be. We.
Brought resources and not only
from other parts of the state
but several times early on
placed orders outside of
California. For additional
resources and ultimately on this
fire there were over seventeen.
States and the country of
Australia that provided
resources to California. With
old me over a thousand fire
engines almost two hundred
bulldozers and over two hundred
and sixty firefighting hand
crews. Were deployed in addition
to California had three incident
management teams type three
teams from local government and
our partners helping and deal
with the situations as you
recall very complex. Situation
and sensitive populations normal
developmental center up your
very challenging incidents to
take care of people and address
all of that within that. You
know ultimately. To hundred and
forty five thousand acres burned
in as you indicated forty four
recovery rehabilitation debris
removal.
All of those things for the
whole of the community to to put
things back and and again that
continues to be. The significant
effort going on here up. One of
those post fire issues that we
have really been learning a lot
about since the Bally fire in
the Butte fire from two thousand
fifteen is that. Emergency
watershed assessment that we do.
Because soon as these fires at
the stars were even contained
and we already had rain in the
forecast concerned about mud
slides debris flow. Of very
aggressive effort to working not
only here in Sonoma county but
with all the impacted counties.
To identify those areas where we
could. That's a mitigation some
place to try to reduce the
impacts of significant rain
occurred or if nothing else
provide. Warning and the
indicators when a we're gonna be
debris flow or mud flow of that
we can provide that notification
and get folks out of harm's way.
Out so that effort was on going
and again continues. As we go
forward.
Abed again no stops were pulled
out in the fire fight.
We had broken records.
In terms of the amount of fire
retardant. Delivered on these
fires from bases throughout the
region amount of water dropped.
From helicopters. It was
significant and again just with
this effort all agencies at all
levels of government providing
that response.
.
For folks may we thought we were
done in October and again
California this change this new
normal.
Things are becoming more
extreme fire season is your
round in in in and sieges are
becoming more frequent and more
intense. And that was proven out
about the first week of
December.
Again red flag fire weather
conditions set up over southern
California.
Offshore winds in that is that
Los Angeles.
Inland areas. As well as.
Center in Santa Barbara
counties. Very quickly in our
southern region south of
Sacramento to the Mexican
border.
Beginning on December fourth we
had one hundred twenty two fires
break out. Across the south land
again understanding and wind
conditions. Dry offshore winds
rapid sixty plus mile an hour
winds. And very quickly again
many of those hundred and twenty
two fires were contained but
six.
Became large a damaging fires
from Santa Barbara to San Diego
county we recorded. Relative
humidity is zero and one percent
and humidity is a key factor in
fire spread and fire behavior
along with wind and fuel. And I
you know I've been doing this
for a long time and when I heard
zero one one percent I literally
thought there were. There was
something wrong with the
instrumentation our firefighters
were coming back from the field.
Getting the same weather
readings of the weather stations
were getting and so. It was very
clear when we burn thirty one
thousand acres in that just a
few hours. On the Thomas fire
and the rates of spread it was
very clear that conditions were.
Extreme and we saw this we
literally the red flag these the
Santa Ana wind event lasted for
thirteen days. In December and
that is a record for California
we're not aware of that.
In in our knowledge that we've
had one for that long and so
what this all pointed towards is
that we are literally seeing
conditions that yeah we had fire
there is aviation. Was our
resources on the ground that
more fire engines getting the
maintained. Or just the
firefighters themselves and
stress is placing on all of our
of the system from our our local
government firefighters hellfire
and our federal partners. So
when all was said and done again
the Thomas fire became the
largest fire in the state's
history.
All right to hundred and eighty
one thousand acres and so during
this overall this year in
California in over ten thousand
structures. Homes primarily were
destroyed.
Forty six lives lost tool
between the two fires sieges and
that's certainly included cal
fighter of fire apparatus
engineer on the Thomas fire.
Who who died in that fire fight
and so these fires are not just
destructive? But they're
certainly a deadly so. As the
two thousand seventeen year came
to a close were still in fire
season in southern California
and the country is across parts
of the southwest still very dry
despite the rain. That we're
seeing and hearing northern
California so it is a year round
fire season and it has changed
the landscape that has to
change.
How we look at this going for
and I think we are governor
brown say that very clear
yesterday? I'm you talked a lot
about the cause and origin
investigations I won't get into
that much more but I understand
that that is very important for
us at the. Very start of these
fires we had a team of over
thirty investigators out looking
at all of these imagine when you
ultimately end up with. You know
close to thirty fires that this
team had to investigate. It's a
lot of work it's painstaking.
And as you indicated the.
There's a lot at stake here for
everyone with the losses all of
that and so we absolutely have
to get this right for everybody.
So again I'm going back this
this afternoon to get an update
on that.
We certainly want to get those
done as quickly as we can. But I
assure you when it does come
it's it's cal fire and our
partners. Expert and best work
going forward to put together
our best review. Of the cause
and that were gins of these
fires so again there isn't
anything more to talk about
their yet I appreciate where
everybody is at with this and we
will get back. With folks when
we have that information more
information to share.
But narrowing down to why your
here today that the working
California's role in working
with the public utilities
commission.
Not only in the fire threat
maps but the many other things
were doing work commission and
utilities in reducing hazard and
certainly reducing. The impact.
Of fire on the landscape.
And.
Certainly commit a president
picker will provide. Great
background today on the on the
information in the work that's
going on you talked about the
two thousand seven wildfires and
the rule making proceeding took
place from there. And president
pickerel certainly elaborate on
that at today but I want to talk
about your call fire has been a
part of this process using our
technical expertise. Ought to
adopt these fire threat maps and
that's looking at the fuel
hazard and risk out on the
landscape. Delineating
boundaries.
Proposing boundaries for this
new fire threat district where
utility infrastructure and
operations will be subject to
regulations again all with the
idea of reducing. Fire starts or
reducing the impact of fires
when they do start in these will
incorporate fire hazards
associated with. Historic power
line because information talked
about the future fire from two
thousand fifteen. Note we want
we're looking at all of those.
Into ranks this fire threat
based on other risks that the
the utility associate wildfires
posed to people and property. So
adjacency Wilander interface all
of that infrastructure how it
plays into protecting our build
community. Up the primary
responsibility for that matter.
Was delegated they're known as
the
independent review team and
that's really the core. Of where
this work has been done which
has led to so much of the effort
that's going on. We recently
signed hellfire signed a
memorandum understanding with
utility commission because. It
was important for us to be
closer together in engaging in
not just that this project but
many other public safety.
Related activities out where we
can land assistance with our
technical expertise and you know
the regulatory authorities and
responsibilities of the. Other
commission and so on you'll see
a lot more and hear more today
about that role involvement. Up
but the biggest factor and and
those out what is ground zero
here in Santa Rosa is the fact
that the factor or the impact
that wind has on while and fires
and as we know we talked about.
These micro wins these climates
what happened in mark west
brings is so key.
And so then are you working
group is reaching identified
that the need to develop a wind
map. And we really look to that
to see what comes from that and
how I can better help us. Out
look at the impacts of wildland
fire vertically at a smaller
scale or finer scale. And help
guide us going forward ma'am not
just here but across the state.
Has we look at fire in the risk
going forward so. I want to
close with you heard the
governor yesterday really talk
about no painting the path
forward.
The the the the forest
management task force that he
announced yesterday is going to
be key. OB it's no accident that
he brought that up in the
beginning ways to reduce the
threat from
wildland fires all the tools
that better manage force and
protect the built. Environment
that we live and work in.
.
Today the governor will
certainly announced the cap and
trade plan where we'll see the
expenditure plan. But certainly
the the the segment this
legislature in this
administration have been very
committed to investing. In fuels
projects and forest health to
continue the work that we're
talking about and I look
forward.
To continuing to see more of
that critical work.
So so much of what you're
talking about here today plays
right into this greater effort
that's going on and so again
thank you for the opportunity to
open today. Turned back to thank
you very much chief in a.
.
She ate that and I I've got a
couple questions and I think
others have a few before you
leave if we could. One you
mentioned and and certainly we
appreciate the hard work at the
dedication of the. Investigation
is ongoing do you have a
timeline of when you were
working that would be completed.
So I'm certainly hopeful that I
think I'll know more this
afternoon as we get get an
update.
The hopefully within the next
several months. This will be
will be reaching a conclusion on
many of these will certainly be
looking at a flow basis so I'm
not looking to have. To wait to
have everything released a once
these are independent. Reports
that will address each fire.
On its merits the challenge we
had was that.
.
It there were many of the fires
burn together and so you have to
go back and sort of start from
beginning and frantically look
at that you have to go back and
frantically. We actually
identified six more fires. In
the course of doing the
investigation because in the fog
of of the firefight that night.
Firefighters put fires out and
moved on to the next fire and it
wasn't until we reviewed records
that we indicated this fire even
occurred. I and so that means
going back and looking at the
cause origin of those fires and
so.
It's a complex process to ensure
we've taken. Account of all that
occurred. But I can tell you the
repeated the process is very
well along.
And we're just we're following
up on gathering additional
information so they can
complete.
Their report and sure everything
that they have.
It you clearly if they're going
to make an indicator in the
report that they've gathered all
the information Evans they need
to back up. What their findings
are in so I'm hopeful again out
without committing but I'm
certainly hopeful that this is
months not years?
And you know possibly sooner
but we're certainly committed to
getting this done very good
thank you chief of. It and you
feel you know you mentioned it
talked about obviously the
interactions in the relationship
between you and other agencies.
Of do you feel the state is
doing enough to properly manage
the risks.
And it by post by power lines.
I think that we learned a lot in
the last several years the last
decade and you talk about what
occurred on the fire sieges of
southern California in two
thousand three in two thousand
seven. We all learned a lot the
utilities learned a lot so did
the fire service in California.
Out we don't allot of work over
the last ten years.
The regulations would that
we're talking about today are a
key example of that. I think
what's happened in two thousand
seventeen is that president tire
new. Playing field of the risk
that's out there and what we
need to look at and I think that
we need to continue. The
dialogue I reason why we engaged
in animal you and the reason
that we're having the
discussions that we are is that
we need to continue to take
lessons learned. Are and and and
move for an employee that was
and I think that's the key here.
Is we learned a lot into says
September two thousand seventeen
about when the fence about
extreme fire but he's in order.
So we can identify where the
risks are and reduce that out
but I think we all collectively
have a lot of work to do going
forward.
Just as you said there's the
amount of risk out there. Ninety
five percent of fires are
started by people and it's all
sorts of crosses utilities are
just one of those we need to
continue working in all of those
arenas to reduce the number of
fire starts. Out but certainly
working with other utilities
working together with us we all
have a lot more work to do to
reduce this risk. Right thank
you I mean moves a questions and
I did not want to go first to
notice senator Dodd or some
member I guess Cury R. then
we'll go to look.
Center requires he's much I'm
gonna make it quick and just
some comments in chief on the
free to react.
As well I'm in Aswan energies
of fire to geysers hear from us
and was a part of the service
chiefs.
He and his force really saved
the city so grateful for all
your work Sir.
I'm. An issue of operations and
I'm I'm grateful that.
Center not brought that Ford I
think the speed force.
At teaching you came in.
After both the valley fire.
And on the north a firestorm.
Has to be commended yeah. They
were here a swarm in when you
saw. Other utilities.
Nine electric or gas and they
were the first so I do wanna say
hats off a truly for the hard
work that they did.
I'm into the hard working men
and women. I think that. Where I
I'm hoping that we're gonna be
able to focus is on that issue
of?
Active measures that we can
take.
In my own opinion I am not an
expert in chief you've been
phenomenal by the way not just.
Saying that because you're in
front of she really happen
tonight.
Is that I think that. Our state.
Has twenty century.
Technology in Canada the
resource is. With one of the
biggest challenges that were
facing down the twenty first
century.
I.
A couple items on that mutual
aid. I think we are flat footed
on issues of mutual aid we put
in forty two million for
Californie finally for local
government. That's a drop in the
bucket.
In two thousand sixteen we saw
record number of. Mutual aid
calls me on answered over six
thousand.
And I think that we need to
continue to focus on that I know
that center dots can be very
focused on is the chair of the
government organization
appreciate his leadership on
that. They can issue utilities
while we may have learned.
I think that the state needs to.
Focus on what we can do on
preventative and proactive
measures. And in whether that's
at the PC in. Look forward to
hearing from speaker thank you
Sir for being here in my only
concern the PC side I know Mr
picker with address this is the
issue of time.
At times when it goes to the PC.
It can be readily years.
In this state is not have that
much time to be able to enact
proactive measures to protect
our communities in this new
normal.
.
The other item would say is.
And appreciating the governors
focus on forest health. By we
are one thing away in this year.
From having an uncontrollable
firestorm.
I think you said in a previous
hearing it's. The worst.
At the potential worst crisis
that would be in your careers
history you had a lot of bad
ones.
But.
We have to move on that the
problem is.
At times with the state it slow
and we have to act with urgency.
And the only way to be able to
act with urgency is I think the
best. The best use of an
organization's mission is their
budget. If its priority
organizations will find it.
And we have to move on finding.
Mutual aid.
Advancing a modern standards for
emergency alerts finishing the
nine one one system. Advancing
rules regulations when it comes
to proactive measures the
utilities.
We have to focus on that force
health insurance.
We have a system of insurance
and again it was a different
side but. All comprehensive.
We're not prepared.
And. It is no fault of your own
as you've been asking for
additional funding but. I I just
bring that forties because.
This new reality in humble
county in two thousand fifteen
as a member what is talked about
this often. Is we had fires at
Christmas time in two thousand
fifteen in Humboldt County.
Which is one of the wettest
spots on earth.
I and we have a fire fighting
force that staff.
A similar to like we were staff
in the early two thousands.
Again.
Not at all blaming the chief
because he's been an amazing
advocate and so has a calf and
professional firefighters and
fire chiefs association think
how fires.
There are fighting force but I
think I just bring that up is.
It's comprehensive and we need
to move with a sense of urgency
chief I don't know if you want
to fire back at all. Just keep
it short at ditto you you you
you. Might what I say they say
it's a comprehensive package
that involves response but it
involves prevention involves
land use planning we need to
engage with every tool into a
box and we need to ensure. That
our ability to respond and
engage in these disasters
wildland fire particular.
Is meeting the current
challenge we're facing and we've
got a lot of challenges there.
But the same time we cannot lose
sight of the fact in areas we
have under invested in for
decades. Are these other
components fuels treatment fire
prevention the pre planning land
use planning and those are
always very difficult
discussions to have. Because
they cost money and and it
changes lifestyles that they're
very local base decisions. Are
out but it's key we now know
what can happen in coffee park
we had a fire burn there in the
nineteen sixties when there
weren't. People now we've had a
fire burned there with
catastrophic.
Results and this can occur
anywhere in the state so we've
got to use that as a lesson
learned and not make. It make
good decisions about everything
and invest in discussions states
committed to working with our
local officials. To land use
planning to help us get. To the
next layer when you do win
investing and
so we have fire safe communities
going forward. My last time.
I miss.
I think we need a change of
culture.
There is a huge fight. About
spending money on the front end.
But we're literally spending
tens of billions of dollars on
the back end after we see that
after we've seen six thousand
homes burned their foundation
sent acceptable.
And I eighty etcetera dog gets
in regard to prevention we have
to change our culture is. In
move towards finding
preventative measures. In. A
reactive measure when it comes
to our fire fighting force so I.
Read it why would hope as were
entering into a budget season
that there is going to be a
unified front. On many these
issues and we don't let politics
or time get in our way.
Thank you senator McGuire up and
thank you again chief we
appreciated the and that we will
be looking forward to hearing
from. The rest of your staff.
A little later this morning to
thank you. Thank you very much
appreciated avoid like to do now
is open the.
The microphones to some public
comment to.
To offer some brief statements
that you get some idea no this
is your community and no one
knows it better and also no one
really knows the.
Some of the ideas the thoughts
perhaps the question should like
us to to address as the at the
hearing moves on so I'd like you
to keep your comments to two
minutes we will be monitoring
that. And so that's about ten
people if we can get this
morning will have public comment
afterwards as well so he didn't
get an opportunity you will have
that after. And also what it
knows that there are no cards
are currently available to those
that wish to write down
questions or comments you may
have. Of two for us to ask the
panelists who are here we'll be
happy to do that to show raise
your hand and our staff will
will a. Hand in the audience
will hand you a card and they
pick that card up a.
And collected from you so at
the end of the the panel
presentations will have another
opportunity as I mentioned for
the public to comment so. If you
would I guess we'll start and on
this site please welcome and a
good morning. Thank you very
much.
Hello to all a decorative there
is. Certainly I want to talk
about my concerns about the
electric power grid.
I had the opportunity to be
down.
In San Francisco and go up into
one of the PGA any buildings
that has a weather central. So I
certainly hope that they're
monitoring the weather that
night will be looked at as part
of your investigation.
It was a rare opportunity to get
up onto the sixteenth floor.
Certainly I am concerned too
that Pacific gas and electric is
run by Ross child. Who is one of
the global bankers globally as
well as Edison international?
They shouldn't be very important
to also investigate. Because
there are plans you can look at
the Ross child announcement. To
restructure. The northern
hemisphere.
And this is on their website
they're setting up offices in
Silicon Valley. And they are
involved in restructuring
through resilient policies. I'm
saying the word resilient all
over cinema county now a big big
Billboard there where the fire
jumped the one on one freeway
there's a word resilient. Well I
would invite everybody here to
please look at resilient cities
look at the fact that the
resilient cities are being
brought into North America. By
Rockefeller and Ross child. In
the controls over all of our
resources are part of this
resilient plan. You can't make
this stuff up it's on their
website and they're telling us
very plainly. So what I'm most
concerned about is that you will
be blind sided by the very
policies that you're not aware
of. Indoor aware of. But I can
only say that my experience in
public forums and in attempting
to be on community.
Discussions has been met with
the word consensus. In the only
way that I was ever able. To be
on one of these.
Controlled by facilitator
boards was if I agreed to the
definition of consensus everyone
needs to look that up. Thank you
very much thank you comments for
being here today Sir good
morning. Good morning.
The representatives of the
people city county and state
I've been asked to come here to
represent the voices of the
voiceless. And to represent the
unrepresented in our community I
know hundreds and hundreds of
people friends and family have
lost everything and getting no
satisfaction whatsoever. My
background is investment banking
I spent twenty five years on
Wall Street working as a
research analyst and I started
looking into a lot of the.
People that are rebuilding the
resilient city here and going
through and I've got a. Question
for representatives of. I'd like
to ask Mr died he said we're not
gonna finger anybody today.
Again again representative hill
you're saying when you get to
the bottom of the liability.
And I'm sorry.
The.
Represented a worker for the
public higher for the public a
chief of him what. Cal fire it's
been over a hundred day Sir
they're still nothing to say
about the sixty four fire
started in nineteen Alex not
just a few. All started without
any weather starting okay. In LA
they had over twenty five fires
from Santa Barbara San Diego and
not one person in the fire
department could tell us how it
happened. So I don't understand
why we're getting into this. I
also want to bring into the fact
that there is Anderson the owner
of the press Democrat. Higher
tapped to use the word. Female
former femur actually James Lee
Witt. James Lee Witt runs eight
E. six visa program to bring in
people for five hundred thousand
to a million dollars to bring in
people overseas to rebuild. And
our partnerships together in the
can what investments for Mister
Anderson to rebuild Treasure
Island six billion dollars would
let our co. Lead our corporate
of the largest homebuilders I'm
asking you why it is someone who
has a disaster capital profit.
That made over eighteen million
dollars in the third quarter see
core holdings the with o'brien
is being loud in here to profit.
From these disasters these are
what the people would like to
know. And I've got ten more
seconds and you people please
look into resilient cities their
part rebuild cities right here
agenda twenty one this is what's
happening to our communities
thank you. Thank you very much
if you could give us your name
winter previewed it.
So representative of the people
as I stated all right they
should call snow mechanic
alliance we have four hundred.
Members of businesses
individuals profits non profits
and.
I.
Like probably every one of our
members. Had a my mother lost
her home so it's affected
everyone of us in the county as
everyone clearly knows.
Couple messages I want to say
today one is.
It I know we're talking about
not the response but this
response was tremendous.
By cal fire in and what we all
know PGA any.
It took nine or ten days before
we were permitted to go visit my
family's property that we knew
it burned hadn't weren't
positive.
But by the time we were
permitted in the entire
infrastructure been replaced on
new polls the old winds that
were down were out. It was quite
amazing I drove by the response
on stony point road pretty much
every day it was put together
instantly traffic well
controlled and when they. Left
that area.
Within twenty four hours of
leave it you had no idea they
were even there and it was an
enormous site the PGT put
together I think a lot of people
need to be commended. For the
response. My last comment is
when we talk about best
practices and new rules and
regulations.
I. Remember hearing similar to
this in more supervisors chamber
I think is twenty fourteen.
Ginny had applied to the board
of supervisors to trim.
Dream ray throughout the county
under the transmission and
distribution lines and hearings
like this a lot of opposition no
you can't cut the green or you
can't cut the greater you can't
cut the greenery anywhere. And
that today I think led to maybe
some of these problems so my
request is if we're coming up
with new business practices.
Let's get them in a mandate form
so the special interest cannot
stop them and we do the right
thing at the right time thank
you thank you for the comments
appreciated. Ma'am more high
good morning. My name is
Patricia hanky on a local
contractor and about three years
ago I contacted PGD about the
problem of workforce development
and how there's a. A lack of
work force for the trees
industry and our nonprofit
started a program that our
training sixteen to twenty four
year old use. And learning how
to.
Be in the construction trades
and actually start a career in
construction and because P.
Jeannie partnered with us to do
that. Now our trainees are going
to be part of the rebuild as
going to take place you don't
spring and summer and also are
you there learning how to
install fire resistant materials
for our homes three of our use
lost their homes. And now they
have the chance to not only
rebuild their homes but also
homes for everyone else and
cinema county and our
contractors think teaching me
for that because we desperately
needed workers to be able to be
able to build. As quickly as
possible so I'm here today to
think PGD for their partnership
and for us to be able to
continue to help us rebuild take
place in a timely manner so.
Thank you.
Good morning Sir.
Good morning my name is hunter
stern I'm with.
The California coalition of
utility employees and I B. W.
local twelve forty five we
represent Ginny workers.
As well as he told workers
throughout the central northern
California and pretty much every
utility in the state of
California.
I want to know Mister chair
that the that the queue the
queue was not invited
participate.
It's not. Essential but it's a
little perplexing given that our
members are the ones that are
operating and maintaining the
electrical infrastructure of the
state.
We. Appreciate the kind words
from all of you about our
members work there were over
forty three hundred.
Twelve forty five members
responding to the.
To the disaster.
And it's important that we keep
that staffing levels so that.
Whether it's P. Ginny Addison SD
Jeannie LADWP the utilities can
respond to these disasters
because regrettably there are
more and more frequent Tom. I
think chief Pimlott. Described
exactly what we're looking at
and we agree a hundred percent
with looking forward that we
have to be proactive we are
actively.
Queue is actively pursuing
legislation to make. Them
infrastructure more resilient to
react. Not to fires but to what
we've learned so that we can
actively prevent them and reduce
the likelihood the fires because
the fires were started in calm.
But when they do that we can
respond even more quickly and
more effectively thank you for
the time thank you very much air
pollution control district.
Where one of thirty five stater
districts tasked with monitoring
air quality in implementing
their pollution controls to meet
state and federal air quality
standards to protect public
health and safety?
Our jurisdiction is in the
northern part of the county.
Today I like to share with you
how the north may well fiery
vent negatively impacted air
quality in artistic communities.
During the North Bay fire the
district had monitors operating
in Greenville Cloverdale in
Healdsburg continuously
measuring particulate matter or
smoke in the air.
These measurements were provided
in real time to the public. The
district's website work company
by EPA's air quality index which
translates the air quality
measurements into easy to
understand health advice
immense.
So at any time the public could
go online see the measurement to
get a health advisement.
In addition to providing real
time air quality information
during the fire the District
Court and with the county public
health department. State and
local emergency responders and
neighboring districts to share
information and to issue public
health advisories.
Our district. Enjoy some of the
best air quality in the state
for example. Typical measured
values for twenty four hour
period are five to twenty one
micrograms. More than fifty is
mixing the state standard for
public health.
During the events the fiery pain
we had eleven twenty four hour
periods that exceeded the state
standard. And three that
exceeded the federal standard if
I could I'd like to submit. For
your review we have just graft
the data that was measured and
you can see the magnitude of the
impacts with the air quality
index the chose. The magnitude.
Of this.
Recognition of wild fire smoke
impacts on your quality of
public health is important.
The state of California and the
federal clean air act recognize
particular matters right here
pollutant that have standards to
protect public health. And
safety and in conclusion we ask
you to please include the air
quality concerns and local air
districts as part of the
solution. In managing wildfire
threats. Thank you again for
appreciate that and the work you
do. Good morning Sir. The
morning of my name is Ryan Solti
hydro five hours to be here this
morning with you guys I'm from
North Fork.
Which is in the heart of this
your National Forest.
.
Before I go any further I would
like to think how fire I have
friends whose homes are still
standing because of the work
that your men didn't put their
lives on the line and we are
grateful for that so thank you.
Every summer we we there's this
sort of doom feeling that we're
going to burn to the ground.
It with what's going on with
beetle kill it is just a.
Stressful time for everybody in
our community one of the things
that you guys have already done
you you've about. An ounce of
prevention being worth more the
park here.
.
There is a power plant that we
are currently constructing and.
Vomit program SP eleven twenty
two that you guys signed up you
guys are doing preventative
things already. And our
committees are excited about it
we've worked diligently it is.
A lot of volunteers have been
hundreds and hundreds of hours
for this project we are part way
through construction.
We would like to ask that P.
Jeannie play by the same rules
and laws and all the rest of us
have to. And part of that has to
do with getting our power
purchase agreement.
We want the option for our.
Pricing and we have yet to get
that contract from P. Jeannie
and our community members are
excited about this project
they're grateful for the laws
you have enacted. And.
We would just ask that the.
PC compel peach need to abide by
the laws the rest of us have to
which is SB eleven twenty two.
So.
And again thank you for what
you guys are doing it for having
this hearing today. Thank you
thank you very much appreciated
thanks for that driving this
morning. Good morning ma'am good
morning good afternoon almost
afternoon this is Christiane at
Arlington I'm with the plaster
county air pollution control
district as well as the
watershed research and training
center. Both of these
organizations are located in
high while fire prone areas the
Sierra Nevada and the Trinity
Alps we have a high concern on
with these issues and we like to
talk with you. Today about
greenhouse gas emissions in
particular I'm not sure you're
aware but when California is six
US celebrates his three million
metric tonne reduction in GHG
from all of its programs. It's
it's a small comparison to the
twenty two million that were
emitted by wildfire in the same
year.
Okay and so all the work that
we're doing it carbon all these
programs that were doing each
war is dwarfed in comparison to
what happens from our wildfires.
I have handouts up here from the
US Forest Service and other
research that's been done so if
you want to take a look at the
statistics and information is
available out here. We need to
do more prescribed fire in
California and we need to do
more fuel reduction in
California that's the type of
work that we really need to see
done. And what when we do that
work we need a place and a way
to get rid of the wood waste
that's produced. That's why our
districts like mine support bio
energy as a solution using the
wood waste for electrical
production or other types of
uses weak. The waste would does
not evaporate it needs to go
somewhere and renewable energy
is a great option for it. The
other thing that a renewable
energy reduces is not just the
CO two from wildfire but also it
reduces the black carbon. That
is also release that's not even
quantified in all this work yet
because we're just starting to
understand the serious
implications of black carbon
which is PM two point five. It's
like so it it is a very high
potential for greenhouse gas
it's a climate change precursor
it's a bad it's bad news. And we
need to reduce it and will and
bio energy can do that we want
the CPUC to recognize its role
in supporting renewable energy
that includes bioenergy and
would waste as a source of
power.
That's what we really want to
push and it's important there
are a lot of other options but
this one is our current tool
that we have now. So we hope
that we will continue to support
that thank you very much.
Good morning Gregory Stangl
with.
Phoenix energy and so hopefully
I'll be I'll be
shorter.
Senator Dodd talked about an
ounce of prevention.
Our company has offered this
state through the SB eleven
twenty two program hundreds of
thousands of metric tons of
prevention a year. And the only
thing that stands in our way is
P. G. any refusing to implement
the law that you pass. We talked
about accountability we need you
to hold them accountable it is
my experience and we've worked
from Japan to Norway to South
Africa it is never been harder
for more expensive than to do
this right here in our home
state of California my home. And
so what I ask of you is to pick
up the phone and call the CPUC
and ask them why they're not.
Compelling PGA need to
participate in the program and
to call PGM eat and ask them to
explain why they are not
participating in the program. If
you review the record you will
see from the. Day that program
was implemented a cavalcade of
excuses piled one after the
other after the other never all
of the objections at the same
time. They wait till we win the
battle and then they start the
next problem and we win the
battle and they start the next
problem this must end. And it
will take you wringing their
switchboard that's what works
thank you very much and and we
are.
Grateful for you holding this
hearing thank you very much are
final morning first.
Opportunity speaker.
And then we'll go to our panel
and then we'll continue the
speakers after we finish with
the arrest of the hearing to
thank you running good morning
to the other seven with a bio
energy association California
senator. Hill as I require I
really want to thank you for
focusing on prevention. The
legislature passed Senate bill
eleven twenty two five and a
half years ago in part to help
prevent wildfires that requires.
Fifty megawatts of small scale
new forest bioenergy facilities
that can take the forest biomass
either dead and dying trees or
forced biomass is removed to
reduce the risks from
transmission lines and other
utility infrastructure and. To
protect communities not not one
not one new project has been
built in five and a half years
PGD hasn't even signed a
contract. And now is refusing to
sign contracts for these
critically needed facilities the
legislature has spoken over and
over and over again to this
first with SB eleven twenty two.
Than SB eight forty numerous
other laws budget allocations
the governor included this in
his emergency order on tree
mortality issue three two and a
half years ago. He called on the
PC to accelerate the development
these projects and accelerate
their connection to the grit.
And the QC needs to do more to
get these projects built and
hold the utilities accountable I
also have some specific
recommendations for the
legislature. First of all one of
the arguments we hear from the
PC from the very top is that
wildfire is not a rate payer
issue. Which I think that the
recent one country fires other
fires this hearing. Kind of
prove that that is absolutely
could not be more untrue. That
rate payers pay huge impact for
these wildfires asked as the
general public. In the cost of
fighting on the the. Impacts on
rate payer infrastructure
etcetera. And I think that the
legislature needs to speak to
that issue that clearly wildfire
prevention is a rate payer issue
they because. So thank you
again for this hearing.
Thank you very much appreciate
those comments and we will
continue the public comment
afterwards and I just wanted to.
Introduce supervisor Hopkins is.
Right behind the speaker of
their supervisor Hopkins welcome
thank you.
For being here today.
Sonoma county.
All of you and and also thank
our governor for focusing in
emphasizing the need to address
forest health.
And I am very fortunate to
represent the fifth district in
cinema Connie I wish did not
burn this last time around but
the question is not whether it
will burn in the future it's
when. And how severe backfire
will be out if you know anything
about old timers in west cinema
Connie they like to talk about
how bad things were back in the
day and how I got it really easy
right now.
And the one exception to that is
that everybody says that the
Forest right now is in the worst
shape that they have ever seen.
We've been struck with a sudden
oak death we've been struck with
pine board beetles and droughts
and so we have so much Ted
standing timber was county is
truly a mask box ready to light
on fire. And there's a
tremendous palpable sense of
fear in the community after the
catastrophic wildfires in
October.
I'm one of the challenges and
the north coast in general is
that we have a highly privately
owned forestland and it's also
highly personalized.
Someone who owns twenty or fifty
acres can't possibly go through
a secret process to conduct
sustainable forest management on
their land for acts that is
also.
By.
Change thank you so much for
coming out to cinema county
today and thanks for your
attention to our forest thank
you supervisor popular thank you
for the. The suggestion in the.
And the commitment to working
on the force management because
I think that's where the focus
is that's the new paradigm that
we're looking at today so. Thank
you very much for that.
Now let's go to our agency
panel with a public utilities
commissioner commission
president of Michael picker and
safety director Elizaveta
malashenko. And cal fire
representatives Craig McFadden
and Daniel Berlin's a thank you
very much for. Coming here today
and and willingness to
participate and share some of
your information will start with
the UC president picker.
Thank you without I want first
first pay my respects and in
honors the work of the first
responders our colleagues from
cal fire but also the local
firefighters and respond yours.
Also the C. H. P. local PD the
sheriff's all the people who are
on the on the front lines when
these when these kinds of
disasters occur. We spend a lot
more time with the P. you see
looking at disasters. It's not
our nature to actually be on the
frontline but we certainly see
their work close up and I can't
tell you how much I and it's
it's it's it's. It's a
it's a testimony to Californians
and their purse perseverance
that we do.
Persist through the pain and
rebuild the communities.
So.
I'll say that that we're seeing
more and more this at the public
utilities commission de
commissioner Peter and his most
senior so public utilities
commissioner as she starts yours
her six year.
Told me that she believes that
one of the challenges the job is
it every year seems to bring
seven new type of disaster. Is
not that we don't prepare for
them but the scale of the
severity the granularity defeats
our resources in and frankly our
ability to prepare.
It out but.
As each of these events becomes
our immediate top priority.
It demanding time energy that
we have to divert from other
work.
She points.
To just a range different
things that have have caught us
by surprise from the sudden
closure of nuclear power plants
are located in week portions of
the transmission grid gas
pipeline explosions. And control
leaking underground gas storage
wells and highly fractured
formation.
Right in the middle of a growing
population in LA county.
Droughts floods mud slides and
now what looks to be a year
round fire season almost
statewide this is this is
somewhat daunting.
And again we prepare for
arranging hazards and and I'll
discuss some of the efforts
we've up when deployed to
mitigate the risk of fires.
We must Dodd be prepared to
prevent fire where the root
causes may point electric if the
structure is a source of
ignition. Or where there were
fires ignited from other sources
Kandahar to harm the critical
pull Senate electrical and
telecommunication service lines.
Failure of electricity and phone
service is itself a hazard.
As people here can testify in
the in the failure of the
marriage communication system.
But I have to say that having.
Participated in this for four
years M. I'm personally scared
that.
The scale severity and
frequency of major disasters
particularly storms having
looked at what we saw in.
In.
The and where the Commonwealth
of Puerto Rico as well.
Some of it's likely to be linked
to climate change couldn't Kevin
always overwhelm are.
Planning tighter rules and
resources in Sacramento's we
prepared for for a bigger and
bigger floods. We spent money we
spend a lot of time improving
our our our emergency rules we
do spend a lot of time looking a
critical infrastructure we did a
lot of land use planning. But we
always know that however much we
do there's a bigger storm coming
it's in the historic in the
geological record prison bigger
think that they're having a
little trouble hearing maybe we
can move the microphones a
little closer.
Sorry what is this better that's
much better thank you.
So I I do this that ferocity of
this year's windstorms and
related fires here just duh con
beyond past experience
particularly here in northern
California.
So.
.
You know one of the very
important ongoing efforts at the
public utilities commission to
spin to rebuild your strength
and are a safety enforcement
division. I won't go into all
the efforts.
Since.
On. Our director the division
lease offensive malashenko is
joining us for our lost her
office in Los Angeles will speak
to this.
A but I have to say that this is
actually one of our most
important stat steps was to hire
very effective fuller competent
division director help being
build a team of specialists. To
focus on putting safety.
Right up front that this is a
challenge for the public
utilities commission as I look
around the country were one of
the few. Reagan economic
regulators public utilities
commissions are state.
Of public services commissions
that has both the economic
regulation and the safety.
In most states there's actually
a state safety agency that gives
direction when I met earlier
with my French colleagues. There
absolutely dumbfounded Ted both
of these functions were in the
same entity.
There their general perspective
is when the national safety
agency tells on the something
should be done. They just put it
in rates.
Here at the P. you sitting.
Because were eco.
Later we open a proceeding we
assign a judge reassigned a
commissioner. We have a scoping.
Process where we look at all
the issues were going to
consider we call for
participants parties an
intervenor stood to join us. We
swear the man they have to to
pledge to participate and then
we'll litigate everything
justice if we were all awkward.
And that we have more checks and
balances than the California
environmental quality act in so
Senate McGuire I think that
speech to your your your comment
about.
Speed we were not designed to
be speedy.
We were designed to slow things
down so that everybody could
participate and we could get to
all the records that we needed
to deliberate as.
Sort of a on bonk of judges to
form the best duh policies.
We are just not designed to do
that.
And as a matter of fact when a
former president sought to move
things along in a.
In a on in the rate making
proceeding. Tried to cut corners
you created enormous scandals.
So this is a tension that that
is above my pay grade I share
the frustration.
But I don't think that it's up
to me to change state law in the
state constitution unilaterally
so I look to your direction on
that.
So what we do in that case.
How do you get around that?
And we don't have a lot of
expertise on.
On fire in know we getting
better on on these things.
We form agreements with other
state agencies.
So for example in underground
gas storage where we don't know
much about anything that happens
thirty foot feet below the
ground. We form de a working
arrangement with the division of
oil gas and geothermal resources
that's bounded by a memorandum
of understanding the clearly
details how we will use their
expertise. To help us move along
more quickly.
In the case of.
Of vegetation management
related to the electric
infrastructure we have an
agreement with.
With.
Count fire and I think that's
actually helped us to move more
quickly because we can try on
expertise.
Rather than having depend on our
parties to provide that they can
give us as they did with the.
With the vegetation management
and the fire map program a paper
and we can say okay so rather
than litigating from the ground
up. We're gonna start here.
And that's been helpful but I
don't know senator that's gonna
that's gonna that's gonna
address the scale the severity
and the frequency of the kinds
of disasters linked to climate
change or just to were. Chance
that we're starting to see.
.
I will say that one of the
things that I discovered and
they think is very important is
that we don't really have a
clear picture of where all the
wooden poles and and and and
transmission lines are.
Particularly distribution lines
the thin wires that serve
sometimes individual houses are
clusters of houses.
We don't know who owns them
always we have a pretty good
sense there abouts eighty
percent of Rome by the
electrical industries. We don't
have a good central database
that we can look at their
updated conditions.
What's attached one of the
classic problems you have with
with wooden poles which connect
every house.
Every building.
They are every community in the
state of California with their
communications in their
electricity. Is that they're
colocated.
And we have numerous incidents
at all point to the Malibu fires
where people illegally attach
their equipment to those polls.
So without some way to add to
the auditing function and have a
true enforcement tool.
Were were always gonna kind of
fine things through the
inevitable Tom on a violation
that comes to our attention.
Were from were refining some
new re.
Issues for enforcement which
been lacking when telecom
equipment has been well managed
to or I. hasn't changed over in
a timely fashion from older. And
weaker polls two new polls.
That's pretty common that you
C. buddy pulls his kinda hanging
in the air.
We need to really be able to
deal with on the leave that to
director malashenko. That is
going to talk about what I think
are the larger challenges. And
this is this is what scares me
the most.
Her more more people are moving
in to high fire hazard areas
that's been pretty constant
those anybody in spin and local
government can tell you the
green fields development is
cheaper and related to housing
affordability then infill.
There nearly four million
Californians who live in and now
live in the high fire risk
hazard areas defined by the new
hire fire hazards map.
That's ten percent of
California's population.
It's much
greater population than ever
before.
So at the same time.
Well let me just say that when
you move into those those new
communities and high fire hazard
areas.
We require the utility under
state law to provide access to
infrastructure.
Particularly tele to city.
So as people move further and
further out into these higher
fire hazard zones.
They have to have electricity
they have to have
telecommunications.
That means that no matter how
good we get.
There's an inherent risk.
And that risk increases as more
people move into the fire hazard
areas.
There that the the size of the
fire risk has grown pretty
dramatically the previous
firemen up by known as the
interim fire
threat maps covered thirty one
thousand square miles the new
map. More than doubles that at
seventy thousand square miles
that's forty four percent of
California's León mass.
That's forty four percent of our
land mass.
The new map also includes the
California tree mortality high
hazard zones which are an
additional nine million acres
were about a hundred and twenty
nine million trees have died due
to drought and and bark beetle
infestation.
So again when people move
further out into these high
hazard areas Richard growing
their need for and demand for
electricity communication
infrastructure.
Continues.
So. I worry. That.
Some one point four million
housing units are within these
high hazard zones.
We estimate that four point two
million wooden poles and maybe
another three hundred thousands
steel poles in nearly two
hundred thousand miles.
Of overhead electric
distribution lines cross through
these expanding hire fire hazard
zones to to serve these growing
populations.
Now argued our new fire rules
recently adopted finalized are
the toughest in the country. And
I will say that they're going to
be expensive to implement.
None of the rate payer
advocates supported them.
We can get better at setting
the standards we can get better
in enforcing that we can bring
new tools into like a
centralized database that we can
use to assess the greatest risk.
War to use to be able to
assemble spot checks to to to be
able to test our audits of.
Utility infrastructure.
But with expanding fire risk
with the growing populations in
those those fire prone areas
ongoing requirement server
infrastructure they carry some
residual risk no matter how good
we continue to get.
A and de all of which is it risk
to fire Morrell more and
frequency Firestar's perfect
safety is going to be really
hard for us to reach.
And I that's why I spy I
personally am very fearful.
So we're grappling with this new
on normal but I gotta tell you
is the governor was dead on when
he said yesterday you can't
fight nature you need to work
with it.
So.
That means rethinking wherein
how development happens.
So that we don't get required to
build inherently risky
infastructure to serve those
communities.
We need to we actually have
issued permission to San Diego
gas and electric to on interrupt
service in.
In areas where they think that
the wind hazard in the fire
hazard could cause.
Faults in potential a risk of.
Of fire initiation.
But we haven't done that
statewide because in the past it
wasn't believes that you're
going to have the intense wins
in northern California that we
were seeing in southern
California.
So we're gonna look in organism
takes a question.
Back to Sacramento for meetings
today.
Alright we'll perhaps then we
should ask some questions.
Who maybe you could we have?
This motion echo testify in her
comments if she has some and
then
we can ask. The two of you
questions with that work for you
Olympic rodeo probably ask you
question I had a answer some of
the questions.
Resume but amino up or find
answers ask questions now a I've
known anxious about time so okay
start to wiggle your toes
knowing traffic usually. Yeah
days of.
That's the one of and.
So let me somewhere else as a
question.
Right.
.
Summer went by.
And then I have it as we as we
look at some of those the larger
issues here I am I am.
Curious.
.
That has a list of people talk
about biomass energy and and the
passage of SB eleven twenty two.
Of five plus years ago and we're
still waiting for some
implementation of that as we try
to manage our force better and
we have to find a place for this
fuel.
Tom I just I'm I'm stunned that
we are now the legislature acted
signed by the governor and move
forward on this and yet we're no
closer to doing that. I thought
my bill that was passed in two
thousand sixteen to enhance some
biomass opportunities that has
not been acted on for
regulations by the PVC now cleo
fifth what fifteen plus months
later.
Was was frustrating but now
here this this is you know
enough about five years.
How we going to deal with yeah?
I I'm I'm just frustrated.
Well that my former job was to
actually expedite the sighting
permitting interconnection of.
Renewable energy projects
so I'm not I would say that that
from my experience there these
are always going to be tough
projects they are in parts of
the state where you don't have a
lot of nearby demand. They're
usually at the end of the St
line they were if where where
biomass facilities have been
most successful. Have been where
there is an existing they'll
sawmill. That that is actually
doing some kind of value added
production but they also use the
electricity and heat from the
biomass facility to make those
products.
So that indigenous demand
becomes very important.
No further you are away from the
man than the more you're likely
have the infrastructure problems
in terms of beefing up the
transmission lines to get the
electricity out there. One
megawatt plant at the end of the
thin transmission line.
Just
doesn't work without some
changes this is just part of the
challenge we had elsewhere in
terms of two way power.
A so I won't go into all the ins
and outs of that we spent a lot
of time working on these
interconnection issues and we
actually brought somebody and
specifically to deal with in our
connection issues has been
knocking these problems down one
by one. Assay that the latest
barrier that I've been wrestling
with his we've been sued by a
company that was denied a
contract for a different
technology.
Alleging that all of these
contracts are a violation of the
federal public.
Utilities.
Home.
Purpose.
And this is that this is
something that the national
sociological ito regulatory
utilities commissioners is
dealing with.
So I'm not familiar with the
specific contracts that people
are complaining out there have
been some successes.
The conditions under which
people have been successful is
indigenous demand and.
And positioned well within the
grid I can't again it's hard for
me to speak to these individual
projects but I will say that
right now all of the reimagined
potentially all the bio mat
projects could be held up by
this lawsuit in the federal
courts.
I. judges are more concerned
about the regulations that go
along with this.
You can't even get to contracts
if you don't have regulations
and so that's.
As we're looking at tools to
manage the bigger picture here
we have lots of regulations
that's the that could be the
problem.
I think you're much.
Mister Cooper things for
testimony.
I D. sure my colleagues concerns
about.
At the speed by which you're
able to enact these laws and
regulations that tighter charge
to promulgate. As a regulatory
agency I. as much speed may not
be expected.
When we're talking about how we
better prepare our state.
There is I think I hope for her
age in a strident efforts.
I'd to. Enact these protections
side as best as possible.
And.
This goes to a bit of a non.
What I. directly related to in
my opening remarks?
Where we do have changing
circumstances in our state with
climate change with people
living in the wild and urban
interface?
With.
The challenges that.
All you some of these have to
meet. Our climate change goals
and competition.
And that that the systems that
we have in place.
That may have worked enough in
the past.
But didn't did work completely
out whether it's because of
mother nature or because of
negligence.
That.
Perhaps those models no longer
work.
That sat in fact the system that
we have.
Has created a. Electricity
providers are in fact.
Too big to succeed.
And we should be.
I considering. When confronting
climate change and the growth of
our state. And D. threats
to life.
That there maybe new models that
we need to employ.
And I no that's.
Pretty big change I it and the
systems that we have.
But it's something that we
might need to start thinking of
what those future models would
be.
Some remember I am not afraid of
change M. not afraid of giving
up both just thirty your
jurisdiction I tried die
mightily to get rid of some
transportation functions that
are pretty much John no longer
monopolies. We were only
partially successful I think
that is you dig deeper into it
it's gonna require legislation
may be constitutional changes
I'd be happy to work with you on
that. I share your concerns
about the process and the amount
of time but I will just say what
one of my up political science
professors told me long long
long ago was it was exploring.
Why it took so long to do
affordable housing in the state
of California and the challenges
that you could bring?
To projects in sequel he said
the goal of democracy is not
efficiency.
And I I have to I have to live
within the law so you if you can
help me to figure out how to do
it within the law or if you can
tell us what changes you can
make within the law.
I I'm I'd be happy to share my
thinking with you.
Thank you much Mister chair
Pacific risky to C. Sir thanks
for coming up as well.
So just a couple of items regard
it specifically are on the issue
of electric utilities and
there's just
or questions regard telecom it's
wise wanna touch bases.
.
Need to focus in on that as well
when it comes hires.
So look I think both of us go
back and forth saying Hey the
legislature needs to be able to
advance reforms we have the
expedite.
And then out I can come back as
a PC needs to be able to advance
reforms IBM expert I think the
bottom line is if there is a
mutual agreement. That we need
to be our expert I let's sit
down figure ways I can do that.
The bottom line is six I. I
don't think time is on our side.
I am what the governor said I
think two or three times
yesterday. And I'm going to
paraphrase you can fight mother
nature but mother nature will
always win.
Which means we need to be able
to adapt to our normal.
So there are ways to be able to
expedite. I working with the PC.
And candidly working with the
constraints that you have
because they are pretty
significant.
I M. and also working with
utilities.
To advance solutions I think
that it that needs to be done
this year.
Bob and I also understand you
have a. Gamut of issues that are
in front of you now that you're
working through.
I'm at the the challenges.
I understand that you when you
mention about the public
participation process.
I think the challenge the public
participation process is that if
you're not a formal intervenor
it is very difficult for you to
be on participate.
And I'm sure that is a
challenge yeah but it's law. I
get it and I've also share my
frustration to them very
separate issue on all issues of
water districts but it credit
what is it is what it is I'm not
gonna go there today.
So.
Well we know.
That got the disasters that we
had. Continued to stare step
stares down because it's gonna
happen again.
We're gonna need to be able to
figure out an ability to be able
to advance reforms in the coming
months.
So. Aimed its ugly head on
resolution.
Identified here today but I
would like to get to do is.
Sit down with you and I think
everyone else on this panel
would like to get a sit down
with you. W. talk about how we
can move reforms that will
protect our communities because.
It's not just about new
development.
Copy part is two miles into the
city.
If you live in Larkfield. Or he
wouldn't have a park where you
always side though if I. Just
have a competition I. because of
last night. Release that we are
gonna be hit with an earthquake.
There is no way in hell that we
thought.
At thirteen hundred homes we
burn down. I. Inkatha park it
was impossible.
There's no wildland interface.
It's a.
Across six lanes of highway.
And there is a lot of pavement
in between coffee park in where
that fire came Calistoga.
So I think that.
The reason I advanced that is.
I understand you're you're very
focused appreciate that I. While
in fire interface and
development within those zones
or I think arming normally is.
The size and scope in the
severity of those wildland fire
Gaines now come in and threaten
the entire cities that wouldn't.
Just ten years ago would have
never thought incident this
could happen in. G. reaction.
Are I hear assure your sense of
urgency and.
I welcome your pledge stone
shackles from this dead weight
of.
For historica practices dippy
you say it's you know it's it's
not going to be simple but I'm
happy to explore. Itsekiri
support I also believe I I think
that taking a.
A narrow view.
Up on this issue.
Because of what the state has
just gone through in regards to.
While in fires here in the North
Bay while in tired.
In southern California that's
where I like to be able to start
nozzle and be realistic that has
to be a narrow view to be a
star.
Because I don't think this is
going to be.
A a question is that this is
typically true and in other
parts of us state and local
government and if you start to
move down there this pathway
once.
Seek to expedite duh policies
and projects that can reduce
risk and a hazard of.
Disasters.
E. you know at some point you
have to to start to expand the
the Rangers sing C. you're
dealing with I'm I'm up for it
I'm not I'm not trying to to
argue with you I'm just telling
you that. There's.
Our wherein in many facts maybe
a independent state agency but
we're still a state agencies who
were bound by the rule of law.
You are the is.
They agents of creating those
rules.
Absolutely in her the ones that
have to live by those rules of
theirs and obeying you're the
ones that know the rules the
vast so if there are reforms you
want to be able to propose I
welcome a discussion.
I see where the experts in those
rules the one item that I would
add Mike to be to bring up is
the issue of telecommunication
services and infrastructure and
this is a comment that was
asked.
Give me a question that was
asked.
On. In what your thought is in
any Skinner reach here but it
works and just you know my
responding regards the telecom
services and infrastructure. And
receiving local direction
ensuring we rebuild. Adequate
reliable resilience services and
infrastructure.
.
We had major challenges during
the fires we thank you very
responded telecom site. That's
that was a big issue in eyes
overweight nice district I mean.
Assume there what it was all
over this issue in Willits
having multiple conversations
and people.
So I'm a separate some of the
their challenges in two
different pockets and one is
that we have a really weak and
inconsistent regulatory
oversight of telecommunications.
So anything is done by a cable
company generally is governed by
give Kerr. Which is essentially
a registration program they pay
us.
You know fifteen hundred
dollars a year and that's it.
Tom does some of their legacy
telecom commute.
Providers that have.
A historic monopoly mom but
which is no longer in effect
because of thigh changes in
federal law and federal
preemption I. theft C. C..
Have have a we have a little
more weight over them.
But not not a lot de in and
that the reality here is that
the that the telephone providers
and the cable providers both
provide the same services under
different laws.
They provide. Of phone service
date both provide duh
entertainment content in the
both proved provide inter inter
internet service but they're
all.
Under different rules.
Then you have some small.
Phone companies who that are
fully regulated.
Because they get a state site
Ben to support the services to
those large rural communities.
The nexus probably were out of
all of this is that they're on
polls.
Arm and the question is how do
you armor those polls.
Because under grounding.
You know in a Hannah in a rural
area me the is cheap is a
million dollars a mile. Urban
settings ten million dollars a
mile.
End under grounding prolly
undercuts the next five G.
technology.
But given that most people don't
have land lines anymore the
probably about duh about eighty
percent of the population just
has cellphones.
That really calls for attention
to both fibre to.
And.
Electricity service to those
those polls.
We've had some discussions with.
Yes with whom we have a I am a
member and of understanding
their priority currently is to
really come up with a redundant
system for for emergency
operations communications.
The challenge of trying to come
up with a really resilient and
strong system. On those two
hundred thousand miles of polls
that go through those fire
hazard areas huge sort of
beggars me. I will say that one
of the things that I expected
some point here is we start to
see the emergence of five G.
technology very high speed fast
broadband.
That's a broadcast technology
you Canada grounded.
Those places were we've
underground electric wires.
Communication wires are prolly
gonna be the hardest to actually
get five G. so if you live
someplace in a slightly rural
area and you have a autonomous
vehicle. And all of a sudden hit
the limits.
Of that system you're gonna be
pushing your autonomous vehicle
up the last two miles to your
driveway.
I expect that these are gonna be
those same tensions that I
pointed out to you between the
desire to move further out. The
desire to have phone and
electricity and the inherent
hazards.
So I I I I'm still we struggle
with us the three hundred
thousand steel poles that the
utilities have been and
installing two to carry their
their distribution and
transmission.
Services and in are mostly high
fire hazard high wind areas.
That may be part of the the
solution they're not perfect
solutions but they're probably
better solutions. But again four
point two million wooden poles
and two hundred thousand are
miles in the.
In the high hazard Firestone's
the cost starts to be an issue.
Pacific me speaker I'm grateful
you're here in the for the
composition that welcome to.
So let's think of a future thank
you very much center require.
.
President Egan the. You have it
contemplate thinking about some
of the the comment you made and
you have some.
One's death questions but.
You're talking about it in the
the six years there's a new.
Dynamic going on a change that
your calling shared with you
and.
That's a thing Sir.
Moving in a different direction
I. I also think and I'm hopeful
that in
if you see.
We're seeing that that culture
shift that.
Over the six years released in
four years your tenure.
That we didn't have before I
mean safety and.
And I look at prevention in
areas of prevention part of that
safety culture.
And.
I think what we've we've where
the* she was confronted with
was that and I've said it before
the safeties not sexy and.
There's not a lot of interest in
doing that and hoping that.
.
We see that change.
And that that that
prioritization and and it does.
Remind me of of one cents to and
and that was a of a comment made
to appear on my colleagues that
there's no we don't sense a
sense of urgency.
Coming from the P. you see.
On or in reflection from what we
saw in October and December.
In California and that's.
In I guess if the feeling is
what what will it take.
To.
Turn this into something that
that we can.
Really do something.
So I. sometimes I think that
unites our agree on what safety
culture means and sometimes I
think we talk past each other.
So for me.
Culture and organization in
particular safety culture isn't
the things you say it isn't the
thing so you think it's the
things that you do on a daily
basis.
So is having a a. A very clear
set of.
Of of goals and objectives
around various.
Issues
having.
Good ability to write Tom on
very specific.
Programs by which people
operate.
And so I told you early on in my
my when I was looking at the P.
C. in trying to understand where
we had safety culture that my
experience with the.
With the real guys told me that
we actually had.
A safety culture but it was
mostly distributed in outside of
the central organization.
And so what I with the evidence
I saw is those safe those real
guys knew what to do they've
been doing it. For years to get
it both for the rail companies
but they also had been doing it
for regulators around the
country. They knew how to go out
and look at tracks
they knew how to look at at it's
because that's we do look at the
tracks and we look at the
crossing guards.
Is very clear to them how they
did that and so the the most
specific artifact that I saw
that was when they train me. On
how you go out and look at track
we your outlook on a track he
has somebody look it up when he
has somebody looking down. And
then you somebody looking at the
track
in the job of the upland in down
when people is to make sure that
you don't miss a train is
coming.
They also tell you not to step
on the track.
Get greasing your boots.
Greece's slip hazard as well as
just this hazard standing there
on the rail.
So when like a stupid
commissioner I stood on the
track
the first thing that I. realizes
though this is what they just
told me not to do. I was a
violation of protocol.
But what I noticed is that
before I even had a chance to
step off the track. Two people
were already moving.
To grab me and move me off the
track.
So that kind of muscle response
in terms of safety that
understanding of protocol and
procedure and process.
Having documentation of that
process is important. The next
thing is how you learn.
From what you and other people
C..
So you can adapt and I will also
point to what I saw. In this the
real guys.
These are they're pretty crusty
they're older they've been
working out there in the in in a
walk in every mile of the track
every year.
Doing their inspections.
They're out in the field there
in San Francisco they were
talkin to all their
colleagues around the country
about bahkan crudes.
And they knew that there wasn't
a lot of Bach it's easy for of
volatile bahkan crews coming to
California the time. Because the
refineries can't handle very
much of it did has its distinct
impacts on the pressure piping
in the in the process is in in
the refineries.
But they have a sense that if
they kept looking they could
start to see where they were
being changes made in refineries
and different kinds of. Answer
structure that could be used to.
Except or barking crude here in
California.
So they stepped outside of their
normal experience based on what
they learned from their
colleagues at three sixty view
and then beginning to actually
look for evidence of it. And
they found two facilities are
being constructed a riff.
Refiner there's really being
rebuilt in Bakersfield any
transfer facility outside of
Bakersfield.
And the news and this is the
route the bokken crude is gonna
take getting in the California
so they double down on their
inspection.
And then they began to raise the
issue getting authority to
actually inspect the rail
bridges that serve those
particular alliance.
They actually get a very good
job of looking at all the
informal crossings.
And where they needed to
actually get some kind of formal
permitting for.
For say were tractors and and.
And duh on trucks crossed the
road rail lines off of the state
highway system.
So I pay tribute to that that's
safety culture it's what you do.
Not so much what you think and
say well so they had all the key
marks they had processes.
They had documentation they had
training. They had constant
communications looking for for
new conditions and they had the
ability to go out and begin to
mobilize their resources there
like Deronda. I think we're
doing that and I'll point to
this the the overalls.
Improvements in our our our
pipeline hazardous materials.
Branch
where we have move significantly
in an estimation of the fence
and specters in terms of how
well we're doing.
So I will say again were one of
the very few state programs.
And were actually one of the few
regulators economic regulators
so I think it runs counter.
To our tradition of acting is
economic regulator first.
And then a safety agency Sakha.
So I point to these artifacts
I will not argue.
They're we don't have a long
ways to go but we're working
against a hundred years history.
And you're working against the
previous administration that had
basically no interest in safety
is I saw actually previous three
three.
It I did want to say that there
is a concern about the adequacy
of of the culture that we're
talking about in the.
Annual report from the office of
a of safety advocates it was
released this month the director
mentions in the report. Having
to justify regular in depth gas
and electric utility safety
training to be conducted first
Beth. Would you say that that
maybe a silo did issue within
the CPUC.
A concern only to. Say and the
safety enforcement division I'd
think that we have silos within
silos within silos I think that
to two issues the you point to.
This is that justice.
As size safety at one point in
our history had not been sexy M.
wasn't attracting the top.
Skills within the organization
and I pay tribute to director
around division from within the
CPU C.
M. without.
But nobody really wanted to do
with administration and CPUC
everybody wanted to do energy
policy we had the energy crisis
we had the drive to to bill
green nobles and we had the
drive to build infrastructure to
get carbon out of California's
economy.
That's where the where where we
got them the most promising an
excited people out of California
and Dodd national universities.
We have worked really hard for
the last three years to be able
to meet our hiring goals and I'm
proud to say that we've gone
from about a twenty two percent
vacancy rate. To sixteen percent
vacancy rate over the last year.
You know some of that is.
Is just the straight got out on
a work of.
Going through and figuring out
what each division was doing at
how they were doing it some of
that was training some of that
was actually outside consultants
that we borrowed from the
department of general services.
And some of that was new
leadership who actually has gone
through it held everybody
accountable on on HR.
Contracting which is one of the
reasons why it's hard for us to
get the training we need is is
remains a problem. And I think
that that. The auditing agency
Israeli of how this accountable
to the fact that perched off in
San Francisco.
We for last twenty five years
haven't really kept up with the
changes in contracting rules and
in their in state government.
Sir were recovering from that
the hope that we continue to
make progress on that.
It is the the office of safety
advocates did is it we know
she's getting started but it's
not been part of the of fire.
Safety proceedings at all is
there now we had almost no
safety advocacy participation
except for the U. utility
unions.
Which which tells me that one of
the places where we need to move
and out Janet spit prolly works
against the overall goal of
moving more quickly and more
efficiently. But it's absolutely
essential is how do we get
better.
Intervenor is how do we get
better parties how do we get
people who actually will talk up
safety with other state agencies
you that expertise so that we
can elevate the starting point.
And it's very true and that's
that's the one that has worked
I. me nicely especially with the
head of the fire mapping.
Hannah and I guess in looking at
the fireman up the the urgency
that the CPU she I believe put
towards.
Finalizing that after the
October fires. I in the
preceding the firemen
proceedings in the updates to
fire safety rules that came out
of your decision.
That the one nine zero twenty
four you were the commissioner
charge of that of.
I'll just I'll just say that it
was much more of an ensemble on.
Action and I give a lot of
credit to the teams that Dachau
fire put together because that's
where the two expertise resided
it and you did mention in that.
Active trying to look at what
the next steps are in that fire
map proceeding.
You mentioned that the fire wind
of map issue and and I guess the
issue of. Here the concern was
raised and chief up Allen
mentioned that as well where I
guess the concern is were hoping
it will take ten years. On earth
on fire map.
Corwin map that would come up
in.
Submitted till the time the
commission cannot rule on the
adoption
of new when loach standards for
utility and Roth commercial.
When. Can be a problem with is
that. The next steps in that in
the house we think we have some
existing when alone standards
the question really is where do
we reach those conditions within
the state now say that some of
that could be so. Moved along or
quickly allow I cannot I cannot
promise that we will either have
the technical basis for will
have a smooth will have smooth
sailing through our our
regulatory processes.
It is really driven by what
I've learned in you probably
hear more from.
About C. India go gas
electric's work after the two
thousand six.
Which we Hedo in rice fires.
They believe that they had never
seen wind speeds
de is consistent to within the
then.
On what they experienced during
those fires and they felt like
they had been caught by
surprise.
So they speak money
putting new Adam on a tree when
the wind speed meters and
meteorologists
studying those developing new
for new win model maps. And then
actually beginning to manage
those those circuits real time
and so we saw.
Because we had actually given
them authority to interrupt.
And to de energize circuits
already. That they were very
carefully applying that trying
not to to to.
Shut off five power to us to
fire stations to police stations
and therefore erupt
communications services and
internet services.
And to make sure the hospitals
were served there also somewhat
aided by the design of the this.
System in east county San Diego.
Tom.
Because there's a lot of
parallel lines and there's a lot
of rain.
And networks as opposed to radio
C. just go out from the central
station.
But I think that that's somehow
model we have to look at and
study in that they if in fact we
can build on that.
That may be helpful to us
because it's pretty clear
they've got better
meteorological data and better
Vader.
Fire response than anybody else
it's I visited that site is
phenomenal did that how much.
.
Did wind and the issue of when
was it considered in the
development of the fire map to.
I'm going to defer to the
experts.
You know yet we can I think we
put it aside to some extent did
this year of the de la I don't
want to miss speak but I'll try
to be brief. Primarily people
looked at fuel.
And where there was
infrastructure and population.
Not so much a wind
and that's one of the reasons
that we think we need to go
further.
Okay thank you and good a few
were just a few more questions.
Couple I actually this one no
one the main criticisms that was
raised during the last
subcommittee hearing that we had
in twenty fifteen on utility
while fire safety.
With the lack of CPU C.
oversight in utility prevention
and mitigation efforts.
As a result of legislature
passed in twenty sixteen to
require utilities to file risk
based mitigation plans that
require CPUC review. And compels
compliance ought audits he
conducted where is this if you
see in implementing that.
That legislation.
So this goes to de as you point
out your paper that fact that we
tend to bifurcate things in
terms audits enforcement.
Are witches who is largely in in
the hands of safety enforcement
and rate making so most of that
I think is really been doubtless
in rate making real our
expenditures.
So it may be worth examining
those fire prevention plans in
light of what we've learned this
year because clearly they didn't
take into account the conditions
that we're finding.
I don't want to say that they
weren't sufficient for the
assumptions.
But we're finding new commission
consists conditions should we
begin to treat them differently
within the CPU's say.
So I that's I'll go that far no
Toni think we need to have
conversations and I probably
will learn more about it as I
did back in.
And in one one final question I
just wanted to.
Talk about any you did that.
M. them.
You mentioned in the joint
concurrence on the San Diego gas
electric Wiener case.
A concern around that the new
oneself line D. entries they
entered energy station.
That you mention.
Just a little while ago. You say
the decision of whether to de
energized powerlines in a region
in response to a catastrophic
event. Such as a wildfire is
significant
because it implicates public
safety broadly.
Even within the M. O. U. with
fire hellfire cal fires
responsibilities are to provide
expertise among other things. In
mechanical engineering utility
design and testing
who is providing the electrical
engineering fundamentals.
Put an end to to this
conversation and and why is the
commission allowing utilities to
make these decisions in
isolation.
And and what are your which
your appetite for protocols
rules around such engineering so
P. could you be more specific
about which specific decisions.
I think these are the decisions
the.
Decision on line. D. energies
Asian. Will again mmhm like guy
many other folks who testified
here were caught flat footed by
the kinds of wind speeds that
we're seeing in northern
California we based on past
experience knew was a
challenging east. County San
Diego.
So on I think we'll be looking
at that that's the purpose of
our safety Armonk next duh next
week is to really dig into these
questions and so what are the
guidelines what's worked so far.
What should we start to see in a
more a uniform program how do we
begin to apply that? I don't
know that to engineering is is
hard but a lot of this is based
on practical experience so if
the if the peace C. doesn't have
something to look at. No we
don't have that there are
experiences elsewhere in the
world but nothing so
comprehensive what scene Diego
seems to devised. So I think
we're gonna be looking first and
foremost to see what's
applicables M. out from that
elsewhere in the state of
California and for the other
utilities.
They're good thank you any other
questions.
President Viktor.
Very good.
Thank you very much Jeff for.
Coming up hopefully that give
you enough time to get back to
us hopefully yes but thank you
very much appreciated I look
forward to. Hearing your plan
stone Shackley.
Yes that sounds about.
Thanks.
That's a wonderful idea and and
and I.
Again no.
Want to commend you for the
changes that we've seen. I won't
say that there isn't good
Republic policy reason for my
staff to constantly advised me
that it's not good to do things.
So rom having those those
internal checks is certainly
good and I think you'll hear
from lots of other people that
is probably a good have external
checks.
But thank you very thank you
very much president picker.
If not check a welcome and thank
you for. Your patience and the.
And for for the work you do.
Looking for additional comments
and then we may have some
questions for you.
M. thank you it's a thank you
having me here today would you
mind if we take a two minute
break the heads and think quite.
Make it through hueso stony.
Just don't Senate reception two
minutes I think that's a
wonderful idea. Will take a two
minute break.
Joel Mike enough of. Five minute
break.
Hopefully.
Yeah.
So if you don't think you.
Thank you.
But I've read it what
Scott what happened when I did I
did think.
Yeah but I have.
He's not.
Yeah you know who
the
I.
Order we could.
And.
.
Appreciate the out the
opportunity another suggestion
for a a couple minutes great.
But we did want to continue on
this motion go thank you very
much is the director of the
safety enforcement division at
the California public utilities
commission.
We appreciate your work and are
looking forward to a. Your
thoughts this morning or this
afternoon thank you.
Good afternoon and.
Thank you for the opportunity
to speak here today home.
I also want to acknowledge the
very direct and personal losses
experienced the by and residents
of Santa Rosa and thousands of
people and I. California.
Home I also want to thank the
first responders the
firefighters law enforcement's.
Allen and all.
Volunteers go through the at
community emergency response
teams the red cross and many
other organizations.
When it comes to safety we all
depend on one another and now
everyone can make a difference.
At home as we heard a lot about
this morning now we face great
challenges says the state of
California and the areas of
safety. Al specifically
wildfires that we're focused on
out today.
But so I really also believed
that Saddam as great of
challenges we face were also in
the best possible position. Out
Sufis and address those
challenges O..
I think we have all of along its
at our disposal to really face.
Gnome.
You know the issues that we have
and there are solutions.
That we can put employees
to.
Get ahead of this issue and
prevents.
These kinds of go.
Crises.
In the future and that's what I
hope to talk a little bit more
about how with you have today.
I leave the safety and
enforcement program at the CPU
C. which includes oversight of
utility and rail infrastructure.
At the primary mandate of the
safety M. Forsman group is to
assure compliance with
applicable state laws the CPUC
regulations and some programs
arm also enforce the federal
laws and regulations as well.
Out this work is primarily done
through audits infrastructure
inspections and welcome and the.
Incident investigations
in the electric safety program.
We conduct about fifteen to
twenty comprehensive audits a
year these last.
At least a week and about half
of that time is spends in the
field inspecting infrastructure.
Of the group also conducts more
than three hundred
investigations of incidents and
our customer complaints.
When we find violations this
different types of enforcement
actions that they C. PCNC pew C.
staff can seek. Arm including
assessing finds all fifty
thousand dollars per violation
per day.
Arm while the compliance work is
at the center of safety in
enforcement program it's only as
effective as the underlying of
regulation safety enforcement
the wood
generalist recovered all of
electrical of gas. Knoll
telecommunications
infrastructure for the entire
state of California and with
twenty six people doing that.
Tom.
So we've gone from from that
model seven years ago to now how
mean dedicated electric and
safety groups
el all were gas branch is no
bigger than the combined no.
No utility safety programs used
to be and we've also been
seeking stops no to grow a world
like trick us safety program.
O..
Just one year ago all over a
little over a year ago we had
fifteen people in the now
electric.
Facilities groups of those
fifteen people were providing
safety oversight for the entire
state of California all of
electric actually
telecommunication facilities.
And.
Where Z. el in increase in the
kind of risk that we're seeing
in the challenges though being
discussed around fire prevention
we just knew that this wasn't
going to be enough? So by
working no.
With CPU C. leadership a
department of finance and
members of the legislature we
ask for additional resources and
were actually granted those
resources O. all last.
Year of this past summer. So
now our program has grown from
fifteen positions out sue.
Over thirty five.
Home soon be very busy hiring
and training those people that's
more than doubling of our all
over staff of that's taking
place right now and were also
the knowledge of being hired and
sit in the office the mob Gaines
Buell unlike headquarters in
Sacramento and San Francisco.
Needs of people who spread
through the entire state going
to be going out there and and it
it and inspecting infrastructure
and assuring that the utilities
are complying with all of these
new regulations and policies
that are being adopted.
.
By the commission in the
distance of the increase in
staff owe the commission is also
granted additional enforcement
tools home to the program of
prayer two of the. Last couple
of years the only way that it
the electric safety program
could calm.
Issue a of flying in against the
utility was to bring informal
proceeding adjudicatory Keast in
front of the commission's those
of major cases taking years to
litigate the very resource
intensive. And take up a just
from with with the
signature of the director
utility has appeal rates bites
elm it it greatly accelerates
this processor when now evil.
To seek L. much faster home
enforcement actions we actually
did that last year old with
issuing a point three million
how fine. Oh to Pacific gas
electric four buttes I'll fire
that was done house through the
Sheik teaching program my agency
services those of us
who close partnerships that
we've been developed over the
last few years. And all those
really whole elm in terms of
both resources access to
knowledge being able to two
investigations concurrently.
Would Butte fire investigation
for example we didn't have the
memorandum of understanding in
place yet so a workgroup had
sweets for cal fire to complete
its investigation issue public
report with them had the same
report does the public did. In
yeah where is providing
expertise to
us around fire home.
Investigations of hellfire
spread and we're able to assist
cal fire with providing
engineering.
Knowledge in the electric
system so it's a pretty well it
think very important partnership
that's not only Gaines hopeless
accelerate how we do
investigations. By L. really
allow us should learned lessons
or bought more quickly and then.
Jointly I'll figure out actions
that we can see based on that
information to make sure that we
put measures in place to prevent
those incidents from taking
place.
Well.
In the future. Of so with that
balm ace it I am generally
optimistic about please our
enforcement program
has more than doubled we have
new enforcement tools we have
state partnerships and agencies
working together like we've
never had before. All the
technology in the knowledge is
there from well you know boys
from work that companies such as
D. genie has gone insane G. ago
but also. Now all globally well
we've found.
Being the bulls cal fire in the
peace you've been working with
so Westralia on lessons learned
therein with Canada said the or
best practices out there there
is progress no Chico I think
what we'll do
is maybe.
Because some of the questions I
have heard Kenneth.
Taylor to both the hellfire but
hellfire and a. You're you're D.
agency so I didn't know if enemy
introduce first.
.
Assista region chief for the
northern region department of
forestry and fire protection
greatly Fadden great thank you
very much okay. There they are
there Hannah.
It's very Richard Crenna Candice
needs it name their action now I
know.
I figured out Verda everything
we.
We had.
Thank you very much appreciate
that. It is different if I could
on.
Couple of issues.
The M..
.
I I thought it was interesting
we're talking about the
expansion in our that
California.
Small shake of the issue of.
Where California's unique in
that we have?
In for safety enforcement
division.
And I think.
President picker also indicated
that that may be unique in that
in the world in fact because
they've separated safety.
From the.
Financial or rate setting up
operations of of their.
Agencies.
How do you think he was or are
you?
Perhaps suggesting that they
should be separated.
From the PC which should have a
separate safety division.
Or a separate entity
organization different
reporting.
Different dumb leadership
perhaps then.
Then having it
combined with them with rate
making.
Home.
I was not intended by my
comments to bow to indicate one
way or the other whether the
yeah. Safety and rate making
program should be housed in the
same agency our. It think there
are different models out there
home as far as. The comments on
the and specifically on the
safety electric safety program
elm. I I don't believe that
there are well similar programs
that are housed elsewhere so
it's log that you know that
they're not necessary part of P.
you she's a thing that type of
work. Is generally are just not
done that the distribution level
nationally if you really look at
indeed sell I think the your C.
states addressing maybe some
specific issues. But even
federally and all of the
vegetation management's rules
were put in specter's auditors
in please
going out inspecting
infrastructure issuing citations
and doing investigations. All
would never come I have.
Reached out to all the agencies
in you wear and sort of done
research on it elm unit we
typically find that the things
that we're doing in California
home are at the forefront. Of
Anthony of the states.
Okay. Thank you I should have
asked him that same question
know when he was here. You
mentioned in tow and I'd been
highlighted a number of times
the M. O. U. that's been
established right before the
October.
But it was new for the October
fires and we've had the December
fires.
The up and you you mentioned is
Marchenko the issue of
coordination now during
investigations.
Couple questions in that how how
is that.
Relationship couldn't.
Formed is since that M. O. you
and are you currently working
with cal fire in the
investigations of these fires.
Hello I guess all Startin needed
Daniel you can add to it down.
It's. No Mister Berlin L. talks
with W. D. Palmer a single
Muslim daily basis so you think
you can really personally alma
testify to hold clues that
relationship is. Now over level
of coordination is really being
on the on the daily beast so
worthy October fires on the
December fires. All bulls on and
assessing it Roy is so happening
on the ground all. How being our
inspectors go out jointly with
cal fire sharing information
about the knitting excellently
related information again there?
Part of first responders so
we're not only coordinating on
the investigation side were also
coordinating all aspects
of.
That. Utility and now
for your own rolls.
Accord talking with each other
very very regularly would do you
see that the investigation that
if this is a cooperative
coordinated investigation of
these fires will that. Change
that get the timeline when
you're complete with your.
Investigation is that a come.
A it will that be the
investigation is my
understanding historically you
would conduct your investigation
then you would do your
investigation. And then we would
see some adjudication education
at the end of the day is that.
Format change now. I would say
that the investigations are are
occurring at the same time.
We're looking at at some
differences between those were
specifically looking for the
origin.
And the cause of the fire.
And.
And then who's responsible the
coordination of information
sharing has been up a new piece
so since October between the two
agencies are but are are I would
say our fire investigation
still.
Is is specific to our
responsibilities in and what we
would typically do any other
year.
Timeline wise.
I would not expect that to have
any impact on our ability to
complete these investigations
and as chief up M. Bob mentioned
a release that information to
the public in the more poorly
for us. Then to learn from.
From from what those
investigations tell us but they
are I would say two separate
investigations were just
cooperating and providing
information with each other as
we go down these two tracks.
I think for the P. you see it
has a major implication on the
time. Of the previous practice
has been that film.
See if you C. staff would not
begin in the investigation
unsold findings of cal fire. All
because we don't Holly again
with you know historically in.
Twelve whistle resources is just
not possible for us to
investigate group concurrently
every fire you know that may or
may not have some utility
infrastructure involvements of
the practice.
Historically was that if
hellfire found that.
That utility infrastructure was
well either responsible for the
ignition was involved in the
ignition at that point we would
only begin the investigation and
so Dow that's completely gone.
We go we fuller and the guys
just in that doesn't work for
many reasons and put this
program in place of the peace
you think it's going to make
major difference. I don't at
this moment anticipate that we
will all conclude their
investigations Galak Lee at the
same time. Well because we you
know the are two parallel
investigations and we're looking
into things all. That different
from what cal fires looking
answer but I do think we will be
evil to at the P. U. C. side
bring well.
Fire invest.
Reports will come out first
they will state that D. because
of the ignition and then if in
cases that there wasn't some
implication of utility
infrastructure.
So at some point after the UPC
staff investigations will
conclude.
That's quite an improvement
over.
The way it had been done before.
One of the immediate term goals
highlighted in the M. O. you is
to work together and identify
the requirements.
For fire hazard prevention plans
in communities communicating
these requirements to it to the
utilities.
Is that working.
I know it's still early in the
process but then how do you see
that Plano.
Home yes this is one of the well
topics that we've been
discussing at the el.
Had the twins so working
sessions with well. Cal fire
well you know we're all sue.
I just brought on board well
resources at the P. C. staff who
are going to be focused on the
utility wild fire mitigation.
Open soul of this year when he
had generalists so without hope
three positions at a dedicated
exclusively to utility and
wildfire prevention so just the
beginning of this year that it
does result resources are
imports and that's going to be
their primary focus is to work
on that's. All we have utilities
filing L. their wild fire
mitigation plans the helping do
enough for several and we help
utility engineers
who generalists in. The in in in
it's already infastructure so
that's really going to be pushed
this year is to would jointly
with cal fire and maybe some
external experts that we going
to bring on. Israeli start
developing criteria and giving a
lot more well the group must
feedback back to utilities as to
the areas where they need to
improve their plans.
And what what I would add to
that is.
Thanks to the M. O. U. N. as we
work on.
At an actual agreement where we
can share funding on the CPU a
strategic a fire plan.
Communities have fire plans
general plans in in local cities
and counties have fire plans so
we don't want to create another
plan that that creates some.
Difference between them so.
What we're really hoping to
bring to the table with C. P. C.
is knowledge of those plants so
that we can be consistent with
what we're telling a local
communities what we're
requiring?
Other agencies as well and so I
think that the relationship and
that there were building here is
gonna be. Really make sure that
the file for mitigation plans.
Are are meaningful and are not
just a plan.
That sits on a on a desk and
and somebody check the box that
they completed them but
something that really helps on
both of our goal which is
reducing.
Lecturer I. utility spark
wildfires the state.
Are are a long term partnership
Bob both with our.
Utili line inspection guide
that we worked with utilities to
provide them some best practices
and what we're looking at doing
of work that that has. Been
ongoing.
But we're gonna continue to
strengthen that in the years to
come.
This notion could you do you
share some responsibility in
identifying some of the best
practices of design.
And the operation of the utility
systems.
Yes absolutely I mean I think
M. O. user anything else aside
and all. Mean W. I think we will
well have responsibility to do
what we can in our respective
positions and all.
With the resources that we have
home they think the one of the
strengths of safety and
enforcement division is our
knowledge of utilities.
Operation so we are one of the
most well positioned and cities
to identify best practices and
I'll be evil to our.
Well it's really well asks the
different utility is about what
they're doing and compare well
effectiveness of the program
Elsie yes I do think we have
well. That responsibility and
opportunity and that's given to
seek us working now with with
the. With cal fire role with the
utilities and again drawing on
experts well nationally and
internationally. All too well
it's really move us forward
eight aging for me one of the
home.
Well one of bill. And lessons
learned of where we are right
now is that we have well it.
Who will have a lot of low
hanging fruit you where the
world as far as I
know? Home we know we've been
focused on this already so for
us to really get to the next
level it's going see. A lot of
creative thinking it's going to
C. looking up expertise global
weight armor and well really.
Tapping in some knowledge of
full of everybody at the
agencies and private sector home
and anybody else who may you
know. How ideas as to how home
what to do next?
Thank you. Mister blonde into in
data requests
between the P. you see and
peachy you need during the
October wildfires last year.
PGD said it pro actively de
energizes powerlines when
directed to do so by cal fire
how hellfire did turn.
Align should be D. E. energized
or non.
Yeah I actually will.
Refer that to hear Ted to chief
McFadden as well but I will tell
you that.
It not just in October but.
But really.
Over the last several years
we've seen a major.
Increasing communication with
the utility companies at the
fires themselves saying you know
where's the fire going what's
the direction.
Where do we need to start
preparing for bill as you said
de energizing those lines so a
lot of coordination goes on to
grow at the ground level on it's
not in a management decision
made in Sacramento? Where we?
León or are forecasting out.
Areas of concern it's really
incident Bates at the field
level of where the fires going
and that allows the Tilly to
make decisions of of ensuring
the safety of of not only our
firefighters.
But the public and if you have
anything to. Nasri much it it's
the icy that's out there at the
incident commander of the
incident probably asking to have
those lead lined de Anne rice so
that. Response teams
responsories wanders can get in
there safely and any evacuations
are going so Caroline to sort of
fall down pulls a phone over.
Trees are taken out.
Power lines well for fire
storage where he
injures nation which would take
effect OB requested by cal fire
I'm not aware of any. Free
distributions being turned down
because of a predicted wind
event that we're employing yet
as a Californian C. asking that
be done.
So that user after these are out
the fires of it been initiated
or started and then we have insa
commander G. spawners out there
and asking for Peter need.
To come in and shut down a
section of the grid so that we
can ever respondents in the
public trying to ski. Work
evacuate aus get out safely
without V. ended you find when
you made those request was there
any problem or with a the
renowned very very cooperative
and usually very quickly
response at that Dodd.
Have they ever requested for
that would be with the P. C. a
request to de energize assist.
Or a line on their own so that I
that would. Come from.
From there were questions the
utilities make those requests of
the.
PC.
De energized.
It as a regulatory agency will
not set up to make operational
decisions at all. And I I would
just echo well wake them was the
week hellfire it's really. Up to
the the court you need to be as
close to the ground as possible
you want to be looking at local
conditions to be able to make
that call. Securing fire advance
it's really up to the incident
command knowledge to make the
decision as to well what's
needed in that area as far as
leading up to events sing G. gas
electric is the only utility
right now that house a program.
For proactively G. energizing
alliances that set again I'm
sorry say G. gas electric files
reports.
With the safety and enforcement
division and we before a man
after action at all review we
don't harming you specific
criteria that the commission
established.
It's really is a reasonable
most check of its subjects of
what those points.
Bullets if the were of so no
red flags.
Well for example of food if
utility de energize something
with no appearance risks Ralph
O. of wild fires starting in
that is something that we could.
Investigate but C. but century
take a month for Smith action on
so that's coat currently is set
up in as well. President picker
mentioned go with the commission
is well planning to continue to
look at this in a valley weights
at all. Prior actions all film
no we have and they've always
been very responsive to come out
declared.
I thank you for.
The opportunity and for your
input today and that and the
testimony is very helpful
initiative thank you very much.
When I moved to our final little
panel in group it's how do
electric utilities prevent and
mitigate wildfires. Riff three
representatives from our three
electric utilities in California
Pat Hogan senior vice president
electric operations for Pacific
gas Electric Company.
Phil Harrington senior vice
president transmission and
distribution southern California
Edison. And Brian they got the
Agostino meteorology program
manager San Diego gas and
Electric Company.
We appreciate.
.
You were.
Being here and.
.
Since we have the looking at the
agenda Mister Hogan. Welcomes
nice to see you again C. M. and.
If you have some comments I
guess at first and then be happy
to we have a few questions we
look past as well. Trait that
thank you senator and I
couldn't.
Good afternoon now. Like what
you're. Thank you for convening
today's hearing and.
Thank you supplement Robert
Levine to hang in there and
so I. again money's tight Hogan
I'm a senior vice president of
our election operations with
peach inane.
Before I began I do want to.
I'm on behalf of all the folks
at PGA I want to express my I'm
have a commitment at safety
will continue to be P. Ginny's
number one priority.
You keep doing that commitment
we have taken a continue to take
extensive steps to increase our
wildfire prevention efforts.
Among highlights somebody's in
my opening remarks Tom including
some of the actions we've taken
since committees last hearing.
And twenty fifteen.
Also touch on further
opportunities we see going
forward. Understanding as I
believe we all don't it's been
mentioned many times today that
this challenge of involving
climate is growing.
As we've heard many times today
wildfires in California but
become more frequent and more
destructive.
Twenty sixteen estate experience
more than forty seven hundred
wildfires on last year was more
than seven thousand included
some of the largest most
destructive in our history.
Over just the past two years
we've seen millions of trees
killed by extended drought. On
by bark beetle infestation bring
in the most recent count two
dead trees in California.
I'm be seen record when storms.
Winter storms this year record
precipitation our service
territory.
Chief talked about earlier that
really led to.
The vegetation becoming
abundant fuel arm and then
recent months we've seen
extraordinary extraordinary
wins.
I'm as governor brown indicated
in cam was repeated. Many times
that I.
This is really reflecting a new
normal umps or for us in
California.
These extremes are
fundamentally changing our
landscape both a both the
physical landscape.
As well as.
Our risk management landscape.
I'm in light of this reality.
I'm I think it's incumbent upon
all of us to work together to
continue to involve our
prevention response efforts and
to develop best practices. And
solutions for the involving
conditions of this new normal.
And dividing best and define the
best practices we need to keep
in mind that each utility
service territory has different
risks.
.
And that really is based on
environment whether vegetation
terrain population density. I
mean there are other factors as
well and what may be an
appropriate practice one utility
may not always be appropriate
for another.
It's in that spirit that I
appreciate this opportunity to
be here today.
Let me start by describing some
of the plans and programs that
are already in place of peas in
a. I'm including the actions
that we've taken since the
committee's last hearing.
I'm these plans and programs
really fall into three main
categories.
One is I. vegetation management
program I'm the second is our
strategies and how we manage our
assets. And the third is our
emergency preparedness and
response.
I'll start with vegetation
management really given the vast
number of trees in our service
territory. And we think this
focus is critical to our
customer safety.
Across P. Ginny seventy thousand
square mile service area there
over a hundred and twenty
million trees with that have the
potential to grow or fall into
our powerlines.
To mitigate that risk we operate
one of the most robust
vegetation matching programs in
this industry covering a total
of over a hundred thousand miles
of line of overhead line.
We inspect and monitor every
single mile of these lines at
least once a year and certain
locations where the risk of
agitation cause outages. And
wires down is higher on we
inspect our lines multiple times
per year.
As a result of these and but
inspections we pruner removes
I'm probably one point four
million trees every year.
Another element of our program
I'm is is clearing vegetation
around our process around
approximate hundred twenty
thousand utility poles.
We continue C. monitor the
effectiveness of these efforts
to quality assurance audits to
verify the inspections in the
tree work that are done by
contractors is is complete.
I also want to point out that
enhance efforts we've taken in
the past years to address areas
particularly affected by drought
and bark beetle.
This is work that we first
started it was conducted
seasonally.
It's now conducted year round.
And we have second patrols a
cover approximately sixty five
percent of our distribution line
miles and twenty seventeen.
That's up from thirty from out
there about thirty eight percent
and twenty fifteen.
I'm we've implemented innovative
technologies miss malashenko
mention one M. such as light are
on to improve our ability to
identify those dead and dying
trees.
I'm with extended the time of
year during which we conduct
aerial file fire patrols on this
past June twenty seventeen Iran
from mid June I'm all the way
through December.
All of these enhanced efforts of
help decide identify and remove
roughly three hundred eighty six
thousand trees dead and dying
trees in the past two years. Not
really comparative pre drought
where we were we were taken out
twenty to thirty thousand a year
so Shuja huge wrap up on that
you can also see evidence of
this in our annual spending. On
vegetation management which
nearly doubled in the past two
years from about two hundred
forty seven million twenty
fourteen to. Fortune forty
million dollars last year and.
Equivalent funding out for this
year.
Another key element of our
wildfire mitigation is how we
manage our assets this is it
area where we've taken
additional actions in recent
years while. I'm of highlight a
few of those on the first is
extending the reach our skater
program skaters of many of you
know a supervisory control and
data acquisition it's technology
that allows us to remotely
monitor. And control equipment
on our system.
When the Avengers skater is that
allows you to provide the
capability to remotely operate
devices such as re closers.
Because this play critical role
in maintaining the safety of our
system and avoiding sustained
power outages was which compose
arrest public safety.
When we last met with this
committee back in twenty fifteen
we're in the process of
installing skater. And high risk
wildfire areas.
And we are now expanding this to
include I'm proximate thousand
additional skate enabled the
closers in the fire map to area
and extreme an elevated areas.
So as we gather additional
learnings from the our pilot
program of some other utilities.
I. we continue about our
policies and practices with
regard to re closers.
And as we do our overall goal
will be to continue to be the
same to use the closing devices
I'm for the benefit I'm. Not
sorry for forum to you to users
caused by an amount of improved
public safety.
I'm in addition to expanding our
skater capabilities another
after we've undertaken is
replacing surge arresters at cal
fire has certified as having hot
as having a lower fire risk.
And we start replacing these M.
twenty seventeen will replace
possibly ninety thousand M. over
the next several years. I'm also
replacing significant amounts of
older and smaller conductor
through our target a conductor
replacement program. For the
past six years were replaced
three hundred forty one miles a
conductor that will now have a
lower fire risk.
Another critical opponent of a
wildfire plan is our mercy
preparedness and response.
Restoring utility service is a
prerequisite for returning life
to some sense of normalcy.
A pigeon he works closely with
cal fire as you heard earlier in
and our local first responders
to prepare for emergencies. He's
close ties are important in the
really important when when.
I'm when when things happen
when speed and coordination are
of the essence.
We thank those first response
for the extraordinary service
without which P. Ginny could not
do its job of restoring gas
electricity I also thank our
customers for
their patience as we completed.
The work in this past while far
our largest restoration since
nineteen eighty nine Loma Prieta
earthquake.
I'm during last year's
restoration effort we brought to
bear forty three hundred linemen
gas workers engineers
troubleshooters another skilled
professionals here. And work to
restore power and gas service
from from four base camps that
were set up. On it I want to
thank god no they left Senate
Dodd and Senate McGuire is as
well as some of that the members
of the public.
I'm for recognizing the yeoman's
effort of the men and women of
teaching a and I will carry that
message back to them very
meaningful.
I'm as I said that when I
started out we recognize the
wild virus in California is
growing with her that a lot
today.
Tom as the climate continues to
change involved. I'm our plans
and programs are involving in
response as well and we know
they will continue to involve
number working to incorporate
this new normal it's how we
adapt. How we proactively manage
risks how we plan and invest and
how we operate and to make our
system more resilient?
Along these lines we also look
forward to engaging multi part
discussions including the CPUC.
Local government elected
officials and community leaders
about circumstances in which
utility should consider
proactively shutting off power
to reduce wildfire risk.
This is inscribed few times is
really as a highly complex issue
with significant public safety
risk while the which needs to be
carefully considered
communicated addressed. These
are not simple solutions.
I'll close by emphasizing
appease Annie is ready to work
with you senator and with all
the parties in this state on the
overall challenge we face. And
we as we work to ensure the
safety of all of our communities
thank you again for this
opportunity was broken you know
we have some questions but Ted
the formalist parented.
Thank you.
You monetary.
The
Bob handguns.
Lawyers and C. right.
Don't know last.
Working.
Hard to pick up Mr you can move
the microphone little closer to
thank you turn a lot of America
turn my back that's okay.
So as we all know last month
number our communities and our
territory suffer the largest
wildfire by acreage in
California history.
Earlier this month we also
experienced a powerful rainstorm
resulting in a catastrophic mud
slide.
Our hearts go out to all who
have been impacted by these
events recovery from these
events and fires. Will take
United efforts.
Edison will be there with every
step away. Help our community
seal and thrive again.
We'll continue to assist people
affected by the earlier
wildfires were providing sap
local assistance centers and
Senate Barbara and Ventura
counties.
While working with affected
customers expediting needed
services changes waiving certain
fees and deposits forgiving
bills making payment
arrangements.
Recording with American red
cross and United Way as well
bright needed services.
We also want to recognize the
efforts of cal fire our first
responders employees including
why cruise from IBEW local forty
seven while.
That's.
Ready.
Terms of what I've lost.
Holmes the structures destroyed
and damaged and significant
harmful effects on California's
landscape and environment.
Research suggests development of
nearly one million new
California homes by mid century
so this problem is only going to
get worse.
Adaptation of his extreme events
is an urgent challenge facing
all Californians.
And we must confront these
challenges together and develop
workable solutions.
I'm which all on which we can
all agree.
The extreme risk we face demand
strong leadership from
government by a broad group of
stakeholders.
But welcome participations form
today.
We're committed to securing the
safety of the communities which
we serve. By doubting our
infrastructure operations to
meet the new challenges.
SC's core mission.
Is and remains to safely deliver
affordable. Clean and reliable
electricity.
So over the years.
Gonna talk a little bit about
our process of procedures to
deal with my I. welfare
mitigation.
Over the years we've adopted
copperheads while fire
mitigation strategies.
Pricing three main elements
burst activities around in
assessing risk how do we
determine risk.
Secondly once we identify that
risk how do we mitigated.
And certainly when we do have
worth awhile far then or even
for that matter how do we
respond.
First I like to talk a little
bit about how we identify risks.
Were the most important
components are risk assessment
is our partnership with our
communities
this is extremely important for
us because thirty percent of our
fifty thousand miles square.
Thermal territory is in a high
fire risk area.
So I C. actually participates
mollify response planning with
fire agencies including cal fire
throughout our service
territory.
We continue to build upon our
already strong partnerships with
state local agencies including
are well established operation
Santa Ana.
Where is C. personnel and state
and county fire agencies?
Conduct joint patrols in the
most fire since of areas in our
service territory.
Much like all utilities are
California with a very robust
that.
Vegetation management program
and want to talk about right now
our inspections.
Annual mid cycle patrols and we
leverage aerial inspections and
hard to reach locations in high
fire areas.
Since the last time we were here
in twenty fifteen we've enhanced
our vegetation management
program by Tim. Increasing our
attention circuits which.
Demonstrate a higher propensity
to trip.
And if you the C. wider to those
hard access areas.
Additionally we have thorough
inspection programs for all
distribution circuits
transmission lines and
substations.
I Tom our inspection programs as
C. has implemented holistic risk
management approach looks at
various components including
safety. Reliability environment
compliance.
And a finance as well as an
investment prioritization
framework that uses the same
elements so risk safety are
included and all the. Decisions
we make in socal Edison.
We have in house meteorologist
with access to a wide variety of
data who tried regular weather
reports and forecasts that we're
currently developing predictive
capabilities to determine the
potential for wildfires. Based
on local weather conditions of
the site related data.
So once we understand risk what
success rests musician whether
resources.
Such as got a partnership we now
have a large county were
deploying fourteen high
definition cameras throughout
the county again to assistant
fire assessment and fire. A
response.
Again back to vegetation
management one of the most
important activities in our
mitigation efforts is vegetation
management.
Our crews pursue multiple trips
a year in high growth trees and
ensure the Ricardo clearances
are maintained throughout the
year.
Since twenty fifteen we removed
over eighty thousand dead or
dying trees as part of our park
Beatle got resolution industry
initiative programs.
Plus another thirty seven
thousand trees as part of a
routine treatment program.
So much like peas in the we are
moving a great many trees every
year.
We're currently implementing it
G. I. S. based network.
Spatially tracks each inventory
tree to allow for improved
forecasting sore continued
involvement or vegetation
management practices.
Another key element of our
mitigation is a robust design
construction standards
we continue to advance our grid
by piloting in introducing new
technologies that reduces the
risk of wildfires.
We've installed in our
evaluating protection devices
with extra sensitive tripping
settings the react quicker when
a fault occurs to reduce thought
energy.
When stone transformers and non
flammable fluid to eliminate
ignition source from this device
as well.
We're introducing cover
conductor and I fart areas and
will continue to review under
Browning is an option where
makes the most sense.
We've replaced over thirty nine
thousand poles and high fires
his twenty fourteen and we've
invested in almost six hundred
million dollars in our overhead
conductor program. Twenty
fifteen twenty eighteen where'd
I'd safety.
When National Weather Service
declares a red flag warning the
company will not automatically
re energize distribution
circuits as well high fire
areas.
After circuit interruption.
We've been doing this practice
for over a decade.
Most electric circuit
interruptions are false or
momentary matter gnomes
conditions the grid
automatically test circuit.
And if the fall conditional
longer exists circus quickly
reenergize.
However during regular bread
like conditions are circuits are
not automatically reenergize
Nancy Cruz.
Statistically aspect lines
before they are re energized.
We're also currently exploring
blocking or transition so
transferred closers.
Similar to the way we do our
distribution network.
And another operational practice
reduces welfare risk.
Is what we call our public
safety power shut off which us
down power preemptively in
limited high risk areas only in
the most extreme weather
conditions.
So actually to have a program I
will have to work with that C.
D. to talk a little bit more
about that we have an active
program as well.
As C. applied this practice
during red flag event in
December twenty seventeen a
forecast of unusually high
winds.
The company coordinate with fire
agencies.
And other first responders
notify customers with special
attention paid to critical care
customers.
And provided other assistance in
advance of shutting off the
power.
We're currently evaluating micro
grids and developing a plan to
deploy portable generators to
support critical customers
infrastructure and reduce the
impact of an outage.
Lastly in terms of our
mitigation but how do we respond
to an event or following
mitigation how to respond to
that what happens.
First again our partnership to
state local apart agencies.
We have a fire management team
with both utility field
experience and firefighting
experience combined.
The same individuals
the work closely with fire
agencies throughout our service
territory. And we provide
training Allen school safety and
we have learned from each other
the value for actually staging
resources during extreme weather
conditions.
We tried sports community
emerges an operation centers in
court with community groups
during and after one of them.
As C. adopted seems incident
command system as well optimize
ability to coordinate and
responsive federal state and
local agencies.
And we've increased our roster
trained individuals from across
the company.
Support the system.
Both of these efforts
contributed a third Allen our
response.
Community outreach and public
awareness.
Because of our partnerships were
able to exchange timely
information.
With first responders about
conditions on the ground and
restoration timeframe.
Are I. C. a structure enables us
to affect we provide that
information to the media
government officials immunities
customers.
So moving forward.
We recognize what's our risk is
growing will continue evolve
Lena dissolutions mitigate
wildfire risk.
Will introduce new technology
and prioritize our work to
ensure safety of the public and
our workers including new
protective devices advanced
weather predicting capabilities.
And great hardening.
We'll valuing consider all
options.
You got to build our current
strategy.
And reduce the threat of
wildfires.
It's imperative that we improve
fire safety for all Californians
by taking needed accent
implement clear state standards
for critical infrastructure.
To develop smarter policies
around building structures and
high fire areas and we execute
stay corny defining strategies
effectively address fire
prevention and fire suppression.
Mouth ours do occur state needs
a new approach to allocating
costs so that the risk is
appropriately shared an
insurance coverage remains
affordable.
Is no sustainable way for
California to mitigate risk
related to climate change
without making fundamental
changes.
It addresses critical issues.
We must find workable solutions
before the next fire season and
we're looking forward to working
with our state. Legislators are
regulators. Courts and all the
stakeholders involved
immediately engage too dressy
elements of this profound
statewide risk.
Again I want to thank you good
up to share our views and
participate in the creative.
Solutions to California's
wildfire threaten future thank
you very much accurate
Harrington moved to stand D. who
gas electric stern
the fifty best you know thank
you yes and and thank you very
much.
Chairman assembly member and I
appreciate the opportunity to
come here and talk a bit about
integrating the technology we've
heard about.
You know that need for the
increased technology and that's
something that we've been very
committed to. I'm in San Diego
now I am I am a degreed
meteorologist tonight joined our
operations teams in two thousand
nine.
And we've really been working
tirelessly I'm sense to try to.
Better understand how wildfire
impacts on southern California
I'm in particular San Diego
county.
And some steps that we can take
to mitigate that wildfire risk
and. How we have taken some
major steps one is the
development of the largest
utility weather network?
That exists anywhere in the
nation and likely the world on
at a hundred and seventy.
I weather stations I. right now
it gives us relative humidity
temperature wind speed wind
gusts.
And it gives us that
information every ten minutes.
So when we look at that the new
cal fire mapping with that both
tier two in. Dodd tier three
levels right now every circuit.
That is in those levels
currently has its own weather
states.
And this becomes very important
day to day operations of the
system.
So whenever there is an outage
or a fault on any of those
circuits.
Our operators automatically know
what it's the wind speed on that
circuit.
What is the relative humidity
high so it turns into feeding
into that that safety
environment where you
automatically know what the
weather is doing on a circuit?
On it beautiful day and then
also under extreme conditions
it really helps us I'll learn a
lot of information about. How
the area that where not
providing that service to?
And so that's something that
where I it's a great foundation
to the technology that we're
developing.
Another thing that's been
extremely important with all of
this information is
collaborating and sharing it.
You know both with folks from
the National Weather Service to
the local universities I'm
university of California we've
worked with them very closely
with a lot of this information.
To even develop certain
websites to get it out to the
firefighters that are on the
front lines.
Because it does give such a
wealth of information.
So this is something that we we
focus on a lot it's once we
gather all of this Weather
information how do we get it out
into. The community and in the
hand of the first responders as
a tool.
Having.
The other thing that we looked
daggers once we started to
understand what the weather was
doing on all of the circuits.
I'm in these. Higher rated tier
two tier three areas I'm we need
to generate forecasts and really
understand what was the weather
going to do on each of those.
And technology that it was not
there to support that level.
That level meaning you couldn't
go buy something from IBM that
would.
Give you that level of.
Whether intelligence.
.
So we did develop it in the
house.
We ended up bringing
supercomputers and M. running
high resolution forecast models
and that would give us really
good information as to at
exactly what we expected the
winds to do because we would
really have to anticipate.
These extreme winds as we've
heard here.
Its very hard to anticipate
wins getting eighty ninety
hundred mile
M. our especially in places
where there's not a historical
record for some of that.
So being able to anticipate. On
this level of event became one
of our crucial goals.
Not because we have to
anticipate this happening in
order to take the proper
preparations to mitigate that
risk.
So that's something we've look
at closely. And and we do need
to operate the system safely of
course three hundred and sixty
five days a year. And not just
when we have these. Extreme
about so without we've developed
tools and analytical tools to
help with this in San Diego we
call it the fire potential
index.
But it takes our eight
districts and it really rates
what is the the possibility that
we're going to see or what is
the potential for a large fire
in any of these districts and.
We look at this day and night
three hundred sixty five days a
year and it helps us make those
decisions in terms of. When
des'ree closing go on when does
it go off.
And it really builds a culture
around understanding fire
potential year round I mean it's
amazing to think here we are
heading into the last weekend in
January the National Weather
Service in San Diego. Issue fire
weather watch this morning and
we're looking at winds sixty to
eighty miles per hour before the
weekend is out so it's it's
something that we deal with.
Year round as I think we've all.
You know discussed here today.
.
Another real technology that
we're looking at and this is
from what we can tell cutting
edge fire behavior modeling
systems.
In in the whole world we've
we've talked to Australia about
this technology we've talked to
folks in Chile about it. But
it's using her.
Fire simulations and fire
behavior modeling.
So every day in San Diego where
simulating over ten million
virtual wildfires
all across our terrain and it
really helps us understand where
the highest risks are. And what
we're looking to mitigate that
risk and start deploying field
resources and trying to get
people in the right place at the
right time. To make observations
on the electric system to try to
keep everything safe this type
of technology has been very.
Very beneficial.
Another thing I wanted to
mention in Britain we've heard
about the camera networks we've
also found those to be extremely
valuable we currently monitor.
And a hundred seven cameras
Allen that are operating across
San Diego and this is been done.
Mostly in partnerships with the
university of California.
But most most mountain tops in
San Diego are now covered with
cameras a lot of them are pan
tilt zoom capabilities and we
give all of that. Ability to
operate those.
I'm also to the fire agencies
as they make out a primary tool.
That's used right now.
With this I.
Wanted to to leave it at that
in terms of the technology but I
look forward to answering any
possible questions.
That you might have thank you
very thank you very much.
Assembly member looking.
Thank you and thank you.
Three for testimony and and
you know I think Ted Mister
Hogan's point it is important to
point out how quickly.
Teaching he did mobilize
thousands people help people I
bring their lives back to normal
C. after.
The fire said thank you Ted to.
All of the women and men to do
that and and all of your
company's out people after the
fires to said.
Just get back to life other
code.
The state budget is something
that I have a little bit. Of
control over think you know what
I mean senator Helms the little
bit and. After these
fires.
I think that you know there is
an opportunity for us to push
for.
More targeted.
Spending or investment in this
type of preparation.
I would probably can't get
everything that we want but I
don't think you can if we do see
people protect.
From every threat. And I think
that's something that you all
experienced yourselves as you're
doing your own budgeting. Which
I have no control over.
That's what I wanted to get to.
How?
Do you when you're talking about
you your excuses at three
electricity.
Utilities but you're just three
of the electricity utilities you
happen to be
the three investor owned
utilities are many more
municipal utilities.
That also are responsible for
service distribution and then of
course there's the growing. Need
for segregation.
.
Done.
Style company that is only for
energy procurement relying upon
you and others for that service
and delivery.
But on.
How did you M. years dealing
with a bottom line?
Figure out what that it will be.
To do all of their. Bob
preparation and protection and
medication for risk.
I'll I'll start I want to thank
you assemblyman for for your
kind comments about our men and
women I'll bring that back as
well Dodd it doesn't really mean
a lot to me. Allen I know means
a lot to our to our people as
well.
I think that I'm you know I
think you've you've really gets
to the heart of the matter is
only number it's it's out you
know. This is a this is a
statewide problem right it's not
one entity is not going to fix
it it's it's really.
We we need to work together on
a on a shared solution and each
of us are going to have are
going to play our part in that
so.
For for us particular in that
in in what we layout in terms
of.
Where we allocate our resources
it's very much a?
A risk informed budget
allocation for for our work and
you know I just use as an
example I'm a few years ago we
were spending on the order of
two hundred million dollars a
little over twenty million
dollars. Honor vegetation
management program as as we saw
the conditions changing with the
drought with the bark beetle.
And that the amount of debt
disease and dying trees and and
the state of California we
recognize we had to to ramp Dodd
up. On and that's an area that
we will also working with the
governor's office and and also
with that with the CPU C. we're
able to do that as well so. It's
those types of things you need
to be you need to have the right
data you need to have the right
partnerships and they're. Just
fuel ready to
go.
Throughout the state the state
itself is updating its own
reputation management plan
which.
It has its own hurdles as far as
on environmental groups that may
be concerned about what we're
trying to do to be more
proactive about this.
But I think it is time to be.
Creative set to protect our
communities do. You the other to
tell them how to comment on how
you.
Budget for keep your community
safe and how are you looking at.
The defense let's say is from a
generation ago.
I both take a couple of.
Couple of a different
directions on that I I do agree
with.
With Pat here as far as the
partnership element of it.
The needs in the service we
provide is really.
It's on many levels of course
is electric
or C. form framework we have a
very developed risk informed
framework begin to make sure
that in my discussion points.
Dodd Allen targeting a number of
different elements EQT including
risks of which fire safety is
one of those.
And a number of other
dimensions that we look at as
far as when we decide to make or
not make an investment.
I will say I think your point
about what it was.
Generation ago.
.
I think utilities have
historically through their
entire history.
Evolves to new conditions that
I was safe right now we have
stepped changed step change
driven by climate change.
I'm confident that with
partnerships that we're
constructing have constructed
will be able addresses change
but I think it will take.
Just that a partnership with our
regulators are legislators
courts.
Other utilities and it was also
mentioned.
Key experts and stakeholders
from outside our state M. is a
lot of knowledge.
About wildfires globally are we
need to pull into this
assessment.
So I think coming to some
standards and coming to a
framework that we can evaluate.
Safety Hannah and having a
conversation among a number of
stakeholders in that.
In that discussion assessment
will be keyed ultimately making
the best decision we can at. I
think number term other the new
normal the other trunks and many
times stays complex.
There are trade offs with all
these decisions you making I
think that's why the stakeholder
process.
Especially corn for what we're
doing right now.
And I Mister Hogan described
attacks investment in vegetation
management deserve a similar I
increasing investment. Agassi
yeah I I don't have those
figures right.
Readily available yes and were
also investing I say more
importantly discipline the
dollars but in the technologies
that assistance and directors to
make very wise and.
Inefficient decisions as we I
try to do more and more and do
better and better vegetation
management.
Mr Dagestani of anything that
I've done. I'm nothing bad right
now thank you
okay the one of the points said
Ted I made in talking about the
diversity of who provides energy
to Californians.
Is that.
.
You are responsible for the
services delivery of electricity
and there is huge cost.
I'd. To that you also are
compensated for it. But.
That causes me rising
because of the risks.
That are increasing in in the
León building projects.
What you know how it will
impact us a particular young
switch dead foliage?
?
Is that business model
sustainable.
Particularly as cinema county
has a clean power CCA Marin does
you know you've competitors that
are not taking care of those
lines their customers are still
paying you. For taking care of
them.
But the risks increase and
you're not getting the profits
from the energy of current and
energy.
That that you're you're selling.
Does that put your whole
business model. On.
At risk as well. Is is this
isn't sustainable as
a competitive marketplace
changes.
Or is this not really affecting.
The amount of resources you are
able to give us an I or you to
the safety issue.
So I'll start.
With them and yet you're
completely happy about
competition desk we don't have.
To look at it now the the issue
you raised. Has a hearing all of
up of its own here but.
On if I was just a kind of boil
it down simply.
You know CCA's is really about
that the delivery of of outside
the production of powertrain so
though that power flows over our
power lines we deliver to to
customers and and those
customers compensate us on for
that so.
And so that meant that in
theory is is not an issue what
what ends up being an issue is
the cost shift. On the cars.
As a as a result of that on
that the mechanisms there but
that really and truly is beyond
my depth and.
It is a.
It is it is a hearing out all
on itself and there's plenty of
proceedings are going on in in
in that space so.
It the the model is laid out to
me is absolutely sustainable.
But there are a there are items
that would Dodd that absolutely
would need to be fixed.
So well I won't go wait in the
waters.
Pat was able to navigate as
well on committee tourists are
mediation there many proceedings
going on there. But but I do
want to come back to one team
and and I will continue to do it
probably got the opportunity.
It is short answer is yes and
my my earlier comment about
utilities have evolved over time
and obviously not all of them
are still around there's been.
Changes in the business over
time.
But I I think there's a reason
for that is because of them. We
can innovate.
And I think not only do we have
a sustainable business model but
I think even more now than ever.
We have a unique role to play
California it healthy California
realize I. it's.
Goals of. Carbon free
transportation of electrifying
transportation and other.
.
Initiatives the state is looking
to pursue.
We can be in the center of that
innovating
at the same time innovating away
that makes our grid safer. And
more free from the risk of
wildfires now this is gonna be
very complex obviously there's
lots of.
Discussions the need to go on
around what those models look
like and how we approach each
one of those issues. But I I
truly believe that this is
probably a more important I.
time for utilities to be part of
the space and active than I do
view it as a very. Stable
business model.
And and so. We haven't
completely any investigations
about how the fire started in in
some night I I don't I don't
want it.
Decide that this year. Died as
these events occur.
Does it change.
That viewpoints.
And then if there is falls in an
incident like this
does that further change the key
point because of the financial
risk.
To your company's
of.
That type of liability.
That there's gotta be need
perhaps another way.
For us Ted to manage those
lines. That inside.
Actually me separated from.
The company that companies as we
know it today attitude he spit
it out to another company.
However I'm talking a long term
financial risk and that maybe
it's a different Dodd.
Different no number here
executive team
but you guys talk about it all.
So absolutely it's.
Yet again I think here you
really get to the heart of
that's of size and really
critical on critical questions
here on critical issues.
And I. I go back to what I said
earlier these are.
Fees are statewide issues these
a statewide issues and we need
we need statewide solutions on
now you're talking about the
financial implications.
The that there's a theory of a
very flawed.
Legal doctrine in my view of
inverse condemnation
California terms of best
practices nobody else looking at
that as a best practice.
And so inverse condemnation is.
Is really a challenge I think
us as a as
the state of California needs
to.
On these to come to grips with.
I again I I would say.
.
It to Pat's point out I think
you're structural elements in
the way that.
Were.
Accounting for risk in the
California model I think.
The opportunity there is to fix
those
coming back to the business
model I still think it's a state
of owning these rates are out
there they're obviously
challenging.
Insurance markets
Bob but whatever I. path we
choose I think the utility has
role to be in the center.
Of the deliver power in
California and.
United I feel very strongly
about that.
Generally feel it's the right
answer.
And I think.
There are plenty of things that
will need to be fixed.
As is I think all of us and
everybody in this room is
highlighted today Bob this is
very bad. Time sensitive issue
we
should not.
Like this.
Moment passed without fixing a
lot of things in the.
Now in the structure
of our dressing risk.
But I. I don't think the
business model is the.
Is the real was a real problem
I will take you are three of you
it thanks for coming in my
district.
Talk about the child
is that your initial.
Bates facing higher plan.
To do this.
So I think you are thank
assemblyman M. about movie to
really appreciate the
opportunity to be here speak.
Thank you.
I think your cell number looking
for the questions.
But with the best way to
describe it I like that.
.
So I'd like to focus a little
bit on the de energizing Isshu
Henry closures of. The last time
we spoke on this topic at least
that Mr Hogan I was that the to
hear from.
If at that hearing two years
ago I I ask all of you the
companies the challenges
associated with faults.
Where the line remains enter
Josh I had passed all bill to
specify your? Automatic circuit
were closed policies of.
This was Beth ascertain how you
handle how you deal with the
automatically.
Those that were closures to
automatically energize a line
after it was faulty.
As Galgiani at the time said.
Declarative restated we turn
off these automatic closure well
before fire chief.
Edison's vice president.
Mister poll agree growth then
said we pro actively block that
were closures during the Santa
Ana season.
And I think you indicated that
Mister Harrington that you you
can also turn your recorders off
when.
You feel during that same Hannah
timer once certain circumstances
our problem that's right but
flag warnings we can do that
remotely so we do and we do
that.
In the program I ask you the
same question. Of in use stated.
And headed back and look at the
the recording to remind myself
and and then I.
Myself after I did that.
Because the.
By put you your answer was by
putting scatter on the
closures were able to take those
Ricardo troops out of service
but.
I realized after listening to
that he really didn't answer my
question and I.
Should have both followed up on
that question.
It's it's now my understanding
the P. genie has installed
capabilities to remotely disable
three closing function be a
skater.
On about seventy five percent of
the line we closures in your
system.
Is that that's correct.
What do you pack week is able
the threat closures
how like your colleagues do in
wildfire seasons or when
circumstances?
Or prevalent that would warrant
that Ted thanks I thank senator
and.
I. I. so you're right I'm
reports in that in that you're
in the media and I was taken by
surprise as well so I went back
also and.
Onto it to review that review
my out review my testimony and.
And I really was responding to
your question around a on where
we investing in technologies to
to limit the current and. And
that's how I answered in and.
And and we and we did deliver
on that.
I set that time we were.
Putting in our closers in.
In awhile iris what wildfire
areas.
That would be complete in the
following year which officers
twenty sixteen arm which we
completed that.
And we developed a pilot for
turning those re closes off on
for the twenty seventeen
wildfire season and.
And what we did was we picked
up our a top ten percent of the
the high high risk areas which
at. That time we were operating
under fire map one I think we
all recognize we've moved on to
farm too but. That time is far
map one we pick our top ten
percent.
And we.
And we put put together a
program to proactively on a to
take those every closes out of
service on we had high fire risk
it on in in those areas we did
implement that. I'm for the
twenty seventeen.
Fire season I was about to
thirty eight of our closers.
Intent was to make sure that it
worked Mitchell there weren't
any.
.
Unintended consequences site
and one of things like I said
earlier is it is what's up
what's a best practice and in
one region on doesn't always up
on turn out to be a best
practice in another region and
there's. Lots of examples of
that and not.
But in this business for thirty
one years and I I've seen that
played out multiple times and
so.
That but the the prudent Ted.
Operation we took was to create
a pilot make sure that.
That work at the where no one
intended consequences and then
seek to out to roll that out to
further silence that's what
we're doing.
And as a matter of fact as we
got into.
On that the December timeframe
given really the confluence of
weather events that we saw our
and not October night. I touched
on a bit of that in my in my
opening I when you kind of go
through and then the chief
talked about as well right. The
five years of drought the bark
beetle the the the the massive
rain the heat.
Fuel I'm and then that those
really extraordinary wins and
not an October.
What?
On is that we continue involved
and we looked at that.
We.
In fact de energized but not
just sorry we out on took got.
That's in the.
That's sort. Of a club thirty
eight.
It does capable reclusion these
areas.
If approximately seventy five
percent.
Of the seven thousand seven
hundred line we closures
throughout your territory are
equipped evidence of that
doesn't sharp so I'm here to
make sense when we develop the
pilot we were on fire map one we
took fire map one. We took the
top ten percent risk and fire
map one.
And and that's what amounts of
thirty every closes I I can't
recall how many total re closes
our our in our entire map one.
it's probably it's probably a
ratio so it's probably on the
order of a three hundred or so
so. Took the top ten percent. Of
the fire map one rescue and
those are the ones that we
piloted so to ensure that there
were no unintended consequences.
So you go so you did not just
install those.
They threaten.
Skinner not out in nine bonfire
prone areas used both M.
throughout. The system exactly
that.
.
Okay the M..
The interest in the idea of.
I think mention that.
.
Do you all think I guess the
concern is when you de energized
a system.
Is there a standard criteria
that she used to do that.
I mean is it.
Read firework you know which
like fire warning time is it
Jordan
humidity conditions or weather
related.
How is that determine it is
that something that should be?
Standardized criteria I I'll
start I think there's
opportunities to standardize.
I. I think were very similar.
But.
You know for me the devil's
always in the details so.
So I'm not gonna say were the
same.
And.
So I think we're similar but I
think this is actually an area
where we could potentially
standardize on I think on next
Dodd next week even though it.
Really focusing on de
energizing circuits on you can
really think about taking her
clothes are out of service as a
step in that direction because.
You know seventy percent of the
faults on the system are.
Or Lara intermittent nation
nature so you have that.
Re closer operates and then it
closes and and so it's out of
time that the fault is gone and
powers restored so when you take
that. Re closer out of service
you're really saying that
seventy percent of time I am
black and I'm taking it circuit
away and blocking out those
communities and.
And there's public safety rest
that goes along with that right
we know hospitals and. On fire
departments and and.
Homes for elderly insect
communication tower so.
Tom so it's it is a complex and
it is a it is a complex a
decision to to make and
reiterated.
Development I think is helpful
it's a form of collaboration
it's way we can all ensure that
we're pursuing best practices.
Up recognizing the point was
made earlier that all the
systems are a little bit
different.
And may have different I would
say.
Technical needs at the end of
the analysis but I think the
things that go into the
analysis.
I would say foundational
conditions that you look out
about when you de energize or
when you take it a re closer.
Out of automatic modes who
doesn't Rico's.
There should be some might say
consistency in how we think
about committed those.
Determinations.
Mr Espino I'm from from our
experience working through the
the emergency operations where
this is been required one
observation I've noticed being
there is that.
No two events tend to be
exactly the same.
You know winds are from
different directions winds are
spread over different areas so
it becomes a very.
Very. Dynamic decision making
process would be.
The thing I would want to share
to that which would be the only.
Consideration when looking at
setting criteria.
I think you you find that
there's lots many many factors
I'm that come into play in a
decision like that so you're
saying basically that. I guess.
Very briefly it would be
difficult to establish a set.
Standard or protocol or
procedure that everyone would
follow because those there could
be just a new watch
change in some form of humidity
here conditions that would.
Would not maybe triggered but
should he yes sorry I mean they
make an example could be if
there is a major fire burning
up.
Up north and all wildfire
resources have been deployed out
of the region I mean it there's
lots of.
There become lots of decisions
so yes that's what we.
Or sec so I'm say Senate I'll
just very good at I..
There are so many similarities
between the we close our
operation and public C. C.
shuttles or what. However we
characterize a preemptive shut
off or actually de energize a
circuit I I think in that case
again the foundational comment I
made would would stand. But also
would say that those are very
different and the number of the
conditions that you look at.
Ultimately are supported by
boots on the ground.
People observing what's
happening and making judgments
that guy inform a final decision
to de energizes circuit. Up
preemptively unlike a re close I
think we're closer you could
establish some level of
consistency in standards and
settings and technologies you
deploy. But making it decision
to de energize a circuit cry
preemptively or Bob
preemptively.
Bob based on some guesses on the
ground I think what feeds into
that will ultimately look like
more general criteria D.
considered fuel loading. When
direction nature the circuits.
The impact in the the area so
there's a number of things that
ultimately will
into that decision.
I I I completely grey.
And I was I was probably too.
Two definitive and talk about
standards right it really is.
Probably more like guidelines
frightened but but it's the
consistency peace I think it is
important. That would be good
and I appreciate that.
I have no further questions in.
If you have nothing else to
offer in this thank you very
very much appreciate that. The
worker doing to improve the
system so that we can.
Prevent what occurred that this
last year and the.
Not see it again in the future
thanks so I could work. Thank
you very much senator León
willingness to to testify and.
And to the end the conversation.
Thanks so much Senate Richard
thank you very much.
I can now open this back up to
any. Members of the public who
would like to make a comment or
two we're going to limit it to
two minutes please.
A it's been a long morning and
early afternoon so Sir you were
the first there so.
If you'd like a please thank
you for being here and your
patience.
I thank you Mister chairman now
bill Schneider a Santa Rosa
resident.
Evacuee.
And I'm also a registered
professional Forster here in
California and in representing
this the society American forces
within the state.
Certainly a lot of the concerns
we have over over this issue
relate to community safe in fuel
treatment.
And the investor owned utilities
clearly have a role in that in
terms of their ability to.
.
Assistance citing. Biomass
plants for look at it a ton of
biomass.
.
And how that moves through the
plant.
Takes about eight eight thousand
times.
On annual basis to generate one
mega watts of energy.
So if we think about looking at
how we have proceeded with this
process we've been losing our
capacity.
To utilize biomass
we fail to get a capacity is not
authorized to eleven twenty two
on the board.
And we can't afford let that
continue to happen in fact we
need to think about expanding
those.
In the areas close to
communities where hauling
distances for promised would be
twenty five to thirty miles.
Every bite megawatt we lose we
lose six hundred acres of
treatment possibility.
And we think about eleven twenty
two with fifty megawatts of
potential.
Biomass power.
That's essentially.
Almost thirty thousand acres a
year that for each year week
delay in getting that capacity
on the landscape. We lose the
capacity to provide for a
community safety.
I think the committee needs to
keep thinking about that as you
look at this in at if you look
at this entire problem because
it is.
.
Disappointing to say the least
that after five years is not Ben
a power purchase agreement.
Under eleven twenty two.
And.
.
I I find that acceptable.
Hopefully you do as well and we
need to figure out how to do
that.
And we need to recognize as we
look at California. Much of this
is gonna fall within.
The PGA knee.
Area in terms of potential.
Thank you thank you very much
and we will look into that I
think you raise some good points
today so thank you Mr Schneider.
Yes
thank thank welcome thank you.
My name is Bob cake M. IE.
Was for thirty years.
An attorney at the public
utilities.
Commission I worked on the.
.
San Bruno gas explosions of
record keeping now.
Portion of the case.
What I wanted to say these two
things?
?
Senator hill but. The people of
California in of Santa Rosa in
particular.
Have a great deal to gain by an
effective M. complete Sir. A.
Investigation of the fires
and conversely they have a great
deal to lose by M. ineffective.
M. incomplete investigation.
M. I M. afraid.
They had.
There is a real possibility for
an incomplete to end ineffective
investigation unless the
legislature.
Make certain that such a
investigation will not.
Occur.
We know that the.
.
De commission investigation of.
The five years impute townie.
Was in me him the adequate in
incomplete investigation.
Of that terrible fire that
killed two people. I M. was
caused by the eighty crazy pine.
Not being properly.
Taken care of.
In costs.
In you have every reason
to expect.
Better from the commission in
this investigation.
My other a quick points it is
all all the global warming born
mean.
Things must be taken into
account but this particular of
family.
Was not a result of these global
warming there is no factor here
have Hanson been known for many
many years.
Thank you.
Patricia Ben and thank you very
much for your long tenured
service with the state for the
state of California much
appreciated and I think you.
M. good afternoon.
Cathleen in.
My name's Mimi Sir out ski and
I'm here on behalf of west
biofuels I'm based in woodland
California.
West biofuels is developing
distributed scale forced biomass
projects to convert would
enforce waste energy.
One of the requirements of the
governor's emergency order on
ximarc Holly was for the CPU C.
to accelerate interconnection.
For forest biomass projects in
high wild fire hazard zones.
Getting these projects connected
to the grid is one of the
biggest barriers to new for
about forest biomass projects.
The governor's tree mortality
task held two meetings last year
to address interconnection costs
and found that P. genie was
inflating the costs.
To connect these projects to the
grid by an average of nearly one
million dollars per project.
First single west by appeals
project Eugenia acknowledge that
its original estimate for
interconnection cost was too
high two point seven million
dollars higher than necessary.
Two point seven million dollars.
Thanks to the governor's office
in the tree mortality task force
P. Jeannie found huge cost
savings for five other forced by
I. energy projects as well.
Given this and the urgency of
getting new forest by I.
energies facilities built you
would think that the CPU C.
would more actively review P.
genies interconnection cost
estimates. Or set some
guidelines for interconnection
costs or do something. To avoid
millions of dollars in
unnecessary costs that will be
passed on to repairs.
You'd be wrong the CPC has done
nothing to accelerate
interconnection for forest
biomass projects.
Which is required by the
governor governor's emergency
order and SP eight forty. Or to
reduce interconnection costs
so interconnection remains one
of the biggest hurdles to
developing new forest biomass
facilities that are just really
needed.
Thank you very much.
I appreciate the comments that
we have heard loud and clear the
biomass issue today and
appreciate that.
The reinforcement of that thank
you ma'am.
Yes thank you very much.
Diverts Verus I remind
everybody that PGD is currently
in criminal probation.
For what a occurred in San Bruno
with a gas explosion.
I also want to let everyone know
that keep P. Ginny has pulled
whether modifying permits in
northern California for. Cloud
seeding they do far more than
cloud seed. Much of the
destruction of the trees is as a
result of the aerosol spray.
From those whether controls that
Roth child is engaged in the
dead trees and the opportunity
to increase.
Of force management as a result
of creating dead trees is a very
interesting money making
opportunity I also want to bring
your attention to the fact that
there has been a slash and
squirt program. Going on in in
the C. no county in Humboldt
County and part of. Assume
county where on the.
Fisher family in San Francisco
who bought hundreds of thousands
of acres from a. Lumber company
has been killing the town oak
trees and leaving them for dead
to stand and die. And there has
been no legislation to require
that the Fisher family remove
millions and millions of trees
that they've killed. In the fire
departments up there on record
at the board of supervisors have
expressed concern the Fisher
family in turn. Offers a in a
factual evacuation route to
those northern California
communities that will likely get
burned.
Out in the fires that will start
there him M. I. I did allow you
to speak the second time and
because I do not think we had
other speakers so thank you very
much I appreciate your comments
and I did make notes of what you
said so thank you. I appreciate
your giving me a second
opportunity at the idea that we
have public comment yes that's
very interesting thank you.
Ma'am Cathleen.
John Locke Sebastopol absorbed
Nancy from here.
This was first suggested that
we've actually by M. a member of
the ya come as volunteer fire
fire department and also who is
also an electrical engineer.
And presented it to us by
southern California Lecter as.
Current best practice.
And that is that we should
require disabling of automatic
thought we settings.
During reply red flag warnings
outside of urbanized areas.
Plain and simple thank you.
Very true thank you very much
for.
Those comments.
.
Anyone else care to make some
comments aren't there in our.
Close in public comment.
Period.
Seen no one.
.
Well I would just like to.
Take the.
Thank everyone for coming today
being part of this conversation
in this discussion.
And.
And those who.
Were most affected by the fires
into.
Sharing your thoughts with the
subcommittee I think we learned
a lot today I think we gained a
lot of insight.
I think we have enough
information to move forward with
some.